Switching Schools: Has the grass been greener?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Switched EOTP to WOTP elementary, and kind of regret it. I don't think WOTP is significantly better in the ways I care about. And in some ways it's worse in ways that I do care about. Both are fine, I just can't get too excited about WOTP.

Could you elaborate on the specific things that you care about?

Individual attention from teachers. I think the academic challenge was actually better EOTP in some ways. WOTP does have now cool stuff that the PTA bus, but I can also supplement that EOTP and maybe benefit some kids who otherwise wouldn't have been exposed to it.

More diverse learning environment. There's a lot the kids are learning other than academics. I'd like my kids to be capable of working with anyone. WOTP is kind of sheltered. At least for elementary school.

EOTP, the mean kids/bullies aren't generally the kids of the super PTA parents. I think there's some reluctance from WOTP teachers to address these issues with bratty kids.

PTA/dues. There's a lot of pressure to donate thousands to the PTA.

Parents community. While the kids experience is more of a focus, I connect much better with the parents EOTP. I don't do well with snobs.

Commute. Sucks.

*chokes* Thousands?! I gave our (eotp) PTA $200 and felt awesome about myself. Is this what everyone else is giving?!

We live EOTP, not WOTP. But I know that the schools WOTP PTA provides things like instructors and programming for the higher achieving kids since DCPS will not.

Also, as someone else posted, a kid scoring 3.5 is going to get a ton of support to bring him to grade level. So sounds like they are much better at supporting those at the bottom (defined as 3 on PARCC) and those at the top.

Frankly, we would have no problem donating a few thousand to get those services.

But part of the reason a child making a 3 on the PARC will get so much attention WOTP is that there aren't many kids making 1 s and 2s, so 3s the resoruces like RTI. Same resources EOTP, but EOTP these resources are going to kids who are further behind. I think high acheiving kids can do great in a struggling school - they will stand out and get special attention because of it. It's the kids who are a year behind grade level rather than two or three years that limp along.

If high achieving kids are doing so great at title 1 schools, then why can’t they keep them in the upper elementary? Why are they not going to DCPS middle schools EOTP?
Why is 50% of the kids in DC go to charter schools? If you break down this 50% to WOTP and EOTP, it will be much, much higher than 50%.

The data doesn’t support your assertion above.

Racism. It explains a lot of it.

And yes, I've heard all the excuses like "but test scores", "but SES not race", "but POC do it too"... I hear you, but I don't believe you.

If you want to use the race card to blanket and explain all the problems with DCPS, that’s your choice.

But we as a minority parent along with our many AA friends disagree. We don’t see middle class AA friends sending their kids to the poor performing schools either. Not an option in their book at all. But sure, they don’t because they are racist too. No other reason for it.

+1 We left our title 1, for a HRC. College educated middle class black family, though not originally from DC. We know other black and brown middle & upper middle class families that are doing the same or moving out to MD or VA. You do have to believe it for it to be true!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Yes, POC can be racist too. They can also have legitimate reasons, like teachers not challenging their kids well because of stereotypes. When white people turn around and say "but POC do it too", it's justification for racist bias.

Try this exercise: if large numbers of middle class black people were sending their kids to a school with mostly black students, do you think that would change the minds of most white parents here? Or would they come up with other reasons? See discussion of Shepherd and Banneker.

Only black parents can have legitimate reasons?

DP. I don't think that's what the PP is saying. However, there are definitely patterns in the data that are there for anyone to see. For example, look at past threads where posters discuss with bated breath whether and when Shepherd will "flip," so that they can feel comfortable sending their own kids there.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Yes, POC can be racist too. They can also have legitimate reasons, like teachers not challenging their kids well because of stereotypes. When white people turn around and say "but POC do it too", it's justification for racist bias.

Try this exercise: if large numbers of middle class black people were sending their kids to a school with mostly black students, do you think that would change the minds of most white parents here? Or would they come up with other reasons? See discussion of Shepherd and Banneker.

Only black parents can have legitimate reasons?

DP. I don't think that's what the PP is saying. However, there are definitely patterns in the data that are there for anyone to see. For example, look at past threads where posters discuss with bated breath whether and when Shepherd will "flip," so that they can feel comfortable sending their own kids there.

No one is saying there are no racists. But it’s disingenuous to blanket a statement saying only racism is the answer as to why parents with higher achieving kids are leaving poor performing schools in DC.

If you don’t think the same thing exists and is happening for all the poor performing white schools in WVA, I have a new Mercedes to sell you for $1.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Yes, POC can be racist too. They can also have legitimate reasons, like teachers not challenging their kids well because of stereotypes. When white people turn around and say "but POC do it too", it's justification for racist bias.

Try this exercise: if large numbers of middle class black people were sending their kids to a school with mostly black students, do you think that would change the minds of most white parents here? Or would they come up with other reasons? See discussion of Shepherd and Banneker.

Only black parents can have legitimate reasons?

DP. I don't think that's what the PP is saying. However, there are definitely patterns in the data that are there for anyone to see. For example, look at past threads where posters discuss with bated breath whether and when Shepherd will "flip," so that they can feel comfortable sending their own kids there.

No one is saying there are no racists. But it’s disingenuous to blanket a statement saying only racism is the answer as to why parents with higher achieving kids are leaving poor performing schools in DC.

If you don’t think the same thing exists and is happening for all the poor performing white schools in WVA, I have a new Mercedes to sell you for $1.

Look at what was said. It wasn't a blanket statement. Stop bring so defensive and try being introspective. If it's you, then own it. If not, then move ok.

[Anonymous]

Also it can be largely racism here and largely classism elsewhere. We're taking DCPS here.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Yes, POC can be racist too. They can also have legitimate reasons, like teachers not challenging their kids well because of stereotypes. When white people turn around and say "but POC do it too", it's justification for racist bias.

Try this exercise: if large numbers of middle class black people were sending their kids to a school with mostly black students, do you think that would change the minds of most white parents here? Or would they come up with other reasons? See discussion of Shepherd and Banneker.

Only black parents can have legitimate reasons?

DP. I don't think that's what the PP is saying. However, there are definitely patterns in the data that are there for anyone to see. For example, look at past threads where posters discuss with bated breath whether and when Shepherd will "flip," so that they can feel comfortable sending their own kids there.

No one is saying there are no racists. But it’s disingenuous to blanket a statement saying only racism is the answer as to why parents with higher achieving kids are leaving poor performing schools in DC.

If you don’t think the same thing exists and is happening for all the poor performing white schools in WVA, I have a new Mercedes to sell you for $1.

Look at what was said. It wasn't a blanket statement. Stop bring so defensive and try being introspective. If it's you, then own it. If not, then move ok.

Yes it was. The original post said racism explains it. Re- read it again.

[Anonymous]

We left our Tier 1 HRC for DCPS (Shepherd) and I cannot tell your what a refreshing experience it has been so far. So much structure, organization, excellence compared to our HRC that we also liked a lot. My K DS has learned so much in the last 3 months. I love the IB model, diversity, our teacher, and that my DS has friends in the neighborhood to organize play dates with.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Yes, POC can be racist too. They can also have legitimate reasons, like teachers not challenging their kids well because of stereotypes. When white people turn around and say "but POC do it too", it's justification for racist bias.

Try this exercise: if large numbers of middle class black people were sending their kids to a school with mostly black students, do you think that would change the minds of most white parents here? Or would they come up with other reasons? See discussion of Shepherd and Banneker.

Only black parents can have legitimate reasons?

DP. I don't think that's what the PP is saying. However, there are definitely patterns in the data that are there for anyone to see. For example, look at past threads where posters discuss with bated breath whether and when Shepherd will "flip," so that they can feel comfortable sending their own kids there.

No one is saying there are no racists. But it’s disingenuous to blanket a statement saying only racism is the answer as to why parents with higher achieving kids are leaving poor performing schools in DC.

If you don’t think the same thing exists and is happening for all the poor performing white schools in WVA, I have a new Mercedes to sell you for $1.

Look at what was said. It wasn't a blanket statement. Stop bring so defensive and try being introspective. If it's you, then own it. If not, then move ok.

Yes it was. The original post said racism explains it. Re- read it again.

"Racism. It explains a lot of it."

And then predicted excuses would come out of the woodwork...

[Anonymous]

How did this thread get off tangent with racism. Let’s move on.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:How did this thread get off tangent with racism. Let’s move on.

Because someone asked a relevant question.

If high achieving kids are doing so great at title 1 schools, then why can’t they keep them in the upper elementary? Why are they not going to DCPS middle schools EOTP?
Why is 50% of the kids in DC go to charter schools? If you break down this 50% to WOTP and EOTP, it will be much, much higher than 50%.

The answer someone offered was that racism explains a lot of it.

[Anonymous]

Don’t agree that racism explains a lot of it.

If that was the case, many parents would not even put their kid in poor performing schools to begin with. But go ahead and say racism accounts for most of the issues instead of addressing it. You will just drive away more families, white and middle class blacks.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Don’t agree that racism explains a lot of it.

If that was the case, many parents would not even put their kid in poor performing schools to begin with. But go ahead and say racism accounts for most of the issues instead of addressing it. You will just drive away more families, white and middle class blacks.

Please explain how you conclude that there’s no racism involved. I’ve heard things along these lines plenty of times: “it’s ok in the younger grades, but once they get older I think the demographics are an issue”

Also, if discussion of racism is enough to scare you off to the suburbs then you were never really committed to combating racism. So, bye.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Don’t agree that racism explains a lot of it.

If that was the case, many parents would not even put their kid in poor performing schools to begin with. But go ahead and say racism accounts for most of the issues instead of addressing it. You will just drive away more families, white and middle class blacks.

Please explain how you conclude that there’s no racism involved. I’ve heard things along these lines plenty of times: “it’s ok in the younger grades, but once they get older I think the demographics are an issue”

Also, if discussion of racism is enough to scare you off to the suburbs then you were never really committed to combating racism. So, bye.

Because only black parents are allowed to move their kids out of underperforming schools without being labelled racist.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Don’t agree that racism explains a lot of it.

If that was the case, many parents would not even put their kid in poor performing schools to begin with. But go ahead and say racism accounts for most of the issues instead of addressing it. You will just drive away more families, white and middle class blacks.

Please explain how you conclude that there’s no racism involved. I’ve heard things along these lines plenty of times: “it’s ok in the younger grades, but once they get older I think the demographics are an issue”

Also, if discussion of racism is enough to scare you off to the suburbs then you were never really committed to combating racism. So, bye.

I never said there is no racism involved. Why do you make false statements to advance your agenda?

I said there are other big reasons besides racism why families leave.

Your tone, dismissive attitude, inability to acknowledge other possible major reasons is exactly why families are put off and leave.

Oh and I’m not white nor have I fled to the suburbs. Why don’t you ask my good black friends if I’m scared of discussions of racism - friends who won’t even send their kids to poor performing schools in DC.

It’s pointless to have a logical discussion with someone who twists peoples words and say my reason is the only one and it’s my way or the highway. Pointless so I’m not going to even try.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:How did this thread get off tangent with racism. Let’s move on.

Because someone asked a relevant question.

If high achieving kids are doing so great at title 1 schools, then why can’t they keep them in the upper elementary? Why are they not going to DCPS middle schools EOTP?
Why is 50% of the kids in DC go to charter schools? If you break down this 50% to WOTP and EOTP, it will be much, much higher than 50%.

The answer someone offered was that racism explains a lot of it.

I'm at an EOTP school that is fantastic and has a small minority of white folks -- racism truly explains a lot of the flight. The white people who stuck around are comfortable with their kids being a racial minority, many of those who left simply were not (and whispered their concerns about it.) I've seen it with my own eyes and heard it with my own ears.