APS swim unit

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Some people are bizarrely offended by the fact that the swim unit doesn’t jazz everyone.

I think it must be Yorktwon pool mom. An oldie but a goodie:

https://www.arlnow.com/2016/06/09/arlington-mom-swim-instructors-man-boobs-should-be-covered-around-my-daughter/

I’ve never forgotten that classic. Lynn wanted to institute a man burka policy for swim instructors.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:It was such a waste.

For kids who already know how to swim, it was worthless.

For kids who don't know how to swim, one week was way to short to teach them.

For non-swimmers, I would rather they give free vouchers to take the Arlington co swim classes so they actually could learn how to swim.

honestly- this is how I feel too. I know some of the kids who don't know how to swim. I have seen what the school swim class does. For one child it meant that he has gone from being afraid to put his face in to being willing to put his face in. That's great and I'm pleased he can do that. But if he fell into deep water- he'd drown. Getting them to the class took out a huge amount of instructional time- getting on a bus, etc.

incidentally- a couple years ago Marymount was offering free swim classes to any child who received free lunch. I'm not sure if they still are or if anyone took them up on it. Getting to Marymount for the classes is a challenge when you are FARMS.

SIGH. The point is not to teach a child how to swim in one week. Everyone knows that's impossible. But it IS possible to teach a child a few basic life safety techniques and very basic familiarity with the water.--and that's what these programs do, and very well I might add. Since the program's adoption in the 1970s, no APS child has drowned. Arlington Parks and Rec ALREADY has drastically reduced swim lessons. Guess what? There are not a lot of very low income kids there! There are many, many reasons why a child doesn't have access to swim lessons--lack of parental involvement, lack of transportation, ingrained societal resistance to water.

You people in your UMC bubble--why don't you get that? I'm sorry your kid has to suffer for a couple of weeks in the pool. Yeesh.

Bubble? Have you ever stopped to think about how this unit would work for a student with a disability? Spoiler alert - not well.

Yes, actually, I have. My neighbor was born with a hereditary muscle dystrophy and cannot jump. He spoke very eloquently at a school board meeting about how the pool at Washington -Lee was the only exercise he was able to get in gym class and how it helped him cope in school. So yes, the pools are important for some people with disabilities. Now, if a child has a disability that prevents them from participating, then no one is going to make a child participate, of course.

And, BTW, my comment was to the person who thought it was oh-so-easy to just bus FARMS kids to Marymount for swimming lessons. That is living in a bubble.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Wow. So inconvenient and unpleasant for your competitive swimmer. You should definitely opt out.

I'm OP and not looking to opt my kid out, but want to manage expectations. DC loves to swim, and is excited about the idea of having extra practices for a week or two. I probably need to warn DC that the focus is learning to float and life-saving basics. So not free play, but also not actual instruction. We won't opt out, but it's like telling a kid who loves to read that they have an hour of reading every day, but must only read K level books. Expect that they'll be slightly less thrilled.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:It was such a waste.

For kids who already know how to swim, it was worthless.

For kids who don't know how to swim, one week was way to short to teach them.

For non-swimmers, I would rather they give free vouchers to take the Arlington co swim classes so they actually could learn how to swim.

honestly- this is how I feel too. I know some of the kids who don't know how to swim. I have seen what the school swim class does. For one child it meant that he has gone from being afraid to put his face in to being willing to put his face in. That's great and I'm pleased he can do that. But if he fell into deep water- he'd drown. Getting them to the class took out a huge amount of instructional time- getting on a bus, etc.

incidentally- a couple years ago Marymount was offering free swim classes to any child who received free lunch. I'm not sure if they still are or if anyone took them up on it. Getting to Marymount for the classes is a challenge when you are FARMS.

SIGH. The point is not to teach a child how to swim in one week. Everyone knows that's impossible. But it IS possible to teach a child a few basic life safety techniques and very basic familiarity with the water.--and that's what these programs do, and very well I might add. Since the program's adoption in the 1970s, no APS child has drowned. Arlington Parks and Rec ALREADY has drastically reduced swim lessons. Guess what? There are not a lot of very low income kids there! There are many, many reasons why a child doesn't have access to swim lessons--lack of parental involvement, lack of transportation, ingrained societal resistance to water.

You people in your UMC bubble--why don't you get that? I'm sorry your kid has to suffer for a couple of weeks in the pool. Yeesh.

Bubble? Have you ever stopped to think about how this unit would work for a student with a disability? Spoiler alert - not well.

The first PP is an ass. Even for kids without disabilities, they may have fear of the water, body issues with getting into the water, among other things. Neither fear nor swim techniques are going to be helped, significantly if at all, in a single unit with 20+ kids in the class. So GMAFB.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:It was such a waste.

For kids who already know how to swim, it was worthless.

For kids who don't know how to swim, one week was way to short to teach them.

For non-swimmers, I would rather they give free vouchers to take the Arlington co swim classes so they actually could learn how to swim.

honestly- this is how I feel too. I know some of the kids who don't know how to swim. I have seen what the school swim class does. For one child it meant that he has gone from being afraid to put his face in to being willing to put his face in. That's great and I'm pleased he can do that. But if he fell into deep water- he'd drown. Getting them to the class took out a huge amount of instructional time- getting on a bus, etc.

incidentally- a couple years ago Marymount was offering free swim classes to any child who received free lunch. I'm not sure if they still are or if anyone took them up on it. Getting to Marymount for the classes is a challenge when you are FARMS.

SIGH. The point is not to teach a child how to swim in one week. Everyone knows that's impossible. But it IS possible to teach a child a few basic life safety techniques and very basic familiarity with the water.--and that's what these programs do, and very well I might add. Since the program's adoption in the 1970s, no APS child has drowned. Arlington Parks and Rec ALREADY has drastically reduced swim lessons. Guess what? There are not a lot of very low income kids there! There are many, many reasons why a child doesn't have access to swim lessons--lack of parental involvement, lack of transportation, ingrained societal resistance to water.

You people in your UMC bubble--why don't you get that? I'm sorry your kid has to suffer for a couple of weeks in the pool. Yeesh.

Bubble? Have you ever stopped to think about how this unit would work for a student with a disability? Spoiler alert - not well.

The first PP is an ass. Even for kids without disabilities, they may have fear of the water, body issues with getting into the water, among other things. Neither fear nor swim techniques are going to be helped, significantly if at all, in a single unit with 20+ kids in the class. So GMAFB.

I’m sorry your third grader has body issues-that’s really too bad. So opt the f out and leave an excellent program that greatly benefits low-income kids alone.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I love Arlington's commitment to swimming. You should go to a middle school swim meet. The kids on the team vary from very talented year-round serious swimmers to just making it across the people. It's wonderful. All kids should know how to swim. The swimming unit is just as important as the basketball unit. I think it's very affirming to send the message that all kids can learn to swim. They get more instruction in HS, too. I think it's fantastic.

Yes but they don't learn how to swim in this unit. Nowhere near enough time for that.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

They probably have a 1-5 ratio or even 1-7 which is fine given probably 2/3 the kids can do a basic stroke. If they go with friends who are encouraging, kids may be more comfortable going underwater as its more fun with friends. My kid has gotten others under water who wouldn't as he'd just play and make it fun. My concern is the locker room in a public pool as anyone can enter and are there enough staff to supervise. Getting kids to at least doggy paddle is a great idea.

What do you mean "probably." Obviously you never asked. Ratios are NOWHERE near what you say. Ask the school or ask your child. When we did it, they had two adults teaching swimming - one PE teacher and 1 APS aquatics person - for 50 kids.

And yet, nobody has ever drowned or been harmed during the swim unit.

That's because kids are forced to opt out if it's not safe for them.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:It was such a waste.

For kids who already know how to swim, it was worthless.

For kids who don't know how to swim, one week was way to short to teach them.

For non-swimmers, I would rather they give free vouchers to take the Arlington co swim classes so they actually could learn how to swim.

honestly- this is how I feel too. I know some of the kids who don't know how to swim. I have seen what the school swim class does. For one child it meant that he has gone from being afraid to put his face in to being willing to put his face in. That's great and I'm pleased he can do that. But if he fell into deep water- he'd drown. Getting them to the class took out a huge amount of instructional time- getting on a bus, etc.

incidentally- a couple years ago Marymount was offering free swim classes to any child who received free lunch. I'm not sure if they still are or if anyone took them up on it. Getting to Marymount for the classes is a challenge when you are FARMS.

SIGH. The point is not to teach a child how to swim in one week. Everyone knows that's impossible. But it IS possible to teach a child a few basic life safety techniques and very basic familiarity with the water.--and that's what these programs do, and very well I might add. Since the program's adoption in the 1970s, no APS child has drowned. Arlington Parks and Rec ALREADY has drastically reduced swim lessons. Guess what? There are not a lot of very low income kids there! There are many, many reasons why a child doesn't have access to swim lessons--lack of parental involvement, lack of transportation, ingrained societal resistance to water.

You people in your UMC bubble--why don't you get that? I'm sorry your kid has to suffer for a couple of weeks in the pool. Yeesh.

Bubble? Have you ever stopped to think about how this unit would work for a student with a disability? Spoiler alert - not well.

Yes, actually, I have. My neighbor was born with a hereditary muscle dystrophy and cannot jump. He spoke very eloquently at a school board meeting about how the pool at Washington -Lee was the only exercise he was able to get in gym class and how it helped him cope in school. So yes, the pools are important for some people with disabilities. Now, if a child has a disability that prevents them from participating, then no one is going to make a child participate, of course.

And, BTW, my comment was to the person who thought it was oh-so-easy to just bus FARMS kids to Marymount for swimming lessons. That is living in a bubble.

the fact that you think you know everything about students with disabilities based on the fact that you have a neighbor with a disability is pretty laughable. APS does not offer enough appropriate support to make this unit safe for students with disabilities. The only choice is to opt out. And that's discriminatory -- because no child should be denied access this unit. But of course you have no problem with this group just being excluded.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:It was such a waste.

For kids who already know how to swim, it was worthless.

For kids who don't know how to swim, one week was way to short to teach them.

For non-swimmers, I would rather they give free vouchers to take the Arlington co swim classes so they actually could learn how to swim.

honestly- this is how I feel too. I know some of the kids who don't know how to swim. I have seen what the school swim class does. For one child it meant that he has gone from being afraid to put his face in to being willing to put his face in. That's great and I'm pleased he can do that. But if he fell into deep water- he'd drown. Getting them to the class took out a huge amount of instructional time- getting on a bus, etc.

incidentally- a couple years ago Marymount was offering free swim classes to any child who received free lunch. I'm not sure if they still are or if anyone took them up on it. Getting to Marymount for the classes is a challenge when you are FARMS.

SIGH. The point is not to teach a child how to swim in one week. Everyone knows that's impossible. But it IS possible to teach a child a few basic life safety techniques and very basic familiarity with the water.--and that's what these programs do, and very well I might add. Since the program's adoption in the 1970s, no APS child has drowned. Arlington Parks and Rec ALREADY has drastically reduced swim lessons. Guess what? There are not a lot of very low income kids there! There are many, many reasons why a child doesn't have access to swim lessons--lack of parental involvement, lack of transportation, ingrained societal resistance to water.

You people in your UMC bubble--why don't you get that? I'm sorry your kid has to suffer for a couple of weeks in the pool. Yeesh.

Bubble? Have you ever stopped to think about how this unit would work for a student with a disability? Spoiler alert - not well.

Yes, actually, I have. My neighbor was born with a hereditary muscle dystrophy and cannot jump. He spoke very eloquently at a school board meeting about how the pool at Washington -Lee was the only exercise he was able to get in gym class and how it helped him cope in school. So yes, the pools are important for some people with disabilities. Now, if a child has a disability that prevents them from participating, then no one is going to make a child participate, of course.

And, BTW, my comment was to the person who thought it was oh-so-easy to just bus FARMS kids to Marymount for swimming lessons. That is living in a bubble.

the fact that you think you know everything about students with disabilities based on the fact that you have a neighbor with a disability is pretty laughable. APS does not offer enough appropriate support to make this unit safe for students with disabilities. The only choice is to opt out. And that's discriminatory -- because no child should be denied access this unit. But of course you have no problem with this group just being excluded.

DP, so now this is about disabilities? Which ones? Surely not all students with disabilities are excluded? Why aren't you pushing for the appropriate supports for those students through SEPTA rather than calling for an end to the program?

P. S. Being afraid of Moobs is not a disability.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Some people are bizarrely offended by the fact that the swim unit doesn’t jazz everyone.

I think it must be Yorktwon pool mom. An oldie but a goodie:

https://www.arlnow.com/2016/06/09/arlington-mom-swim-instructors-man-boobs-should-be-covered-around-my-daughter/

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:It was such a waste.

For kids who already know how to swim, it was worthless.

For kids who don't know how to swim, one week was way to short to teach them.

For non-swimmers, I would rather they give free vouchers to take the Arlington co swim classes so they actually could learn how to swim.

honestly- this is how I feel too. I know some of the kids who don't know how to swim. I have seen what the school swim class does. For one child it meant that he has gone from being afraid to put his face in to being willing to put his face in. That's great and I'm pleased he can do that. But if he fell into deep water- he'd drown. Getting them to the class took out a huge amount of instructional time- getting on a bus, etc.

incidentally- a couple years ago Marymount was offering free swim classes to any child who received free lunch. I'm not sure if they still are or if anyone took them up on it. Getting to Marymount for the classes is a challenge when you are FARMS.

SIGH. The point is not to teach a child how to swim in one week. Everyone knows that's impossible. But it IS possible to teach a child a few basic life safety techniques and very basic familiarity with the water.--and that's what these programs do, and very well I might add. Since the program's adoption in the 1970s, no APS child has drowned. Arlington Parks and Rec ALREADY has drastically reduced swim lessons. Guess what? There are not a lot of very low income kids there! There are many, many reasons why a child doesn't have access to swim lessons--lack of parental involvement, lack of transportation, ingrained societal resistance to water.

You people in your UMC bubble--why don't you get that? I'm sorry your kid has to suffer for a couple of weeks in the pool. Yeesh.

Bubble? Have you ever stopped to think about how this unit would work for a student with a disability? Spoiler alert - not well.

Yes, actually, I have. My neighbor was born with a hereditary muscle dystrophy and cannot jump. He spoke very eloquently at a school board meeting about how the pool at Washington -Lee was the only exercise he was able to get in gym class and how it helped him cope in school. So yes, the pools are important for some people with disabilities. Now, if a child has a disability that prevents them from participating, then no one is going to make a child participate, of course.

And, BTW, my comment was to the person who thought it was oh-so-easy to just bus FARMS kids to Marymount for swimming lessons. That is living in a bubble.

the fact that you think you know everything about students with disabilities based on the fact that you have a neighbor with a disability is pretty laughable. APS does not offer enough appropriate support to make this unit safe for students with disabilities. The only choice is to opt out. And that's discriminatory -- because no child should be denied access this unit. But of course you have no problem with this group just being excluded.

DP, so now this is about disabilities? Which ones? Surely not all students with disabilities are excluded? Why aren't you pushing for the appropriate supports for those students through SEPTA rather than calling for an end to the program?


Oh my gosh, your naivete is laughable. You think parents of students with disabilities have not been advocating? Ha. Instead of assuming wrongly they have not, why don't YOU help and add your voice if you care so much?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Wow. So inconvenient and unpleasant for your competitive swimmer. You should definitely opt out.

I'm OP and not looking to opt my kid out, but want to manage expectations. DC loves to swim, and is excited about the idea of having extra practices for a week or two. I probably need to warn DC that the focus is learning to float and life-saving basics. So not free play, but also not actual instruction. We won't opt out, but it's like telling a kid who loves to read that they have an hour of reading every day, but must only read K level books. Expect that they'll be slightly less thrilled.

My kid loves swimming and does competitively swim. He understands when play/fun is and when its time to practice. If he cannot swim, then this is great to learn the survival skills and if he does swim he can help the other kids and hopefully make it fun for him. In our summer swim, the better swimmers/teens help the younger ones and that's what made it fun and got my child to swim and into swimming. My child in return when he's been at the pool for fun has helped show kids how to go under and a basic stroke. Its also far more fun if they do it with friends. Your child is not going to be the best swimmer and I would assume they work more on technique and ever kid this age needs stroke help, especially those of our kids who do swim competitively as the coaches rarely work on stroke in a meaningful way.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:It was such a waste.

For kids who already know how to swim, it was worthless.

For kids who don't know how to swim, one week was way to short to teach them.

For non-swimmers, I would rather they give free vouchers to take the Arlington co swim classes so they actually could learn how to swim.

honestly- this is how I feel too. I know some of the kids who don't know how to swim. I have seen what the school swim class does. For one child it meant that he has gone from being afraid to put his face in to being willing to put his face in. That's great and I'm pleased he can do that. But if he fell into deep water- he'd drown. Getting them to the class took out a huge amount of instructional time- getting on a bus, etc.

incidentally- a couple years ago Marymount was offering free swim classes to any child who received free lunch. I'm not sure if they still are or if anyone took them up on it. Getting to Marymount for the classes is a challenge when you are FARMS.

SIGH. The point is not to teach a child how to swim in one week. Everyone knows that's impossible. But it IS possible to teach a child a few basic life safety techniques and very basic familiarity with the water.--and that's what these programs do, and very well I might add. Since the program's adoption in the 1970s, no APS child has drowned. Arlington Parks and Rec ALREADY has drastically reduced swim lessons. Guess what? There are not a lot of very low income kids there! There are many, many reasons why a child doesn't have access to swim lessons--lack of parental involvement, lack of transportation, ingrained societal resistance to water.

You people in your UMC bubble--why don't you get that? I'm sorry your kid has to suffer for a couple of weeks in the pool. Yeesh.

Bubble? Have you ever stopped to think about how this unit would work for a student with a disability? Spoiler alert - not well.

The first PP is an ass. Even for kids without disabilities, they may have fear of the water, body issues with getting into the water, among other things. Neither fear nor swim techniques are going to be helped, significantly if at all, in a single unit with 20+ kids in the class. So GMAFB.

I’m sorry your third grader has body issues-that’s really too bad. So opt the f out and leave an excellent program that greatly benefits low-income kids alone.

This program does not greatly benefit low income kids. It gets them in the water. It doesn't teach them how to swim or help them to achieve any level of proficiency. I have no dog in this fight because my kids swim well and are happy going to any swim related activity, but let's not fool ourselves that this benefits low income kids by somehow making them less likely to drown.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:It was such a waste.

For kids who already know how to swim, it was worthless.

For kids who don't know how to swim, one week was way to short to teach them.

For non-swimmers, I would rather they give free vouchers to take the Arlington co swim classes so they actually could learn how to swim.

honestly- this is how I feel too. I know some of the kids who don't know how to swim. I have seen what the school swim class does. For one child it meant that he has gone from being afraid to put his face in to being willing to put his face in. That's great and I'm pleased he can do that. But if he fell into deep water- he'd drown. Getting them to the class took out a huge amount of instructional time- getting on a bus, etc.

incidentally- a couple years ago Marymount was offering free swim classes to any child who received free lunch. I'm not sure if they still are or if anyone took them up on it. Getting to Marymount for the classes is a challenge when you are FARMS.

SIGH. The point is not to teach a child how to swim in one week. Everyone knows that's impossible. But it IS possible to teach a child a few basic life safety techniques and very basic familiarity with the water.--and that's what these programs do, and very well I might add. Since the program's adoption in the 1970s, no APS child has drowned. Arlington Parks and Rec ALREADY has drastically reduced swim lessons. Guess what? There are not a lot of very low income kids there! There are many, many reasons why a child doesn't have access to swim lessons--lack of parental involvement, lack of transportation, ingrained societal resistance to water.

You people in your UMC bubble--why don't you get that? I'm sorry your kid has to suffer for a couple of weeks in the pool. Yeesh.

Bubble? Have you ever stopped to think about how this unit would work for a student with a disability? Spoiler alert - not well.

The first PP is an ass. Even for kids without disabilities, they may have fear of the water, body issues with getting into the water, among other things. Neither fear nor swim techniques are going to be helped, significantly if at all, in a single unit with 20+ kids in the class. So GMAFB.

I’m sorry your third grader has body issues-that’s really too bad. So opt the f out and leave an excellent program that greatly benefits low-income kids alone.

This program does not greatly benefit low income kids. It gets them in the water. It doesn't teach them how to swim or help them to achieve any level of proficiency. I have no dog in this fight because my kids swim well and are happy going to any swim related activity, but let's not fool ourselves that this benefits low income kids by somehow making them less likely to drown.

You are so, so wrong. And you’ve never stepped foot into an APS pool when, e.g., Carling Springs kids are there. Plus, the program is OVER 40 YEARS long now. No child attending APS has drowned in those years. Pretty remarkable considering the high rate of drowning for low income and minority children. You are someone who knows nothing, but feel some unknown compulsion to tear down a program you know nothing about.