Overcrowding at Arlington Traditional School

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Every school in the county is fighting being overcrowded. Why should ATS be any different? Much of the criticism of ATS comes off as sour grapes. "Oh, poor us. My kid didn't get into ATS so now we're going to trash the program at every opportunity."

Renovations were on the table at one point, and the school accepted the idea. And then APS didn't have the money, so they pulled the proposal to renovate.

If the program moves, it moves. But the community is coming out against being moved way over into a far corner of the county because it would adversely affect the kids from other parts of the county. For example, moving to Tuckahoe would really disadvantage the South Arlington kids whose parents can't get there easily.

My original point was that all the schools are not the same size, so they don't all have the same capacity. Adding trailers to a school does not necessarily add capacity. Anyone who fails to understand that might need a refresher course on math.

I'm looking at the Facilities Optimization Study right now, and it's showing that ATS can accommodate those 12 trailers and still have *tons* of open space. It further shows that, based on cafeteria capacity with a three-seating schedule, APS could accommodate up to 780 students. So don't sob that you can't possibly take more students, it's garbage.

780 students in a building made for 465 students? You are out of your mind!

No school currently has 780 students, and none ever will once the new schools are ready.

You are obviously new here.

McKinley - 811, take out Montessori and it's 794

Math tells me that is more than 780.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Excellent report in the Arlington Connection about overcrowding at Arlington Traditional School (ATS). For 2018 they are projected to have utliization at 121% of capacity.

121%! For ATS!!! And yet the School Board wants to go from four relocatables on the ATS lot to twelve. Even though the whole point of the traditional education model is that you don't have ANY relocatables on the lot .

People cry about McKinley's victimhood, but they're only at 113%. Henry is at 150%. Science Focus is at 128%, with Claremont at 130%.

People have overstated how McKinley has been harmed while schools like Nottingham and Discovery benefited. Well, Nottingham and Discovery are bursting at the seams. As is Tuckahoe. Even Jamestown, which schools kids who live in the most expensive real estate in the County, winds up OVER capacity.

I'm glad the Connection has inserted actual facts into this debate

Really?! The "whole point" of the traditional model is that you don't have any relocatables? Who came up with that idea? I guess the people choosing the ATS program don't even know what the program is about.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Every school in the county is fighting being overcrowded. Why should ATS be any different? Much of the criticism of ATS comes off as sour grapes. "Oh, poor us. My kid didn't get into ATS so now we're going to trash the program at every opportunity."

Renovations were on the table at one point, and the school accepted the idea. And then APS didn't have the money, so they pulled the proposal to renovate.

If the program moves, it moves. But the community is coming out against being moved way over into a far corner of the county because it would adversely affect the kids from other parts of the county. For example, moving to Tuckahoe would really disadvantage the South Arlington kids whose parents can't get there easily.

My original point was that all the schools are not the same size, so they don't all have the same capacity. Adding trailers to a school does not necessarily add capacity. Anyone who fails to understand that might need a refresher course on math.

I'm looking at the Facilities Optimization Study right now, and it's showing that ATS can accommodate those 12 trailers and still have *tons* of open space. It further shows that, based on cafeteria capacity with a three-seating schedule, APS could accommodate up to 780 students. So don't sob that you can't possibly take more students, it's garbage.

780 students in a building made for 465 students? You are out of your mind!

No school currently has 780 students, and none ever will once the new schools are ready.

Brainchild, 780 would include trailers. Yes, ATS is going to have trailers, you and your snowflake are not so precious that you can't cope with the same circumstances everyone else does. It's not going to go up to 780, but don't be cute and pretend ATS couldn't possibly accommodate more students than it has now. The numbers have been crunched and you absolutely can.

[Anonymous]

I take that back:

Two schools with the highest total number of students (K-5)
McKinley and Oakridge. (790, 774)

Two schools with the lowest number of total students (K-5)
Campbell and Hoffman Boston (362 each)

School *most over capacity for its building* and most trailers (10) on its premises this year and next year:
Patrick Henry!
School 4th (of 23) most over capacity for its building: ATS. (Trailers: 4)

Schools with zero trailers: Jamestown, Discovery, ....

Feel free to add actual facts.

Which are the 2nd and 3rd and 5th most overcrowded for their building?
Which schools have zero trailers this year?

[Anonymous]

ATS is crying about five kindergartens. BOO HOO. Other schools have had seven.

It's about time the choice schools share in this overcrowding pain. Either utilize the choice schools as fully as all the neighborhood schools, or disband them altogether. The entitlement is astonishing.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:ATS is crying about five kindergartens. BOO HOO. Other schools have had seven.

It's about time the choice schools share in this overcrowding pain. Either utilize the choice schools as fully as all the neighborhood schools, or disband them altogether. The entitlement is astonishing.

+1 and I pay shocking Arl income tax

[Anonymous]

5 Kinder classes - Oh no!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:ATS is crying about five kindergartens. BOO HOO. Other schools have had seven.

It's about time the choice schools share in this overcrowding pain. Either utilize the choice schools as fully as all the neighborhood schools, or disband them altogether. The entitlement is astonishing.

So, not an ATS parent but I wonder what happens when we catch up at the neighborhood schools. After Reed is built, there won't be any schools in NW Arlington over capacity, supposedly they will even have to close one neighborhood school and move an option program into its building. Does ATS get to scale back at that point? Or is it forced to keep growing when neighborhood schools are no longer in such dire straights? I don't really think parents at ATS would be freaking out so much if it were clear that this was a temporary situation that would mirror whatever is happening across the system. If increased enrollment is permanent, at ATS or Campbell, or at any neighborhood school, then I think they need to be renovating to enlarge the schools and the common spaces.

Also, what of HB? Why are we talking about that? I know they can't have trailers because of their location in Rosslyn, but how else can they do their share? Are they having that discussion yet?

[Anonymous]

My god, this thread just might be the perfect microcosm of the crab bucket mentality this site bleeds daily.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:ATS is crying about five kindergartens. BOO HOO. Other schools have had seven.

It's about time the choice schools share in this overcrowding pain. Either utilize the choice schools as fully as all the neighborhood schools, or disband them altogether. The entitlement is astonishing.

So, not an ATS parent but I wonder what happens when we catch up at the neighborhood schools. After Reed is built, there won't be any schools in NW Arlington over capacity, supposedly they will even have to close one neighborhood school and move an option program into its building. Does ATS get to scale back at that point? Or is it forced to keep growing when neighborhood schools are no longer in such dire straights? I don't really think parents at ATS would be freaking out so much if it were clear that this was a temporary situation that would mirror whatever is happening across the system. If increased enrollment is permanent, at ATS or Campbell, or at any neighborhood school, then I think they need to be renovating to enlarge the schools and the common spaces.

Also, what of HB? Why are we talking about that? I know they can't have trailers because of their location in Rosslyn, but how else can they do their share? Are they having that discussion yet?

Don’t get me started on HB. Should be gone!!!!!!!!! Talk about entitlement. I think both need to go. We can’t afford them anymore.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:ATS is crying about five kindergartens. BOO HOO. Other schools have had seven.

It's about time the choice schools share in this overcrowding pain. Either utilize the choice schools as fully as all the neighborhood schools, or disband them altogether. The entitlement is astonishing.

So, not an ATS parent but I wonder what happens when we catch up at the neighborhood schools. After Reed is built, there won't be any schools in NW Arlington over capacity, supposedly they will even have to close one neighborhood school and move an option program into its building. Does ATS get to scale back at that point? Or is it forced to keep growing when neighborhood schools are no longer in such dire straights? I don't really think parents at ATS would be freaking out so much if it were clear that this was a temporary situation that would mirror whatever is happening across the system. If increased enrollment is permanent, at ATS or Campbell, or at any neighborhood school, then I think they need to be renovating to enlarge the schools and the common spaces.

Also, what of HB? Why are we talking about that? I know they can't have trailers because of their location in Rosslyn, but how else can they do their share? Are they having that discussion yet?

Regarding HB - They are taking 10 additional students. That’s it. They got a new building and no crowding.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:ATS is crying about five kindergartens. BOO HOO. Other schools have had seven.

It's about time the choice schools share in this overcrowding pain. Either utilize the choice schools as fully as all the neighborhood schools, or disband them altogether. The entitlement is astonishing.

So, not an ATS parent but I wonder what happens when we catch up at the neighborhood schools. After Reed is built, there won't be any schools in NW Arlington over capacity, supposedly they will even have to close one neighborhood school and move an option program into its building. Does ATS get to scale back at that point? Or is it forced to keep growing when neighborhood schools are no longer in such dire straights? I don't really think parents at ATS would be freaking out so much if it were clear that this was a temporary situation that would mirror whatever is happening across the system. If increased enrollment is permanent, at ATS or Campbell, or at any neighborhood school, then I think they need to be renovating to enlarge the schools and the common spaces.

Also, what of HB? Why are we talking about that? I know they can't have trailers because of their location in Rosslyn, but how else can they do their share? Are they having that discussion yet?

The bolded part is exactly right. A lot of ATS parents are worried, because in two years, according to APS, all overcrowding in the elementary schools will be over, and APS doesn’t even know, if they can fill all the seats, perhaps closing down an entire school?! But ATS shall sit there with 16 (!) trailers, if they make a decision right now to add 6 classes to ATS and take it over to 700 students? It will stay that way for 6 years.

So while all trailers are gone from all the other schools (fingers crossed!), you want ATS to sit there with 16 trailers?
Really? Right now, the record of any elementary is 10 trailers! You can hate ATS as much as you want, but that is just purely malicious.
And has nothing to do anymore with sharing the burden.

The other choice programs loose kids through moves, etc. and those seats do NOT refill. Their upper grades are always at least an entire class smaller. ATS is different in that all its classes are filled to capacity all the way through, and 5K classes now are 5th grade classes years later. The common areas can’t hold that many kids for their mandatory assemblies and theater and orchestra and all that’s part of the program.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:ATS is crying about five kindergartens. BOO HOO. Other schools have had seven.

It's about time the choice schools share in this overcrowding pain. Either utilize the choice schools as fully as all the neighborhood schools, or disband them altogether. The entitlement is astonishing.

Overcrowding is a huge burden that is falling on a lot of schools, including option schools. Take a deeper look at the data.

Only ONE elementary school has been in the top five for seat deficits for five years running with no relief.

And guess what? It's an option school.

And while other schools have gotten needed measures to move them off the top of the list, this school has gotten very little (other than trailers) and has continued to take six kindergartens each year.

So please realize that your school's problems are not unique and are probably not even as bad as other schools.

Sure, advocate to fix your school, but also advocate to fix the schools in most need.

Your snowflake is no more precious than anyone else's.

[Anonymous]

ATS is only adding ONE kindergarten class next year - 24 kids. They are not adding a class at all grades. That would allow a bit of overflow from the rest of the county until the following year when Fleet opens and all elementary school are redistricted.

ATS is a luxury. There is no guarantee in any of our schools that you get protected from trailers! If you don’t like it, go back to your home school.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:ATS is only adding ONE kindergarten class next year - 24 kids. They are not adding a class at all grades. That would allow a bit of overflow from the rest of the county until the following year when Fleet opens and all elementary school are redistricted.

ATS is a luxury. There is no guarantee in any of our schools that you get protected from trailers! If you don’t like it, go back to your home school.

Again, not an ATS parent, but I think the issue is: have they made it clear that this is for one year, with a promise to reassess next year and adjust appropriately? I know the idea would be a lot less upsetting to the option school parents if it were clear that they will be getting "bubble" classes only as long as the neighborhood schools are also overcrowded. That's fair and equitable. I think they're freaking out because there is at least one board member who's made statements to the effect that anyone who wants to be admitted to a lottery school should be (ATS could not, even with trailers, admit everybody who applies, that would be crazy and then the neighborhood schools would be left under-enrolled). At the same time, there are definitely people who are trying to use this to punish or undermine the option programs. This is a crazy way to go about that. If you don't want option schools, fight for that. Don't fight to make the kids enrolled there have a bad experience. Nobody should be fighting for this. It was terrible when that happened to McKinley, and Claremont and Key. It's terrible that we haven't acted faster for Henry and Oakridge (although, they have resisted the idea of boundary changes that could alleviate crowding instantly because, given the choice, they'd rather have their kids at their "good" but crowded school than at school with space and low test scores).