People who moved from DC to Arlington / suburbs in general -- did things improve for you?

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:We lived in an affluent part of DC for several years, but even there it seemed we could never feel completely safe. My wife had a couple of scary incidents where sketchy guys were following her on her walks (once with baby stroller!) and she had to either start running or one time she actually ran into a starbucks to get away. That was the last straw and we have had no problems in NoVA.

OP here. Thanks for your responses, everyone; I appreciate your honest and it seems like the majority of you are pretty happy with your move.

The quote above is my biggest reason for wanting to move as well. Pretty much everyone I know in DC has a similar story or two.

I agree with the people who said that Arlington and Bethesda are bland and sterile; I like the old architecture in DC, but even that's being torn down, but I don't think it justifies dropping mad money in an area where I'm uncomfortable. I will say to the "nosy neighbor" PP that I DEFINITELY have that in DC in spades, haha!

OP, where do people you know live in DC? I live in upper NW near MD line and I've never been followed, nor had any other scary incidents. Those types of incidents are as rare in our neighborhood as I imagine they are 5 min away in MD.

Logan Circle, Chinatown/Gallery Place, Dupont (one friend saw a woman being raped in front of their building), U St, L'Enfant station (I had a really scary incident there) and DEFINITELY Columbia Heights! My friend who lives there could write a 10-volume book about the stuff she sees.

PP here. I'm not surprised given the places you've mentioned (I work near Dupont). We live up here in the boonies close to Rock Creek Park and while not as walkable, those types of incidents are extremely rare.

OP here again. What's up, former neighbor (I used to be in the "boonies" as well in upper NW)? I'm surprised by how much I miss it.

PP here. We are actually EOTP upper NW. It's been pretty great during the pandemic. Low density, safe, kids run feral through the woods, backyards with room for outdoor toys, sidewalks for scootering during breaks from distance learning. I originally preferred a more walkable area closer to downtown, but it's definitely not bad right now. And no one who buys here moves to the burbs, since it basically is the burbs, lol.

Haha, exactly -- basically Nova/MoCo with a DC zipcode. That sounds like a nice life! Did you live closer to downtown, and how does your experience compare? Also, how is your commute to Dupont?

PP. We actually moved from the real suburbs, where we were renting when we first moved to the area--however, most of our neighbors with young kids have moved from Petworth and the like. It's been a great move. I can walk to the red line (Silver Spring) and it's not a bad commute. I work between Farragut North and Dupont--usually get off at Farragut in ~20-25 min at peak rush hour. Not that I've been in the office since mid-March.

That sounds ideal! But WFH is nothing to complain about, either

[Anonymous]

Just to counter - we moved from intown DC to upper NW. If you can afford it - it's great. Feels like the suburbs up here with lots of trees and open space. Schools are good and it is great to have your kids be able to walk to school. Plus, no school buses which means your kids will go to school roughly the same time from elementary school through high school.

There are other areas like this across DC - the intense urban areas can be so much fun and yet so exhausting.

[Anonymous]

That sounds ideal! But WFH is nothing to complain about, either

PP here. Actually, it's not all that great when you're simultaneously trying to do distance learning for an elementary kid--but that's a discussion for a different thread!

[Anonymous]

What does "intense urban areas" mean? That's a nicely turned phrase.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

That sounds ideal! But WFH is nothing to complain about, either

PP here. Actually, it's not all that great when you're simultaneously trying to do distance learning for an elementary kid--but that's a discussion for a different thread!

Ouch. Good luck, PP. Sending you strength for that one, and kudos for not giving up on distance learning! Apparently tons of others have thrown in the towel ages ago. -OP

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:We moved from DC to Arlington and I love it!!! In DC our kids went to a charter school which meant every morning started with fighting city traffic for a 3 mile drive and then hunting for parking. Ugh! Now my kids take a free school bus that picks up two blocks away and there is even a late bus for when they do after school clubs! We go for tons of bike rides because biking on the city streets isn't terrifying and we can pretty easily get to trails that are much less crowded than the Rock Creek Park trail we used to bike on. overall, our lives are so much simpler and easier now.

My spouse works in Arlington so one of our commutes is much shorter now and my commute is about the same by metro. I can walk to a few good coffee shops, Sweetgreens, Giant, Trader Joes, Whole Foods. It is actually more walkable than some of the places I lived in DC. (We live in Lyon Park).

I just noticed the earlier PP who looked down on people who want things to be easier. I used to be like that but honestly after 10 years of DH and I each working 50+ hours a week and juggling two kids, I was just worn down and wanted free school buses. And we are actually as close or closer to the DC museums than we were when we lived in DC. And my favorite local theater is Signature, which is in Arlington so no loss there (although I do still see shows at Arena Stage and Studio).

I used to live in Chicago and was pretty smug about being able to deal with the cold. Now having been gone a decade, I realize it’s just nice for things to be nice. Easy, pleasant, convenient. It’s great.

I'm the PP who doesn't appreciate the desire for things to be easy. I also used to live in the upper Midwest. Sure, dealing the any kind of extreme weather can be a source of personal pride, and yes I find it nice not to deal with such extremes anymore. The difference is that the weather isn't a social phenomenon; whether you live in Chicago or DC, you don't bear responsibility for each cold snap. And, although global warming is a function of human choices, it doesn't directly depend on where you live, except to the extent that you can locate in a place that reduces your carbon emissions (i.e. the city). You're not abdicating any responsibility by moving to a more comfortable climate.

Also, not to make this about me, but the people who are speculating that I live in a suburban part of DC and am therefore being hypocritical are mostly wrong. I live in a rowhouse within the L'Enfant City. There are probably 20,000 people per square mile in my neighborhood, which is much more than the city average, but still quite a bit less than in our densest neighborhoods. I'm not one to argue that we should all be trying to live in high-rise condos, or that every city should look like Midtown Manhattan. I get that there are trade-offs in all of life's choices, and that not everyone can afford this particular lifestyle. But I find it really disappointing when people who *can* afford this lifestyle (which in DCUM-land is a lot of people) decide that they would rather that things be easy than that they use their position of fortune to contribute to the social good. And I do believe that things like sending your children to urban public schools with others who have less than them, working to deter crime in the community rather than fleeing it, and remaining connected to the artistic and cultural communities of the city are important parts of that contribution to the social good. I'm not perfect, nor is anyone, but it's very sad to see that so few people consider these trade-offs.

In short, people should expect more of themselves.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:We moved from DC to Arlington and I love it!!! In DC our kids went to a charter school which meant every morning started with fighting city traffic for a 3 mile drive and then hunting for parking. Ugh! Now my kids take a free school bus that picks up two blocks away and there is even a late bus for when they do after school clubs! We go for tons of bike rides because biking on the city streets isn't terrifying and we can pretty easily get to trails that are much less crowded than the Rock Creek Park trail we used to bike on. overall, our lives are so much simpler and easier now.

My spouse works in Arlington so one of our commutes is much shorter now and my commute is about the same by metro. I can walk to a few good coffee shops, Sweetgreens, Giant, Trader Joes, Whole Foods. It is actually more walkable than some of the places I lived in DC. (We live in Lyon Park).

I just noticed the earlier PP who looked down on people who want things to be easier. I used to be like that but honestly after 10 years of DH and I each working 50+ hours a week and juggling two kids, I was just worn down and wanted free school buses. And we are actually as close or closer to the DC museums than we were when we lived in DC. And my favorite local theater is Signature, which is in Arlington so no loss there (although I do still see shows at Arena Stage and Studio).

I used to live in Chicago and was pretty smug about being able to deal with the cold. Now having been gone a decade, I realize it’s just nice for things to be nice. Easy, pleasant, convenient. It’s great.

I'm the PP who doesn't appreciate the desire for things to be easy. I also used to live in the upper Midwest. Sure, dealing the any kind of extreme weather can be a source of personal pride, and yes I find it nice not to deal with such extremes anymore. The difference is that the weather isn't a social phenomenon; whether you live in Chicago or DC, you don't bear responsibility for each cold snap. And, although global warming is a function of human choices, it doesn't directly depend on where you live, except to the extent that you can locate in a place that reduces your carbon emissions (i.e. the city). You're not abdicating any responsibility by moving to a more comfortable climate.

Also, not to make this about me, but the people who are speculating that I live in a suburban part of DC and am therefore being hypocritical are mostly wrong. I live in a rowhouse within the L'Enfant City. There are probably 20,000 people per square mile in my neighborhood, which is much more than the city average, but still quite a bit less than in our densest neighborhoods. I'm not one to argue that we should all be trying to live in high-rise condos, or that every city should look like Midtown Manhattan. I get that there are trade-offs in all of life's choices, and that not everyone can afford this particular lifestyle. But I find it really disappointing when people who *can* afford this lifestyle (which in DCUM-land is a lot of people) decide that they would rather that things be easy than that they use their position of fortune to contribute to the social good. And I do believe that things like sending your children to urban public schools with others who have less than them, working to deter crime in the community rather than fleeing it, and remaining connected to the artistic and cultural communities of the city are important parts of that contribution to the social good. I'm not perfect, nor is anyone, but it's very sad to see that so few people consider these trade-offs.

In short, people should expect more of themselves.

So in conclusion, the more difficult you make life for yourself and your family, the more virtuous you are?

[Anonymous]

We were in Chicago before, so not DC, but were worried about the move to the suburbs (Arlington for us) and have been very happy. Especially grateful right now with young kids during a pandemic.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Glad that we moved to a house 1/4 mile across the DC line into Silver Spring.

Schools

if you were in bethesda/potomac/chevy chase it would be 6 fold even better, so there are always ways to improve

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:So much better now. I spent 10 years in DC before moving to NoVa. The difference in quality of services is like another world. Things just work here, and we have trails, parks, and diverse dining options all around. Schools are much better (even the “bad” ones out here are leagues ahead of Wilson/Deal). No one throws their fast food trash in my yard and I have yet to hear a gunshot.

Ha, ha, ha, ha, ha, ha!

Okay, here's a trick question: Which state/district still has kids in school - VA or DC?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:We moved from DC to Arlington and I love it!!! In DC our kids went to a charter school which meant every morning started with fighting city traffic for a 3 mile drive and then hunting for parking. Ugh! Now my kids take a free school bus that picks up two blocks away and there is even a late bus for when they do after school clubs! We go for tons of bike rides because biking on the city streets isn't terrifying and we can pretty easily get to trails that are much less crowded than the Rock Creek Park trail we used to bike on. overall, our lives are so much simpler and easier now.

My spouse works in Arlington so one of our commutes is much shorter now and my commute is about the same by metro. I can walk to a few good coffee shops, Sweetgreens, Giant, Trader Joes, Whole Foods. It is actually more walkable than some of the places I lived in DC. (We live in Lyon Park).

I just noticed the earlier PP who looked down on people who want things to be easier. I used to be like that but honestly after 10 years of DH and I each working 50+ hours a week and juggling two kids, I was just worn down and wanted free school buses. And we are actually as close or closer to the DC museums than we were when we lived in DC. And my favorite local theater is Signature, which is in Arlington so no loss there (although I do still see shows at Arena Stage and Studio).

I used to live in Chicago and was pretty smug about being able to deal with the cold. Now having been gone a decade, I realize it’s just nice for things to be nice. Easy, pleasant, convenient. It’s great.

I'm the PP who doesn't appreciate the desire for things to be easy. I also used to live in the upper Midwest. Sure, dealing the any kind of extreme weather can be a source of personal pride, and yes I find it nice not to deal with such extremes anymore. The difference is that the weather isn't a social phenomenon; whether you live in Chicago or DC, you don't bear responsibility for each cold snap. And, although global warming is a function of human choices, it doesn't directly depend on where you live, except to the extent that you can locate in a place that reduces your carbon emissions (i.e. the city). You're not abdicating any responsibility by moving to a more comfortable climate.

Also, not to make this about me, but the people who are speculating that I live in a suburban part of DC and am therefore being hypocritical are mostly wrong. I live in a rowhouse within the L'Enfant City. There are probably 20,000 people per square mile in my neighborhood, which is much more than the city average, but still quite a bit less than in our densest neighborhoods. I'm not one to argue that we should all be trying to live in high-rise condos, or that every city should look like Midtown Manhattan. I get that there are trade-offs in all of life's choices, and that not everyone can afford this particular lifestyle. But I find it really disappointing when people who *can* afford this lifestyle (which in DCUM-land is a lot of people) decide that they would rather that things be easy than that they use their position of fortune to contribute to the social good. And I do believe that things like sending your children to urban public schools with others who have less than them, working to deter crime in the community rather than fleeing it, and remaining connected to the artistic and cultural communities of the city are important parts of that contribution to the social good. I'm not perfect, nor is anyone, but it's very sad to see that so few people consider these trade-offs.

In short, people should expect more of themselves.

So in conclusion, the more difficult you make life for yourself and your family, the more virtuous you are?

If that's all you inferred from what I wrote then I feel sorry for you.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:We moved from DC to Arlington and I love it!!! In DC our kids went to a charter school which meant every morning started with fighting city traffic for a 3 mile drive and then hunting for parking. Ugh! Now my kids take a free school bus that picks up two blocks away and there is even a late bus for when they do after school clubs! We go for tons of bike rides because biking on the city streets isn't terrifying and we can pretty easily get to trails that are much less crowded than the Rock Creek Park trail we used to bike on. overall, our lives are so much simpler and easier now.

My spouse works in Arlington so one of our commutes is much shorter now and my commute is about the same by metro. I can walk to a few good coffee shops, Sweetgreens, Giant, Trader Joes, Whole Foods. It is actually more walkable than some of the places I lived in DC. (We live in Lyon Park).

I just noticed the earlier PP who looked down on people who want things to be easier. I used to be like that but honestly after 10 years of DH and I each working 50+ hours a week and juggling two kids, I was just worn down and wanted free school buses. And we are actually as close or closer to the DC museums than we were when we lived in DC. And my favorite local theater is Signature, which is in Arlington so no loss there (although I do still see shows at Arena Stage and Studio).

I used to live in Chicago and was pretty smug about being able to deal with the cold. Now having been gone a decade, I realize it’s just nice for things to be nice. Easy, pleasant, convenient. It’s great.

I'm the PP who doesn't appreciate the desire for things to be easy. I also used to live in the upper Midwest. Sure, dealing the any kind of extreme weather can be a source of personal pride, and yes I find it nice not to deal with such extremes anymore. The difference is that the weather isn't a social phenomenon; whether you live in Chicago or DC, you don't bear responsibility for each cold snap. And, although global warming is a function of human choices, it doesn't directly depend on where you live, except to the extent that you can locate in a place that reduces your carbon emissions (i.e. the city). You're not abdicating any responsibility by moving to a more comfortable climate.

Also, not to make this about me, but the people who are speculating that I live in a suburban part of DC and am therefore being hypocritical are mostly wrong. I live in a rowhouse within the L'Enfant City. There are probably 20,000 people per square mile in my neighborhood, which is much more than the city average, but still quite a bit less than in our densest neighborhoods. I'm not one to argue that we should all be trying to live in high-rise condos, or that every city should look like Midtown Manhattan. I get that there are trade-offs in all of life's choices, and that not everyone can afford this particular lifestyle. But I find it really disappointing when people who *can* afford this lifestyle (which in DCUM-land is a lot of people) decide that they would rather that things be easy than that they use their position of fortune to contribute to the social good. And I do believe that things like sending your children to urban public schools with others who have less than them, working to deter crime in the community rather than fleeing it, and remaining connected to the artistic and cultural communities of the city are important parts of that contribution to the social good. I'm not perfect, nor is anyone, but it's very sad to see that so few people consider these trade-offs.

In short, people should expect more of themselves.

Question: Do you have school-age kids? Because in my experience, that is generally the turning point.

[Anonymous]

We live WOTP in DC (aka the original DC suburbs). We love it. Pre-covid we had 5-15 min commutes (worked in dupont). Now, we live next door to a great set of parks and amenities (all walking distance and we back the glover park spur of rock creek).

The suburbs are great, we don't miss living in the city at all!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:We moved from DC to Arlington and I love it!!! In DC our kids went to a charter school which meant every morning started with fighting city traffic for a 3 mile drive and then hunting for parking. Ugh! Now my kids take a free school bus that picks up two blocks away and there is even a late bus for when they do after school clubs! We go for tons of bike rides because biking on the city streets isn't terrifying and we can pretty easily get to trails that are much less crowded than the Rock Creek Park trail we used to bike on. overall, our lives are so much simpler and easier now.

My spouse works in Arlington so one of our commutes is much shorter now and my commute is about the same by metro. I can walk to a few good coffee shops, Sweetgreens, Giant, Trader Joes, Whole Foods. It is actually more walkable than some of the places I lived in DC. (We live in Lyon Park).

I just noticed the earlier PP who looked down on people who want things to be easier. I used to be like that but honestly after 10 years of DH and I each working 50+ hours a week and juggling two kids, I was just worn down and wanted free school buses. And we are actually as close or closer to the DC museums than we were when we lived in DC. And my favorite local theater is Signature, which is in Arlington so no loss there (although I do still see shows at Arena Stage and Studio).

I used to live in Chicago and was pretty smug about being able to deal with the cold. Now having been gone a decade, I realize it’s just nice for things to be nice. Easy, pleasant, convenient. It’s great.

I'm the PP who doesn't appreciate the desire for things to be easy. I also used to live in the upper Midwest. Sure, dealing the any kind of extreme weather can be a source of personal pride, and yes I find it nice not to deal with such extremes anymore. The difference is that the weather isn't a social phenomenon; whether you live in Chicago or DC, you don't bear responsibility for each cold snap. And, although global warming is a function of human choices, it doesn't directly depend on where you live, except to the extent that you can locate in a place that reduces your carbon emissions (i.e. the city). You're not abdicating any responsibility by moving to a more comfortable climate.

Also, not to make this about me, but the people who are speculating that I live in a suburban part of DC and am therefore being hypocritical are mostly wrong. I live in a rowhouse within the L'Enfant City. There are probably 20,000 people per square mile in my neighborhood, which is much more than the city average, but still quite a bit less than in our densest neighborhoods. I'm not one to argue that we should all be trying to live in high-rise condos, or that every city should look like Midtown Manhattan. I get that there are trade-offs in all of life's choices, and that not everyone can afford this particular lifestyle. But I find it really disappointing when people who *can* afford this lifestyle (which in DCUM-land is a lot of people) decide that they would rather that things be easy than that they use their position of fortune to contribute to the social good. And I do believe that things like sending your children to urban public schools with others who have less than them, working to deter crime in the community rather than fleeing it, and remaining connected to the artistic and cultural communities of the city are important parts of that contribution to the social good. I'm not perfect, nor is anyone, but it's very sad to see that so few people consider these trade-offs.

In short, people should expect more of themselves.

Hi PP. I kept out of your last round of comments, but you're doubling down.

You have no kids, correct? All your reasons fail for families. Not only do they fail, your condescension indicates you're way out of touch with the reality of raising children. And kids are probably the number one reason why people leave the city for the burbs, all other things being equal. The parents that go to the burbs probably enjoyed city life, but are making a sacrifice for their families by moving.

You want to expect more of yourself? Sure, fine. But it's not about you when you are a parent. Are you willing to experiment with your child's education? Are you willing to sign up your kid, who has no say in the matter, to stay in schools with substandard test scores for the good of other students? (Let's leave aside how paternalistic and White Savior this sounds.) Are you being realistic about the effects of exposing a tween to dramatically higher levels of crime by their peer group, in their neighborhood? Again, these are not choices you're making for yourself, this is you making the choice to put your kid into an environment with much higher risks.

Simultaneously, as a parent, you must consider that some of the best performing schools in the entire country are only 10-20 miles away in the suburbs. There is (repeat: is) socioeconomic, racial, and even political diversity in the suburbs. The museums and artistic culture of the city are a short trip away, and quite accessible on weekends and holidays. Crime is staggeringly lower, but you (as someone who expects more of yourself) can certainly volunteer in your suburban community or in the city for any range of social problems. Here, your child is more likely to get a great public school education, less likely to be exposed traumatic events, less likely to normalize crime and violence, but still able to contribute to their communities.

People can make different choices, but moving to the burbs is the right choice for many families, and it doesn't mean those families are giving up or failing to contribute to the social good. In case I'm not being clear enough: shove your disappointment.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

I used to live in Chicago and was pretty smug about being able to deal with the cold. Now having been gone a decade, I realize it’s just nice for things to be nice. Easy, pleasant, convenient. It’s great.

I'm the PP who doesn't appreciate the desire for things to be easy. I also used to live in the upper Midwest. Sure, dealing the any kind of extreme weather can be a source of personal pride, and yes I find it nice not to deal with such extremes anymore. The difference is that the weather isn't a social phenomenon; whether you live in Chicago or DC, you don't bear responsibility for each cold snap. And, although global warming is a function of human choices, it doesn't directly depend on where you live, except to the extent that you can locate in a place that reduces your carbon emissions (i.e. the city). You're not abdicating any responsibility by moving to a more comfortable climate.

Also, not to make this about me, but the people who are speculating that I live in a suburban part of DC and am therefore being hypocritical are mostly wrong. I live in a rowhouse within the L'Enfant City. There are probably 20,000 people per square mile in my neighborhood, which is much more than the city average, but still quite a bit less than in our densest neighborhoods. I'm not one to argue that we should all be trying to live in high-rise condos, or that every city should look like Midtown Manhattan. I get that there are trade-offs in all of life's choices, and that not everyone can afford this particular lifestyle. But I find it really disappointing when people who *can* afford this lifestyle (which in DCUM-land is a lot of people) decide that they would rather that things be easy than that they use their position of fortune to contribute to the social good. And I do believe that things like sending your children to urban public schools with others who have less than them, working to deter crime in the community rather than fleeing it, and remaining connected to the artistic and cultural communities of the city are important parts of that contribution to the social good. I'm not perfect, nor is anyone, but it's very sad to see that so few people consider these trade-offs.

In short, people should expect more of themselves.

It's rare for people to be willing to burn their offspring on the altar of social good. I mean, keep fighting a good fight. I'm just going to do what's best for my children, and leave the worry about social good to people in charge of these things.