Intellectual disability? I wonder if my toddler has this.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:OP here. Thank you all for your responses.

I should clarify or give examples of what I meant by he doesn’t know how to play. From what I understand, cognitive development can’t be measured directly so they use play and social interactions to gauge how cognitive development is progressing or not. At 17.5 months, DS does not put things into a container. Forget about shape sorters. He plays by spinning things (a small plate, a lid, a ball) and loves picking and dropping those things. He likes the baby musical toys that lots up. That’s the extent of his play. Tried reading to him and after two pages, he would close the book and treats it as a toy.

He is in an all day preschool (daycare center) in the toddler’s class. His teachers reported that he is unable to do things the rest of the class does. Painting with a brush for instance , or other sensory play like running a toy car over whipped cream. His PT and teacher from early intervention visit him at school as their approach is a coaching model. I can see why the developmental pediatrician puts him at 9 months as far as physical and cognitive development is concerned.

I just feel like there is something more to this global delay. I understand “intellectual disability” is a nicer term than “mental retardation” and it is very general umbrella term for a number of things. He is too young to get evaluated for a lot of things but if I read the early symptoms of intellectual disability, he seems to check all the boxes.

Some of the questions that were asked of us include if it was a normal pregnancy and yes it was. No alcohol consumption or drugs. I was asked if he has seizures, and no he doesn’t. He doesn’t wake up screaming either (apparently this happens if there is swelling in his head).

He is otherwise a more or less happy baby. Very sweet and loving, to us parents, at least.

Failure to meet physical developmental goals is not a sign of intellectual disability. And many kids with ID can accomplish those tasks easily. ID becomes much more apparent as a child gets older.

What puzzles me about your post is that you seem to be caught up in a triad of autism, intellectual disability, and cerebral palsy. There are many reasons why your child may be delayed in certain play areas that do not have anything to do with these three conditions. Moreover, the fact that your child developmentally plays more like a 9 months old child is not a sign of ID.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:A lot of kids cant do those things at that age. Your day care teachers are not being realistic. A child under two should not be pinging with a brush. I would do the MRI at this point, personally.

Please don’t mitigate her concern. You may think you’re being reassuring but you’re gaslighting her into believing her very valid concerns and her knowledge about her own child are wrong. They are not. Kids can play and point and speak and move at this age. She is right to be concerned and right to be proactive. EI is critical at this age and people saying “lots of kids don’t talk or play or walk until 4 and then they’re in AP in high school” do parents and kids a disservice by convincing them to wait and see and waste that precious time.

No one is mitigating the concern but the preschool teachers are not being developmentally appropriate to think that age can paint.

And if you have read the OP you will note she has other standalone concerns and is only using the preschool teachers’ observations to substantiate her own worries. Holding a brush and being able to swipe it across paper is something kids this age can do. I would hand my kids paintbrushes with paint on it and let them do this at 11-12 months. No it’s not sophisticated painting but it’s a gross motor skill and he can’t do it in addition to other gross motor skills that children his age should be able to do.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:OP here. Thank you all for your responses.

I should clarify or give examples of what I meant by he doesn’t know how to play. From what I understand, cognitive development can’t be measured directly so they use play and social interactions to gauge how cognitive development is progressing or not. At 17.5 months, DS does not put things into a container. Forget about shape sorters. He plays by spinning things (a small plate, a lid, a ball) and loves picking and dropping those things. He likes the baby musical toys that lots up. That’s the extent of his play. Tried reading to him and after two pages, he would close the book and treats it as a toy.

He is in an all day preschool (daycare center) in the toddler’s class. His teachers reported that he is unable to do things the rest of the class does. Painting with a brush for instance , or other sensory play like running a toy car over whipped cream. His PT and teacher from early intervention visit him at school as their approach is a coaching model. I can see why the developmental pediatrician puts him at 9 months as far as physical and cognitive development is concerned.

I just feel like there is something more to this global delay. I understand “intellectual disability” is a nicer term than “mental retardation” and it is very general umbrella term for a number of things. He is too young to get evaluated for a lot of things but if I read the early symptoms of intellectual disability, he seems to check all the boxes.

Some of the questions that were asked of us include if it was a normal pregnancy and yes it was. No alcohol consumption or drugs. I was asked if he has seizures, and no he doesn’t. He doesn’t wake up screaming either (apparently this happens if there is swelling in his head).

He is otherwise a more or less happy baby. Very sweet and loving, to us parents, at least.

Failure to meet physical developmental goals is not a sign of intellectual disability. And many kids with ID can accomplish those tasks easily. ID becomes much more apparent as a child gets older.

What puzzles me about your post is that you seem to be caught up in a triad of autism, intellectual disability, and cerebral palsy. There are many reasons why your child may be delayed in certain play areas that do not have anything to do with these three conditions. Moreover, the fact that your child developmentally plays more like a 9 months old child is not a sign of ID.

OP here. I mentioned these 3 because 2 were brought up to me by the pediatrician and PT and as I said in my previous posts, they don’t think he has CP or autism and the pediatrician acknowledge that it is too soon to tell. I’m just bringing up ID as a possibility and hoping ppl on this board can share some light. I’m not really caught up in those three as you mentioned.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:A lot of kids cant do those things at that age. Your day care teachers are not being realistic. A child under two should not be pinging with a brush. I would do the MRI at this point, personally.

Please don’t mitigate her concern. You may think you’re being reassuring but you’re gaslighting her into believing her very valid concerns and her knowledge about her own child are wrong. They are not. Kids can play and point and speak and move at this age. She is right to be concerned and right to be proactive. EI is critical at this age and people saying “lots of kids don’t talk or play or walk until 4 and then they’re in AP in high school” do parents and kids a disservice by convincing them to wait and see and waste that precious time.

No one is mitigating the concern but the preschool teachers are not being developmentally appropriate to think that age can paint.

And if you have read the OP you will note she has other standalone concerns and is only using the preschool teachers’ observations to substantiate her own worries. Holding a brush and being able to swipe it across paper is something kids this age can do. I would hand my kids paintbrushes with paint on it and let them do this at 11-12 months. No it’s not sophisticated painting but it’s a gross motor skill and he can’t do it in addition to other gross motor skills that children his age should be able to do.

OP here again. Yes, I obviously don’t mean paint in that way you are thinking. The toddlers are given brushes with paint to just swipe across a sheet of paper back and forth making a mess and with the teachers guidance. My son I was told could not hold the brush and imitate that behavior. It’s his failure to grasp that concept that worries me. He can hold a brush and pick up stuff with his hands... I don’t think I’m explaining myself well.

There are numerous examples that I observed myself and one that can to mind is when my daughter rolled a ball to him and we tried to show him to roll back to her and he doesn’t get that. I think the most jarring example for me is his inability to put things in a box despite numerous attempts to show him.

The county PT suggested that we also do private PT as he may need both the coaching and direct approach. She also suggested private speech therapy as the county doesn’t offer those services for kids under 2.

[Anonymous]

OP, I want to encourage you about the MRI-my dd was delayed similarly (but not as much I don't think) as your ds. She had an EEG and an MRI.

I was so worried about the sedation, but the procedure was at a leading children's hospital (I'm not local) and went really fast and smoothly. In our case, the MRI ruled out brain issues which was a relief. DD was eventually dx with mild ASD, not saying that is what your ds has but just saying that was what turned out to be her case. She has typical IQ (she's had a neuropysch eval).

In the meanwhile while you go through all this (it takes a long time it seems) I think the therapies are the best thing. Regardless of whether he ends up dx with ID or not, the therapies will help him develop.

[Anonymous]

I agree with seeing Ken Rosenbaum at Children’s Hospital in DC. He is the best geneticist in the area.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:A lot of kids cant do those things at that age. Your day care teachers are not being realistic. A child under two should not be pinging with a brush. I would do the MRI at this point, personally.

Please don’t mitigate her concern. You may think you’re being reassuring but you’re gaslighting her into believing her very valid concerns and her knowledge about her own child are wrong. They are not. Kids can play and point and speak and move at this age. She is right to be concerned and right to be proactive. EI is critical at this age and people saying “lots of kids don’t talk or play or walk until 4 and then they’re in AP in high school” do parents and kids a disservice by convincing them to wait and see and waste that precious time.

No one is mitigating the concern but the preschool teachers are not being developmentally appropriate to think that age can paint.

And if you have read the OP you will note she has other standalone concerns and is only using the preschool teachers’ observations to substantiate her own worries. Holding a brush and being able to swipe it across paper is something kids this age can do. I would hand my kids paintbrushes with paint on it and let them do this at 11-12 months. No it’s not sophisticated painting but it’s a gross motor skill and he can’t do it in addition to other gross motor skills that children his age should be able to do.

OP here again. Yes, I obviously don’t mean paint in that way you are thinking. The toddlers are given brushes with paint to just swipe across a sheet of paper back and forth making a mess and with the teachers guidance. My son I was told could not hold the brush and imitate that behavior. It’s his failure to grasp that concept that worries me. He can hold a brush and pick up stuff with his hands... I don’t think I’m explaining myself well.

There are numerous examples that I observed myself and one that can to mind is when my daughter rolled a ball to him and we tried to show him to roll back to her and he doesn’t get that. I think the most jarring example for me is his inability to put things in a box despite numerous attempts to show him.

The county PT suggested that we also do private PT as he may need both the coaching and direct approach. She also suggested private speech therapy as the county doesn’t offer those services for kids under 2.

I think you must be in Moco because I was told the same bs when my kid wasn't babbling. If you go to private PT go to Becky Leonard's practice Early Intervention Associates. The good thing about PT is that most places do take insurance. I would try to get in with Becky herself because she has been in the area for a long time and knows a lot of people to refer to. Also she can give your her two cents at least when it comes to motor issues. If you can afford out of pocket I would see Anne Reynolds for speech because she specializes in getting very young children to babble and make first sounds. I am certain my kid would not be talking without her.

[Anonymous]

Not being able to imitate an action physically is not the same as being unable to grasp a concept intellectually.

I can’t do a cartwheel. That doesn’t make me intellectually delayed.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:OP here. Thank you all for your responses.

I should clarify or give examples of what I meant by he doesn’t know how to play. From what I understand, cognitive development can’t be measured directly so they use play and social interactions to gauge how cognitive development is progressing or not. At 17.5 months, DS does not put things into a container. Forget about shape sorters. He plays by spinning things (a small plate, a lid, a ball) and loves picking and dropping those things. He likes the baby musical toys that lots up. That’s the extent of his play. Tried reading to him and after two pages, he would close the book and treats it as a toy.

He is in an all day preschool (daycare center) in the toddler’s class. His teachers reported that he is unable to do things the rest of the class does. Painting with a brush for instance , or other sensory play like running a toy car over whipped cream. His PT and teacher from early intervention visit him at school as their approach is a coaching model. I can see why the developmental pediatrician puts him at 9 months as far as physical and cognitive development is concerned.

I just feel like there is something more to this global delay. I understand “intellectual disability” is a nicer term than “mental retardation” and it is very general umbrella term for a number of things. He is too young to get evaluated for a lot of things but if I read the early symptoms of intellectual disability, he seems to check all the boxes.

Some of the questions that were asked of us include if it was a normal pregnancy and yes it was. No alcohol consumption or drugs. I was asked if he has seizures, and no he doesn’t. He doesn’t wake up screaming either (apparently this happens if there is swelling in his head).

He is otherwise a more or less happy baby. Very sweet and loving, to us parents, at least.

Schedule an ADOS evaluation ASAP. There are plenty of autism flags, and the pediatrician’s dismissal based on eye contact and affection is truly ignorant. Plenty of autistic children are very affectionate and attached to parents and have good eye contact. Obvi I’m not diagnosing your child online, but that’s my recommendation for next step. ASD early intervention is critical, usually covered by insurance better that other therapies. If he has autism, a DX will help you tremendously in providing the appropriate therapy Birth-3 therapies aren’t nearly enough. Good luck.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote: OP, I want to encourage you about the MRI-my dd was delayed similarly (but not as much I don't think) as your ds. She had an EEG and an MRI.

I was so worried about the sedation, but the procedure was at a leading children's hospital (I'm not local) and went really fast and smoothly. In our case, the MRI ruled out brain issues which was a relief. DD was eventually dx with mild ASD, not saying that is what your ds has but just saying that was what turned out to be her case. She has typical IQ (she's had a neuropysch eval).

In the meanwhile while you go through all this (it takes a long time it seems) I think the therapies are the best thing. Regardless of whether he ends up dx with ID or not, the therapies will help him develop.

so the MRI was pointless. does not really support getting the MRI.

again, unless doctors can point to a suspicion of something brain-based that will a) show up on the MRI and b) change the treatment, you don't do an MRI.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:OP here. Thank you all for your responses.

I should clarify or give examples of what I meant by he doesn’t know how to play. From what I understand, cognitive development can’t be measured directly so they use play and social interactions to gauge how cognitive development is progressing or not. At 17.5 months, DS does not put things into a container. Forget about shape sorters. He plays by spinning things (a small plate, a lid, a ball) and loves picking and dropping those things. He likes the baby musical toys that lots up. That’s the extent of his play. Tried reading to him and after two pages, he would close the book and treats it as a toy.

He is in an all day preschool (daycare center) in the toddler’s class. His teachers reported that he is unable to do things the rest of the class does. Painting with a brush for instance , or other sensory play like running a toy car over whipped cream. His PT and teacher from early intervention visit him at school as their approach is a coaching model. I can see why the developmental pediatrician puts him at 9 months as far as physical and cognitive development is concerned.

I just feel like there is something more to this global delay. I understand “intellectual disability” is a nicer term than “mental retardation” and it is very general umbrella term for a number of things. He is too young to get evaluated for a lot of things but if I read the early symptoms of intellectual disability, he seems to check all the boxes.

Some of the questions that were asked of us include if it was a normal pregnancy and yes it was. No alcohol consumption or drugs. I was asked if he has seizures, and no he doesn’t. He doesn’t wake up screaming either (apparently this happens if there is swelling in his head).

He is otherwise a more or less happy baby. Very sweet and loving, to us parents, at least.

Schedule an ADOS evaluation ASAP. There are plenty of autism flags, and the pediatrician’s dismissal based on eye contact and affection is truly ignorant. Plenty of autistic children are very affectionate and attached to parents and have good eye contact. Obvi I’m not diagnosing your child online, but that’s my recommendation for next step. ASD early intervention is critical, usually covered by insurance better that other therapies. If he has autism, a DX will help you tremendously in providing the appropriate therapy Birth-3 therapies aren’t nearly enough. Good luck.

I agree with this. My child with an HFA dx (and the very delayed motor skills that often goes along with that) was extremely loving with us and also declined to do all the activities the other kids did in daycare. I retrospect, a combination of very poor fine motor skills with just not being motivated to do what all the other kids are doing.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:A lot of kids cant do those things at that age. Your day care teachers are not being realistic. A child under two should not be pinging with a brush. I would do the MRI at this point, personally.

Please don’t mitigate her concern. You may think you’re being reassuring but you’re gaslighting her into believing her very valid concerns and her knowledge about her own child are wrong. They are not. Kids can play and point and speak and move at this age. She is right to be concerned and right to be proactive. EI is critical at this age and people saying “lots of kids don’t talk or play or walk until 4 and then they’re in AP in high school” do parents and kids a disservice by convincing them to wait and see and waste that precious time.

No one is mitigating the concern but the preschool teachers are not being developmentally appropriate to think that age can paint.

And if you have read the OP you will note she has other standalone concerns and is only using the preschool teachers’ observations to substantiate her own worries. Holding a brush and being able to swipe it across paper is something kids this age can do. I would hand my kids paintbrushes with paint on it and let them do this at 11-12 months. No it’s not sophisticated painting but it’s a gross motor skill and he can’t do it in addition to other gross motor skills that children his age should be able to do.

Great yours could, mine could not.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:A lot of kids cant do those things at that age. Your day care teachers are not being realistic. A child under two should not be pinging with a brush. I would do the MRI at this point, personally.

Please don’t mitigate her concern. You may think you’re being reassuring but you’re gaslighting her into believing her very valid concerns and her knowledge about her own child are wrong. They are not. Kids can play and point and speak and move at this age. She is right to be concerned and right to be proactive. EI is critical at this age and people saying “lots of kids don’t talk or play or walk until 4 and then they’re in AP in high school” do parents and kids a disservice by convincing them to wait and see and waste that precious time.

No one is mitigating the concern but the preschool teachers are not being developmentally appropriate to think that age can paint.

And if you have read the OP you will note she has other standalone concerns and is only using the preschool teachers’ observations to substantiate her own worries. Holding a brush and being able to swipe it across paper is something kids this age can do. I would hand my kids paintbrushes with paint on it and let them do this at 11-12 months. No it’s not sophisticated painting but it’s a gross motor skill and he can’t do it in addition to other gross motor skills that children his age should be able to do.

OP here again. Yes, I obviously don’t mean paint in that way you are thinking. The toddlers are given brushes with paint to just swipe across a sheet of paper back and forth making a mess and with the teachers guidance. My son I was told could not hold the brush and imitate that behavior. It’s his failure to grasp that concept that worries me. He can hold a brush and pick up stuff with his hands... I don’t think I’m explaining myself well.

There are numerous examples that I observed myself and one that can to mind is when my daughter rolled a ball to him and we tried to show him to roll back to her and he doesn’t get that. I think the most jarring example for me is his inability to put things in a box despite numerous attempts to show him.

The county PT suggested that we also do private PT as he may need both the coaching and direct approach. She also suggested private speech therapy as the county doesn’t offer those services for kids under 2.

I would do private pt, ot and speech given the concerns but I would also follow up with the neurologist and mri. Lots of kids care annot hold a paint brush and that is a bad example but the lack of walking and other concerns are what I would focus on. There is clearly something going on but it’s hard to tell at this age and it’s mainly rule outs now.

[Anonymous]

Sounds so much like my older son. Never got an official diagnosis, but now at 30 he has graduated college and can drive a car. You can still tell there is “something”.... but never got an official diagnosis of a syndrome.
But if you want the Best geneticist- it’s Dr Rosenbaum from Children’s.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote: OP, I want to encourage you about the MRI-my dd was delayed similarly (but not as much I don't think) as your ds. She had an EEG and an MRI.

I was so worried about the sedation, but the procedure was at a leading children's hospital (I'm not local) and went really fast and smoothly. In our case, the MRI ruled out brain issues which was a relief. DD was eventually dx with mild ASD, not saying that is what your ds has but just saying that was what turned out to be her case. She has typical IQ (she's had a neuropysch eval).

In the meanwhile while you go through all this (it takes a long time it seems) I think the therapies are the best thing. Regardless of whether he ends up dx with ID or not, the therapies will help him develop.

so the MRI was pointless. does not really support getting the MRI.

again, unless doctors can point to a suspicion of something brain-based that will a) show up on the MRI and b) change the treatment, you don't do an MRI.

You are not this child's doctor and shouldn't be saying don't get one.