s/o Sending your child to a small liberal arts college for $50k a year is a rip-off

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:if you can afford it then sure throw your money away but if you're saddling your kid with loans (i.e. saddling the American taxpayer with loans) it's really a shitty purchase. Send them to a larger state school, spend 20k a year less and have them get a real degree or a artsy-fartsy degree at a fraction of the cost. Go Tarheels!

How are taxpayers being saddled with loans?

Because most student loans are made/guaranteed by the federal government. The default rate is hovers around 25-40%, so taxpayers are on the hook. Plus the new "loan forgiveness" programs will also seek to have taxpayers absorb some of the debt. (However, those "loan forgiveness" programs aren't nearly as generous to student borrowers as they appear at first glance; very few will qualify and those who do will be extremely hard up financially, probably for life.)

From the Department of Education student loan overview (R-10): "For Direct Loans, the overall weighted average subsidy rate was estimated to be -13.91 percent in FY 2011; that is, the overall program on average was projected to earn about 13.91 percent on each dollar of loans made, thereby providing savings to the Federal Government.” Unless you start making up discount rates, these loans make a profit for taxpayers.

As Alan White notes, according to the "Congressional Budget Office, $37 billion will flow IN to Treasury from student loans made this fiscal year at the 3.4% rate (on a net present value basis and net of about $1.5 billion to administer them.) " If anything, we should make rates lower than 3.4 percent.

Here's the link: http://www.nextnewdeal.net/rortybomb/there-good-case-doubling-student-loan-interest-rates

It's also impossible to discharge student loans in bankruptcy.

[Anonymous]

I think some of the folks are thinking the student loan bubble will reach a point where we're faced with "massive bankruptcies among thirtysomethings" or "bail out student lenders." You know, sort of what folks were complaining about in 2005.

[Anonymous]

I love how the few people that went to the top 5 schools are rapidly posting about how great their school experience was. What you're not seeing is everyone who went to school 10 and down the Haverfords, St Olafs, Macalaster College, Pomona etc. Btw GW and Georgetown are not considered small schools. Oh and if you don't think Vtech or UVA don't have a huge alumni presence then you're smoking something.

[Anonymous]

I am a college counselor at a local private school:

Smaller, private, Liberal Arts schools will provide more financial aid (scholarships, grants, etc.) than larger, state schools. In addition, the alumni connection at the smaller schools is much greater for the students (meaning better job prospects upon graduation).

The BEST bang for your buck? One to two years at a community college. You take the same courses your first year at UMD as you do at Montgomery College (unless you have earned your AP credits in high school to skip some of these classes) and it is for a fraction of the cost, however most students want the "college experience" and poopoo the community college route.

Of course, as a DC resident, your kids get in-state tuition at any public college or university in the country. Quite a deal!

[Anonymous]

PP, you do not get in state tuition at any public college or university. For participating public schools, you get 10K per year for tuition towards the out-of state cost. In some cases this is close to in-state tuition, but at a school like Michigan, you're still stuck with a 30K tuition bill.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I think some of the folks are thinking the student loan bubble will reach a point where we're faced with "massive bankruptcies among thirtysomethings" or "bail out student lenders." You know, sort of what folks were complaining about in 2005.

Student loans are not dischargeable in bankruptcy.

[Anonymous]

DS and DD attend SLACs that each total 60K per year with tuition, room and board. We live in DC and it was actually cheaper to send them to SLACs than a public university with DCTAG. The SLACs offered them each a fantastic package of scholarships and gift aid, with minimal loan debt. We pay less than 15k for each kid.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:PP, you do not get in state tuition at any public college or university. For participating public schools, you get 10K per year for tuition towards the out-of state cost. In some cases this is close to in-state tuition, but at a school like Michigan, you're still stuck with a 30K tuition bill.

$30k to Michigan a school with worldwide alumni, great academics and rich NCAA tradition (which increases alumni camaraderie) is worth more than $50k to Grinnell or other middling school.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:PP, you do not get in state tuition at any public college or university. For participating public schools, you get 10K per year for tuition towards the out-of state cost. In some cases this is close to in-state tuition, but at a school like Michigan, you're still stuck with a 30K tuition bill.

DC residents can commute to UMD or GMU. Metro to GMU!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I love how the few people that went to the top 5 schools are rapidly posting about how great their school experience was. What you're not seeing is everyone who went to school 10 and down the Haverfords, St Olafs, Macalaster College, Pomona etc. Btw GW and Georgetown are not considered small schools. Oh and if you don't think Vtech or UVA don't have a huge alumni presence then you're smoking something.

PP, you're kind of mixing apples and oranges here: US News ranks Pomona 4th, Haverford 10th, Macalester 25th. This has been a problem with this entire thread -- you can't say all LACs are the same or all state schools are the same -- there are vast differences among them. Moreover, for those relying on their memories from back in the day when we applied to college, the reputations of many schools have changed since then (this is true even if you're only in your 30s).

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I am a college counselor at a local private school:

Smaller, private, Liberal Arts schools will provide more financial aid (scholarships, grants, etc.) than larger, state schools. In addition, the alumni connection at the smaller schools is much greater for the students (meaning better job prospects upon graduation).

The BEST bang for your buck? One to two years at a community college. You take the same courses your first year at UMD as you do at Montgomery College (unless you have earned your AP credits in high school to skip some of these classes) and it is for a fraction of the cost, however most students want the "college experience" and poopoo the community college route.

Of course, as a DC resident, your kids get in-state tuition at any public college or university in the country. Quite a deal!

Yowza, you are a college counselor and, yet, you are WRONG about DC TAG. I hope you aren't at DC's school! You don't get in-state tuition, you get $10K (annually) off the out-of-state tuition. Please read up.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I love how the few people that went to the top 5 schools are rapidly posting about how great their school experience was. What you're not seeing is everyone who went to school 10 and down the Haverfords, St Olafs, Macalaster College, Pomona etc. Btw GW and Georgetown are not considered small schools. Oh and if you don't think Vtech or UVA don't have a huge alumni presence then you're smoking something.

1. You need to get your ranking straight. Pomona is definitely top 5-7 and Haverford is very close behind. St. Olaf and Macalaster are good, but not in the same league as Swarthmore, Amherst, Williams, Pomona, Wellesley, and probably Carleton and Davidson.

2. No one said that UVA or VT, or UMD, for that matter has small alumni presence. However, there is something special about the very tight alumni network at the most selective, SLACs. UVA alum (and I speak as one!) are a dime a dozen here in DC, but when I see one of my colleagues meet another "Swattie," it's like they are kindred spirits. Maybe because it's a self-selecting bunch that choose to attend these schools (UVA, OTOH, was a "default" option for the strong students at my NOVA high school)? BTW, all the alum I've known from Swarthmore and Williams seem to be doing really interesting, cool work. I would be very, very pleased if DD got into one of those schools.

[Anonymous]

You know what opinions are like ... everyone has one.

I have nothing against public colleges & universities, my father was a trustee of one for more than 20 yrs. and we support them even though he & I both went to a prestigious small liberal arts college.

I will say, however, that I had the chance to do things at a small LA school that I would never have been able to do at a large school. YMMV. Different strokes for diff. folks.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:PP, you do not get in state tuition at any public college or university. For participating public schools, you get 10K per year for tuition towards the out-of state cost. In some cases this is close to in-state tuition, but at a school like Michigan, you're still stuck with a 30K tuition bill.

$30k to Michigan a school with worldwide alumni, great academics and rich NCAA tradition (which increases alumni camaraderie) is worth more than $50k to Grinnell or other middling school.

One of my kids would thrive at Michigan (and will probably apply next year). My other kid would be lost and doesn't care about a rich NCAA tradition (you mean of professional athletes pretending to go to college?). He needs, and attends, a LAC. And of course we don't live in DC so Michigan is not $30k. It's not one size fits all and luckily we have choices.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:PP, you do not get in state tuition at any public college or university. For participating public schools, you get 10K per year for tuition towards the out-of state cost. In some cases this is close to in-state tuition, but at a school like Michigan, you're still stuck with a 30K tuition bill.

$30k to Michigan a school with worldwide alumni, great academics and rich NCAA tradition (which increases alumni camaraderie) is worth more than $50k to Grinnell or other middling school.

One of my kids would thrive at Michigan (and will probably apply next year). My other kid would be lost and doesn't care about a rich NCAA tradition (you mean of professional athletes pretending to go to college?). He needs, and attends, a LAC. And of course we don't live in DC so Michigan is not $30k. It's not one size fits all and luckily we have choices.

+1 -- from a former college admissions officer