Kevin Spacey comes out after allegations of approaching a 14 year old boy

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I hope he doesn't get a pass since he's gay. Pedophilia is pedophilia.

This wouldn't be pedophilia and doesn't have any signs that Spacey is a pedophile.

He sexually assaulted a teen.

Whatever. Not a big difference in my opinion. Assaulting anyone is wrong. Assaulting a teen is even worse IMHO...and says something about the attacker. A 14 year old is a kid.

Again, I hope this isn't spun differently and the media takes a lighter touch because "he has the courage to come out." Spacey doesn't deserve a free pass.

I'm not giving Spacey a pass on the incident, but if we're going to throw around terms like pedophile, context matters. A 26-year-old at a late-night party with a 14-year-old who may have looked older than he was, it's entirely possible Spacey didn't appreciate how young Rapp was at the time. It's not like Spacey was hanging around the local roller rink trying to pick up teens, the teen was in an adult context, which may have created an assumption that he was at least 17/18.

I further think that, given the context, you're doing Rapp and other victims a disservice by injecting the term pedophile into the discussion. Spacey's behavior would be wrong whether Rapp was 14 or 24 at the time, but now you've created a whole separate line of debate where people will end up defending Spacey against pedophilia accusations rather than focusing on the improper conduct itself. You've turned Spacey from a perpetrator of sexual assault into a victim of defamation. Good job.

Sorry but you are dead wrong.

What you just wrote is the equivalent of saying "Well the context is that the high school girl at the frat party looked and dressed older than she was so of course it was a fair assumption for the guy to assume she was legal." That is asinine. In fact, it is worse because the high school girl at the frat party and the frat boy are most like both teenagers, or at most a single digit age spread. Spacey was an adult man of at least twelve years older than this eighth grader. So yes, that makes him a child predator. This is not defamation. This is a fact.

If he was a recognized child actor on Broadway then Spacey knew he was a child.

If you look at pictures of him from the time, he clearly looked like a child and in fact, looked younger than his age.

Just because he is gay and liberal does not give Spacey a pass for being a predator.

I will continue to disagree with you and your analogy. If Rapp had gone to the police at the time and Spacey had been charged with statutory rape based on Rapp's age, I would not have disagreed with that charge. That is not the same thing, though, as assuming that Spacey targeted Rapp specifically because he knew Rapp was underage (which is a key element of pedophilia, you're specifically targeting children because they are children). The same is true in your example, if the 14-year-old goes to a frat party or a bar with a fake id and has sex with someone there, the of-age person is guilty of statutory rape, but that doesn't mean the of-age person targeted the younger teen due to her young age as opposed to assuming she was of-age as well.

Taking a step back from this particular case, can we at least agree on the notion that an adult might mistake a younger teen for someone is over the age of legal consent, and thus engaged in a sexual act with them that constitutes statutory rape without is also being a case of pedophilia? If we can agree on that, then we can debate whether it's credible that Spacey might not have appreciated how young Rapp was at the time. If we can't agree on that notion in the abstract, though, there's no sense in discussing this any further.

DP. Your posts are laughable.

Spacey didn’t just run into Rapp randomly on the street. Spacey obviously knew who Rapp was when he invited him to his party.

If you’re this invested in defending Spacey’s egregious behavior, then you’re in for a hard time. Along with Bryan Singer, he’s been preying on young boys for a long time. I’m sure more victims are currently weighing whether to share their stories.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I read the story and I think it entirely plausible that he can't recall an incident that occurred when he was 26 while he was drunk.

If you can’t recall the time that, as a grown man, you jumped on top of a child in a sexual manner, it kind of suggests that this wasn’t a big deal for you. That it was maybe something you did with frequency.

If you were black-out drunk, you may not remember making advances on anyone. Or should we assume that any woman who can't remember being raped because she was black-out drunk wasn't really raped, because you'd remember something like that?

He did not claim he was black out drunk. Most drunk people are not blacked out.

Also, even when black out drunk, I would not jump on top of a child in a sexual manner. In fact, I have been black out drunk, and I can say with certainty I have never sexually assaulted a child. Guess how I know? As an adult, I’m not and have never been sexually attracted to children.

Precisely.

And sexual attraction to children is how pedophilia is defined in the dictionary.

[Anonymous]

Know it is NOR "credible" that Spacey did not appreciate how young Rapp was at the time.

Rapp was a known child actor currently performing on Broadway. Spacey would have been very well aware that he was just a child.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I don't know what planet you are on PP to keep insisting that Spacey did not know that this boy was a child.

He looks at the oldest maybe seventh grade.

Quit excusing a child predator.

I bet if Rapp was a girl who looked (and was known to be) that young you would have a completely different attitude. You are excusing Spacey because he is gay and Rapp was a teen hoy. You fell for Spacey's big "announcement" hook link and sinker.

Actually, I think it's bullshit that Spacey tried to bury his apology in his coming-out announcement, and I judge him pretty harshly for that.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:There’s definitely a PP on this thread who is trying hard to make grown ups being sexually attracted to children seem like a normal thing.

And you seem very invested in finding pedophilia where you can. I'm sorry for whatever you experienced that brought you to that worldview.

An adult being sexually attracted to children IS pedophilia. It sounds like you probably have some skeletons in your own closet that you’re working overtime right now to deny.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Very manipulative and sneaky. He is trying to bury the story of his pedophilic assault on that boy with what he hopes is a bigger story of him coming out.

This.

He shouldn't get a pass just because he's coming out.

Yeah, that wasn't cool. Made the statement all about him. Not about the victim.

But that's part of the Hollywood situation; it's ALL about them, ALL the time. Unfortunately, it makes EVERYONE unreliable, because the accusers also tend to pile on, some to grab attention. It's just one big vie for attention. And if they are out of the loop, a la Meryl Streep or Geo Clooney and a few others, they grab attention by making a statement that they didn't know it was going on. Or they did, but they are so sorry they didn't do anything about. Anything to get the camera and mic on them. All of them. It's so gross.

But the Hollywood child thing has been going on for a long time. ugh.

I remember studying for my bar exam and staying in temporary housing near the studios. One night I went to the jacuzzi, and sat in there with a group of child actors. omg. Good looking but such weirdly sexualized strange kids. It was unnerving and upsetting. They totally creeped me out.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I hope he doesn't get a pass since he's gay. Pedophilia is pedophilia.

This wouldn't be pedophilia and doesn't have any signs that Spacey is a pedophile.

He sexually assaulted a teen.

Whatever. Not a big difference in my opinion. Assaulting anyone is wrong. Assaulting a teen is even worse IMHO...and says something about the attacker. A 14 year old is a kid.

Again, I hope this isn't spun differently and the media takes a lighter touch because "he has the courage to come out." Spacey doesn't deserve a free pass.

I'm not giving Spacey a pass on the incident, but if we're going to throw around terms like pedophile, context matters. A 26-year-old at a late-night party with a 14-year-old who may have looked older than he was, it's entirely possible Spacey didn't appreciate how young Rapp was at the time. It's not like Spacey was hanging around the local roller rink trying to pick up teens, the teen was in an adult context, which may have created an assumption that he was at least 17/18.

I further think that, given the context, you're doing Rapp and other victims a disservice by injecting the term pedophile into the discussion. Spacey's behavior would be wrong whether Rapp was 14 or 24 at the time, but now you've created a whole separate line of debate where people will end up defending Spacey against pedophilia accusations rather than focusing on the improper conduct itself. You've turned Spacey from a perpetrator of sexual assault into a victim of defamation. Good job.

Sorry but you are dead wrong.

What you just wrote is the equivalent of saying "Well the context is that the high school girl at the frat party looked and dressed older than she was so of course it was a fair assumption for the guy to assume she was legal." That is asinine. In fact, it is worse because the high school girl at the frat party and the frat boy are most like both teenagers, or at most a single digit age spread. Spacey was an adult man of at least twelve years older than this eighth grader. So yes, that makes him a child predator. This is not defamation. This is a fact.

If he was a recognized child actor on Broadway then Spacey knew he was a child.

If you look at pictures of him from the time, he clearly looked like a child and in fact, looked younger than his age.

Just because he is gay and liberal does not give Spacey a pass for being a predator.

I will continue to disagree with you and your analogy. If Rapp had gone to the police at the time and Spacey had been charged with statutory rape based on Rapp's age, I would not have disagreed with that charge. That is not the same thing, though, as assuming that Spacey targeted Rapp specifically because he knew Rapp was underage (which is a key element of pedophilia, you're specifically targeting children because they are children). The same is true in your example, if the 14-year-old goes to a frat party or a bar with a fake id and has sex with someone there, the of-age person is guilty of statutory rape, but that doesn't mean the of-age person targeted the younger teen due to her young age as opposed to assuming she was of-age as well.

Taking a step back from this particular case, can we at least agree on the notion that an adult might mistake a younger teen for someone is over the age of legal consent, and thus engaged in a sexual act with them that constitutes statutory rape without is also being a case of pedophilia? If we can agree on that, then we can debate whether it's credible that Spacey might not have appreciated how young Rapp was at the time. If we can't agree on that notion in the abstract, though, there's no sense in discussing this any further.

What's wrong with you? Seriously...what's wrong with you?

You can see the pictures of Rapp and how he looked at the time. They are literally posted in this thread. He clearly looks like a prepubescent boy...because he was. There's no mistaking him for 18...or even 16. He looks like a boy (again, because he was a boy).

I have a 14 year old who looks older than Rapp did, yet my kid clearly is still a kid.

Why on earth are you struggling to defend spacey? Is this striking a nerve with you?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I hope he doesn't get a pass since he's gay. Pedophilia is pedophilia.

This wouldn't be pedophilia and doesn't have any signs that Spacey is a pedophile.

He sexually assaulted a teen.

Whatever. Not a big difference in my opinion. Assaulting anyone is wrong. Assaulting a teen is even worse IMHO...and says something about the attacker. A 14 year old is a kid.

Again, I hope this isn't spun differently and the media takes a lighter touch because "he has the courage to come out." Spacey doesn't deserve a free pass.

I'm not giving Spacey a pass on the incident, but if we're going to throw around terms like pedophile, context matters. A 26-year-old at a late-night party with a 14-year-old who may have looked older than he was, it's entirely possible Spacey didn't appreciate how young Rapp was at the time. It's not like Spacey was hanging around the local roller rink trying to pick up teens, the teen was in an adult context, which may have created an assumption that he was at least 17/18.

I further think that, given the context, you're doing Rapp and other victims a disservice by injecting the term pedophile into the discussion. Spacey's behavior would be wrong whether Rapp was 14 or 24 at the time, but now you've created a whole separate line of debate where people will end up defending Spacey against pedophilia accusations rather than focusing on the improper conduct itself. You've turned Spacey from a perpetrator of sexual assault into a victim of defamation. Good job.

Sorry but you are dead wrong.

What you just wrote is the equivalent of saying "Well the context is that the high school girl at the frat party looked and dressed older than she was so of course it was a fair assumption for the guy to assume she was legal." That is asinine. In fact, it is worse because the high school girl at the frat party and the frat boy are most like both teenagers, or at most a single digit age spread. Spacey was an adult man of at least twelve years older than this eighth grader. So yes, that makes him a child predator. This is not defamation. This is a fact.

If he was a recognized child actor on Broadway then Spacey knew he was a child.

If you look at pictures of him from the time, he clearly looked like a child and in fact, looked younger than his age.

Just because he is gay and liberal does not give Spacey a pass for being a predator.

I will continue to disagree with you and your analogy. If Rapp had gone to the police at the time and Spacey had been charged with statutory rape based on Rapp's age, I would not have disagreed with that charge. That is not the same thing, though, as assuming that Spacey targeted Rapp specifically because he knew Rapp was underage (which is a key element of pedophilia, you're specifically targeting children because they are children). The same is true in your example, if the 14-year-old goes to a frat party or a bar with a fake id and has sex with someone there, the of-age person is guilty of statutory rape, but that doesn't mean the of-age person targeted the younger teen due to her young age as opposed to assuming she was of-age as well.

Taking a step back from this particular case, can we at least agree on the notion that an adult might mistake a younger teen for someone is over the age of legal consent, and thus engaged in a sexual act with them that constitutes statutory rape without is also being a case of pedophilia? If we can agree on that, then we can debate whether it's credible that Spacey might not have appreciated how young Rapp was at the time. If we can't agree on that notion in the abstract, though, there's no sense in discussing this any further.

DP. Your posts are laughable.

Spacey didn’t just run into Rapp randomly on the street. Spacey obviously knew who Rapp was when he invited him to his party.

If you’re this invested in defending Spacey’s egregious behavior, then you’re in for a hard time. Along with Bryan Singer, he’s been preying on young boys for a long time. I’m sure more victims are currently weighing whether to share their stories.

Then let them come forward and I will hear their stories. I'm not defending Spacey's behavior, my argument from the very beginning has been that we should keep our focus on the assault that we know happened rather than getting distracted into these kinds of debates about what else might have been going on that we don't know for sure. We don't need to get into debating whether Spacey's behavior also fits the definition of pedophilia to know that it was wrong, that it was assault. Spacey assaulted another person, why is that not enough to stand on its own as a terrible thing? Is it something about the fact that he assaulted another man, that we're not comfortable calling that assault on its own? Do we need it to be that Spacey deliberately targeted a child because we're still not convinced on some level that men, even adult men, also get sexually assaulted?

[Anonymous]

It seems that men in America are rapists. Much more than those in India. No?

[Anonymous]

For everyone making this be about Rapp and the way he was parented, please read details of his account here:

https://www.buzzfeed.com/adambvary/anthony-rapp-kevin-spacey-made-sexual-advance-when-i-was-14?utm_term=.ltnAJ0Z2xZ#.ttE0J8VmKV

As a teen actor, he was given a lot of leeway to attend "work" events. And given he was already on Broadway, late nights probably were not seen as particularly unusual. Buzzfeed also confirmed independently that he had told a number of people about the incident when it happened...and also mentioned it in a 2000 interview without naming names. It's not strange to me, though, that he didn't come out about it until now. He probably, rightly, assumed people would say the things about him that they are saying.

And I will end this by saying that I have adored Spacey as an actor throughout his career...but I find his response to the allegations pretty infuriating and disgusting. To blame his alleged pedophilia on confusion about his sexual identity is just wrong.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I hope he doesn't get a pass since he's gay. Pedophilia is pedophilia.

This wouldn't be pedophilia and doesn't have any signs that Spacey is a pedophile.

He sexually assaulted a teen.

Whatever. Not a big difference in my opinion. Assaulting anyone is wrong. Assaulting a teen is even worse IMHO...and says something about the attacker. A 14 year old is a kid.

Again, I hope this isn't spun differently and the media takes a lighter touch because "he has the courage to come out." Spacey doesn't deserve a free pass.

I'm not giving Spacey a pass on the incident, but if we're going to throw around terms like pedophile, context matters. A 26-year-old at a late-night party with a 14-year-old who may have looked older than he was, it's entirely possible Spacey didn't appreciate how young Rapp was at the time. It's not like Spacey was hanging around the local roller rink trying to pick up teens, the teen was in an adult context, which may have created an assumption that he was at least 17/18.

I further think that, given the context, you're doing Rapp and other victims a disservice by injecting the term pedophile into the discussion. Spacey's behavior would be wrong whether Rapp was 14 or 24 at the time, but now you've created a whole separate line of debate where people will end up defending Spacey against pedophilia accusations rather than focusing on the improper conduct itself. You've turned Spacey from a perpetrator of sexual assault into a victim of defamation. Good job.

Sorry but you are dead wrong.

What you just wrote is the equivalent of saying "Well the context is that the high school girl at the frat party looked and dressed older than she was so of course it was a fair assumption for the guy to assume she was legal." That is asinine. In fact, it is worse because the high school girl at the frat party and the frat boy are most like both teenagers, or at most a single digit age spread. Spacey was an adult man of at least twelve years older than this eighth grader. So yes, that makes him a child predator. This is not defamation. This is a fact.

If he was a recognized child actor on Broadway then Spacey knew he was a child.

If you look at pictures of him from the time, he clearly looked like a child and in fact, looked younger than his age.

Just because he is gay and liberal does not give Spacey a pass for being a predator.

I will continue to disagree with you and your analogy. If Rapp had gone to the police at the time and Spacey had been charged with statutory rape based on Rapp's age, I would not have disagreed with that charge. That is not the same thing, though, as assuming that Spacey targeted Rapp specifically because he knew Rapp was underage (which is a key element of pedophilia, you're specifically targeting children because they are children). The same is true in your example, if the 14-year-old goes to a frat party or a bar with a fake id and has sex with someone there, the of-age person is guilty of statutory rape, but that doesn't mean the of-age person targeted the younger teen due to her young age as opposed to assuming she was of-age as well.

Taking a step back from this particular case, can we at least agree on the notion that an adult might mistake a younger teen for someone is over the age of legal consent, and thus engaged in a sexual act with them that constitutes statutory rape without is also being a case of pedophilia? If we can agree on that, then we can debate whether it's credible that Spacey might not have appreciated how young Rapp was at the time. If we can't agree on that notion in the abstract, though, there's no sense in discussing this any further.

DP. Your posts are laughable.

Spacey didn’t just run into Rapp randomly on the street. Spacey obviously knew who Rapp was when he invited him to his party.

If you’re this invested in defending Spacey’s egregious behavior, then you’re in for a hard time. Along with Bryan Singer, he’s been preying on young boys for a long time. I’m sure more victims are currently weighing whether to share their stories.

Then let them come forward and I will hear their stories. I'm not defending Spacey's behavior, my argument from the very beginning has been that we should keep our focus on the assault that we know happened rather than getting distracted into these kinds of debates about what else might have been going on that we don't know for sure. We don't need to get into debating whether Spacey's behavior also fits the definition of pedophilia to know that it was wrong, that it was assault. Spacey assaulted another person, why is that not enough to stand on its own as a terrible thing? Is it something about the fact that he assaulted another man, that we're not comfortable calling that assault on its own? Do we need it to be that Spacey deliberately targeted a child because we're still not convinced on some level that men, even adult men, also get sexually assaulted?

According to longstanding societal norms as well as legal jurisprudence, it is generally considered worse to sexually assault a child than an adult.

I can’t believe you need me to explain this to you.

[Anonymous]

To the PP arguing that is was not pedeophelia change it from Kevin Spacey to

26 year old Person of Color tries to sexually assault a 14 year old girl. How do you feel about that now?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:To the PP arguing that is was not pedeophelia change it from Kevin Spacey to

26 year old Person of Color tries to sexually assault a 14 year old girl. How do you feel about that now?

The same way I do about Spacey. It's assault. It's attempted statutory rape. That doesn't automatically make it pedophilia without knowing whether the 26 yo POC appreciated how young the girl was and targeted her because of her young age.

[Anonymous]

I'm pretty confident that had he known, Ed Harris would have beaten Spacey's ass, deservedly so.

There's right and wrong, not too much grey here.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I hope he doesn't get a pass since he's gay. Pedophilia is pedophilia.

This wouldn't be pedophilia and doesn't have any signs that Spacey is a pedophile.

He sexually assaulted a teen.

Whatever. Not a big difference in my opinion. Assaulting anyone is wrong. Assaulting a teen is even worse IMHO...and says something about the attacker. A 14 year old is a kid.

Again, I hope this isn't spun differently and the media takes a lighter touch because "he has the courage to come out." Spacey doesn't deserve a free pass.

I'm not giving Spacey a pass on the incident, but if we're going to throw around terms like pedophile, context matters. A 26-year-old at a late-night party with a 14-year-old who may have looked older than he was, it's entirely possible Spacey didn't appreciate how young Rapp was at the time. It's not like Spacey was hanging around the local roller rink trying to pick up teens, the teen was in an adult context, which may have created an assumption that he was at least 17/18.

I further think that, given the context, you're doing Rapp and other victims a disservice by injecting the term pedophile into the discussion. Spacey's behavior would be wrong whether Rapp was 14 or 24 at the time, but now you've created a whole separate line of debate where people will end up defending Spacey against pedophilia accusations rather than focusing on the improper conduct itself. You've turned Spacey from a perpetrator of sexual assault into a victim of defamation. Good job.

Sorry but you are dead wrong.

What you just wrote is the equivalent of saying "Well the context is that the high school girl at the frat party looked and dressed older than she was so of course it was a fair assumption for the guy to assume she was legal." That is asinine. In fact, it is worse because the high school girl at the frat party and the frat boy are most like both teenagers, or at most a single digit age spread. Spacey was an adult man of at least twelve years older than this eighth grader. So yes, that makes him a child predator. This is not defamation. This is a fact.

If he was a recognized child actor on Broadway then Spacey knew he was a child.

If you look at pictures of him from the time, he clearly looked like a child and in fact, looked younger than his age.

Just because he is gay and liberal does not give Spacey a pass for being a predator.

I will continue to disagree with you and your analogy. If Rapp had gone to the police at the time and Spacey had been charged with statutory rape based on Rapp's age, I would not have disagreed with that charge. That is not the same thing, though, as assuming that Spacey targeted Rapp specifically because he knew Rapp was underage (which is a key element of pedophilia, you're specifically targeting children because they are children). The same is true in your example, if the 14-year-old goes to a frat party or a bar with a fake id and has sex with someone there, the of-age person is guilty of statutory rape, but that doesn't mean the of-age person targeted the younger teen due to her young age as opposed to assuming she was of-age as well.

Taking a step back from this particular case, can we at least agree on the notion that an adult might mistake a younger teen for someone is over the age of legal consent, and thus engaged in a sexual act with them that constitutes statutory rape without is also being a case of pedophilia? If we can agree on that, then we can debate whether it's credible that Spacey might not have appreciated how young Rapp was at the time. If we can't agree on that notion in the abstract, though, there's no sense in discussing this any further.

DP. Your posts are laughable.

Spacey didn’t just run into Rapp randomly on the street. Spacey obviously knew who Rapp was when he invited him to his party.

If you’re this invested in defending Spacey’s egregious behavior, then you’re in for a hard time. Along with Bryan Singer, he’s been preying on young boys for a long time. I’m sure more victims are currently weighing whether to share their stories.

Then let them come forward and I will hear their stories. I'm not defending Spacey's behavior, my argument from the very beginning has been that we should keep our focus on the assault that we know happened rather than getting distracted into these kinds of debates about what else might have been going on that we don't know for sure. We don't need to get into debating whether Spacey's behavior also fits the definition of pedophilia to know that it was wrong, that it was assault. Spacey assaulted another person, why is that not enough to stand on its own as a terrible thing? Is it something about the fact that he assaulted another man, that we're not comfortable calling that assault on its own? Do we need it to be that Spacey deliberately targeted a child because we're still not convinced on some level that men, even adult men, also get sexually assaulted?

According to longstanding societal norms as well as legal jurisprudence, it is generally considered worse to sexually assault a child than an adult.

I can’t believe you need me to explain this to you.

^^^THIS.

The person defending Spacey (and let's be clear, he/she is defending Spacey on some really bizarre level) is nuts.