Does anyone else feel stressed about lack of school options?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Honestly, I think the issue is as much about having too many option as it is about having too few.

I think people in DC get the idea that school needs to be "perfect". They reject schools because they are "not an option", or because the test scores aren't exactly what they want, or because they have too many students, or because you have to live in a certain neighborhood to get in, and that neighborhood has a "bad commute" or "isn't walkable" or requires that they live in an apartment.

The reality is that most people in this country simply send their kid to the school that serves their neighborhood. Most of those schools have both good things and bad things about them. They might be a small school but with huge class sizes, or they might be all about reading and math with very little outdoor time or specials, or whatever.

Similarly, people in these communities don't have the huge array of housing choices that we can imagine. Many rural communities have no walkable neighborhoods. Many people right now are stuck in underwater mortgages, and community a hundred miles to the only work they can find. They also aren't making $250K because those jobs don't exist in rural areas.

Stop whining and choose one of the choices available to you. You've got plenty. As a middle income family living in DC EOTP, you've got plenty of options.

1) You can stay in your neighborhood, send your child to the local public school, and provide enrichment.

2) You can stay in your neighborhood, and home school (note: if your family has an income of $150K, then presumably one of you is making at least $75K, which is enough to live on in this city).

3) You can move to PG county, save a lot on housing, send your kid to public school and use the money for enrichment.

4) You can move to PG county, save a lot on housing, and use it to send your child to a parochial or other lower cost private option.

5) You can move to an apartment (not one with a pullout, but a nice 2 or 3 BR) WOTP, or in a close in suburb like Takoma Park, Bethesda, or North Arlington, and send your kid to the highly regarded public schools in those areas.

6) You can move farther out, put up with a slightly longer commute, and have a single family house and a public school that is as good as what you'd get in the mythical small town that you dream of.

How is that not enough options?

This is an awesome post. Thank you.

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:How do you define "huge" in terms of a public elementary?

We are in APS and our school is just under 400. It seems like a very nice-sized school. It's one of the smaller ones in Arlington but I think 450 or 500 would still be fine.

Yes, but you assume that everyone can afford housing costs into Arlington, or wants to deal with the traffic logjam or the wonderful unreliability of Metro to get into the city for their job every day.

I'm not OP BTW.

OP mentioned moving to the suburbs as one solution, except for the "huge" elementary schools. So I was just responding on that point.

I understand. It's just that the reality is many people are priced out of close in suburbs like Arlington, so you have to move to East Bumblefuck to find an affordable house in a good school district, and then spend half your life commuting. I can't speak for OP, but for me that is no "solution."

I would add, a lot of people are priced out of East Bumblefuck.

I would just like to thank whomever came up with the name "East Bumblefuck" which I can't even type without laughing. Thank you.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:10:03 Sure, living outside this area can be cheaper and there are some great schools, but go on any homeschool forum and you'll read about moms with kids in small town schools that were pathetic and gave no other option besides homeschooling. Of the about 50 people I know living in a small town or city at least 1/4 of them have had problems finding jobs and had to move to a larger city area or have someone have a long commute to another town or city. If you are smart and can get a good steady job in a small town, by all means, move there. You'll probably have a nicer house. I definitely have friends who love this type of living especially being near their families, but almost all have their children in private schools there because the publics are underperforming or have a husband with a long commute anyway. To say that this area sucks when the schools are all well rated, taxes in the suburbs are relatively low (at least compared to the Northeast), and there are jobs to be had for all, is only looking at things from one side. Your children aren't even in the school system yet so you're making assumptions about things that you don't really know well. Smaller towns need more people, so please move there if you can make it work. We live out in the Vienna/Fairfax area with many schools under 600 students. There's even a school near us under 300 students. Parents do have an hour commute to their job in the city, but they seem to be ok with it. Most also have jobs in the suburbs. Every place has it's compromises and yes, middle income families IMO should not be so concerned about having the best of everything, but should be more concerned with having a life that works for them.

I do have children, and I come from a city in OH that does have some great suburban school districts. The job market isn't DC, but it's not terrible either. So thanks for trying to "school" me or whatever, but you are making false assumptions about me and speaking as though your anecdotal stories are gospel. So just zip it already, windbag.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:The terrible choices in DC are caused by DCPS' unwillingness to meet the needs of high-achievers through subject tracking in every school, at least for math and english. How can we maybe join forces to fix this, maybe a petition? I don't know politics but this charter lottery hell vs. crap public school is insane, and everybody with a lottery number is a potential for lost tax revenue to the city. Maybe the council is unaware of this?

Huh? How does a lottery number equal lost tax revenue? This doesn't 'make sense.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

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Anonymous wrote:The problem is that many of you have bourgie tastes, middle-class budgets and racist attitudes. Stop pretending to be hipsters and go back to your small towns and boring suburbs in Ohio.

You know, those small towns and boring suburbs often have far better schools, safe neighborhoods at affordable prices, and a sense of community that doesn't exist here. And regardless of what people in the Beltway Bubble think, there are decent jobs to be had outside of Metro DC.

Asswipe.

Don't let us stop you from leaving. Just don't bore us with your endless tales of woe when all you really need to do is make the same types of compromises that people coming to large urban areas have made for generations.

Fucking spoiled brats.

How is it that I am a spoiled brat because I want a different QOL and have different values? YOU are a fucking snob.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

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Anonymous wrote:How do you define "huge" in terms of a public elementary?

We are in APS and our school is just under 400. It seems like a very nice-sized school. It's one of the smaller ones in Arlington but I think 450 or 500 would still be fine.

Yes, but you assume that everyone can afford housing costs into Arlington, or wants to deal with the traffic logjam or the wonderful unreliability of Metro to get into the city for their job every day.

I'm not OP BTW.

OP mentioned moving to the suburbs as one solution, except for the "huge" elementary schools. So I was just responding on that point.

I understand. It's just that the reality is many people are priced out of close in suburbs like Arlington, so you have to move to East Bumblefuck to find an affordable house in a good school district, and then spend half your life commuting. I can't speak for OP, but for me that is no "solution."

I would add, a lot of people are priced out of East Bumblefuck.

You're welcome


I would just like to thank whomever came up with the name "East Bumblefuck" which I can't even type without laughing. Thank you.

[Anonymous]

Well, the problem I have with the PP who says there are too many options is I think think she/he fails to see that ALL of those options still require a certain HHI.

It is expensive even to get a small apartment in MOCO. So let's not fool ourselves. I lived in Takoma Park in the early 2000s, and it was expensive then (and I lived in a 1-bedroom apartment that didn't have AC).

People who say move to PG and then you can afford private school don't realize that for a lot of people, even living in, gasp, PG county is expensive!!! Not all salaries in DC support the high COL.

Personally, I don't care about scores. I don't care about getting a kid into an Ivy League. For me, the issue is safety and behavioral issues. And that is a serious concern in the public school choices in D.C. and PG and parts of MOCO. that's what scares people. And because of those issues, private schools are hard to get into and expensive.

I hate when people act like people are overdramatic.

Personally, I plan to give public schools in PG a try, but I live in a section that feeds to a more stable school. And where I live isn't dirt cheap, like people pretend PG is, but MOCO doesn't work for me for financial and commute reasons.

And yes, it is reasonable for people to consider commute. If a person has to commute over an hour to and from work, it does affect how much they see their kid. Not to mention it adds to before and after care costs, and even then MOST of those after care places require you to be there by 6pm. Some long commutes don't allow for that.

So while I believe there are solutions and trade-offs, I still think it's very hard for the true middle class in the d.c. area (by middle class, I mean 100k hhi).

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:So while I believe there are solutions and trade-offs, I still think it's very hard for the true middle class in the d.c. area (by middle class, I mean 100k hhi).

Here are the median household incomes in the DC area:

DC: $61,835
Montgomery County: $95,660
Prince George's County: $73,447
Fairfax County: $108,439
Arlington County: $99,651

The median means that half of households earn more and half of households earn less.

If you define middle class as a household income of $100,000, what do you call the well over half of households in the DC area with a household income of less?

[Anonymous]

10:51 Wow! I thought people from Ohio had better manners. If you like Ohio suburbia so much, please just move back. I can't believe though it will be any more exciting walkabillity wise than living in Bumblefuck DC suburb which you seem to hate. I was merely pointing out that many people move to a smaller town either because of family or whatever with a dream job and then find out it is now closing and then they have to move elsewhere or have a long commute or people start moving away and then the local private school closes, public schools merge together, etc. This is happening to many of my friends in the NE. I think there was even a posting not too long ago about not enough good paying jobs in the DC area to afford housing. Someone posted that it was cheaper to live in Ohio and I remember the people from Ohio were posting about how bad the job market was out there with people having to work 2 jobs or having no job and saying Cry me a River about not enough good paying jobs in the DC area. I'm all for people moving out of the area. I just happen to also see the benefits in living in a place where you can count on having a job and with many amenities nearby. You don't, so please move back to OH or find a cheaper city to live in which has the excitement your looking for. I happen to live in a nice school district with a reasonably priced older house and good jobs and live near family and I like it. Ok with you?

[Anonymous]

I also think it's very funny that the OP is mainly concerned about the social upbringings of others in DC when she's so insulting herself.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Well, the problem I have with the PP who says there are too many options is I think think she/he fails to see that ALL of those options still require a certain HHI.

It is expensive even to get a small apartment in MOCO. So let's not fool ourselves. I lived in Takoma Park in the early 2000s, and it was expensive then (and I lived in a 1-bedroom apartment that didn't have AC).

People who say move to PG and then you can afford private school don't realize that for a lot of people, even living in, gasp, PG county is expensive!!! Not all salaries in DC support the high COL.

Personally, I don't care about scores. I don't care about getting a kid into an Ivy League. For me, the issue is safety and behavioral issues. And that is a serious concern in the public school choices in D.C. and PG and parts of MOCO. that's what scares people. And because of those issues, private schools are hard to get into and expensive.

I hate when people act like people are overdramatic.

Personally, I plan to give public schools in PG a try, but I live in a section that feeds to a more stable school. And where I live isn't dirt cheap, like people pretend PG is, but MOCO doesn't work for me for financial and commute reasons.

And yes, it is reasonable for people to consider commute. If a person has to commute over an hour to and from work, it does affect how much they see their kid. Not to mention it adds to before and after care costs, and even then MOST of those after care places require you to be there by 6pm. Some long commutes don't allow for that.

So while I believe there are solutions and trade-offs, I still think it's very hard for the true middle class in the d.c. area (by middle class, I mean 100k hhi).

Couldn't have said it better myself. And for those of us who can get good jobs, we can be better off financially too. Really, DC is not the be all end all. It really isn't.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:10:51 Wow! I thought people from Ohio had better manners. If you like Ohio suburbia so much, please just move back. I can't believe though it will be any more exciting walkabillity wise than living in Bumblefuck DC suburb which you seem to hate. I was merely pointing out that many people move to a smaller town either because of family or whatever with a dream job and then find out it is now closing and then they have to move elsewhere or have a long commute or people start moving away and then the local private school closes, public schools merge together, etc. This is happening to many of my friends in the NE. I think there was even a posting not too long ago about not enough good paying jobs in the DC area to afford housing. Someone posted that it was cheaper to live in Ohio and I remember the people from Ohio were posting about how bad the job market was out there with people having to work 2 jobs or having no job and saying Cry me a River about not enough good paying jobs in the DC area. I'm all for people moving out of the area. I just happen to also see the benefits in living in a place where you can count on having a job and with many amenities nearby. You don't, so please move back to OH or find a cheaper city to live in which has the excitement your looking for. I happen to live in a nice school district with a reasonably priced older house and good jobs and live near family and I like it. Ok with you?

Of course. If you are happy, awesome for you. Is the fact that some of us don't like it here okay with YOU? Because your posts have been exceedingly holier than thou.

[Anonymous]

And your posts are exceedingly rude. I think I would be worried about your children setting bad examples in my well to do suburban school to be honest. I was 14:02 about New York which you thanked me for so I'm not sure why I'm holier than thou. You keep discussing how you won't move out past Arlington or Bethesda but then exclaim that suburban Ohio is the way to go. I've merely pointed out that many of us are happy in the suburbs and even have jobs out here verses DC and feel comfortable about getting a job in the future if needed. If you don't like that option or any others presented to you, please move. As others have said, DC isn't the end all be all, but it isn't the pits either. There are $400,000 houses in our neighborhood with a 500 student population, but they aren't brand spanking new. You'd probably find fault with that too.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:We live in DC and are middle class. Our neighborhood ES is not a good option, at least past the lower grades. We had ridiculously high waitlist numbers on the OOB lottery. We were waitlisted at every charter we applied to. We are now faced with either sending DC to a fairly crappy public school, or applying to a private and hoping for financial aid. Or moving to the suburbs; even then, we are facing huge public elementaries. I know we are not the only ones in this situation.

Yep. This is why we are moving back to our hometown as soon as one of us can lock down a good job. The economics of living here don't make sense if you can't pull in $250K a year or more, which is just insane. In our case the financial pressure is impacting our family size because schooling (and the cost of it) is such a major issue, and it is a major source of frustration for both of us. DC's system is fucked up beyond belief.

I don't get this. Our HHI is well below that (This $100k below) and we are doing fine. We are in the northern Arlington/southern McLean area. We saved one of our salaries entirely for the first few years of marriage so we could have a huge down payment. Then we bought a fixer upper and fixed it up.

[Anonymous]

Also, you should realize that many people move here with family not too far away, so it's probably more worth it for them to live here than someone from the Midwest. I really think if you want a city feel, you would be happier in some of the smaller cities in the Midwest. The cost would go down and you'd be closer to family.