33 and ready to give up (secondary)

[Anonymous]

I don't know WTF is wrong with my body. I have one child from mini IVF in 2012 (I was 30). In 2014, about a year ago, I went through conventional IVF at Shady Grove (Shared Risk) and got around 12 eggs which turned into 2 blasts. One blast took but was abnormal, found out in 2nd trimester and terminated. Second blast frozen.

In May of this year our Dr let us do another cycle before using the frozen blast. It was abysmal. I was on the highest dose of everything (antagonist protocol, same as before), and ended up with 6 or so eggs retrieved, and one mature, which didn't make it to blast. After this we decided to try for an FET after testing and finding out our blast from the previous cycle was normal. Didn't implant.

A couple weeks ago, I started the estrogen priming protocol... seems like a lot of ladies on here have had success with that. I've been on the patch and started stims 3 days ago. Again, pretty much max dose. This morning I went in for my first monitoring appt and things are not looking promising. Basically I have 2 decent sized follicles and a few tiny ones. My Dr who saw me today all but said he expected we would have to cancel. We're going to reevaluate once he gets my BW today and then after my next monitoring on Saturday.

I just don't understand how I could do fairly well only a year ago and then go through these two awful cycles. I know this isn't a done deal yet it sure seems like it's headed that way. I don't know whether to stick with Shared Risk or move onto Cornell, which would practically bleed us dry, or just throw in the towel. I know no one here will have the magic answer but I need advice. I feel so lost. There is also no trying naturally for us.

[Anonymous]

I feel your pain! I did three cycles before having my son and estrogen priming is what finally worked. Keep in mind women who do EPP take a longer time to stim so those other follicles will catch up. Also, it's just the first monitoring, and three days of stims. that's nothing. I stimmed for 14/15 days on that protocol.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I feel your pain! I did three cycles before having my son and estrogen priming is what finally worked. Keep in mind women who do EPP take a longer time to stim so those other follicles will catch up. Also, it's just the first monitoring, and three days of stims. that's nothing. I stimmed for 14/15 days on that protocol.

Thanks for your reply. I think I'd feel more hopeful if it was a nurse or technician who did the ultrasound. The fact that it was my doctor, and that he seemed pretty discouraged, is what makes me feel so sad and defeated.

[Anonymous]

Agree not to panic yet. Since you are in shared risk, and young, I would try at least two more cycles. See if they will try a lower dose protocol. And maybe a freeze all.

[Anonymous]

Definitely don't let panic set in. I just did EPP antagonist with SG last month. It wasn't until day 8 that we saw any real growth. I stimmed for 12 days. Retrieved 7 mature eggs.

[Anonymous]

OP here. Thanks everyone. Honestly I'm afraid to get my hopes up even slightly after the year we've had. We are already planning on freeze all with PGS. We have already paid the PGS lab, so if we leave Shady Grove for Cornell or wherever, we'll lose that money.

I don't know but maybe the reason my Dr wasn't feeling hopeful is because there are already 2 larger follicles? I could understand if they were all roughly the same size, because the hope is that they would continue to grow together. The one thing he did say is that if we do continue this cycle I would start the antagon a few days early. Based on my limited understanding of these protocols, I guess that would enable me to stim longer without ovulating. I have no idea.

[Anonymous]

Nurse called and those two follicles were 12 and almost 14. That seems really high for day 3. I'm starting Ganirelix tonight they'll decide on Saturday if I'm proceeding or not

[Anonymous]

I know this may not be helpful OP, but you are quite young and actually not all that far into the infertility battles (compared to many of us.)

I don't say that to minimize the pain and stress of what you're going through at all. Really I just want you to keep in mind that this can often be a marathon, and in those terms you have lots of time (though I know the financial stress is pretty major also and may be limiting in itself.)

But the good news here is that you ARE young, you are getting some eggs and follicles, and you have already successfully delivered a baby. Those are HUGE positives in your column in terms of your overall odds.

You might be in for a much longer struggle that you would want, but from my perspective I think you're a long way from having to throw in the towel.

Hang in there and good luck!!

[Anonymous]

don't give up. you're only 33. If you pull out of shared risk presumably they will refund everything? Including PGS?
Here is what I would do - at the end of the cycle request your records and do a few consults outside of SG - GW, CFA, Cornell. You might need to run extra tests. What are your numbers? FSH, AMH, etc? Are you officially DOR?

Another thing to consider - high dosages are not for everyone. They can actually affect egg quality (Menopur and Ganilerix/Cetrotide).

I know this sucks, but you need to start reading up and understanding the protocols and what is what in the process. Unless you have easy success (like you had with your first child) doing 2nd, 3rd and so on cycles will involve advocating for yourself, understanding the metrics and questioning the proposed course of action.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I know this may not be helpful OP, but you are quite young and actually not all that far into the infertility battles (compared to many of us.)

I don't say that to minimize the pain and stress of what you're going through at all. Really I just want you to keep in mind that this can often be a marathon, and in those terms you have lots of time (though I know the financial stress is pretty major also and may be limiting in itself.)

But the good news here is that you ARE young, you are getting some eggs and follicles, and you have already successfully delivered a baby. Those are HUGE positives in your column in terms of your overall odds.

You might be in for a much longer struggle that you would want, but from my perspective I think you're a long way from having to throw in the towel.

Hang in there and good luck!!

I agree completely with this post. OP, you are in the middle of the shit storm. But keep your eye on all the things you have going for you and just take it day by day. When I got crappy news (which happened a lot), I would give myself a day to wallow. And then you just have to keep going. Be good to yourself.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:don't give up. you're only 33. If you pull out of shared risk presumably they will refund everything? Including PGS?
Here is what I would do - at the end of the cycle request your records and do a few consults outside of SG - GW, CFA, Cornell. You might need to run extra tests. What are your numbers? FSH, AMH, etc? Are you officially DOR?

Another thing to consider - high dosages are not for everyone. They can actually affect egg quality (Menopur and Ganilerix/Cetrotide).

I know this sucks, but you need to start reading up and understanding the protocols and what is what in the process. Unless you have easy success (like you had with your first child) doing 2nd, 3rd and so on cycles will involve advocating for yourself, understanding the metrics and questioning the proposed course of action.

If I pull out, all SG fees will be reimbursed. We did also have to pay an outside lab for PGS ($4000 for up to 8 or 12 embryos -- we have only sent one) and this would not be reimbursed. If we leave SG, I would want to make it worth my trouble and go to Cornell but DW is understandably very concerned about the OOP cost. We might be able to get local coverage soon, but even that is up in the air.

As far as testing goes, I could probably use updated day 3 testing. It's been almost two years, as far as I know, since the last tests were done and my FSH was at 9 (it's been higher before) and AMH was at .5 -- no other tests have been done. My chart at SG still says unexplained, so not officially DOR, but it looks like I'm headed there very fast.

I know a lot of you have been through far worse. The 2nd tri loss we had earlier this year just about killed me, so I've been pretty shaky since. That happened in January/February, and I don't think that will really change. We are also down to 3 vials of sperm, and that's putting a lot of pressure on things. As of now, we aren't interested in changing donors (ours is a known one with little to no possibility of obtaining more vials). Long story there.

Thanks again, everyone. I am trying hard to keep things in perspective.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:don't give up. you're only 33. If you pull out of shared risk presumably they will refund everything? Including PGS?
Here is what I would do - at the end of the cycle request your records and do a few consults outside of SG - GW, CFA, Cornell. You might need to run extra tests. What are your numbers? FSH, AMH, etc? Are you officially DOR?

Another thing to consider - high dosages are not for everyone. They can actually affect egg quality (Menopur and Ganilerix/Cetrotide).

I know this sucks, but you need to start reading up and understanding the protocols and what is what in the process. Unless you have easy success (like you had with your first child) doing 2nd, 3rd and so on cycles will involve advocating for yourself, understanding the metrics and questioning the proposed course of action.

If I pull out, all SG fees will be reimbursed. We did also have to pay an outside lab for PGS ($4000 for up to 8 or 12 embryos -- we have only sent one) and this would not be reimbursed. If we leave SG, I would want to make it worth my trouble and go to Cornell but DW is understandably very concerned about the OOP cost. We might be able to get local coverage soon, but even that is up in the air.

As far as testing goes, I could probably use updated day 3 testing. It's been almost two years, as far as I know, since the last tests were done and my FSH was at 9 (it's been higher before) and AMH was at .5 -- no other tests have been done. My chart at SG still says unexplained, so not officially DOR, but it looks like I'm headed there very fast.

I know a lot of you have been through far worse. The 2nd tri loss we had earlier this year just about killed me, so I've been pretty shaky since. That happened in January/February, and I don't think that will really change. We are also down to 3 vials of sperm, and that's putting a lot of pressure on things. As of now, we aren't interested in changing donors (ours is a known one with little to no possibility of obtaining more vials). Long story there.

Thanks again, everyone. I am trying hard to keep things in perspective.

Wait, you did a cycle this past May (the abysmal one) but your day 3 testing is 2 years old? This is not possible. There is always a baseline before you start the stims, which includes ultrasound and day 3 bloodwork. Get your records. They list your result and the normal reference range. You need to be aggressive with other testing as well, see a regular endocrinologist for thyroid function testing, etc. Also, is the sperm frozen? Are you doing ICSI or regular fertilization?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:don't give up. you're only 33. If you pull out of shared risk presumably they will refund everything? Including PGS?
Here is what I would do - at the end of the cycle request your records and do a few consults outside of SG - GW, CFA, Cornell. You might need to run extra tests. What are your numbers? FSH, AMH, etc? Are you officially DOR?

Another thing to consider - high dosages are not for everyone. They can actually affect egg quality (Menopur and Ganilerix/Cetrotide).

I know this sucks, but you need to start reading up and understanding the protocols and what is what in the process. Unless you have easy success (like you had with your first child) doing 2nd, 3rd and so on cycles will involve advocating for yourself, understanding the metrics and questioning the proposed course of action.

If I pull out, all SG fees will be reimbursed. We did also have to pay an outside lab for PGS ($4000 for up to 8 or 12 embryos -- we have only sent one) and this would not be reimbursed. If we leave SG, I would want to make it worth my trouble and go to Cornell but DW is understandably very concerned about the OOP cost. We might be able to get local coverage soon, but even that is up in the air.

As far as testing goes, I could probably use updated day 3 testing. It's been almost two years, as far as I know, since the last tests were done and my FSH was at 9 (it's been higher before) and AMH was at .5 -- no other tests have been done. My chart at SG still says unexplained, so not officially DOR, but it looks like I'm headed there very fast.

I know a lot of you have been through far worse. The 2nd tri loss we had earlier this year just about killed me, so I've been pretty shaky since. That happened in January/February, and I don't think that will really change. We are also down to 3 vials of sperm, and that's putting a lot of pressure on things. As of now, we aren't interested in changing donors (ours is a known one with little to no possibility of obtaining more vials). Long story there.

Thanks again, everyone. I am trying hard to keep things in perspective.

Wait, you did a cycle this past May (the abysmal one) but your day 3 testing is 2 years old? This is not possible. There is always a baseline before you start the stims, which includes ultrasound and day 3 bloodwork. Get your records. They list your result and the normal reference range. You need to be aggressive with other testing as well, see a regular endocrinologist for thyroid function testing, etc. Also, is the sperm frozen? Are you doing ICSI or regular fertilization?

I wasn't aware that FSH/AMH was tested when during baseline testing for an IVF cycle. Shady Grove only ever gives me E2 and progesterone levels. I've already requested my records so I should be able to look at everything soon. No one has ever suggested any thyroid testing but I'm going to ask for it before any subsequent cycles.

The sperm is frozen and we always have done ICSI.

[Anonymous]

Op I really feel for you. This is a very hard journey and everyone goes through it differently.

So I say this with love and respect for your journey: but you need to get a lot more knowledgable about this process and the protocols available to you. It's nice to feel like you can just leave everything up to your doctor, but there is too much on the line with IF not to be your own educated advocate. There are a lot of really knowledgable women on here and loads of information online that should really help you understand what tests are needed, etc.

[Anonymous]

Honestly OP I would seriously consider throwing in the towel since you already have one child. I can't see destroying your finances by going to Cornell when you have a child to take care of already. Plus the emotional toll is probably hindering your ability to enjoy the child you have. I have one child from my first ivf and had three frozen embryos. The FETs are a bust so far (we're also in shared risk at SG) and if the last embryo doesn't take we're done. It's just too much and we want to enjoy the child we have.