Can professors force students to attend class in person?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Attendance apologies around COVID are set by the university and I can’t fathom a school not allowing a student to opt into DL. Clarity around this isn’t great right now and I’m finding students think they have to come in when actually they don’t and I won’t be teaching in person 90% of the time.
Can your child just directly ask the department chair if there is a policy in the works for opting into distance learning? That would be an appropriate person to ask (the Professor doesn’t set this at a department-level) and in college “Dean of Students” isn’t a thing.

So sick of people who think THEIR little world is THE world.

Of course Dean iof students is a “thing” in college. Try googling it you smug jerk.

At the university I teach at, my kid’s school, AU, Vanderbilt, U of Texas, Catholic University, NYU, Harvard.let’s just say the larger world.

So try practicing some humility

Hello! Not-humble-enough-PP here! I am also a university professor, so chill. To clarify, I realize Dean of Students is a position that does exist, but they are not typically related to or under Academic Affairs, right? They are more for concerns re: student life, outside of academic policy. If OP's kid's school has one, perhaps their office (not directly the Dean) would be a good point of contact for concerns re: residence life or something, but not course attendance policies. PS I will work on being more humble if you work on correcting people in a way that is...I don't know...less like a rabid animal?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Just call her doctor and get a note saying she has compromised immunity and must be excused from in-person classes. Its like getting a note from the eye doctor to get out of swim in gym.

And people can ABSOLUTELY focus with a mask on for two hours. How the f*ck do you think surgeons perform surgery?

You don't lie about a health situation that doesn't exist. You take it at a different school or wait.

No doctor is going to say she is immune suppressed.

Dr. Nick might!

[Anonymous]

This is one of the many reasons I chose to teach online. If I had a student who had signed up then changed their mind and decided they felt unsafe, I would have been on the hook to somehow still provide the course to them (our university is telling us to be flexible with attendance). Between this type of thing and the inevitable "I need to miss class because my roommate/parent/coworker tested positive and I am now waiting on results", it didn't seem worth it.

Sorry your daughter is in this situation, OP. I would reach out to a higher up to see whether this is against university policy. Normally professors can enforce any type of attendance policy they want (unless student has a disability accommodation that specifies flexibility with attendance), but most have come out with formal policies for COVID.

[Anonymous]

Another college professor here. I’m sorry your daughter is in this situation, but she may not have much recourse if the professor isn’t in violation of university policy. If the faculty member teaching it thinks the pedagogical goals of the course can only be met in person and there is no departmental or university policy against it, it’s unlikely that appealing to a higher authority will be helpful. It can’t hurt to reach out to the department chair, but you should know that very few people at a university can actually intervene in a professor’s course and they tend to be high-ranking. Most people at a university who are called deans do not have any supervisory role over faculty. Anyone called a dean of students would not have authority over faculty, although the actual dean of a college or school would, as would the provost. But I would not go up the chain of command about a particular course. First, have your student find out what the reasons are for being in-person and whether the professor has plans for what to do if students get sick or must quarantine. This should definitely be your student, not you, although feel free to coach her on the email. You should also know that setting up a course for simultaneous in-person learning and distance learning is actually quite complicated and and requires a lot of technology. It may not be possible for the professor to do both, especially if it is a lab course or something similar. But there should still be a plan for students if they get sick or if they have medical reasons for not being able to attend in person, even setting aside the mandatory disability accommodations.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:My dd signed up for a class that is foundational to her learning path. The school was unclear about the mode of instruction till the last minute. Now the professor has made it mandatory that all students attend in person, with consequences if they don’t. The state I am in is a raging COVID hotspot and as a parent I am upset at this decision. I do not want my DD to face the risk of sitting in class. It’s a 2 hr class to boot and I can’t fathom how she can focus with a mask on her face, for that long. What is a logical way to address this with the school, without losing my mind?

I feel badly for anyone who spent time sympathizing with this OP. You’ve been had. This is an absolute troll post.

Are you for real? Why would this be a troll post? I’m worried sick for our safety.
OP

[Anonymous]

Then your daughter won’t pass the class. Tell her to put a mask on and go to the class. An adult wearing a mask for two hours is no big deal.

[Anonymous]

I find it surprising that someone who is at least 18 years old can't wear a mask for 2 hours. Have you coddled her your entire life? It sounds like she has poor functioning, probably because of your poor parenting.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Then your daughter won’t pass the class. Tell her to put a mask on and go to the class. An adult wearing a mask for two hours is no big deal.

Lol OP is probably one of those people who complains about millenials and doesn't realize that she's raising a young adult who is part of a generation even worse than millenials.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:My dd signed up for a class that is foundational to her learning path. The school was unclear about the mode of instruction till the last minute. Now the professor has made it mandatory that all students attend in person, with consequences if they don’t. The state I am in is a raging COVID hotspot and as a parent I am upset at this decision. I do not want my DD to face the risk of sitting in class. It’s a 2 hr class to boot and I can’t fathom how she can focus with a mask on her face, for that long. What is a logical way to address this with the school, without losing my mind?

My 18 yr old was wearing a mask for 6hrs/day at work.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Then your daughter won’t pass the class. Tell her to put a mask on and go to the class. An adult wearing a mask for two hours is no big deal.

Lol OP is probably one of those people who complains about millenials and doesn't realize that she's raising a young adult who is part of a generation even worse than millenials.

DP. All this personal bashing of OP is nasty and completely useless. You are not here to offer any actual ideas like some PPs but to snark at OP for being worried about her daughter. You seem very quick to assume that all the DD has to do is wear a mask and it'll be fine. You're naïve or ignorant or both.

You all focused hard on the mask comment and yes, it's entirely possible to wear a mask for hours on end and that shouldn't be the real concern.

But I think OP is right to be worried about a class that meets several times each week. OP and DD don't know for sure how crowded the classroom actually will be (let's face it, six-foot distancing on ALL sides is already not happening and will fall apart quickly in many classrooms). They don't know that any of the other students will take masking seriously or will go around with symptoms like many young adults have done (ask Florida and the beach communities in VA how that's working out right now). The professor sounds arrogant and there's no knowing if the professor will bother to enforce mask wearing in the room or just let it slide. And the DD lives AT HOME so is going back and forth possibly from this classroom to a household with others in it whom she might expose to the virus if the class is poorly managed and there's no real distancing or masking except for the DD's own mask.

Right now, wearing your own one mask in a situation isn't always enough. The idea is that masks work if we ALL wear them especially indoors EVERY time, and do so while six feet apart--at least. Sure, the DD can wear a mask for 2 hours at a time. But leaping on that as the sole issue for the DD and the OP is just ignorant. OP is right to be concerned.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Another college professor here. I’m sorry your daughter is in this situation, but she may not have much recourse if the professor isn’t in violation of university policy. If the faculty member teaching it thinks the pedagogical goals of the course can only be met in person and there is no departmental or university policy against it, it’s unlikely that appealing to a higher authority will be helpful. It can’t hurt to reach out to the department chair, but you should know that very few people at a university can actually intervene in a professor’s course and they tend to be high-ranking. Most people at a university who are called deans do not have any supervisory role over faculty. Anyone called a dean of students would not have authority over faculty, although the actual dean of a college or school would, as would the provost. But I would not go up the chain of command about a particular course. First, have your student find out what the reasons are for being in-person and whether the professor has plans for what to do if students get sick or must quarantine. This should definitely be your student, not you, although feel free to coach her on the email. You should also know that setting up a course for simultaneous in-person learning and distance learning is actually quite complicated and and requires a lot of technology. It may not be possible for the professor to do both, especially if it is a lab course or something similar. But there should still be a plan for students if they get sick or if they have medical reasons for not being able to attend in person, even setting aside the mandatory disability accommodations.

If the professor fails to enforce masking in the classroom, what then? All the pedagogical reasons aside, what does any student do if there is supposed to be masking in class and students flout that or wear masks slung around their chins "because I can't breathe!" and the professor...does nothing? Asking seriously. I can see this happening with some professors. I also suspect a lot of students would be afraid to say anything because they believe calling out the professor and class on this would harm their grades.

[Anonymous]

OP, my advice is is for you to talk to someone at this school. Does the professor have the right to enforce attendance? This seems a little crazy ( to me). If so, you have 2 choices: take the class with a mask or wait until next semester. Just curious, what kind of class? A lecture or is this for a science lab? The multiple times per week for 2 hours seems high.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:My dd signed up for a class that is foundational to her learning path. The school was unclear about the mode of instruction till the last minute. Now the professor has made it mandatory that all students attend in person, with consequences if they don’t. The state I am in is a raging COVID hotspot and as a parent I am upset at this decision. I do not want my DD to face the risk of sitting in class. It’s a 2 hr class to boot and I can’t fathom how she can focus with a mask on her face, for that long. What is a logical way to address this with the school, without losing my mind?

Unleash your rage in this order- department head, President of the school, board of regents. You have to be a pain in the ass. Make sure they hear from you 2-3 times a day. Your goal should be in person meeting with the president and or board. Those people hate interacting with “customers”. Do not let them tell you there are no face to face meeting because of the Pandemic.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:My dd signed up for a class that is foundational to her learning path. The school was unclear about the mode of instruction till the last minute. Now the professor has made it mandatory that all students attend in person, with consequences if they don’t. The state I am in is a raging COVID hotspot and as a parent I am upset at this decision. I do not want my DD to face the risk of sitting in class. It’s a 2 hr class to boot and I can’t fathom how she can focus with a mask on her face, for that long. What is a logical way to address this with the school, without losing my mind?

Unleash your rage in this order- department head, President of the school, board of regents. You have to be a pain in the ass. Make sure they hear from you 2-3 times a day. Your goal should be in person meeting with the president and or board. Those people hate interacting with “customers”. Do not let them tell you there are no face to face meeting because of the Pandemic.

? OP’s kid is presumably an adult.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Just call her doctor and get a note saying she has compromised immunity and must be excused from in-person classes. Its like getting a note from the eye doctor to get out of swim in gym.

And people can ABSOLUTELY focus with a mask on for two hours. How the f*ck do you think surgeons perform surgery?

I don’t know if that will help her unless they offer the class virtually( which they are not!). She still needs those credits. They promised a hybrid version and back tracked on that

Call the dean of students. They need to hear from families so they can use that info in making decisions.