School mentioning self contained class room?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:My son is in a self contained class and he's at or above grade level academically. They get a lot of personalized instruction, teacher attention and support. Don't be afraid of these classrooms. They also work to mainstream the kids.

I will say, I'm in MD.

This is also my experience in Moco.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I would absolutely not agree to this change without having the opportunity to observe the SC class first. Push back. Make the school show data as to why a self contained class is more appropriate than following the current IEP, and maybe adding compensatory services. Why not have the school follow the IEP (plus compensatory services) for a quarter or semester once school is back in person and then evaluate? There is a big loss of socialization and typical peer interaction opportunities in a SC class; that’s why the least restrictive environment is so important.

Also, I don’t know what jurisdiction you are in, but we are in DC and my experience and discussions with other parents of SN kids confirm that there is a lot of variation in SC classes, absolutely between different charter schools, but even between different DCPS schools. In DC, kids without learning disabilities but with autism or communication problems do not get taught to their full potential in some of these SC classes. My friends with kids formerly in CES classes have experienced this. Again, if you’re in DC, I wouldn’t allow this change without a chance to observe the self contained class your daughter would join.

Thanks for this we are in DC. We are currently at a charter which we liked originally but I am not sure if it is still the best fit. I am not confident about their ability to teach our child to the best of DD abilities given their major learning gap. Which is funny because they talk as if that is one of their big things they do well. They want to talk about it before the fall but I am hesitant given what I have seen so far and the crap zoom school year.
We will be talking with doctors about all of this as well. We have one evaluation at KKI that says Autism spectrum but her Developmental Neurologist says she doesn't agree she thinks it is a lot of other things that present very much the same. So IDK what the heck to think I can see both prospectives. I am not sure what it matter really other than services getting covered or offered.
But, we also have yet to try and medicine for anxiety or the suspected ADHD. So, I am interested to see how this might impact things as well.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I would absolutely not agree to this change without having the opportunity to observe the SC class first. Push back. Make the school show data as to why a self contained class is more appropriate than following the current IEP, and maybe adding compensatory services. Why not have the school follow the IEP (plus compensatory services) for a quarter or semester once school is back in person and then evaluate? There is a big loss of socialization and typical peer interaction opportunities in a SC class; that’s why the least restrictive environment is so important.

Also, I don’t know what jurisdiction you are in, but we are in DC and my experience and discussions with other parents of SN kids confirm that there is a lot of variation in SC classes, absolutely between different charter schools, but even between different DCPS schools. In DC, kids without learning disabilities but with autism or communication problems do not get taught to their full potential in some of these SC classes. My friends with kids formerly in CES classes have experienced this. Again, if you’re in DC, I wouldn’t allow this change without a chance to observe the self contained class your daughter would join.

Thanks for this we are in DC. We are currently at a charter which we liked originally but I am not sure if it is still the best fit. I am not confident about their ability to teach our child to the best of DD abilities given their major learning gap. Which is funny because they talk as if that is one of their big things they do well. They want to talk about it before the fall but I am hesitant given what I have seen so far and the crap zoom school year.
We will be talking with doctors about all of this as well. We have one evaluation at KKI that says Autism spectrum but her Developmental Neurologist says she doesn't agree she thinks it is a lot of other things that present very much the same. So IDK what the heck to think I can see both prospectives. I am not sure what it matter really other than services getting covered or offered.
But, we also have yet to try and medicine for anxiety or the suspected ADHD. So, I am interested to see how this might impact things as well.

DO NOT LEAVE THE CHARTER. RE-enroll. You have a lot more leverage for private placement from the Charter than you do from DCPS.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:
You want to ask this question, OP: What is the percentage of kids who move from self-contained classes to gen ed?

As you can see from this thread, it varies widely. Some districts use the opportunity to help kids catch up, others use it as a inferior babysitting track and once your kid is on it, they can never catch up.

I fought tooth and nail to keep my kid in gen ed with support, because self-contained classes were a one-way ticket to nowhere in my district.

This is my fear. That is will be babysitting and nothing will be done to challenge and move my kid forward. But, I got completely slammed for this fear, saying I was the problem early on in the posting. I very well maybe part of the problem. But is I'll not accept my DD being written off and not being pushed to the best of her abilities whatever they maybe. I don't feel like she has been pushed to the best of her academic abilities this year zoom school isn't great

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:OP, I agree with some previous PPs that you should push back and get more information.

Is may be more convenient for them, but is it really the right thing for your DD? The self-contained classes I have seen for autism are really for kids who can't communicate verbally very well and if your child can seeing as how she was mainstreamed before I would urge you to be cautious. How would this impact her socialization?

If they are thinking about a learning classroom with kids with different types of disabilities that might be better for your DD.

Could they get her an aide for gen ed instead? I would seriously consider holding her back a year if you think that could help. Your child is still very young and no one can possibly know what she'll be like in even a year or two in the future.

If you do accept the self contained class I would make sure they have her mainstreamed for certain subjects like math and science that are her strengths. They may not want to do it but you can insist and they can do it. I have seen it done and it was the best of both worlds for the child.

DD has a speech delay has made progress every year. But, was typical 9-11 months behind for her age every time tested. Our current speech therapist said she didn't think more speech made sense at this stage (gert 2 x30 sessions a week via zoom). She recommended working more on frustration threshold and self regulation and social skills.
When we left K out kid wasn't really reading and was doing kindergarten work just but behind the pace of the class for sure. DD never had an aide in K but they did have 3 teachers in the room. One of which spent a lot of time with DD and a few similar level peers.
We did ask about an aide for this year but when school never happened in-person there wasn't much of an point. I know small group or 1-1 is definitely better for DD (probably is for most NT too). So, I am not apposed to the idea of some smaller classes and an aide. I am just sorting out the best thing. She has potential to learn and is learning all be it differently and at a slower pace than NT kids

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:What grade? It sounds appropriate to me. I wouldn’t be afraid of it. Inclusion is overrated for kids who are behind and need a lot of support. A spade is a spade. You have to put your ego etc. aside.

Wow. It isn't about ego. It is about a kid getting further behind because of covid and services not being all that great over zoom.
It about trying to make sure the school isn't taking the easiest path vrs the best bath for a child. It's about knowing what to ask to make sure whatever classroom or services are the best to move a child forward.

You say scared and terrified etc., but your child is not learning. What does your child need. Is it possible to get the kind of support she needs in a gen Ed classroom. This isn’t ego as you’re thinking about if, just your own preconceived ideas and ideals. Those need to be set aside. It isn’t working for her.

Last time I was told about there self contained they said it was oh for IEP goals not attempting grade level work. We have other services to work on IEP goals. So, I don't understand being in a classroom that doesn't try to move kids forward with academic work when possible.

They are correct and I think you misunderstand because you're so new on the special ed road. The IEP goals should reflect what the student can reasonable achieve in one year. Of course, everyone wants students to meet grade level expectations but the specialized instruction provided in the self-contained classroom is geared towards ensuring students meet their goals, not grade level expectations. The difference is subtle but important. It's also one of the reasons why students from different grades (at least in early elementary) may be in the same self-contained classroom.

If your DC's goals are set that they are aiming to achieve grade level expectations, then that's the type of instruction your child will receive in the self-contained classroom.

How does one write grade level goals into an IEP?? Examples for 1-2 grade?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I teach self-contained. Your kid will get much more targeted intervention at her level. I would absolutely jump on it. You are not signing her up for life. Kids move back into gen ed all the time.

I teach in a school and have never seen a kid move from self contained to gen Ed. Not once in 17 years. They may get included in social studies, but they continue to be based in the self contained room

I work in a school with a self-contained program aimed at kids with multiple needs working at least 2 years below grade level and we usually have at least 1 kid per year sent back to their home school because they have outgrown the program and are near grade level. We also have multiple kids each year who are in the self-contained class as their "homeroom" but are included almost all day except for maybe just ELA, or just math. It is absolutely not a one-way ticket.

PP with kids in HS here. I, personally, know a number of kids (including my own) who moved out of self-contained over the years. I don't know where you're teaching that not a single kid moved into Gen Ed.

I teach in DCPS. The difference in self contained programs in MCPS and DCPS is staggering. So are the outcomes. There is no comparison.

So, how does a SC patent find the right program or school. Idk if SELA is good with IEPs of kids with Learning Differences but they are the only smaller classroom size school I know of. How does one find a school with a strong program?

What are some DC schools with strong SPED or sled contained programs that move kids forward?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I would absolutely not agree to this change without having the opportunity to observe the SC class first. Push back. Make the school show data as to why a self contained class is more appropriate than following the current IEP, and maybe adding compensatory services. Why not have the school follow the IEP (plus compensatory services) for a quarter or semester once school is back in person and then evaluate? There is a big loss of socialization and typical peer interaction opportunities in a SC class; that’s why the least restrictive environment is so important.

Also, I don’t know what jurisdiction you are in, but we are in DC and my experience and discussions with other parents of SN kids confirm that there is a lot of variation in SC classes, absolutely between different charter schools, but even between different DCPS schools. In DC, kids without learning disabilities but with autism or communication problems do not get taught to their full potential in some of these SC classes. My friends with kids formerly in CES classes have experienced this. Again, if you’re in DC, I wouldn’t allow this change without a chance to observe the self contained class your daughter would join.

Thanks for this we are in DC. We are currently at a charter which we liked originally but I am not sure if it is still the best fit. I am not confident about their ability to teach our child to the best of DD abilities given their major learning gap. Which is funny because they talk as if that is one of their big things they do well. They want to talk about it before the fall but I am hesitant given what I have seen so far and the crap zoom school year.
We will be talking with doctors about all of this as well. We have one evaluation at KKI that says Autism spectrum but her Developmental Neurologist says she doesn't agree she thinks it is a lot of other things that present very much the same. So IDK what the heck to think I can see both prospectives. I am not sure what it matter really other than services getting covered or offered.
But, we also have yet to try and medicine for anxiety or the suspected ADHD. So, I am interested to see how this might impact things as well.

DO NOT LEAVE THE CHARTER. RE-enroll. You have a lot more leverage for private placement from the Charter than you do from DCPS.

What how?? Why?? How do we learn more about this?
Even if this is true I go the impression there aren't many good privates around either??
Who do we talk with about this?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

DO NOT LEAVE THE CHARTER. RE-enroll. You have a lot more leverage for private placement from the Charter than you do from DCPS.

What how?? Why?? How do we learn more about this?
Even if this is true I go the impression there aren't many good privates around either??
Who do we talk with about this?

I am not a lawyer - just a parent trying to navigate DCPS with a child with an IEP.

Here is what I understand:
1 - Each Charter (Or Charter network - Like KIPP) is it own LEA "Local Educational Agency”. When the Charter was created - they are required to educate all students enrolled - even children with Special Education Needs. They can't kick your kid out because they do not have a self-contained classroom and your child needs that.
Federal law requires each LEA to "locating, evaluating, and identifying all eligible children with disabilities in their district." In this case - the LEA = district.
Once a student is identified as eligible for services under the IDEA, the local school district is responsible for ensuring that the student receives a free, appropriate public education.

It is not your job to find the right private school for your child - that is your Charter's Job (if they can not provide FAPE within the established structures)

Open up the procedural safeguards document that the school gave you. There is a contact in there for help - Advocates for Justice in Education. They can explain it to you.

In your next meeting with the school - ANYTHING they say about a placement outside of the current school write down and send back to them as a part of your meeting minutes. You might need to have evidence that and hold them to their statements in the future.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

DO NOT LEAVE THE CHARTER. RE-enroll. You have a lot more leverage for private placement from the Charter than you do from DCPS.

What how?? Why?? How do we learn more about this?
Even if this is true I go the impression there aren't many good privates around either??
Who do we talk with about this?

I am not a lawyer - just a parent trying to navigate DCPS with a child with an IEP.

Here is what I understand:
1 - Each Charter (Or Charter network - Like KIPP) is it own LEA "Local Educational Agency”. When the Charter was created - they are required to educate all students enrolled - even children with Special Education Needs. They can't kick your kid out because they do not have a self-contained classroom and your child needs that.
Federal law requires each LEA to "locating, evaluating, and identifying all eligible children with disabilities in their district." In this case - the LEA = CORRECTION - Charter school not district.
Once a student is identified as eligible for services under the IDEA, the local school district is responsible for ensuring that the student receives a free, appropriate public education.

It is not your job to find the right private school for your child - that is your Charter's Job (if they can not provide FAPE within the established structures)

Open up the procedural safeguards document that the school gave you. There is a contact in there for help - Advocates for Justice in Education. They can explain it to you.

In your next meeting with the school - ANYTHING they say about a placement outside of the current school write down and send back to them as a part of your meeting minutes. You might need to have evidence that and hold them to their statements in the future.

Typo - I was trying to get the content out quickly - The LEA = Charter school

[Anonymous]

Wow, it’s interesting how people paint DCPS. As a self contained teacher I have transitioned multiple students out of my room to gen ed.

A child isn’t put into self contained based on grades alone, that is a recipe for disaster. I have kids 1-2 grade levels above their own in my CES classroom lol. Some kids just need a smaller class size and get way overwhelmed and then their behaviors become unmanageable in gen ed. So I give them the tools to make that possible for them.

For my kids who are way behind, the goal is to gain 1.5-2 years in one year. You can always ask for this data. Strangely I’ve had a lot of parents with advocates and such (which doesn’t bother me) but they ask me how I move children.

This is only my 3rd year with DCPS and I didn’t realize they have such a poor reputation for sped. I do think it really depends on the teacher and the program.

I’d always advocate for gen ed and pull out/push in before self contained.

Ps. Private placement isn’t the goldmine parents think it is, often times it can hinder your child more.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

DO NOT LEAVE THE CHARTER. RE-enroll. You have a lot more leverage for private placement from the Charter than you do from DCPS.

What how?? Why?? How do we learn more about this?
Even if this is true I go the impression there aren't many good privates around either??
Who do we talk with about this?

I am not a lawyer - just a parent trying to navigate DCPS with a child with an IEP.

Here is what I understand:
1 - Each Charter (Or Charter network - Like KIPP) is it own LEA "Local Educational Agency”. When the Charter was created - they are required to educate all students enrolled - even children with Special Education Needs. They can't kick your kid out because they do not have a self-contained classroom and your child needs that.
Federal law requires each LEA to "locating, evaluating, and identifying all eligible children with disabilities in their district." In this case - the LEA = district.
Once a student is identified as eligible for services under the IDEA, the local school district is responsible for ensuring that the student receives a free, appropriate public education.

It is not your job to find the right private school for your child - that is your Charter's Job (if they can not provide FAPE within the established structures)

Open up the procedural safeguards document that the school gave you. There is a contact in there for help - Advocates for Justice in Education. They can explain it to you.

In your next meeting with the school - ANYTHING they say about a placement outside of the current school write down and send back to them as a part of your meeting minutes. You might need to have evidence that and hold them to their statements in the future.

This is good advice. Don't many of the placements for places like Lab come from charters in DC?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

DO NOT LEAVE THE CHARTER. RE-enroll. You have a lot more leverage for private placement from the Charter than you do from DCPS.

What how?? Why?? How do we learn more about this?
Even if this is true I go the impression there aren't many good privates around either??
Who do we talk with about this?

I am not a lawyer - just a parent trying to navigate DCPS with a child with an IEP.

Here is what I understand:
1 - Each Charter (Or Charter network - Like KIPP) is it own LEA "Local Educational Agency”. When the Charter was created - they are required to educate all students enrolled - even children with Special Education Needs. They can't kick your kid out because they do not have a self-contained classroom and your child needs that.
Federal law requires each LEA to "locating, evaluating, and identifying all eligible children with disabilities in their district." In this case - the LEA = district.
Once a student is identified as eligible for services under the IDEA, the local school district is responsible for ensuring that the student receives a free, appropriate public education.

It is not your job to find the right private school for your child - that is your Charter's Job (if they can not provide FAPE within the established structures)

Open up the procedural safeguards document that the school gave you. There is a contact in there for help - Advocates for Justice in Education. They can explain it to you.

In your next meeting with the school - ANYTHING they say about a placement outside of the current school write down and send back to them as a part of your meeting minutes. You might need to have evidence that and hold them to their statements in the future.

This is good advice. Don't many of the placements for places like Lab come from charters in DC?

Not at all.

[Anonymous]

Stay at the charter. Wait until next year — after you have a chance to observe the self contained class — to discuss whether or not it is appropriate for your child. Call AJE. Hopefully they can give you some suggestions of special needs schools that might work for your child.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:
So, how does a SC patent find the right program or school. Idk if SELA is good with IEPs of kids with Learning Differences but they are the only smaller classroom size school I know of. How does one find a school with a strong program?

What are some DC schools with strong SPED or sled contained programs that move kids forward?

Unfortunately, most charter schools will offer little useful information about their special Ed programs to prospective parents. Legally, every charter should provide every child with an IEP with a “Free Appropriate Public Education.” In reality, few charters designed for typical kids can provide FAPE for kids with severe or complex special needs. Some don’t want to, some can’t afford to, and others lack the expertise and staff to do so. Some charters will acknowledge they can’t meet the child’s needs and be quick to offer a “non public placement” (I.e., pay to send your child to a private special needs school). Some will deny the kid needs help, push ineffective supports, or write a great IEP and then fail to implement it. If you’re lucky, you might find a charter that actually works for your child. Personally, we’ve tried three charter schools and none have been perfect. The best for my child with fairly severe ASD was Creative Minds. If you want to start a new thread describing you child’s diagnosis and profile, folks can make recommendations. I really wish there was a better way to find this information, but my child has been in the DC public schools for four years and I’m still recommending that you ask an anonymous message board for advice. ☹️ You can try to contact AJE and see if they can give you some guidance; IME some of their advocates have more bandwidth and expertise than others. You can also pay a special Ed advocate, but there is no licensing or educational requirements for that position, and IME many advocates are just other parents like you who’ve been through this process and may or may not have up to date, relevant information to share with you. You may get just as helpful guidance from posting here.

FWIW, I have not heard anything good or bad about Sela’s programs for kids with SNs.