Which high schools have the worst grade deflation?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:There is no such thing as grade deflation. That is how grades are supposed to be in reality.

Well, when you admit a class of kids who all had straight As and high standardized scores, and you know you cannot give them all straight As like they all used to have, you need to do gymnastics to make sure the distribution of grades looks reasonable to colleges. For one teacher that may mean a painful curve where 2 wrong is a C; for another it may be giving harder and harder questions so no one can get them all correct; for another it may be a hard pop quiz on the Monday after Prom to catch a few kids out; etc. I've heard teachers say at our school that if more than certain number of students are getting perfects scores on quizzes and tests, they aren't making it hard enough. That's how you get a class average over 1400 on the SAT and yet 25% of the class with multiple C grades.

Sorry, what you stated is not the reality.
SATs have nothing to do with course grades.
The "gymnastics" teachers do is not about not giving students Cs, but to not mark students down for anything. Teachers do this because of parents' and administration's pressures to keep the kids' grades up.
FWIW if the stdents at are all getting perfect scores, then you have to wonder 1) if the class has the right level of rigor 2) is there too much teaching to the test and handholding.

How do you explain how many kids get all 5s on APs with now studying and yet Bs in the classes?
This happens frequently.

A student's grade is based on many factors, not just the ability to answer standardized test questions (participation, ability to submit work on time, daily homework completion, projects, etc.). Also, most students learn by making mistakes on quizzes and unit assessments, only to them go on and earn 4s or 5s later in the spring.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Yep. This is why people send their unhooked kids to public schools. Grade deflation hurts college admissions.

This article says otherwise: https://bethesdamagazine.com/2024/09/17/where-do-moco-students-attend-college/

Grade inflation in public schools actually hurts the strongest students by making it harder to distinguish themselves academically. It’s much harder to differentiate yourself when you’re 1 of 15 valedictorians. It’s easier when you attend a school like Sidwell or NCS and you’re the only student who graduated with a 4.0 (or even >3.98 GPA).

That story doesn’t say anything at all about grade inflation?

It speaks to the PP’s erroneous hot take:

“Yep. This is why people send their unhooked kids to public schools. Grade deflation hurts college admissions.”

You’ll find no competitive advantage in moving your children to public school. They’ll have to work harder to differentiate themselves from the competition.

+1. College admissions officers have context for grades. Schools and districts have to provide that. If they were taking all grades at face value, there would be no reason to require the SAT.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:There is no such thing as grade deflation. That is how grades are supposed to be in reality.

Well, when you admit a class of kids who all had straight As and high standardized scores, and you know you cannot give them all straight As like they all used to have, you need to do gymnastics to make sure the distribution of grades looks reasonable to colleges. For one teacher that may mean a painful curve where 2 wrong is a C; for another it may be giving harder and harder questions so no one can get them all correct; for another it may be a hard pop quiz on the Monday after Prom to catch a few kids out; etc. I've heard teachers say at our school that if more than certain number of students are getting perfects scores on quizzes and tests, they aren't making it hard enough. That's how you get a class average over 1400 on the SAT and yet 25% of the class with multiple C grades.

Sorry, what you stated is not the reality.
SATs have nothing to do with course grades.
The "gymnastics" teachers do is not about not giving students Cs, but to not mark students down for anything. Teachers do this because of parents' and administration's pressures to keep the kids' grades up.
FWIW if the stdents at are all getting perfect scores, then you have to wonder 1) if the class has the right level of rigor 2) is there too much teaching to the test and handholding.

How do you explain how many kids get all 5s on APs with now studying and yet Bs in the classes?
This happens frequently.

AP exams are curved. A raw score that would give you a 70% translates to a 5 on some AP exams.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Exorciststeps wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Exorciststeps wrote:

Anonymous wrote:There absolutely a way to do grade deflation in STEM. In many STEM subjects, but especially math, all that is needed is to add 2, 5, 10 or more problems/questions that deal with material not yet covered in class but that can be said “logically flow” from that things that were. My kids get that on every STEM class that take. The classes are hard enough but when you throw PhD level questions on top, 96s become 82s very quickly.

PhD level questions? Pull the other one...

Am sorry your kids are underserved.

My kid is at TJ, but they have yet to report any "PhD level questions" on their tests...

That’s because public school teachers have some degree of accountability which does not exist at private schools.

At STA we have teachers who give 1/2 the class C’s by testing on material they haven’t taught. There’s no accountability for bad teaching or bad testing.

What PP is referring to as PhD level problems are stupid questions that go way beyond what was covered in class that the boys are supposed to solve under timed test conditions.

Students compensate for bad teaching by getting outside help. If you’re on FA and can’t afford it, you’re SOL.

This is not accurate about STA. The work is manageable for the student willing to put in the effort.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Exorciststeps wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Exorciststeps wrote:

Anonymous wrote:There absolutely a way to do grade deflation in STEM. In many STEM subjects, but especially math, all that is needed is to add 2, 5, 10 or more problems/questions that deal with material not yet covered in class but that can be said “logically flow” from that things that were. My kids get that on every STEM class that take. The classes are hard enough but when you throw PhD level questions on top, 96s become 82s very quickly.

PhD level questions? Pull the other one...

Am sorry your kids are underserved.

My kid is at TJ, but they have yet to report any "PhD level questions" on their tests...

That’s because public school teachers have some degree of accountability which does not exist at private schools.

At STA we have teachers who give 1/2 the class C’s by testing on material they haven’t taught. There’s no accountability for bad teaching or bad testing.

What PP is referring to as PhD level problems are stupid questions that go way beyond what was covered in class that the boys are supposed to solve under timed test conditions.

Students compensate for bad teaching by getting outside help. If you’re on FA and can’t afford it, you’re SOL.

This is not accurate about STA. The work is manageable for the student willing to put in the effort.

Agree that STA is very manageable. My son took rigorous classes, had many of the teachers known to be difficult and did really well. The boys who struggle often don't do the work or try and cut corners.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Exorciststeps wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Exorciststeps wrote:

Anonymous wrote:There absolutely a way to do grade deflation in STEM. In many STEM subjects, but especially math, all that is needed is to add 2, 5, 10 or more problems/questions that deal with material not yet covered in class but that can be said “logically flow” from that things that were. My kids get that on every STEM class that take. The classes are hard enough but when you throw PhD level questions on top, 96s become 82s very quickly.

PhD level questions? Pull the other one...

Am sorry your kids are underserved.

My kid is at TJ, but they have yet to report any "PhD level questions" on their tests...

That’s because public school teachers have some degree of accountability which does not exist at private schools.

At STA we have teachers who give 1/2 the class C’s by testing on material they haven’t taught. There’s no accountability for bad teaching or bad testing.

What PP is referring to as PhD level problems are stupid questions that go way beyond what was covered in class that the boys are supposed to solve under timed test conditions.

Students compensate for bad teaching by getting outside help. If you’re on FA and can’t afford it, you’re SOL.

This is not accurate about STA. The work is manageable for the student willing to put in the effort.

Agree that STA is very manageable. My son took rigorous classes, had many of the teachers known to be difficult and did really well. The boys who struggle often don't do the work or try and cut corners.

To get the best grades requires working above and beyond. Also, very few kids don’t do the work or try to cut the corners.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Exorciststeps wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Exorciststeps wrote:

Anonymous wrote:There absolutely a way to do grade deflation in STEM. In many STEM subjects, but especially math, all that is needed is to add 2, 5, 10 or more problems/questions that deal with material not yet covered in class but that can be said “logically flow” from that things that were. My kids get that on every STEM class that take. The classes are hard enough but when you throw PhD level questions on top, 96s become 82s very quickly.

PhD level questions? Pull the other one...

Am sorry your kids are underserved.

My kid is at TJ, but they have yet to report any "PhD level questions" on their tests...

That’s because public school teachers have some degree of accountability which does not exist at private schools.

At STA we have teachers who give 1/2 the class C’s by testing on material they haven’t taught. There’s no accountability for bad teaching or bad testing.

What PP is referring to as PhD level problems are stupid questions that go way beyond what was covered in class that the boys are supposed to solve under timed test conditions.

Students compensate for bad teaching by getting outside help. If you’re on FA and can’t afford it, you’re SOL.

This is not accurate about STA. The work is manageable for the student willing to put in the effort.

Agree that STA is very manageable. My son took rigorous classes, had many of the teachers known to be difficult and did really well. The boys who struggle often don't do the work or try and cut corners.

To get the best grades requires working above and beyond. Also, very few kids don’t do the work or try to cut the corners.

I really beg to differ--that was not our experience.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:There is no such thing as grade deflation. That is how grades are supposed to be in reality.

Well, when you admit a class of kids who all had straight As and high standardized scores, and you know you cannot give them all straight As like they all used to have, you need to do gymnastics to make sure the distribution of grades looks reasonable to colleges. For one teacher that may mean a painful curve where 2 wrong is a C; for another it may be giving harder and harder questions so no one can get them all correct; for another it may be a hard pop quiz on the Monday after Prom to catch a few kids out; etc. I've heard teachers say at our school that if more than certain number of students are getting perfects scores on quizzes and tests, they aren't making it hard enough. That's how you get a class average over 1400 on the SAT and yet 25% of the class with multiple C grades.

Sorry, what you stated is not the reality. I can only speak to what teachers tell me at the schools I am associated with, and this is true there.
SATs have nothing to do with course grades. Obviously, never said otherwise.
The "gymnastics" teachers do is not about not giving students Cs, but to not mark students down for anything. Teachers do this because of parents' and administration's pressures to keep the kids' grades up. Again, not true of the schools I work with.
FWIW if the stdents at are all getting perfect scores, then you have to wonder 1) if the class has the right level of rigor 2) is there too much teaching to the test and handholding. [b]Repeating:" I've heard teachers say at our school that if more than certain number of students are getting perfects scores on quizzes and tests, they aren't making it hard enough." That's literally why they don't allow it to happen; hence, really smart kids get Bs and Cs - -challenging them at their already high level.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Exorciststeps wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Exorciststeps wrote:

Anonymous wrote:There absolutely a way to do grade deflation in STEM. In many STEM subjects, but especially math, all that is needed is to add 2, 5, 10 or more problems/questions that deal with material not yet covered in class but that can be said “logically flow” from that things that were. My kids get that on every STEM class that take. The classes are hard enough but when you throw PhD level questions on top, 96s become 82s very quickly.

PhD level questions? Pull the other one...

Am sorry your kids are underserved.

My kid is at TJ, but they have yet to report any "PhD level questions" on their tests...

That’s because public school teachers have some degree of accountability which does not exist at private schools.

At STA we have teachers who give 1/2 the class C’s by testing on material they haven’t taught. There’s no accountability for bad teaching or bad testing.

What PP is referring to as PhD level problems are stupid questions that go way beyond what was covered in class that the boys are supposed to solve under timed test conditions.

Students compensate for bad teaching by getting outside help. If you’re on FA and can’t afford it, you’re SOL.

This is not accurate about STA. The work is manageable for the student willing to put in the effort.

Agree that STA is very manageable. My son took rigorous classes, had many of the teachers known to be difficult and did really well. The boys who struggle often don't do the work or try and cut corners.

To get the best grades requires working above and beyond. Also, very few kids don’t do the work or try to cut the corners.

I really beg to differ--that was not our experience.

Some teachers grade much harsher than others. But in the end, it mostly evens out.

[Anonymous]

I don't know if I'd call it grade deflation, but NCS English teachers can be very tough graders.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Yep. This is why people send their unhooked kids to public schools. Grade deflation hurts college admissions.

This article says otherwise: https://bethesdamagazine.com/2024/09/17/where-do-moco-students-attend-college/

Grade inflation in public schools actually hurts the strongest students by making it harder to distinguish themselves academically. It’s much harder to differentiate yourself when you’re 1 of 15 valedictorians. It’s easier when you attend a school like Sidwell or NCS and you’re the only student who graduated with a 4.0 (or even >3.98 GPA).

That story doesn’t say anything at all about grade inflation?

It speaks to the PP’s erroneous hot take:

“Yep. This is why people send their unhooked kids to public schools. Grade deflation hurts college admissions.”

You’ll find no competitive advantage in moving your children to public school. They’ll have to work harder to differentiate themselves from the competition.

+1. College admissions officers have context for grades. Schools and districts have to provide that. If they were taking all grades at face value, there would be no reason to require the SAT.

If you can retake tests and assignments then everyone gets an A.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Sidwell.

The English and History Departments’ grading is especially ridiculous! Math 1 to 4 (particularly 3 & 4) is equally ridiculous, and Chem 1A is pure, unadulterated nonsense.

Sidwell parent from 3 years ago. This PP nailed it. Obv I can’t compare to other schools my kids didn’t attend but very tough, honest grading is very real at Sidwell.

My kid and all of their close friends at Sidwell are finding grading curves much kinder at their current colleges, which include Brown, Yale, Vandy, Cornell, Swarthmore. The possible exception is Chicago. Not that these ^^ schools don’t ask a lot of questions- they do - but if you put in the extensive work then college grades seem higher. My kids friend group is balanced between STEM and humanities majors now fwiw

PP. edit to say these current colleges ask a lot of their students, not questions. My kid is assigned 1000 pages of reading per WEEK some semesters. Which he can do, because Sidwell 🤣

But when he does it and does it really well and better than his current classmates, he doesn’t always get a B because the DSA female must always be given the lone A in that class

Explain?

There are at least two humanities teachers at Sidwell (or were, i think one mat have retired) who bestow a single /A/ grade per class. That /A/ grade coincidentally is received by a female who tracks with the national DSA platform.

The kids all talk among themselves so they figure out who got the straight A vs. an A- or B etc.

[Anonymous]

Gonzaga - not grade deflation, but no wiggle room for missing assignments or late work. Not a bad thing, but again little ability to recover from a zero on an assignment.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Exorciststeps wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Exorciststeps wrote:

Anonymous wrote:There absolutely a way to do grade deflation in STEM. In many STEM subjects, but especially math, all that is needed is to add 2, 5, 10 or more problems/questions that deal with material not yet covered in class but that can be said “logically flow” from that things that were. My kids get that on every STEM class that take. The classes are hard enough but when you throw PhD level questions on top, 96s become 82s very quickly.

PhD level questions? Pull the other one...

Am sorry your kids are underserved.

My kid is at TJ, but they have yet to report any "PhD level questions" on their tests...

That’s because public school teachers have some degree of accountability which does not exist at private schools.

At STA we have teachers who give 1/2 the class C’s by testing on material they haven’t taught. There’s no accountability for bad teaching or bad testing.

What PP is referring to as PhD level problems are stupid questions that go way beyond what was covered in class that the boys are supposed to solve under timed test conditions.

Students compensate for bad teaching by getting outside help. If you’re on FA and can’t afford it, you’re SOL.

This is not accurate about STA. The work is manageable for the student willing to put in the effort.

Agree that STA is very manageable. My son took rigorous classes, had many of the teachers known to be difficult and did really well. The boys who struggle often don't do the work or try and cut corners.

To get the best grades requires working above and beyond. Also, very few kids don’t do the work or try to cut the corners.

I really beg to differ--that was not our experience.

Your kids didn’t work hard? Otherwise, you really have no clue.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Sidwell.

The English and History Departments’ grading is especially ridiculous! Math 1 to 4 (particularly 3 & 4) is equally ridiculous, and Chem 1A is pure, unadulterated nonsense.

Sidwell parent from 3 years ago. This PP nailed it. Obv I can’t compare to other schools my kids didn’t attend but very tough, honest grading is very real at Sidwell.

My kid and all of their close friends at Sidwell are finding grading curves much kinder at their current colleges, which include Brown, Yale, Vandy, Cornell, Swarthmore. The possible exception is Chicago. Not that these ^^ schools don’t ask a lot of questions- they do - but if you put in the extensive work then college grades seem higher. My kids friend group is balanced between STEM and humanities majors now fwiw

PP. edit to say these current colleges ask a lot of their students, not questions. My kid is assigned 1000 pages of reading per WEEK some semesters. Which he can do, because Sidwell 🤣

But when he does it and does it really well and better than his current classmates, he doesn’t always get a B because the DSA female must always be given the lone A in that class

Explain?

There are at least two humanities teachers at Sidwell (or were, i think one mat have retired) who bestow a single /A/ grade per class. That /A/ grade coincidentally is received by a female who tracks with the national DSA platform.

The kids all talk among themselves so they figure out who got the straight A vs. an A- or B etc.

I have a DC who graduated from Sidwell last year. Never heard of this.