Cooper AAP center?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Why should other students have to put up with overcrowded facilities simply because some parents worry that a new center may be inferior to an existing one?

+1000

This is the heart of the matter. Some people are always afraid of change. That doesn't make their fears well-founded, or right. Spoke to a friend of mine whose daughter was in the first class of AAP at Churchill Road. Parents were up in arms in the exact same way when that center started. "It's new, unproven, untested." "You're sending our kids away from a great AAP to a smaller, hastily created one." "This principal/these teachers/this school doesn't support AAP and won't be ready in time."

Guess what? People love Churchill Road, and they loved it from the get-go. I know many are afraid of change. Your kids were afraid to eat new foods, try new sports, or learn a new skill, too. But being ruled by your fears is a terrible way to live. I hope the SB doesn't listen to these suspicious, fearful people and does what's best for the county as a whole.

Oh please, save us the amateur psychologist routine. Some people also resort to transparent tactics that try to trivialize rational, well-founded concerns when it's convenient to their point of view. Some people also always naively trust a giant school bureaucracy with a history of slip-shod decisions. This is not about being afraid of change. It's about ensuring that the school system moves forward in a well-planned, well-supported manner -- this is what's best for ALL of FCPS, not just AAP students in one particular school.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Why should other students have to put up with overcrowded facilities simply because some parents worry that a new center may be inferior to an existing one?

+1000

This is the heart of the matter. Some people are always afraid of change. That doesn't make their fears well-founded, or right. Spoke to a friend of mine whose daughter was in the first class of AAP at Churchill Road. Parents were up in arms in the exact same way when that center started. "It's new, unproven, untested." "You're sending our kids away from a great AAP to a smaller, hastily created one." "This principal/these teachers/this school doesn't support AAP and won't be ready in time."

Guess what? People love Churchill Road, and they loved it from the get-go. I know many are afraid of change. Your kids were afraid to eat new foods, try new sports, or learn a new skill, too. But being ruled by your fears is a terrible way to live. I hope the SB doesn't listen to these suspicious, fearful people and does what's best for the county as a whole.

Exactly.

[Anonymous]

I'm hopeful that the Kaufax amendment will receive enough votes.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I'm hopeful that the Kaufax amendment will receive enough votes.

^edited: that the Kaufax MOTION will receive enough votes

[Anonymous]

PP said : I believe Cooper has Honors level science now, correct? The Honors curriculum is the same as the AAP curriculum, just with non tagged GT students. AAP, Honors and GE use the same facilities at Longfellow. There are no "special" facilities for AAP science students. The difference between GE and the AAP/Honors curriculum is that the AAP/Honors currilum includes additional extentions. I know that some parents with children in AAP like to think it is the quality of the students the AAP program that makes it better than the Honors program, but IME with both at Longfellow, there really isn't a difference with the bulk of the students. The biggest difference is in the attitude of the parents.

==> this is not about the parents... most parents appreciate that every child in Fairfax County schools is amazing and very smart, given where we are located, the advantages of the economy around here, the level of education of parents and caregivers here, the dedication of most of the teachers here. That is all great.

But to pretend that Cooper has, e.g., the science facilities for an AAP center is not only incorrect, it is refuted by Fairfax County Public Schools own internal emails, now available online because of a FOIA request.

I am not tech-savvy enough to reproduce the pdf file here, but it says that S.E. Science Room 109 will need to be converted to a regular science lab, by dividing ESOL room 108. The Shop room 124 will be converted to Project Based Learning Lab. Art Room 119 will become a Science Lab. In Phase 2, Room 126 is going to be divided into and Art Room and Synergistics Lab. This all has some amount of as yet uncomputed costs (and will take time).

On top of that, they are going to need another mod, it seems, which they will deal with separately.

For the emails themselves, see this link:

http://reston.patch.com/blog_posts/numbers-game-aap-in-fairfax-county#pdf-13083396

I note that Longfellow doesn't need any mods or trailers yet -- it's hypothetical in their case.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:PP said : I believe Cooper has Honors level science now, correct? The Honors curriculum is the same as the AAP curriculum, just with non tagged GT students. AAP, Honors and GE use the same facilities at Longfellow. There are no "special" facilities for AAP science students. The difference between GE and the AAP/Honors curriculum is that the AAP/Honors currilum includes additional extentions. I know that some parents with children in AAP like to think it is the quality of the students the AAP program that makes it better than the Honors program, but IME with both at Longfellow, there really isn't a difference with the bulk of the students. The biggest difference is in the attitude of the parents.

==> this is not about the parents... most parents appreciate that every child in Fairfax County schools is amazing and very smart, given where we are located, the advantages of the economy around here, the level of education of parents and caregivers here, the dedication of most of the teachers here. That is all great.

But to pretend that Cooper has, e.g., the science facilities for an AAP center is not only incorrect, it is refuted by Fairfax County Public Schools own internal emails, now available online because of a FOIA request.

I am not tech-savvy enough to reproduce the pdf file here, but it says that S.E. Science Room 109 will need to be converted to a regular science lab, by dividing ESOL room 108. The Shop room 124 will be converted to Project Based Learning Lab. Art Room 119 will become a Science Lab. In Phase 2, Room 126 is going to be divided into and Art Room and Synergistics Lab. This all has some amount of as yet uncomputed costs (and will take time).

On top of that, they are going to need another mod, it seems, which they will deal with separately.

For the emails themselves, see this link:

http://reston.patch.com/blog_posts/numbers-game-aap-in-fairfax-county#pdf-13083396

I note that Longfellow doesn't need any mods or trailers yet -- it's hypothetical in their case.

This reads like an exercise in heel-dragging. If some rooms need to be converted, convert them. Your kid may be eligible for AAP. He or she is not going on a space shuttle launch this fall.

There are still trailers at Longfellow today. It is not a hypothetical.

[Anonymous]

And another article - which is interesting for a number of reasons (and points out that another internal FCPS email obtained under FOIA predicts overcrowding at Cooper under the plan - you can see it for yourself at citation above).

http://reston.patch.com/blog_posts/2013-fcps-aap-expansion-a-rush-to-failure

No one is saying that there should not be more AAP centers, or even one at Cooper. There simply is no reason to throw students and money at a makeshift one by September 2013, when the Board could take more time and think about where the resources should best be provided. It may be for an AAP program in some other part of FFX County, as the author suggests. There is no magic in the date of September 2013 and we should not encourage our elected officials to press forward on plans for which they have no budgetary information (seriously, this will cost money - no one knows how much yet) ... or teacher certification plan (circumvention of the certification requirements on the teachers should not be encouraged or the norm) ... or confidence that any of the population projections are valid. GE will suffer too ...

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:And another article - which is interesting for a number of reasons (and points out that another internal FCPS email obtained under FOIA predicts overcrowding at Cooper under the plan - you can see it for yourself at citation above).

http://reston.patch.com/blog_posts/2013-fcps-aap-expansion-a-rush-to-failure

No one is saying that there should not be more AAP centers, or even one at Cooper. There simply is no reason to throw students and money at a makeshift one by September 2013, when the Board could take more time and think about where the resources should best be provided. It may be for an AAP program in some other part of FFX County, as the author suggests. There is no magic in the date of September 2013 and we should not encourage our elected officials to press forward on plans for which they have no budgetary information (seriously, this will cost money - no one knows how much yet) ... or teacher certification plan (circumvention of the certification requirements on the teachers should not be encouraged or the norm) ... or confidence that any of the population projections are valid. GE will suffer too ...

The best arguments against the expansion of AAP to Cooper in the fall of 2013 are that FCPS needs to step back and reassess the entire AAP program, which may lead to either expansion or contraction of the current program, and that it has the luxury to engage in such a review without changing the current MS assignments right now because the current overcrowding at Kilmer and projected overcrowding at Longfellow are not as severe as the current overcrowding at a school like Haycock. The other arguments are make-weight arguments.

[Anonymous]

I read those emails and have yet to see a comparison of core capacity [excluding modulars] between Longfellow, Kilmer, and Cooper.

Gen ed students deserve science labs also. All the schools should have tech. The growth in AAP is responsible for overcrowding at some schools and that has created a shift in locations.

Where are the Scott Parks enrollment per school per grade level comparisons? It does make sense to have AAP at Cooper unless Longfellow and Kilmer are better equipped to handle the bricks and mortar overcrowding. Which schools are better at 100 over? 150? 200? 300?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:PP said : I believe Cooper has Honors level science now, correct? The Honors curriculum is the same as the AAP curriculum, just with non tagged GT students. AAP, Honors and GE use the same facilities at Longfellow. There are no "special" facilities for AAP science students. The difference between GE and the AAP/Honors curriculum is that the AAP/Honors currilum includes additional extentions. I know that some parents with children in AAP like to think it is the quality of the students the AAP program that makes it better than the Honors program, but IME with both at Longfellow, there really isn't a difference with the bulk of the students. The biggest difference is in the attitude of the parents.

==> this is not about the parents... most parents appreciate that every child in Fairfax County schools is amazing and very smart, given where we are located, the advantages of the economy around here, the level of education of parents and caregivers here, the dedication of most of the teachers here. That is all great.

But to pretend that Cooper has, e.g., the science facilities for an AAP center is not only incorrect, it is refuted by Fairfax County Public Schools own internal emails, now available online because of a FOIA request.

I am not tech-savvy enough to reproduce the pdf file here, but it says that S.E. Science Room 109 will need to be converted to a regular science lab, by dividing ESOL room 108. The Shop room 124 will be converted to Project Based Learning Lab. Art Room 119 will become a Science Lab. In Phase 2, Room 126 is going to be divided into and Art Room and Synergistics Lab. This all has some amount of as yet uncomputed costs (and will take time).

On top of that, they are going to need another mod, it seems, which they will deal with separately.

For the emails themselves, see this link:

http://reston.patch.com/blog_posts/numbers-game-aap-in-fairfax-county#pdf-13083396

I note that Longfellow doesn't need any mods or trailers yet -- it's hypothetical in their case.

This reads like an exercise in heel-dragging. If some rooms need to be converted, convert them. Your kid may be eligible for AAP. He or she is not going on a space shuttle launch this fall.

There are still trailers at Longfellow today. It is not a hypothetical.

The science labs they need for Cooper are to accommodate the additional student load for transfering the AAP program, not because AAP has different or special facility requirements. The language is written to make it seem like AAP needs special facilities, but it just needs the same as the Honors or Gen Ed programs. Like I said before, the Honor and AAP science curriculum are identical.

Sorry for copying the entire post, but I am new to IPad technology and haven't figured out how to highlight a whole section to be able to delete in one fell swoop without a mouse.

[Anonymous]

curricula not curriculum in previous post.

[Anonymous]

The curriculum in Honors is not the same as AAP - not in Science or anything. AAP is more advanced

http://www.fcps.edu/is/aap/pdfs/AAPforMSdiagram.pdf

[Anonymous]

SOmeone should inform thge Principal at Longfellow,, because she has stated at numerous parent meeting that I have attended over the past 4 years that the curricula are the same. They see the same core requirements and the same extentions.

[Anonymous]

They are not the same. She thinks they are the same because her teachers are not AAP-certified -- and that is what she intends to offer as AAP ... seriously, that's it. So she thinks 3 or more Honors classes = AAP. But it simply doesn't. However, she is clearly putting all parents on notice that Honors classes is what they are going to get as AAP at Cooper -- which fits in well with being able to open AAP at Cooper ... if it was just Honors classes, then they would already have it! Presto!

See below as well for Fairfax County's own description of AAP ... then Honors. Yes, Honors is more advanced than GE, but the AAP classes are more advanced than Honors. The kids move faster, delve deeper, involve more issues of higher reasoning and autonomy in education (hence more science lab work required). The AAP classes at Longfellow are NOT the same as Honors - much as Honors is not the same as GE. They offer three levels of classes at AAP centers -- not two masquerading as three.

http://www.fcps.edu/is/aap/level4.shtml

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:They are not the same. She thinks they are the same because her teachers are not AAP-certified -- and that is what she intends to offer as AAP ... seriously, that's it. So she thinks 3 or more Honors classes = AAP. But it simply doesn't. However, she is clearly putting all parents on notice that Honors classes is what they are going to get as AAP at Cooper -- which fits in well with being able to open AAP at Cooper ... if it was just Honors classes, then they would already have it! Presto!

See below as well for Fairfax County's own description of AAP ... then Honors. Yes, Honors is more advanced than GE, but the AAP classes are more advanced than Honors. The kids move faster, delve deeper, involve more issues of higher reasoning and autonomy in education (hence more science lab work required). The AAP classes at Longfellow are NOT the same as Honors - much as Honors is not the same as GE. They offer three levels of classes at AAP centers -- not two masquerading as three.

http://www.fcps.edu/is/aap/level4.shtml

The prior poster was referring to the principal at Longfellow, not Cooper. A Longfellow principal ought to have some experience with AAP courses and teacher certifications.