Carnegie Mellon and Georgetown - why so low endowments?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Georgetown's relatively small endowment has been a problem for a long while. When I was in college (early 90s) my senior year there was not enough financial aid to go around. Seniors were told they could go to their flagship state university and still graduate from Georgetown. At the last minute, there was some deal where funds were found at the law school and loaned to the undergrad operations so that financial aid could be provided to seniors . . .

I'd always heard that the reason for the relatively small endowment (relative to the prestige of the school and success of its grads) was because it's a Catholic institution and people feel like when they give to the church, they're "covered" or something like this (even though the Catholic church does not financially support Georgetown U.)

I went to the law school in the late 90s and it just felt like we were just there to be the cash cow for the rest of the university. We were at this sad ugly campus in a not-great neighborhood and it did not feel part of the campus community at all. The tuition felt outrageous and it was very law-school-factory feeling due to the high number of law students. I've never given them a dime FWIW.

If you want to talk about a GU cash cow, you should look at the School of Continuing Studies. It is shameful some of the SCS programs that have been created over the last few years. Tuition is very expensive and I have trouble believing that most of these programs will lead to meaningful employment opportunities.

[Anonymous]

^ JFK's widow attended GU's SCS courses.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Do grads not like these schools enough to give after they graduate?

It's because a large number of grads go into public service and non-profit work versus ivy peers

Ivies are not the peers of GU

The ivies beg to differ.
http://theairspace.net/commentary/u-s-colleges-name-their-own-peer-institutions-rank-themselves/

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Do grads not like these schools enough to give after they graduate?

It's because a large number of grads go into public service and non-profit work versus ivy peers

Ivies are not the peers of GU

The ivies beg to differ.
http://theairspace.net/commentary/u-s-colleges-name-their-own-peer-institutions-rank-themselves/

very interesting survey. thank you

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Georgetown's relatively small endowment has been a problem for a long while. When I was in college (early 90s) my senior year there was not enough financial aid to go around. Seniors were told they could go to their flagship state university and still graduate from Georgetown. At the last minute, there was some deal where funds were found at the law school and loaned to the undergrad operations so that financial aid could be provided to seniors . . .

I'd always heard that the reason for the relatively small endowment (relative to the prestige of the school and success of its grads) was because it's a Catholic institution and people feel like when they give to the church, they're "covered" or something like this (even though the Catholic church does not financially support Georgetown U.)

I went to the law school in the late 90s and it just felt like we were just there to be the cash cow for the rest of the university.[b] We were at this sad ugly campus in a not-great neighborhood and it did not feel part of the campus community at all. The tuition felt outrageous and it was very law-school-factory feeling due to the high number of law students. I've never given them a dime FWIW.

All law schools are cash cows. Legal education is low-cost and there are lots of students who pay full freight.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I have yet to meet one person who graduated from GU that I have an ounce of respect for.

It funny you say that because I have had similar experience - although I would say I have been underwhelmed.

But they hold themselves in very very high esteem.
The school should do something to tone the attitude of its graduates down - it's repulsive to others.
The typical graduate says 'I went to GU and then there's a pause and you're supposed to bow, clap or throw money or something. All three I guess.

Georgetown is the dream school for the student council try-hard dorks who lacked self-awareness. The few peers I know who are GU alums didn't even apply to Ivies. It was all about GU.

It's the catholic harvard

Yes! This describes it perfectly. I have a family member--by marriage--who came from money, went on to graduate and turn that money into even more money, and now thinks his riches should get him a seat at the cool kids table. But he's still just a completely unself-aware dork.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:My DD turned down CMU because the buildings were in such a state of disrepair. She thought the buildings were beautiful but falling down. Of course, it didn't help that the students seemed depressed and overworked. Her classmate enrolled and, while she likes the school, she is stressed. I know everyone rants about how the luxuries are a waste of money but when you turn off students because of a lack of upkeep, you are going to far in the other direction.

Cmu dorms are disgusting and filthy. I don't expect wake forest or Princeton level accommodations but come on.

Princeton doesn't have nice dorms. People don't go to Princeton for the dorms.

People don't go to Princeton for the dorms, but the dorms are generally quite nice. For example, the crappiest residential college in my time there -- Butler -- has been completely redone and is now leaps and bounds better than before.

Well, my Wilson dorm is still a dump, and I was just back for my 20th reunion, which took place near Little, and while the hallways seem to have been renovated, the bathrooms are still in the basement and still spartan.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Georgetown's relatively small endowment has been a problem for a long while. When I was in college (early 90s) my senior year there was not enough financial aid to go around. Seniors were told they could go to their flagship state university and still graduate from Georgetown. At the last minute, there was some deal where funds were found at the law school and loaned to the undergrad operations so that financial aid could be provided to seniors . . .

I'd always heard that the reason for the relatively small endowment (relative to the prestige of the school and success of its grads) was because it's a Catholic institution and people feel like when they give to the church, they're "covered" or something like this (even though the Catholic church does not financially support Georgetown U.)

I went to the law school in the late 90s and it just felt like we were just there to be the cash cow for the rest of the university. We were at this sad ugly campus in a not-great neighborhood and it did not feel part of the campus community at all. The tuition felt outrageous and it was very law-school-factory feeling due to the high number of law students. I've never given them a dime FWIW.

If you want to talk about a GU cash cow, you should look at the School of Continuing Studies. It is shameful some of the SCS programs that have been created over the last few years. Tuition is very expensive and I have trouble believing that most of these programs will lead to meaningful employment opportunities.

Many colleges have extension schools now that offer stuff like "Master's of Professional Studies in ____." These are usually extension programs that are designed to trade on the regular school's name by selling expensive degrees from "prestigious" colleges to people who don't know better.

[Anonymous]

If you want a story with a sad ending take a prep or visi kid and send them to GU. They will be with kids who "went away to college" and grew up. As far as endowment, well that's based in a greedy, very entitled culture. There are thousands of skimpy showy scholarships available at GU. BUT THEY TEND TO ROLL OVER BECAUSE THEY ARE UNKNOWN....AND SKIMPY.
I don't have any knowledge of CM. But you can probably I have a bee in my bonnet about GU because I have had to put up with too many of their graduates.

[Anonymous]

CMU is more than a century younger than many of the other universities mentioned in this post. It started as Carnegie Tech in 1900. It was also not founded as an elite school for the wealthy but as a tech school for the sons and daughters of Andrew Carnegies steel workers. It eventually merged with Mellon College of Science but was only considered a good regional school until about 40-50 years ago. It is playing catch up, but hard to beat old money millions from the 1700s, 1800s with all of that compounding interest, legacy of giving back, and such.

[Anonymous]

Wow, a lot of bitter folks on this thread. Perhaps you (or your kids) got rejected from GU.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Is this a joke? They both have over a billion dollar endowments. That's well above average for schools outside of HYPSM/Ivy.

Small LAC Berea College in Kentucky has over a billion dollars in endowments.

Berea has a serious and admirable commitment to first generation and low income kids from Appalachia. Education is pretty much free, but you have to work while you are there to help keep the place running. I would imagine they have some seriously grateful alums. They do a great job, but you can't generalize from such a unique institution.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:My DD turned down CMU because the buildings were in such a state of disrepair. She thought the buildings were beautiful but falling down. Of course, it didn't help that the students seemed depressed and overworked. Her classmate enrolled and, while she likes the school, she is stressed. I know everyone rants about how the luxuries are a waste of money but when you turn off students because of a lack of upkeep, you are going to far in the other direction.

Which buildings did she visit? I just visited with my DC, and the building were shiny, new, and technologically impressive.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:My DD turned down CMU because the buildings were in such a state of disrepair. She thought the buildings were beautiful but falling down. Of course, it didn't help that the students seemed depressed and overworked. Her classmate enrolled and, while she likes the school, she is stressed. I know everyone rants about how the luxuries are a waste of money but when you turn off students because of a lack of upkeep, you are going to far in the other direction.

Which buildings did she visit? I just visited with my DC, and the building were shiny, new, and technologically impressive.

The dorms we saw were gross

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:CMU is more than a century younger than many of the other universities mentioned in this post. It started as Carnegie Tech in 1900. It was also not founded as an elite school for the wealthy but as a tech school for the sons and daughters of Andrew Carnegies steel workers. It eventually merged with Mellon College of Science but was only considered a good regional school until about 40-50 years ago. It is playing catch up, but hard to beat old money millions from the 1700s, 1800s with all of that compounding interest, legacy of giving back, and such.

That’s a fair point