S/o med school application process

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:So is there a doctor shortage, or not? If so, what is being done about it? MD schools demand clinical hours, shadowing hours, research hours. Each MD school has thousands of applicants, and the vast majority are rejected. DO schools are typically pricey and the results (residency matches) iffy.

There is only a Dr shortage in rural areas in primary care and general surgery for the most part.
40% of US med school applicants get into at least one US MD program during each of the last few application years, not counting DO programs. AMCAS has a chart of overall gpa vs mcat and something like 70% get into at least one if they have 518+ and above 3.79. Inclusive of all undergrad schools as well as those applying with post baccalaureates. It was worse in the mid 90s to be fair. Agree DO is generally not worth the risk. When people say oh this 3.9X did not get in anywhere: usually the MCAT is not competitive (under 510) which often occurs when the undergrad program is insufficient. 3.9X should imply mastery level of med school course prereqs. It does not at many schools unfortunately.

Are DOs going to ruralt areas?

No, DOs and MDs are interchangeable now in many residencies and clinics. I’m in urban area and it’s a 50-50 mix.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:So is there a doctor shortage, or not? If so, what is being done about it? MD schools demand clinical hours, shadowing hours, research hours. Each MD school has thousands of applicants, and the vast majority are rejected. DO schools are typically pricey and the results (residency matches) iffy.

There is only a Dr shortage in rural areas in primary care and general surgery for the most part.
40% of US med school applicants get into at least one US MD program during each of the last few application years, not counting DO programs. AMCAS has a chart of overall gpa vs mcat and something like 70% get into at least one if they have 518+ and above 3.79. Inclusive of all undergrad schools as well as those applying with post baccalaureates. It was worse in the mid 90s to be fair. Agree DO is generally not worth the risk. When people say oh this 3.9X did not get in anywhere: usually the MCAT is not competitive (under 510) which often occurs when the undergrad program is insufficient. 3.9X should imply mastery level of med school course prereqs. It does not at many schools unfortunately.

Are DOs going to ruralt areas?

No, DOs and MDs are interchangeable now in many residencies and clinics. I’m in urban area and it’s a 50-50 mix.

There is at least one poster on here saying that DOs don't get matched to competive residencies.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:So is there a doctor shortage, or not? If so, what is being done about it? MD schools demand clinical hours, shadowing hours, research hours. Each MD school has thousands of applicants, and the vast majority are rejected. DO schools are typically pricey and the results (residency matches) iffy.

There is only a Dr shortage in rural areas in primary care and general surgery for the most part.
40% of US med school applicants get into at least one US MD program during each of the last few application years, not counting DO programs. AMCAS has a chart of overall gpa vs mcat and something like 70% get into at least one if they have 518+ and above 3.79. Inclusive of all undergrad schools as well as those applying with post baccalaureates. It was worse in the mid 90s to be fair. Agree DO is generally not worth the risk. When people say oh this 3.9X did not get in anywhere: usually the MCAT is not competitive (under 510) which often occurs when the undergrad program is insufficient. 3.9X should imply mastery level of med school course prereqs. It does not at many schools unfortunately.

Are DOs going to ruralt areas?

No, DOs and MDs are interchangeable now in many residencies and clinics. I’m in urban area and it’s a 50-50 mix.

There is at least one poster on here saying that DOs don't get matched to competive residencies.

That's not incorrect but check it out yourself. A lot of residencies post where their residents come from (Undergrad, med school attended). It won't be easy to find someone from DO schools.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:So is there a doctor shortage, or not? If so, what is being done about it? MD schools demand clinical hours, shadowing hours, research hours. Each MD school has thousands of applicants, and the vast majority are rejected. DO schools are typically pricey and the results (residency matches) iffy.

There is only a Dr shortage in rural areas in primary care and general surgery for the most part.
40% of US med school applicants get into at least one US MD program during each of the last few application years, not counting DO programs. AMCAS has a chart of overall gpa vs mcat and something like 70% get into at least one if they have 518+ and above 3.79. Inclusive of all undergrad schools as well as those applying with post baccalaureates. It was worse in the mid 90s to be fair. Agree DO is generally not worth the risk. When people say oh this 3.9X did not get in anywhere: usually the MCAT is not competitive (under 510) which often occurs when the undergrad program is insufficient. 3.9X should imply mastery level of med school course prereqs. It does not at many schools unfortunately.

Are DOs going to ruralt areas?

No, DOs and MDs are interchangeable now in many residencies and clinics. I’m in urban area and it’s a 50-50 mix.

There is at least one poster on here saying that DOs don't get matched to competive residencies.

It depends on the focus area.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:For profit school maybe? How do they do anatomy class online?

ASU is a state university in Arizona. It's public.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:So is there a doctor shortage, or not? If so, what is being done about it? MD schools demand clinical hours, shadowing hours, research hours. Each MD school has thousands of applicants, and the vast majority are rejected. DO schools are typically pricey and the results (residency matches) iffy.

There is only a Dr shortage in rural areas in primary care and general surgery for the most part.
40% of US med school applicants get into at least one US MD program during each of the last few application years, not counting DO programs. AMCAS has a chart of overall gpa vs mcat and something like 70% get into at least one if they have 518+ and above 3.79. Inclusive of all undergrad schools as well as those applying with post baccalaureates. It was worse in the mid 90s to be fair. Agree DO is generally not worth the risk. When people say oh this 3.9X did not get in anywhere: usually the MCAT is not competitive (under 510) which often occurs when the undergrad program is insufficient. 3.9X should imply mastery level of med school course prereqs. It does not at many schools unfortunately.

Are DOs going to ruralt areas?

No, DOs and MDs are interchangeable now in many residencies and clinics. I’m in urban area and it’s a 50-50 mix.

There is at least one poster on here saying that DOs don't get matched to competive residencies.

That's not incorrect but check it out yourself. A lot of residencies post where their residents come from (Undergrad, med school attended). It won't be easy to find someone from DO schools.

Correct. The DO’s who match do fine. About 25-40% of DO grads do not match depending on the DO school. among those that do match, another 25-40% do not match in their first choice field. MD programs are 0-7% for each category depending on the prestige of the med school. DO is a huge risk financially.

[Anonymous]

https://medicine.ucsf.edu/internal-medicine-interns

First year residents at UCSF (one of big 4 residency programs along with Mass General (Harvard), Brigham and Women's Hospital (Harvard), and Hopkins). 0 from DO schools.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:So is there a doctor shortage, or not? If so, what is being done about it? MD schools demand clinical hours, shadowing hours, research hours. Each MD school has thousands of applicants, and the vast majority are rejected. DO schools are typically pricey and the results (residency matches) iffy.

There is only a Dr shortage in rural areas in primary care and general surgery for the most part.
40% of US med school applicants get into at least one US MD program during each of the last few application years, not counting DO programs. AMCAS has a chart of overall gpa vs mcat and something like 70% get into at least one if they have 518+ and above 3.79. Inclusive of all undergrad schools as well as those applying with post baccalaureates. It was worse in the mid 90s to be fair. Agree DO is generally not worth the risk. When people say oh this 3.9X did not get in anywhere: usually the MCAT is not competitive (under 510) which often occurs when the undergrad program is insufficient. 3.9X should imply mastery level of med school course prereqs. It does not at many schools unfortunately.

Are DOs going to ruralt areas?

No, DOs and MDs are interchangeable now in many residencies and clinics. I’m in urban area and it’s a 50-50 mix.

There is at least one poster on here saying that DOs don't get matched to competive residencies.

That's not incorrect but check it out yourself. A lot of residencies post where their residents come from (Undergrad, med school attended). It won't be easy to find someone from DO schools.

My relative graduated from DO and matched with dermatology. It’s not impossible. It’s just varies year to year.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:https://medicine.ucsf.edu/internal-medicine-interns

First year residents at UCSF (one of big 4 residency programs along with Mass General (Harvard), Brigham and Women's Hospital (Harvard), and Hopkins). 0 from DO schools.

Top residencies NEVER take DOs, even primary care ones listed above(internal medicine is primary care for adults only). No surprise at all but additionally, top residency is not needed for most physician jobs. The problem with DO is that a large percent do not match at all and those that do are heavily skewed to rural residency programs and family med (the most general primary care field there is--adults, kids and basic gyn care). It is very difficult to know what specialty you want to do before medical school starts, and whether you might want to be a subspecialist in a well known teaching hospital. DO school completely shuts the door. MD programs as long as they are based at research oriented specialty.
US students who want to go to medical school but do not quite have the Mcat scores (ie above 508) or GPA to get in to MD programs should take another year off, study more, take a post-bacc or even 2 yrs to get a masters in science or public health and try again. Otherwise they should do PA: the job market is still good, pay is above 100k and PA's can work in many subspecialties and get cool cases, albeit under a doctor.

[Anonymous]

What happens if you're a MD or DO who doesn't match at all? What opportunities are there then?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:What happens if you're a MD or DO who doesn't match at all? What opportunities are there then?

When I was a med student they had to “scramble” which involved the dean of students getting in touch a schools and programs all over the country. My understanding was then usually people would get a sort of generic “prelim” intern year and then try again the next year to match in their specialty. It was very, very rare though. 1 person in my class had to scramble.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:What happens if you're a MD or DO who doesn't match at all? What opportunities are there then?

When I was a med student they had to “scramble” which involved the dean of students getting in touch a schools and programs all over the country. My understanding was then usually people would get a sort of generic “prelim” intern year and then try again the next year to match in their specialty. It was very, very rare though. 1 person in my class had to scramble.

Still the same

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:https://medicine.ucsf.edu/internal-medicine-interns

First year residents at UCSF (one of big 4 residency programs along with Mass General (Harvard), Brigham and Women's Hospital (Harvard), and Hopkins). 0 from DO schools.

Top residencies NEVER take DOs, even primary care ones listed above(internal medicine is primary care for adults only). No surprise at all but additionally, top residency is not needed for most physician jobs. The problem with DO is that a large percent do not match at all and those that do are heavily skewed to rural residency programs and family med (the most general primary care field there is--adults, kids and basic gyn care). It is very difficult to know what specialty you want to do before medical school starts, and whether you might want to be a subspecialist in a well known teaching hospital. DO school completely shuts the door. MD programs as long as they are based at research oriented specialty.
US students who want to go to medical school but do not quite have the Mcat scores (ie above 508) or GPA to get in to MD programs should take another year off, study more, take a post-bacc or even 2 yrs to get a masters in science or public health and try again. Otherwise they should do PA: the job market is still good, pay is above 100k and PA's can work in many subspecialties and get cool cases, albeit under a doctor.

This is off. DOs have a very high match rate. You will likely match as a DO. What is hard for them is matching into competitive specialities (ortho, ophthalmology, derm) or top programs in internal medicine and Peds. I went to a top IM program and we didn’t take DOs. However, where you go to residency doesn’t really matter all that much in the end. You’ll always have a job.

This main issue is going to the Caribbean to do an MD. These individuals have a terrible match rate.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:https://medicine.ucsf.edu/internal-medicine-interns

First year residents at UCSF (one of big 4 residency programs along with Mass General (Harvard), Brigham and Women's Hospital (Harvard), and Hopkins). 0 from DO schools.

Top residencies NEVER take DOs, even primary care ones listed above(internal medicine is primary care for adults only). No surprise at all but additionally, top residency is not needed for most physician jobs. The problem with DO is that a large percent do not match at all and those that do are heavily skewed to rural residency programs and family med (the most general primary care field there is--adults, kids and basic gyn care). It is very difficult to know what specialty you want to do before medical school starts, and whether you might want to be a subspecialist in a well known teaching hospital. DO school completely shuts the door. MD programs as long as they are based at research oriented specialty.
US students who want to go to medical school but do not quite have the Mcat scores (ie above 508) or GPA to get in to MD programs should take another year off, study more, take a post-bacc or even 2 yrs to get a masters in science or public health and try again. Otherwise they should do PA: the job market is still good, pay is above 100k and PA's can work in many subspecialties and get cool cases, albeit under a doctor.

This is off. DOs have a very high match rate. You will likely match as a DO. What is hard for them is matching into competitive specialities (ortho, ophthalmology, derm) or top programs in internal medicine and Peds. I went to a top IM program and we didn’t take DOs. However, where you go to residency doesn’t really matter all that much in the end. You’ll always have a job.

This main issue is going to the Caribbean to do an MD. These individuals have a terrible match rate.

Actually one quarter to one third of most DO school 4th yrs have to scramble after not matching on match day, as described above. Over half them get some type of residency or at least a one-year intern spot allowing them to try again, but that is much different than the MD average of less than 2% having to scramble. Caribbean is indeed much worse than DO, you are correct on that.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:https://medicine.ucsf.edu/internal-medicine-interns

First year residents at UCSF (one of big 4 residency programs along with Mass General (Harvard), Brigham and Women's Hospital (Harvard), and Hopkins). 0 from DO schools.

Top residencies NEVER take DOs, even primary care ones listed above(internal medicine is primary care for adults only). No surprise at all but additionally, top residency is not needed for most physician jobs. The problem with DO is that a large percent do not match at all and those that do are heavily skewed to rural residency programs and family med (the most general primary care field there is--adults, kids and basic gyn care). It is very difficult to know what specialty you want to do before medical school starts, and whether you might want to be a subspecialist in a well known teaching hospital. DO school completely shuts the door. MD programs as long as they are based at research oriented specialty.
US students who want to go to medical school but do not quite have the Mcat scores (ie above 508) or GPA to get in to MD programs should take another year off, study more, take a post-bacc or even 2 yrs to get a masters in science or public health and try again. Otherwise they should do PA: the job market is still good, pay is above 100k and PA's can work in many subspecialties and get cool cases, albeit under a doctor.

This is off. DOs have a very high match rate. You will likely match as a DO. What is hard for them is matching into competitive specialities (ortho, ophthalmology, derm) or top programs in internal medicine and Peds. I went to a top IM program and we didn’t take DOs. However, where you go to residency doesn’t really matter all that much in the end. You’ll always have a job.

This main issue is going to the Caribbean to do an MD. These individuals have a terrible match rate.

Actually one quarter to one third of most DO school 4th yrs have to scramble after not matching on match day, as described above. Over half them get some type of residency or at least a one-year intern spot allowing them to try again, but that is much different than the MD average of less than 2% having to scramble. Caribbean is indeed much worse than DO, you are correct on that.

So odds are that you do match as a DO, but if not, you do a one-year internship and try again. Doesn't sound like the worst outcome. Hopefully the internship is paid.