Middle and high school on Capitol Hill

[Anonymous]

Its so frustrating. I mean how much hold handing do all you idiots need. Just stay in the public schools past third the numbers are there you freaking idiots

[Anonymous]

I really hope you're right, PP. I want to be wrong, and want you to be right. But, as I said, I'm not optimistic, not in my heart of hearts at any rate.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I really hope you're right, PP. I want to be wrong, and want you to be right. But, as I said, I'm not optimistic, not in my heart of hearts at any rate.

What are you afraid of? What is the worst that can happen?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Its so frustrating. I mean how much hold handing do all you idiots need. Just stay in the public schools past third the numbers are there you freaking idiots

We are staying past third. In the fall, Brent will have at least three times as my 5th grader as it had just two years ago. But using a by-right middle school where 6th graders test proficient in both reading and math in the teens, that's a freaking hard sell to parents with multiple grad degrees.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I really hope you're right, PP. I want to be wrong, and want you to be right. But, as I said, I'm not optimistic, not in my heart of hearts at any rate.

What are you afraid of? What is the worst that can happen?

My above-grade-level kid won't learn anything in a classroom where the teacher (correctly) focuses on kids at or behind grade level. Especially in math.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I really hope you're right, PP. I want to be wrong, and want you to be right. But, as I said, I'm not optimistic, not in my heart of hearts at any rate.

What are you afraid of? What is the worst that can happen?

Um, my children being the only students of Asian descent in a MS school. That was my situation as a 12 year-old and racist epithets came my way every school day, with tough kids of various races pulling on the corner of their eyes to taunt me and admins telling my family to suck it up. My immigrant uncles and aunts taught me the advanced math I wasn't learning at school, and I read a lot on my own for English. Not doing it for my kids. Would rather move. It's hard enough that our DCPS is around 1% Asian.

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:Eastern's IBD pass rate average points totals have been a little lower than Banneker's to date, but they're only about to graduate their third class of IBD students, with a dozen students in a cohort.

Enough of this PC silliness. Controlling for race and class alone doesn't get you a high-performing school. In an urban center, bona fide selective admissions combined with decent facilities, strong teaching and leadership,and a diverse student body (with many high SES families of all races involved) gets you a high-performing school.

Yes, DCI will be offering International Baccalaureate Diploma studies, but only IBD lite. IBD studies won't be required at DCI, so they won't have a critical mass of students to offer many Higher Level (1-2 years past AP) classes. Reading the tea leaves, I predict that their pass total will be in the high 20s for the first five years or so they graduate students. If you're shooting for the stars in college admissions (Ivies, Little Ivies, Georgetown, Stanford, military academies, Duke etc.) and you're white or Asian, you're going to need a points total of 40+.

I'm the PP who's years away. Thank you for posting and explaining the stats. I'm familiar with the AP system from my own education but am learning about IB and watching closely what happens with the various local programs.

The other thing to consider is that Eastern and Banneker offer both AP and IB courses.

DCI, on the other hand, will only offer IB.

The problem definitely isn't that DCI will only offer IB courses, it's that their IB courses are unlikely to be terribly rigorous (because so many of their students aren't really "full" IBD material). If a Hill kid can score 6s and 7s on IBD exams at either the Standard or Higher Levels, 4s and 5s on corresponding APs come easily. Go visit one of the MoCo of Fairfax IBD programs and chat with their in-house IB Coordinator if you want to learn more. These programs run IBD open houses.

Just curious- are they not really "full IBD Material" because they're Hispanic? Or are you disgusted by the fact that DCI has black kids?

I am absolutely for a Hill middle school and a rigorous test-in high school, but your statement is flat out racist. The DCI feeders are very strong (stronger than many Hill schools in fact), and since you dismissed most of them as "not IDB material" based on nothing... You're really just a revolting racist.

- Hispanic IB diploma holder who probably would have been dismissed by racist trash like PP, but actually scored only 6s and 7s.

Hello Hispanic IBD holder, I'm not white. Look at DCI's PARCC scores, in the aggregate and by sub-bgroup. Then visit any of the MoCo elementary immersion "feeder" schools sending kids on to Richard Montgomery (which boasts one of the highest IBD average points totals in the world, and is loaded with high-scoring Hispanics). Compare the DCI feeder and DCI itself to the MoCo programs. Take my point without the vitriol.

No, your point is still racist. Just because you're Asian (yes I know who you are now), doesn't allow you to dismiss students based on their race.

Furthermore I would not say Montgomery county isn't doing its part when it comes to Hispanics. They themselves came to this conclusion last year. I understand that you're irritated that Yu Ying doesn't take mandarin speakers (I get it!), but that's not something that's Yu Ying or DCIs fault.

Granted, but you're painting with too broad a brush. The low-income Hispanic students I attended Boston Latin, and my Ivy, with were impressive and I know a little bit about racism (having been called "chink" hundreds of times as a kid). If cities bother to identify academically advanced minority kids young to get them into GT programs, then ensure they have access to free, unlimited test prep, they can be well represented in MS and HS test-in magnet programs. As has been pointed out, Chicago's application system for test-in magnets is superior to MoCo's. Disagree that YY and the other DCI feeders aren't to blame for the lack of native speakers (which negatively impacts their IBD program results later). I've done research on the issue - the DCPC Board seems open to considering letting native speakers test in to replace upper grades drop-outs, tweaking their LEA arrangements, but the feeder schools have not teamed up to ask for this.

As has been explained HUNDREDS of times, the DCI feeders can't do this unless they obtain approval from CONGRESS.

And all the comments you've posted has been consistently racist and xenophobic. I get that you want a language preference for Yu Ying. I support that. But your "research" consists of trashing schools and painting black and Hispanic kids as undesirable. You disgust me, frankly.

You're shadow boxing, mate. Arguably, all the comments you've posted have been seriously uptight. You can always talk to DCPSC Board members yourself about these issues. You can also complain to Jeff to get comments deleted.

I'm not your "mate".

Don't call me uptight jackass. You're racist. Also move to MoCo if you feel all this is beneath you.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I really hope you're right, PP. I want to be wrong, and want you to be right. But, as I said, I'm not optimistic, not in my heart of hearts at any rate.

What are you afraid of? What is the worst that can happen?

My above-grade-level kid won't learn anything in a classroom where the teacher (correctly) focuses on kids at or behind grade level. Especially in math.

Then you withdraw then after one year, move to the suburbs or upper NW as planned, and have them spend 30 minutes per day on Khan academy to catch up. You still have a house with tons of equity and options.

And if your 'gamble' pays off (or even if it doesn't_ your kid will have much more interesting life experiences to write about for his/her college application essays

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I really hope you're right, PP. I want to be wrong, and want you to be right. But, as I said, I'm not optimistic, not in my heart of hearts at any rate.

What are you afraid of? What is the worst that can happen?

Um, my children being the only students of Asian descent in a MS school. That was my situation as a 12 year-old and racist epithets came my way every school day, with tough kids of various races pulling on the corner of their eyes to taunt me and admins telling my family to suck it up. My immigrant uncles and aunts taught me the advanced math I wasn't learning at school, and I read a lot on my own for English. Not doing it for my kids. Would rather move. It's hard enough that our DCPS is around 1% Asian.

Please move already. I think a number of us would be happy to come and help you pack.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:From what I've observed, new arrivals to Cap Hill with babies and toddlers have a strong tendency to err on the side of optimism where MS goes. Flash forward 5 years, and at least half are gone, or on their way out (many after swearing up and down that they'd never go). After 15 years here, with kids in the lower ES grades, I'm feeling less optimistic about MS options than I was several years back.

Bowser doesn't seem interested in helping Latin or BASIS open second MS/HS campuses (e.g. by telling DCPS to hand off appealing real estate to them), and neither program appears to be pushing hard to expand locally. Deal is pretty much a closed book from the Hill now. Within 5 years, Hardy probably won't have OOB spots to auction off. Hobson and Two Rivers already have long WLs for those who aren't in the feeders or catchment areas. Test in DCPS MS programs are not on the table. Eliot-Hine and Jefferson may become crowd pleasers within 10 or 15 years, but not in 5.

Looks to me like those of us with little kids will have fewer acceptable MS options than parents of older kids.

I disagree and I think we'll know soon. We'll be in middle school within the next 5 years and would like to stay in the neighborhood. I think there are others in that boat. People think there is going to be a slow drip but actually it will happen really fast. Some year soon I think, 15 to 20 kids from a "good" ES are going to give it a go and then we'll see what happens. If Jefferson and EH become 50-60% IB, then I think you can start looking at Eastern.

Ward 6 people only seem to look at BASIS and Latin if they don't want to move or go private. There are only so many seats...

Isn't EH more likely than Jefferson? Because of housing mix? Most of the market rate housing for both Amidon-Bowen and Van Ness is multifamily, and smallish units, so not many UMC families with older kids no matter how good the schools. Whereas pretty much all the EH feeders have lots of row houses.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I really hope you're right, PP. I want to be wrong, and want you to be right. But, as I said, I'm not optimistic, not in my heart of hearts at any rate.

What are you afraid of? What is the worst that can happen?

Um, my children being the only students of Asian descent in a MS school. That was my situation as a 12 year-old and racist epithets came my way every school day, with tough kids of various races pulling on the corner of their eyes to taunt me and admins telling my family to suck it up. My immigrant uncles and aunts taught me the advanced math I wasn't learning at school, and I read a lot on my own for English. Not doing it for my kids. Would rather move. It's hard enough that our DCPS is around 1% Asian.

Please move already. I think a number of us would be happy to come and help you pack.

We're at Maury and we're happy there but if Latin or BASIS don't work out, may take you up on the offer.

[Anonymous]

There are about 90 kids per grade at Jefferson. If 10 more kids who were on grade level went to Jefferson next year, its 6th grade proficiency rate would rise from 11%/14% (ELA/Math) to 20%/23%. That's basically the same as Stuart-Hobson (6th grade there was 24%/18%)

Hardy was 42%/27% for 6th grade. Getting to that ELA level at Jefferson just through demographic changes would require about 50 more on-grade-level 6th graders...but if you assume as so many Hill families do, that mere proximity to on-grade-level students would help the underperformers, then you don't need that many.

Math is less daunting. To get to Hardy's level of math proficiency, JA would need to attract 16 more 6th graders who are on grade level. Brent has too few 5th graders to see its proficiency rate, but 13% of 5th graders at Tyler and 7% of 5th graders at Amidon were proficient in math. How many of them go to JA already, and how many more could be convinced to do so? How many proficient 5th graders will Van Ness have in a few years, and will any pick JA? And the kids don't just need to be from feeder schools. Will families in Wards 7 and 8 with proficient kids be willing to send kids to JA instead of SH or Hardy or charters? It really doesn't take that many kids to change proficiency levels at JA to match the middle schools that are currently more desired--and Jefferson used to be just as desirable, if not more so, than SH or Hardy.

But getting 10 or 16 or 50 kids who perform on grade level to pick Jefferson is not easy. Nobody want to be the first mover.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:From what I've observed, new arrivals to Cap Hill with babies and toddlers have a strong tendency to err on the side of optimism where MS goes. Flash forward 5 years, and at least half are gone, or on their way out (many after swearing up and down that they'd never go). After 15 years here, with kids in the lower ES grades, I'm feeling less optimistic about MS options than I was several years back.

Bowser doesn't seem interested in helping Latin or BASIS open second MS/HS campuses (e.g. by telling DCPS to hand off appealing real estate to them), and neither program appears to be pushing hard to expand locally. Deal is pretty much a closed book from the Hill now. Within 5 years, Hardy probably won't have OOB spots to auction off. Hobson and Two Rivers already have long WLs for those who aren't in the feeders or catchment areas. Test in DCPS MS programs are not on the table. Eliot-Hine and Jefferson may become crowd pleasers within 10 or 15 years, but not in 5.

Looks to me like those of us with little kids will have fewer acceptable MS options than parents of older kids.

I disagree and I think we'll know soon. We'll be in middle school within the next 5 years and would like to stay in the neighborhood. I think there are others in that boat. People think there is going to be a slow drip but actually it will happen really fast. Some year soon I think, 15 to 20 kids from a "good" ES are going to give it a go and then we'll see what happens. If Jefferson and EH become 50-60% IB, then I think you can start looking at Eastern.

Ward 6 people only seem to look at BASIS and Latin if they don't want to move or go private. There are only so many seats...

Isn't EH more likely than Jefferson? Because of housing mix? Most of the market rate housing for both Amidon-Bowen and Van Ness is multifamily, and smallish units, so not many UMC families with older kids no matter how good the schools. Whereas pretty much all the EH feeders have lots of row houses.

I don't know. Sounds like the Brenties organizing to get a group to jump to Jefferson in a couple years are a lot more serious about the exercise than the Maury upper grades parents.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:From what I've observed, new arrivals to Cap Hill with babies and toddlers have a strong tendency to err on the side of optimism where MS goes. Flash forward 5 years, and at least half are gone, or on their way out (many after swearing up and down that they'd never go). After 15 years here, with kids in the lower ES grades, I'm feeling less optimistic about MS options than I was several years back.

Bowser doesn't seem interested in helping Latin or BASIS open second MS/HS campuses (e.g. by telling DCPS to hand off appealing real estate to them), and neither program appears to be pushing hard to expand locally. Deal is pretty much a closed book from the Hill now. Within 5 years, Hardy probably won't have OOB spots to auction off. Hobson and Two Rivers already have long WLs for those who aren't in the feeders or catchment areas. Test in DCPS MS programs are not on the table. Eliot-Hine and Jefferson may become crowd pleasers within 10 or 15 years, but not in 5.

Looks to me like those of us with little kids will have fewer acceptable MS options than parents of older kids.

I disagree and I think we'll know soon. We'll be in middle school within the next 5 years and would like to stay in the neighborhood. I think there are others in that boat. People think there is going to be a slow drip but actually it will happen really fast. Some year soon I think, 15 to 20 kids from a "good" ES are going to give it a go and then we'll see what happens. If Jefferson and EH become 50-60% IB, then I think you can start looking at Eastern.

Ward 6 people only seem to look at BASIS and Latin if they don't want to move or go private. There are only so many seats...

Isn't EH more likely than Jefferson? Because of housing mix? Most of the market rate housing for both Amidon-Bowen and Van Ness is multifamily, and smallish units, so not many UMC families with older kids no matter how good the schools. Whereas pretty much all the EH feeders have lots of row houses.

There are hundreds, maybe 1000, market rate townhomes IB for Amidon. And JA is starting with higher proficiency rates and a history of being a desirable middle school that could be helpful with attracting higher-performing kids from families that have lived in DC a while. Charles Allen also has a Jefferson alum working for him. But it doesn't have to be a competition. It only takes a few kids over a few years for either school's reputation (not necessarily its quality; those two are very separate and I think at both schools there's a lot of quality already) to change.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:There are about 90 kids per grade at Jefferson. If 10 more kids who were on grade level went to Jefferson next year, its 6th grade proficiency rate would rise from 11%/14% (ELA/Math) to 20%/23%. That's basically the same as Stuart-Hobson (6th grade there was 24%/18%)

Hardy was 42%/27% for 6th grade. Getting to that ELA level at Jefferson just through demographic changes would require about 50 more on-grade-level 6th graders...but if you assume as so many Hill families do, that mere proximity to on-grade-level students would help the underperformers, then you don't need that many.

Math is less daunting. To get to Hardy's level of math proficiency, JA would need to attract 16 more 6th graders who are on grade level. Brent has too few 5th graders to see its proficiency rate, but 13% of 5th graders at Tyler and 7% of 5th graders at Amidon were proficient in math. How many of them go to JA already, and how many more could be convinced to do so? How many proficient 5th graders will Van Ness have in a few years, and will any pick JA? And the kids don't just need to be from feeder schools. Will families in Wards 7 and 8 with proficient kids be willing to send kids to JA instead of SH or Hardy or charters? It really doesn't take that many kids to change proficiency levels at JA to match the middle schools that are currently more desired--and Jefferson used to be just as desirable, if not more so, than SH or Hardy.

But getting 10 or 16 or 50 kids who perform on grade level to pick Jefferson is not easy. Nobody want to be the first mover.

If Jefferson could guarantee honors class offerings on a par with SH's for starters, your ask would be a lot easier.