Science at Liberal Arts Colleges: A Better Education?

[Anonymous]

Some of us want to pay for a great education, not PTSD!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:If you come out with a STEM degree at a school like UC Berkeley, that is incredibly impressive. Much more so than Middlebury or Colby or Swarthmore. UC Berkeley STEM is cutthroat and hard as hell.

Sounds like you are describing a tour in a combat zone.

Not everyone's dream for their kid's undergrad experience.

But hey, it is what impresses you.

I went to a SLAC. I don’t think I could make it in STEM at UC Berkeley personally. Maybe I could but I doubt I would stand out like I did at my SLAC. But heck ya, those Berkeley kids are impressive. Ask any STEM university professor and they would say the same thing.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:If you come out with a STEM degree at a school like UC Berkeley, that is incredibly impressive. Much more so than Middlebury or Colby or Swarthmore. UC Berkeley STEM is cutthroat and hard as hell.

You think Swarthmore STEM isn’t hard? Okay buddy.

Not saying it isn’t hard but Swarthmore way overplays their intellectual and tough brand. Really not that different from other SLACS. Top 10 SLACs are pretty much indistinguishable but Swarthmore is more braggy. They act like they are UChicago or Columbia. Big chip on their shoulder for some reason.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:If you come out with a STEM degree at a school like UC Berkeley, that is incredibly impressive. Much more so than Middlebury or Colby or Swarthmore. UC Berkeley STEM is cutthroat and hard as hell.

You think Swarthmore STEM isn’t hard? Okay buddy.

Not saying it isn’t hard but Swarthmore way overplays their intellectual and tough brand. Really not that different from other SLACS. Top 10 SLACs are pretty much indistinguishable but Swarthmore is more braggy. They act like they are UChicago or Columbia. Big chip on their shoulder for some reason.

Maybe it's because so many Swatties go onto earn PhDs? Historically, it is THE feeder for top doctoral programs across multiple disciplines, including STEM fields.
https://www.swarthmore.edu/institutional-research/doctorates-awarded

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:If you come out with a STEM degree at a school like UC Berkeley, that is incredibly impressive. Much more so than Middlebury or Colby or Swarthmore. UC Berkeley STEM is cutthroat and hard as hell.

You think Swarthmore STEM isn’t hard? Okay buddy.

Not saying it isn’t hard but Swarthmore way overplays their intellectual and tough brand. Really not that different from other SLACS. Top 10 SLACs are pretty much indistinguishable but Swarthmore is more braggy. They act like they are UChicago or Columbia. Big chip on their shoulder for some reason.

Go ahead and substantiate that wacky claim.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:If you come out with a STEM degree at a school like UC Berkeley, that is incredibly impressive. Much more so than Middlebury or Colby or Swarthmore. UC Berkeley STEM is cutthroat and hard as hell.

You think Swarthmore STEM isn’t hard? Okay buddy.

Not saying it isn’t hard but Swarthmore way overplays their intellectual and tough brand. Really not that different from other SLACS. Top 10 SLACs are pretty much indistinguishable but Swarthmore is more braggy. They act like they are UChicago or Columbia. Big chip on their shoulder for some reason.

Maybe it's because so many Swatties go onto earn PhDs? Historically, it is THE feeder for top doctoral programs across multiple disciplines, including STEM fields.
https://www.swarthmore.edu/institutional-research/doctorates-awarded

Good point. The others at the top of that list share the difficulty reputation.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Absolutely not. They may do well in undergrad, when they have tons of encouragement and individual attention from professors, but they consistently struggle in graduate school when they will have to deal with high expectations for independence and a lack of constant encouragement and hand-holding. Any R1 program (state or private) will better prepare them for a career in science, where how they do in grad school is going to make or break it for them.

Can you explain this then?

https://www.swarthmore.edu/institutional-research/doctorates-awarded

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Absolutely not. They may do well in undergrad, when they have tons of encouragement and individual attention from professors, but they consistently struggle in graduate school when they will have to deal with high expectations for independence and a lack of constant encouragement and hand-holding. Any R1 program (state or private) will better prepare them for a career in science, where how they do in grad school is going to make or break it for them.

Can you explain this then?

https://www.swarthmore.edu/institutional-research/doctorates-awarded

Ph.D in History, Psychology?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:If you come out with a STEM degree at a school like UC Berkeley, that is incredibly impressive. Much more so than Middlebury or Colby or Swarthmore. UC Berkeley STEM is cutthroat and hard as hell.

Sounds like you are describing a tour in a combat zone.

Not everyone's dream for their kid's undergrad experience.

But hey, it is what impresses you.

I went to a SLAC. I don’t think I could make it in STEM at UC Berkeley personally. Maybe I could but I doubt I would stand out like I did at my SLAC. But heck ya, those Berkeley kids are impressive. Ask any STEM university professor and they would say the same thing.

I went to a SLAC too. I got into the Chemistry PhD program at Berkeley. I didn't go, both went to a top social science PhD program instead. I'm sure I would have fine at Berkeley as well. I did get to TA in Chemistry at the other school and the kids in my section did much better than those in other sections. I think this was because I learned to teach better at the SLAC and English was actually my first language.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Absolutely not. They may do well in undergrad, when they have tons of encouragement and individual attention from professors, but they consistently struggle in graduate school when they will have to deal with high expectations for independence and a lack of constant encouragement and hand-holding. Any R1 program (state or private) will better prepare them for a career in science, where how they do in grad school is going to make or break it for them.

Can you explain this then?

https://www.swarthmore.edu/institutional-research/doctorates-awarded

It is because you can't get a decent job directly from a SLAC. You need an advanced degree. Undergrad engineers, CS students, etc from research universities get good jobs right out of school.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Absolutely not. They may do well in undergrad, when they have tons of encouragement and individual attention from professors, but they consistently struggle in graduate school when they will have to deal with high expectations for independence and a lack of constant encouragement and hand-holding. Any R1 program (state or private) will better prepare them for a career in science, where how they do in grad school is going to make or break it for them.

Can you explain this then?

https://www.swarthmore.edu/institutional-research/doctorates-awarded

Ph.D in History, Psychology?

Is it easy going through life as a fool?

https://www.thecollegesolution.com/the-colleges-where-phds-get-their-start/

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Absolutely not. They may do well in undergrad, when they have tons of encouragement and individual attention from professors, but they consistently struggle in graduate school when they will have to deal with high expectations for independence and a lack of constant encouragement and hand-holding. Any R1 program (state or private) will better prepare them for a career in science, where how they do in grad school is going to make or break it for them.

Can you explain this then?

https://www.swarthmore.edu/institutional-research/doctorates-awarded

Ph.D in History, Psychology?

Look a little closer, genius.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Absolutely not. They may do well in undergrad, when they have tons of encouragement and individual attention from professors, but they consistently struggle in graduate school when they will have to deal with high expectations for independence and a lack of constant encouragement and hand-holding. Any R1 program (state or private) will better prepare them for a career in science, where how they do in grad school is going to make or break it for them.

Can you explain this then?

https://www.swarthmore.edu/institutional-research/doctorates-awarded

Ph.D in History, Psychology?

Look a little closer, genius.

Dummy isn’t capable.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:If you come out with a STEM degree at a school like UC Berkeley, that is incredibly impressive. Much more so than Middlebury or Colby or Swarthmore. UC Berkeley STEM is cutthroat and hard as hell.

Sounds like you are describing a tour in a combat zone.

Not everyone's dream for their kid's undergrad experience.

But hey, it is what impresses you.

I went to a SLAC. I don’t think I could make it in STEM at UC Berkeley personally. Maybe I could but I doubt I would stand out like I did at my SLAC. But heck ya, those Berkeley kids are impressive. Ask any STEM university professor and they would say the same thing.

I went to a SLAC too. I got into the Chemistry PhD program at Berkeley. I didn't go, both went to a top social science PhD program instead. I'm sure I would have fine at Berkeley as well. I did get to TA in Chemistry at the other school and the kids in my section did much better than those in other sections. I think this was because I learned to teach better at the SLAC and English was actually my first language.

Sure, you would have excelled at Berkeley. More likely, Berkeley would have chewed you up and spit you out. Sure you were the best TA in your grad program! Did you go to undergrad at Swarthmore by any chance?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:If you come out with a STEM degree at a school like UC Berkeley, that is incredibly impressive. Much more so than Middlebury or Colby or Swarthmore. UC Berkeley STEM is cutthroat and hard as hell.

Sounds like you are describing a tour in a combat zone.

Not everyone's dream for their kid's undergrad experience.

But hey, it is what impresses you.

I went to a SLAC. I don’t think I could make it in STEM at UC Berkeley personally. Maybe I could but I doubt I would stand out like I did at my SLAC. But heck ya, those Berkeley kids are impressive. Ask any STEM university professor and they would say the same thing.

I went to a SLAC too. I got into the Chemistry PhD program at Berkeley. I didn't go, both went to a top social science PhD program instead. I'm sure I would have fine at Berkeley as well. I did get to TA in Chemistry at the other school and the kids in my section did much better than those in other sections. I think this was because I learned to teach better at the SLAC and English was actually my first language.

Who applies to both Chemistry and Social Science PhD programs? That is very strange.