Low MAP reading score of a bookworm

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:It is concerning but you know your kid. Can she read well for her age or not?

That's all you really need to know.

Also recognize that reading a lot is not the same as reading well. Being a bookworm doesn’t equate to comprehension and analysis

It should. What would be the motivation to read long books and several of them if you don’t understand the plot? Comprehending the story is what makes reading so enjoyable

I think DD is understanding the plot and characters, based on what she tells me about books she is reading. I'm not sure she understands how to answer reading comprehension questions. I talked to her last night and asked about a couple of reading comprehension passages and sheets she brought home, because they were perfect. She said the teacher goes through all of them in class together and she sets up each question by giving the kids 2 answers to choose from. I don't know if this is 100% accurate, but it's what DD said and she said that's how it was done all year. I'm no language arts teacher, but this does not sound good at all to me. I have ordered a reading comp workbook that we will tackle over the summer.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I am going to make a suggestion since your child is 8. My oldest kid was an early reader who tore through books! He still loves to read (he is now 18). In 1st grade, his lovely teacher mentioned that although he had a great vocabulary and was a greater reader, she thought that he was memorizing the words and not really taking the time to understand the context of the books he was reading. In order to combat this, we checked out a bunch of chapter books that our public library identified as being perfect for this grade level (he was reading books that were just too advanced for him too truly understand) and we started a book club. He would read a chapter or two (or three) on his own and then I would read the same chapters and we would discuss them. This really slowed him down and he started to pay a lot more attention to figuring out what was happening in the story. If, when we discussed the book, he did not connect to a point that I made, we would go back and reread that section together. We also spent some time reading the books aloud to each other. Honestly, it was a lovely time to spend together. It took some time (all summer), but his reading comprehension greatly improved and he was able to move forward reading more difficult books and understanding them. We also got him a dictionary (an actual book one...not access to an online one) and I told him to keep it next to him when he was reading. If he was unsure of a word, to look it up! He didn't really need to do this with the easier books, but for years later, I would catch him doing this with more complicated books. Also, I brought this up directly with him and got him onboard with the process. If you can spend the time this summer to work with your child (it can be in the evening), it can pay dividends in the long run! Also, we continued to do this off and on for years, even when he no longer needed my help. I think that he enjoyed the one on one time. Best wishes!

Thank you for the encouragement. I am kind of shocked because she is such an enthusiastic reader and reads all the time! And I don't want any supplemental work or the feeling that she doesn't test well to change that love of books. The 1st and 2nd grade teachers both said she is reading way above grade level and said she has great vocab, comprehension, though writing is just ok / on grade level and not amazing. She tested well in the fall, so I don't understand what happened this year.

We actually do already read together, chat about books, and she often asks me about new words and I explain what they mean. She loves reading chapter books, but also reads the occasional picture book, nonfiction, and goes back to easier chapter books, too. So she is reading a good variety too. I have purchased a reading comp workbook that also has some fun vocab crosswords and other activities that I hope she will like.

[Anonymous]

Honestly, I’d switch schools. This is a teaching/curriculum problem. If she scored 85th percentile in the fall it is unlikely she has a disability or doesn’t know how to test- she has proved fully capable of learning and testing. She is now in the 45th percentile with steady decrease- she is not learning in school and is actively losing knowledge.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:If you ask the teacher, they can share a detailed breakdown that shows what areas she's struggling in and what areas she's getting right.

What does this mean, what kind of specifics are given? The score sheet I was given does great down the lexile range and gives individual scores for categories like “informational text.”

The school year is over so I hesitate to contact the teacher if the info won’t be useful.

This is a stupid response. If you want to know why she's doing poorly on the test, ask for the score breakdown. Don't just ask random strangers on the Internet to guess.

The score breakdown will go through each subject area and flag her weakest skills as needing further development.

[Anonymous]

Could she need glasses? Has she had her eyes checked?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:So it seems like people are generally in agreement here that 42 percentile is concerning?

Yes.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Bookworm DD8 started the year scoring 85 percentile on Fall MAP and over the year (3 more MAP tests) dropped steadily down until scoring 42 percentile on the last Spring MAP. Is this concerning or normal? She reports nothing unusual about the testing days, sleeps well, no other changes.

School uses a reading curriculum I despise, but I taught phonics at home and she reads chapter books that are above grade level. She reads a lot! They don’t teach spelling at school, but I assume this has nothing to do with the test score, right?

Sounds like she needs extra reading help/intervention.

We had her do an informal screening last year with a reading specialist. I did this because I learned in kindergarten about the three cueing taught at school and wanted to know if she needed professional help. The reading specialist (not affiliated with school) said there’s no reason to tutor at all and she is above grade level. There doesn’t seem to be an issue with actual reading. That was last year.

[Anonymous]

The teacher and curriculum sound terrible, OP. What sort of standardized testing score does this school have? What's their reputation like?

You might have to switch schools, and in the meantime, get your kid some reading comprehension workbooks over the summer.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I am going to make a suggestion since your child is 8. My oldest kid was an early reader who tore through books! He still loves to read (he is now 18). In 1st grade, his lovely teacher mentioned that although he had a great vocabulary and was a greater reader, she thought that he was memorizing the words and not really taking the time to understand the context of the books he was reading. In order to combat this, we checked out a bunch of chapter books that our public library identified as being perfect for this grade level (he was reading books that were just too advanced for him too truly understand) and we started a book club. He would read a chapter or two (or three) on his own and then I would read the same chapters and we would discuss them. This really slowed him down and he started to pay a lot more attention to figuring out what was happening in the story. If, when we discussed the book, he did not connect to a point that I made, we would go back and reread that section together. We also spent some time reading the books aloud to each other. Honestly, it was a lovely time to spend together. It took some time (all summer), but his reading comprehension greatly improved and he was able to move forward reading more difficult books and understanding them. We also got him a dictionary (an actual book one...not access to an online one) and I told him to keep it next to him when he was reading. If he was unsure of a word, to look it up! He didn't really need to do this with the easier books, but for years later, I would catch him doing this with more complicated books. Also, I brought this up directly with him and got him onboard with the process. If you can spend the time this summer to work with your child (it can be in the evening), it can pay dividends in the long run! Also, we continued to do this off and on for years, even when he no longer needed my help. I think that he enjoyed the one on one time. Best wishes!

That’s such a lovely thing you did for your son. I bet the book club is a cherished memory for both of you

[Anonymous]

tbh map scores are horrendously designed. kids with college reading levels or lexile level 1600 are getting scores below the target becaus it gives you a mysterious final score that is spposedly applicable to all 3 categories which all have different targets. dcps ela curriculum is atrocious, just keep your kid reading and dont worry about mathematically flawed tests that target bland, niche skills and require students to be taught about "specifically how to do this question" as opposed to using nuance and inferences, something bookworms are better at. you do good on map if you follow instructions and think like a machine. you do bad if either: you have poor reading skills or grew up reading actual books rather than pathetic passeseges designed for a soceity full of developed adhd and low standards.
at least, as a 7th grader who has 1600 lexile but does poorly on map, thats my opinion.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:If you ask the teacher, they can share a detailed breakdown that shows what areas she's struggling in and what areas she's getting right.

What does this mean, what kind of specifics are given? The score sheet I was given does great down the lexile range and gives individual scores for categories like “informational text.”

The school year is over so I hesitate to contact the teacher if the info won’t be useful.

This is a stupid response. If you want to know why she's doing poorly on the test, ask for the score breakdown. Don't just ask random strangers on the Internet to guess.

The score breakdown will go through each subject area and flag her weakest skills as needing further development.

there is no score breakdown. its a mathematically flawed system idesigned by a team of idiots. you get one mysterious numeric score, and different target numbers for different categories. for instance if i get a 242, then i am above grade level for category a, which has a target score of 235, but below grade level for b and c, which have goals of,say, 243 and 247. the problem is the averages. lets say i got 235, 243, and 247 respectlvely, putting me right on grade level for every category. however, when averaged out_ i get a 242, putting me way above grade level for cat a, but below for b and c. this is a deeply flawed system that attempts to measure the performance of students using niche questions and seemingly arbitrary scores and score goals. i say this as a 7th grade kid who takes geometry and has a college level reading level or a lexile of 1650.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:What do students do after the test is over? My kid's scores were always highest in the fall. Once he saw that his teacher allowed students to play games on the computer when they finished the test, he flew through it to get to the games. Computer based testing on little kids is BS IMO.

teachers do this so kids get lower scores in the fall, so it seems like they improved more. its not immoral, just part of the job. encourage them to rush and say they can play games upon completion in fall. tell them to take their time and that they can sit ghere quietly while the rest of the class finished in spring.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:What do students do after the test is over? My kid's scores were always highest in the fall. Once he saw that his teacher allowed students to play games on the computer when they finished the test, he flew through it to get to the games. Computer based testing on little kids is BS IMO.

teachers do this so kids get lower scores in the fall, so it seems like they improved more. its not immoral, just part of the job. encourage them to rush and say they can play games upon completion in fall. tell them to take their time and that they can sit ghere quietly while the rest of the class finished in spring.

So a low spring score is even worse then… and drop from fall to spring is worse than just a flat low score all year.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Honestly, I’d switch schools. This is a teaching/curriculum problem. If she scored 85th percentile in the fall it is unlikely she has a disability or doesn’t know how to test- she has proved fully capable of learning and testing. She is now in the 45th percentile with steady decrease- she is not learning in school and is actively losing knowledge.

You don’t know stop projecting

[Anonymous]

Until 3rd grade the MAP is administered by some of the questions being read out loud to kids on the computer. That could be an issue as well. I found my bookworm kid was breezing through the tests in 2nd and 3rd and not actually paying attention to what was asked. I'd work on that as well.