What is so special about AAP?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:The benefit of AAP is more apparent in middle school....in AAP there seems to be peer pressure to do well. When I was in middle school, beck when Ford was president, peer pressure was to do poorly; cool kids did bad.

Nowadays, peer pressure is such that ALL kids are encouraged to do well and celebrated when they do - regardless of an AAP label. My child doesn't attend an AAP middle school, but takes all Honors classes along with many other kids, and excels in them. Kids, by and large, want to do well.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I am a PP who wrote about a bunch of differences I see b/t my two kids schools (one AAP, one not). It's not that the non-AAP school "sucks" -- it's a pretty normal school and people (parents, teachers, kids) seem pretty happy with it. But, now that I see what is happening at the AAP school (re: expectations for the kids), I see that there IS a difference and the AAP school is a higher level.

I'm starting to see at the dinner table that my 3rd grader is using words that my 5th grader doesn't understand. It's not b/c my 5th grader is lower level in reading/verbal. 5th grader actually scored in the 99th percentile and 3rd grader was more like 95th or 92% (based on local norms). But, 3rd grader's teacher uses different words in explaining things and they have vocab words that are far above what my 5th grader is doing.

The 5th grader is getting a decent education, but we feel bad that she's still not getting as much as the 3rd grader. If only the non-AAP school would up the ante a bit and challenge the kids a little more. That would go a long way.

New poster - thank you both posts very helpful. Would you be willing to share name of Aap school? Sounds like it has stellar teachers.

It's not in the western part of the county -- those schools seem to be the focus of the aap discussion on DCUM. I'll give you some hints... it's a school that is about 50% aap, and the 50% non-aap part is largely farms and esol... yet it still rates a "10" on greatschools.net.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I am a PP who wrote about a bunch of differences I see b/t my two kids schools (one AAP, one not). It's not that the non-AAP school "sucks" -- it's a pretty normal school and people (parents, teachers, kids) seem pretty happy with it. But, now that I see what is happening at the AAP school (re: expectations for the kids), I see that there IS a difference and the AAP school is a higher level.

I'm starting to see at the dinner table that my 3rd grader is using words that my 5th grader doesn't understand. It's not b/c my 5th grader is lower level in reading/verbal. 5th grader actually scored in the 99th percentile and 3rd grader was more like 95th or 92% (based on local norms). But, 3rd grader's teacher uses different words in explaining things and they have vocab words that are far above what my 5th grader is doing.

The 5th grader is getting a decent education, but we feel bad that she's still not getting as much as the 3rd grader. If only the non-AAP school would up the ante a bit and challenge the kids a little more. That would go a long way.

I think you make a great point here. The level of expectations that the teachers have isn't the same between the 2 schools. IMO children rise to whatever challenge the teacher gives them. If a teacher expects more, the child delivers more.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I am a PP who wrote about a bunch of differences I see b/t my two kids schools (one AAP, one not). It's not that the non-AAP school "sucks" -- it's a pretty normal school and people (parents, teachers, kids) seem pretty happy with it. But, now that I see what is happening at the AAP school (re: expectations for the kids), I see that there IS a difference and the AAP school is a higher level.

I'm starting to see at the dinner table that my 3rd grader is using words that my 5th grader doesn't understand. It's not b/c my 5th grader is lower level in reading/verbal. 5th grader actually scored in the 99th percentile and 3rd grader was more like 95th or 92% (based on local norms). But, 3rd grader's teacher uses different words in explaining things and they have vocab words that are far above what my 5th grader is doing.

The 5th grader is getting a decent education, but we feel bad that she's still not getting as much as the 3rd grader. If only the non-AAP school would up the ante a bit and challenge the kids a little more. That would go a long way.

New poster - thank you both posts very helpful. Would you be willing to share name of Aap school? Sounds like it has stellar teachers.

It's not in the western part of the county -- those schools seem to be the focus of the aap discussion on DCUM. I'll give you some hints... it's a school that is about 50% aap, and the 50% non-aap part is largely farms and esol... yet it still rates a "10" on greatschools.net.

Springfield Estates.

[Anonymous]

It depends on the school and teacher. I've seen different culture and curricula in various AAP schools. It's really all over the map. We're at Spring Hill and have a great teacher, THIS YEAR. Next year may be a different story.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I am a PP who wrote about a bunch of differences I see b/t my two kids schools (one AAP, one not). It's not that the non-AAP school "sucks" -- it's a pretty normal school and people (parents, teachers, kids) seem pretty happy with it. But, now that I see what is happening at the AAP school (re: expectations for the kids), I see that there IS a difference and the AAP school is a higher level.

I'm starting to see at the dinner table that my 3rd grader is using words that my 5th grader doesn't understand. It's not b/c my 5th grader is lower level in reading/verbal. 5th grader actually scored in the 99th percentile and 3rd grader was more like 95th or 92% (based on local norms). But, 3rd grader's teacher uses different words in explaining things and they have vocab words that are far above what my 5th grader is doing.

The 5th grader is getting a decent education, but we feel bad that she's still not getting as much as the 3rd grader. If only the non-AAP school would up the ante a bit and challenge the kids a little more. That would go a long way.

I think you make a great point here. The level of expectations that the teachers have isn't the same between the 2 schools. IMO children rise to whatever challenge the teacher gives them. If a teacher expects more, the child delivers more.

Which is exactly why the AAP curriculum should simply be the regular curriculum.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I am a PP who wrote about a bunch of differences I see b/t my two kids schools (one AAP, one not). It's not that the non-AAP school "sucks" -- it's a pretty normal school and people (parents, teachers, kids) seem pretty happy with it. But, now that I see what is happening at the AAP school (re: expectations for the kids), I see that there IS a difference and the AAP school is a higher level.

I'm starting to see at the dinner table that my 3rd grader is using words that my 5th grader doesn't understand. It's not b/c my 5th grader is lower level in reading/verbal. 5th grader actually scored in the 99th percentile and 3rd grader was more like 95th or 92% (based on local norms). But, 3rd grader's teacher uses different words in explaining things and they have vocab words that are far above what my 5th grader is doing.

The 5th grader is getting a decent education, but we feel bad that she's still not getting as much as the 3rd grader. If only the non-AAP school would up the ante a bit and challenge the kids a little more. That would go a long way.

I think you make a great point here. The level of expectations that the teachers have isn't the same between the 2 schools. IMO children rise to whatever challenge the teacher gives them. If a teacher expects more, the child delivers more.

Great example of the importance of fidelity of implementation.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I am a PP who wrote about a bunch of differences I see b/t my two kids schools (one AAP, one not). It's not that the non-AAP school "sucks" -- it's a pretty normal school and people (parents, teachers, kids) seem pretty happy with it. But, now that I see what is happening at the AAP school (re: expectations for the kids), I see that there IS a difference and the AAP school is a higher level.

I'm starting to see at the dinner table that my 3rd grader is using words that my 5th grader doesn't understand. It's not b/c my 5th grader is lower level in reading/verbal. 5th grader actually scored in the 99th percentile and 3rd grader was more like 95th or 92% (based on local norms). But, 3rd grader's teacher uses different words in explaining things and they have vocab words that are far above what my 5th grader is doing.

The 5th grader is getting a decent education, but we feel bad that she's still not getting as much as the 3rd grader. If only the non-AAP school would up the ante a bit and challenge the kids a little more. That would go a long way.

I think you make a great point here. The level of expectations that the teachers have isn't the same between the 2 schools. IMO children rise to whatever challenge the teacher gives them. If a teacher expects more, the child delivers more.

Which is exactly why the AAP curriculum should simply be the regular curriculum.

I'm the first PP on this (with the 5th and 3rd graders) -- I'm not sure that ALL kids should have the AAP curriculum -- honestly, it may be a bit much for a sizable portion of the kids. But, I would absolutely like to see it offered to a subset of kids in every grade in every elem. school. Whether that is 30% or 50% or 70% of kids in a given school, I don't know. But, I do think it should be provided and there are many kids who would benefit from it.

As an example, 5th graders' spelling/vocab words involve studying the concept of "-dge" and "-ge" so an example of this week's words are "hedge" and "village" (mind you, DC was 99th % on cogat -- back in 2nd grade). 3rd grader's vocab/spelling words this week are focused on "trans" -- "translucent," "transfusion," "transaction," etc. It doesn't seem reasonable to me that the 3rd grader's words are SO much more advanced than the 5th grader. I thought AAP was one year ahead, not three or four years ahead... or maybe the 5th grade teachers (non-AAP) aren't expecting enough of 5th graders?

Same with the presentations -- aap kids are expected to prepare presentations according to a rubric and then get up and present. Experience with presentations breeds confidence. Non-aap kids are capable of giving presentations more often -- and it would help them become better speakers (which isn't a skill linked to advanced thinking abilities).

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

I'm the first PP on this (with the 5th and 3rd graders) -- I'm not sure that ALL kids should have the AAP curriculum -- honestly, it may be a bit much for a sizable portion of the kids. But, I would absolutely like to see it offered to a subset of kids in every grade in every elem. school. Whether that is 30% or 50% or 70% of kids in a given school, I don't know. But, I do think it should be provided and there are many kids who would benefit from it.

As an example, 5th graders' spelling/vocab words involve studying the concept of "-dge" and "-ge" so an example of this week's words are "hedge" and "village" (mind you, DC was 99th % on cogat -- back in 2nd grade). 3rd grader's vocab/spelling words this week are focused on "trans" -- "translucent," "transfusion," "transaction," etc. It doesn't seem reasonable to me that the 3rd grader's words are SO much more advanced than the 5th grader. I thought AAP was one year ahead, not three or four years ahead... or maybe the 5th grade teachers (non-AAP) aren't expecting enough of 5th graders?

Same with the presentations -- aap kids are expected to prepare presentations according to a rubric and then get up and present. Experience with presentations breeds confidence. Non-aap kids are capable of giving presentations more often -- and it would help them become better speakers (which isn't a skill linked to advanced thinking abilities).

AAP vs non-AAP depends on which schools and teachers you are comparing. What is your experience with your kids is not necessarily the norm everywhere else. Some center schools have good AAP programs and others are meh. Same with Non-AAP as well.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

I'm the first PP on this (with the 5th and 3rd graders) -- I'm not sure that ALL kids should have the AAP curriculum -- honestly, it may be a bit much for a sizable portion of the kids. But, I would absolutely like to see it offered to a subset of kids in every grade in every elem. school. Whether that is 30% or 50% or 70% of kids in a given school, I don't know. But, I do think it should be provided and there are many kids who would benefit from it.

As an example, 5th graders' spelling/vocab words involve studying the concept of "-dge" and "-ge" so an example of this week's words are "hedge" and "village" (mind you, DC was 99th % on cogat -- back in 2nd grade). 3rd grader's vocab/spelling words this week are focused on "trans" -- "translucent," "transfusion," "transaction," etc. It doesn't seem reasonable to me that the 3rd grader's words are SO much more advanced than the 5th grader. I thought AAP was one year ahead, not three or four years ahead... or maybe the 5th grade teachers (non-AAP) aren't expecting enough of 5th graders?

Same with the presentations -- aap kids are expected to prepare presentations according to a rubric and then get up and present. Experience with presentations breeds confidence. Non-aap kids are capable of giving presentations more often -- and it would help them become better speakers (which isn't a skill linked to advanced thinking abilities).

AAP vs non-AAP depends on which schools and teachers you are comparing. What is your experience with your kids is not necessarily the norm everywhere else. Some center schools have good AAP programs and others are meh. Same with Non-AAP as well.

+1000

This poster absolutely nailed it. There is no consistency between schools/teachers, and this lack of consistency is in both AAP and non-AAP.

[Anonymous]

Our child is at a center school, in AAP. Other than math, I think the program is not that great. The math IS compacted and moves extremely quickly. My child is doing fine in math but for the first time she has to actually work to learn the material. Homework is 5 minutes of math, but then every few weeks there is a comprehensive test and that is where she has to do the work to learn it. I think that most kids WOULD have trouble with the speed of math if not in AAP. Before I get jumped on, I said "most" - some could certainly do it, but to be able to go soooo slowwwww in math for years and then be whizzing through it would be difficult for many kids.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Our child is at a center school, in AAP. Other than math, I think the program is not that great. The math IS compacted and moves extremely quickly. My child is doing fine in math but for the first time she has to actually work to learn the material. Homework is 5 minutes of math, but then every few weeks there is a comprehensive test and that is where she has to do the work to learn it. I think that most kids WOULD have trouble with the speed of math if not in AAP. Before I get jumped on, I said "most" - some could certainly do it, but to be able to go soooo slowwwww in math for years and then be whizzing through it would be difficult for many kids.

Yes, math is a different animal. There will always need to be many levels of math. But there is no reason AAP language arts, social studies, and science shouldn't be offered to ALL kids, in every school.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Our child is at a center school, in AAP. Other than math, I think the program is not that great. The math IS compacted and moves extremely quickly. My child is doing fine in math but for the first time she has to actually work to learn the material. Homework is 5 minutes of math, but then every few weeks there is a comprehensive test and that is where she has to do the work to learn it. I think that most kids WOULD have trouble with the speed of math if not in AAP. Before I get jumped on, I said "most" - some could certainly do it, but to be able to go soooo slowwwww in math for years and then be whizzing through it would be difficult for many kids.

Yes, math is a different animal. There will always need to be many levels of math. But there is no reason AAP language arts, social studies, and science shouldn't be offered to ALL kids, in every school.

i

In our AAP school, advanced math is included in the science curriculum. Not sure how non - advanced math kids could participate in the science portion.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Our child is at a center school, in AAP. Other than math, I think the program is not that great. The math IS compacted and moves extremely quickly. My child is doing fine in math but for the first time she has to actually work to learn the material. Homework is 5 minutes of math, but then every few weeks there is a comprehensive test and that is where she has to do the work to learn it. I think that most kids WOULD have trouble with the speed of math if not in AAP. Before I get jumped on, I said "most" - some could certainly do it, but to be able to go soooo slowwwww in math for years and then be whizzing through it would be difficult for many kids.

But math aptitude/performance is only one aspect of the AAP screening. It is possible to be not great at math and get into AAP and it is also possible to have high math aptitude / grades and not get into AAP (low GBRS, lower scores on other sub tests). And then supposedly Advanced Math should be available for the Gen Ed students but in some schools it is and some schools it really is not. And if differentiated math is really the main feature of AAP then while all the noise about "kids who think differently"?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Our child is at a center school, in AAP. Other than math, I think the program is not that great. The math IS compacted and moves extremely quickly. My child is doing fine in math but for the first time she has to actually work to learn the material. Homework is 5 minutes of math, but then every few weeks there is a comprehensive test and that is where she has to do the work to learn it. I think that most kids WOULD have trouble with the speed of math if not in AAP. Before I get jumped on, I said "most" - some could certainly do it, but to be able to go soooo slowwwww in math for years and then be whizzing through it would be difficult for many kids.

But math aptitude/performance is only one aspect of the AAP screening. It is possible to be not great at math and get into AAP and it is also possible to have high math aptitude / grades and not get into AAP (low GBRS, lower scores on other sub tests). And then supposedly Advanced Math should be available for the Gen Ed students but in some schools it is and some schools it really is not. And if differentiated math is really the main feature of AAP then while all the noise about "kids who think differently"?

I also wonder why the schools really need a separate AAP program. DS is a level III student in a center school. The school "levels" the math classes thoughout AAP and Gen Ed. DS is in the highest math group and doesn't have a problem with it. Some of the AAP students are in the on-grade-level math class. Those students are labeled AAP and DS is labeled Gen Ed. I don't understand why they need separate base classes. Why don't the school's just level the classes as needed. Isn't this what is going to happen in middle and high school?