Why apply to an Oberlin/Kenyon/Grinnell

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Grinnell is frickin loaded. They support kids with a lot of opportunities during their 4 years.

Sure, but all that money can’t change the location. Our DC visited and concluded, despite our efforts, it would be depressing to go there based on the tiny town, isolated location, difficulty with flights (so fewer friends would visit and easier to get stuck in a random connecting airport during a storm, which almost happened during visit), Trump signs on the drive in, multiple gun shops in town (stands out more when there’s so little else), and small/boring (in their view) campus. The academics are, however, first rate, and they are known for their merit aid. Facilities are very good. An alum we know was very positive on their experience from decades ago. Would recommend visiting if possible cause not everyone will react the same way. Some athletes might prefer schools with shorter commutes for league games, as only one other school is in the same state. Did not visit Oberlin or Kenyon.

Dartmouth is surrounded by trump signs and gun shops.

True, but at least they have quadruple the students and a lot of natural beauty nearby to explore.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Grinnell is frickin loaded. They support kids with a lot of opportunities during their 4 years.

Sure, but all that money can’t change the location. Our DC visited and concluded, despite our efforts, it would be depressing to go there based on the tiny town, isolated location, difficulty with flights (so fewer friends would visit and easier to get stuck in a random connecting airport during a storm, which almost happened during visit), Trump signs on the drive in, multiple gun shops in town (stands out more when there’s so little else), and small/boring (in their view) campus. The academics are, however, first rate, and they are known for their merit aid. Facilities are very good. An alum we know was very positive on their experience from decades ago. Would recommend visiting if possible cause not everyone will react the same way. Some athletes might prefer schools with shorter commutes for league games, as only one other school is in the same state. Did not visit Oberlin or Kenyon.

Yea, well, with a 9 percent acceptance rate and one of the most geographically diverse student bodies of any college in the country, it attracts plenty of applicants who aren’t discouraged by such trivial stuff. Grinnell is doing just fine without your kid.

Wow, a personal dig. Well, my kid is doing fine without Grinnell too, but neither is the point. The point I thought was to help people who haven’t visited understand both the pros and cons so they can decide whether applying or visiting is worth their time. If you re-read my post, I listed both the pros and cons we saw. Your purpose seems different. But I find your immediate reference to admit rate very telling. It’s as if you think legitimate concerns regarding mental health can be overlooked if admit rate is something parents can brag about on anonymous forums.

Since you brought up admit rates, tell me, what do you think Grinnell’s admit rate would be if they required a supplemental essay like most schools? LACs are supposed to be about fit, and this ultra endowed LAC dropped the one part of the application that asks students to explain why they see the college as a fit. Between no supplement and no application fee, I’m honestly surprised they don’t have a much lower acceptance rate than their class of 2027 rate of 13% (not 9% as you say). It costs nothing, time or money, to apply. When they had a supplement their admit rate was in the mid 30s. They dropped it in 2014 and, big surprise, as word got around it costs no money or work to apply to Grinnell, applications went up. Admit rate going down doesn’t fundamentally change the experience. It still has the lowest retention rate of any of the top 15 LACs; in fact students are *twice* as likely not to return after their first year as at the others averaged. If the aforementioned concerns were “trivial” as you dismissively claim, first year transfers out wouldn’t be double its peers.

Grinnell will absolutely be a good fit for some and, as already mentioned in the post you replied to, has a lot of positives. But I think honesty will help not hurt those matches occur. Grinnell’s retention and grad rates have actually dropped as their admit rates have gone down, because no supplemental essay means weaker fits. There’s a reason why USNWR counts retention and graduation rates and not admit rates; practices that drive low admit rates are at best irrelevant to the experience but at worst negatively impacting it. If families want to be spared the difficulty of a transfer or a health crisis, they should learn what they can about both the pros and cons early in the process. Personal attacks because someone shares both positive and negatives doesn’t signal institutional (or for that matter personal) strength.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Grinnell is frickin loaded. They support kids with a lot of opportunities during their 4 years.

Sure, but all that money can’t change the location. Our DC visited and concluded, despite our efforts, it would be depressing to go there based on the tiny town, isolated location, difficulty with flights (so fewer friends would visit and easier to get stuck in a random connecting airport during a storm, which almost happened during visit), Trump signs on the drive in, multiple gun shops in town (stands out more when there’s so little else), and small/boring (in their view) campus. The academics are, however, first rate, and they are known for their merit aid. Facilities are very good. An alum we know was very positive on their experience from decades ago. Would recommend visiting if possible cause not everyone will react the same way. Some athletes might prefer schools with shorter commutes for league games, as only one other school is in the same state. Did not visit Oberlin or Kenyon.

Dartmouth is surrounded by trump signs and gun shops.

I love Grinnell but will note there are no gun shops in Hanover. Hanover won’t even allow McDonalds. It’s more of a Simon Pearce town.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Grinnell is frickin loaded. They support kids with a lot of opportunities during their 4 years.

Sure, but all that money can’t change the location. Our DC visited and concluded, despite our efforts, it would be depressing to go there based on the tiny town, isolated location, difficulty with flights (so fewer friends would visit and easier to get stuck in a random connecting airport during a storm, which almost happened during visit), Trump signs on the drive in, multiple gun shops in town (stands out more when there’s so little else), and small/boring (in their view) campus. The academics are, however, first rate, and they are known for their merit aid. Facilities are very good. An alum we know was very positive on their experience from decades ago. Would recommend visiting if possible cause not everyone will react the same way. Some athletes might prefer schools with shorter commutes for league games, as only one other school is in the same state. Did not visit Oberlin or Kenyon.

Yea, well, with a 9 percent acceptance rate and one of the most geographically diverse student bodies of any college in the country, it attracts plenty of applicants who aren’t discouraged by such trivial stuff. Grinnell is doing just fine without your kid.

Wow, a personal dig. Well, my kid is doing fine without Grinnell too, but neither is the point. The point I thought was to help people who haven’t visited understand both the pros and cons so they can decide whether applying or visiting is worth their time. If you re-read my post, I listed both the pros and cons we saw. Your purpose seems different. But I find your immediate reference to admit rate very telling. It’s as if you think legitimate concerns regarding mental health can be overlooked if admit rate is something parents can brag about on anonymous forums.

Since you brought up admit rates, tell me, what do you think Grinnell’s admit rate would be if they required a supplemental essay like most schools? LACs are supposed to be about fit, and this ultra endowed LAC dropped the one part of the application that asks students to explain why they see the college as a fit. Between no supplement and no application fee, I’m honestly surprised they don’t have a much lower acceptance rate than their class of 2027 rate of 13% (not 9% as you say). It costs nothing, time or money, to apply. When they had a supplement their admit rate was in the mid 30s. They dropped it in 2014 and, big surprise, as word got around it costs no money or work to apply to Grinnell, applications went up. Admit rate going down doesn’t fundamentally change the experience. It still has the lowest retention rate of any of the top 15 LACs; in fact students are *twice* as likely not to return after their first year as at the others averaged. If the aforementioned concerns were “trivial” as you dismissively claim, first year transfers out wouldn’t be double its peers.

Grinnell will absolutely be a good fit for some and, as already mentioned in the post you replied to, has a lot of positives. But I think honesty will help not hurt those matches occur. Grinnell’s retention and grad rates have actually dropped as their admit rates have gone down, because no supplemental essay means weaker fits. There’s a reason why USNWR counts retention and graduation rates and not admit rates; practices that drive low admit rates are at best irrelevant to the experience but at worst negatively impacting it. If families want to be spared the difficulty of a transfer or a health crisis, they should learn what they can about both the pros and cons early in the process. Personal attacks because someone shares both positive and negatives doesn’t signal institutional (or for that matter personal) strength.

NP. if I ever reach a point in my life where I can rattle off these sorts of details and opinions about a random college in Iowa that my child does not attend...please just make the call

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Grinnell is frickin loaded. They support kids with a lot of opportunities during their 4 years.

Sure, but all that money can’t change the location. Our DC visited and concluded, despite our efforts, it would be depressing to go there based on the tiny town, isolated location, difficulty with flights (so fewer friends would visit and easier to get stuck in a random connecting airport during a storm, which almost happened during visit), Trump signs on the drive in, multiple gun shops in town (stands out more when there’s so little else), and small/boring (in their view) campus. The academics are, however, first rate, and they are known for their merit aid. Facilities are very good. An alum we know was very positive on their experience from decades ago. Would recommend visiting if possible cause not everyone will react the same way. Some athletes might prefer schools with shorter commutes for league games, as only one other school is in the same state. Did not visit Oberlin or Kenyon.

Yea, well, with a 9 percent acceptance rate and one of the most geographically diverse student bodies of any college in the country, it attracts plenty of applicants who aren’t discouraged by such trivial stuff. Grinnell is doing just fine without your kid.

Wow, a personal dig. Well, my kid is doing fine without Grinnell too, but neither is the point. The point I thought was to help people who haven’t visited understand both the pros and cons so they can decide whether applying or visiting is worth their time. If you re-read my post, I listed both the pros and cons we saw. Your purpose seems different. But I find your immediate reference to admit rate very telling. It’s as if you think legitimate concerns regarding mental health can be overlooked if admit rate is something parents can brag about on anonymous forums.

Since you brought up admit rates, tell me, what do you think Grinnell’s admit rate would be if they required a supplemental essay like most schools? LACs are supposed to be about fit, and this ultra endowed LAC dropped the one part of the application that asks students to explain why they see the college as a fit. Between no supplement and no application fee, I’m honestly surprised they don’t have a much lower acceptance rate than their class of 2027 rate of 13% (not 9% as you say). It costs nothing, time or money, to apply. When they had a supplement their admit rate was in the mid 30s. They dropped it in 2014 and, big surprise, as word got around it costs no money or work to apply to Grinnell, applications went up. Admit rate going down doesn’t fundamentally change the experience. It still has the lowest retention rate of any of the top 15 LACs; in fact students are *twice* as likely not to return after their first year as at the others averaged. If the aforementioned concerns were “trivial” as you dismissively claim, first year transfers out wouldn’t be double its peers.

Grinnell will absolutely be a good fit for some and, as already mentioned in the post you replied to, has a lot of positives. But I think honesty will help not hurt those matches occur. Grinnell’s retention and grad rates have actually dropped as their admit rates have gone down, because no supplemental essay means weaker fits. There’s a reason why USNWR counts retention and graduation rates and not admit rates; practices that drive low admit rates are at best irrelevant to the experience but at worst negatively impacting it. If families want to be spared the difficulty of a transfer or a health crisis, they should learn what they can about both the pros and cons early in the process. Personal attacks because someone shares both positive and negatives doesn’t signal institutional (or for that matter personal) strength.

Part of Grinnell’s lower retention rate apparently has to do with the high percentage of international students who are, I’ve heard second hand, more likely to transfer or not return. There is a supplemental essay - I think it’s optional but it comes out in January. So they get their extra applications for sure by being free and doing a surprise supplemental (like Hamilton). But it shouldn’t impact fit negatively. They also are using ED heavily now, which I’d imagine will increase retention rates.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Grinnell is frickin loaded. They support kids with a lot of opportunities during their 4 years.

Sure, but all that money can’t change the location. Our DC visited and concluded, despite our efforts, it would be depressing to go there based on the tiny town, isolated location, difficulty with flights (so fewer friends would visit and easier to get stuck in a random connecting airport during a storm, which almost happened during visit), Trump signs on the drive in, multiple gun shops in town (stands out more when there’s so little else), and small/boring (in their view) campus. The academics are, however, first rate, and they are known for their merit aid. Facilities are very good. An alum we know was very positive on their experience from decades ago. Would recommend visiting if possible cause not everyone will react the same way. Some athletes might prefer schools with shorter commutes for league games, as only one other school is in the same state. Did not visit Oberlin or Kenyon.

Yea, well, with a 9 percent acceptance rate and one of the most geographically diverse student bodies of any college in the country, it attracts plenty of applicants who aren’t discouraged by such trivial stuff. Grinnell is doing just fine without your kid.

Wow, a personal dig. Well, my kid is doing fine without Grinnell too, but neither is the point. The point I thought was to help people who haven’t visited understand both the pros and cons so they can decide whether applying or visiting is worth their time. If you re-read my post, I listed both the pros and cons we saw. Your purpose seems different. But I find your immediate reference to admit rate very telling. It’s as if you think legitimate concerns regarding mental health can be overlooked if admit rate is something parents can brag about on anonymous forums.

Since you brought up admit rates, tell me, what do you think Grinnell’s admit rate would be if they required a supplemental essay like most schools? LACs are supposed to be about fit, and this ultra endowed LAC dropped the one part of the application that asks students to explain why they see the college as a fit. Between no supplement and no application fee, I’m honestly surprised they don’t have a much lower acceptance rate than their class of 2027 rate of 13% (not 9% as you say). It costs nothing, time or money, to apply. When they had a supplement their admit rate was in the mid 30s. They dropped it in 2014 and, big surprise, as word got around it costs no money or work to apply to Grinnell, applications went up. Admit rate going down doesn’t fundamentally change the experience. It still has the lowest retention rate of any of the top 15 LACs; in fact students are *twice* as likely not to return after their first year as at the others averaged. If the aforementioned concerns were “trivial” as you dismissively claim, first year transfers out wouldn’t be double its peers.

Grinnell will absolutely be a good fit for some and, as already mentioned in the post you replied to, has a lot of positives. But I think honesty will help not hurt those matches occur. Grinnell’s retention and grad rates have actually dropped as their admit rates have gone down, because no supplemental essay means weaker fits. There’s a reason why USNWR counts retention and graduation rates and not admit rates; practices that drive low admit rates are at best irrelevant to the experience but at worst negatively impacting it. If families want to be spared the difficulty of a transfer or a health crisis, they should learn what they can about both the pros and cons early in the process. Personal attacks because someone shares both positive and negatives doesn’t signal institutional (or for that matter personal) strength.

NP. if I ever reach a point in my life where I can rattle off these sorts of details and opinions about a random college in Iowa that my child does not attend...please just make the call

If a family visited a rural Iowa town it means the interest in the college was more than passing, right? If you are on this site but don't want to know about things like retention rates, or admit rates, or supplements, or campus visits, well, I guess there's some other motivation for you.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Grinnell is frickin loaded. They support kids with a lot of opportunities during their 4 years.

Sure, but all that money can’t change the location. Our DC visited and concluded, despite our efforts, it would be depressing to go there based on the tiny town, isolated location, difficulty with flights (so fewer friends would visit and easier to get stuck in a random connecting airport during a storm, which almost happened during visit), Trump signs on the drive in, multiple gun shops in town (stands out more when there’s so little else), and small/boring (in their view) campus. The academics are, however, first rate, and they are known for their merit aid. Facilities are very good. An alum we know was very positive on their experience from decades ago. Would recommend visiting if possible cause not everyone will react the same way. Some athletes might prefer schools with shorter commutes for league games, as only one other school is in the same state. Did not visit Oberlin or Kenyon.

Umm, I visit there every few months and there are no more Trump signs than what I see driving out to the DMV shore. Heck, there are Trumpers living in DC, MoCo, NoVA, so whatever.

I grew up in a rural part of a blue county (also blue) and there are more gun shops there than Grinnell, which is the county seat.

Yes, the location factors make it a challenge, but neither DC picked a college based on ability of HS friends to visit - that's what school breaks are for.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Grinnell is as good as any liberal arts college in the country and has a much more quirky and less preppy and rich kid vibe than any of the top northeast schools. And yes, there’s the merit aid.

My kid loved Grinnell.

Do you have kids there? Because I do, and this isn't the case any more. Colby has very actively been recruiting minorites and first gen students, they have committed that no kid that goes there will graduate with student loans. Our kid sort of fits the preppy rich kid mold in that he's from here and we're full pay, but we're an AA family so not exactly.

ditto for Grinnell - no student loans, meets need

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Grinnell is frickin loaded. They support kids with a lot of opportunities during their 4 years.

Sure, but all that money can’t change the location. Our DC visited and concluded, despite our efforts, it would be depressing to go there based on the tiny town, isolated location, difficulty with flights (so fewer friends would visit and easier to get stuck in a random connecting airport during a storm, which almost happened during visit), Trump signs on the drive in, multiple gun shops in town (stands out more when there’s so little else), and small/boring (in their view) campus. The academics are, however, first rate, and they are known for their merit aid. Facilities are very good. An alum we know was very positive on their experience from decades ago. Would recommend visiting if possible cause not everyone will react the same way. Some athletes might prefer schools with shorter commutes for league games, as only one other school is in the same state. Did not visit Oberlin or Kenyon.

Yea, well, with a 9 percent acceptance rate and one of the most geographically diverse student bodies of any college in the country, it attracts plenty of applicants who aren’t discouraged by such trivial stuff. Grinnell is doing just fine without your kid.

Wow, a personal dig. Well, my kid is doing fine without Grinnell too, but neither is the point. The point I thought was to help people who haven’t visited understand both the pros and cons so they can decide whether applying or visiting is worth their time. If you re-read my post, I listed both the pros and cons we saw. Your purpose seems different. But I find your immediate reference to admit rate very telling. It’s as if you think legitimate concerns regarding mental health can be overlooked if admit rate is something parents can brag about on anonymous forums.

Since you brought up admit rates, tell me, what do you think Grinnell’s admit rate would be if they required a supplemental essay like most schools? LACs are supposed to be about fit, and this ultra endowed LAC dropped the one part of the application that asks students to explain why they see the college as a fit. Between no supplement and no application fee, I’m honestly surprised they don’t have a much lower acceptance rate than their class of 2027 rate of 13% (not 9% as you say). It costs nothing, time or money, to apply. When they had a supplement their admit rate was in the mid 30s. They dropped it in 2014 and, big surprise, as word got around it costs no money or work to apply to Grinnell, applications went up. Admit rate going down doesn’t fundamentally change the experience. It still has the lowest retention rate of any of the top 15 LACs; in fact students are *twice* as likely not to return after their first year as at the others averaged. If the aforementioned concerns were “trivial” as you dismissively claim, first year transfers out wouldn’t be double its peers.

Grinnell will absolutely be a good fit for some and, as already mentioned in the post you replied to, has a lot of positives. But I think honesty will help not hurt those matches occur. Grinnell’s retention and grad rates have actually dropped as their admit rates have gone down, because no supplemental essay means weaker fits. There’s a reason why USNWR counts retention and graduation rates and not admit rates; practices that drive low admit rates are at best irrelevant to the experience but at worst negatively impacting it. If families want to be spared the difficulty of a transfer or a health crisis, they should learn what they can about both the pros and cons early in the process. Personal attacks because someone shares both positive and negatives doesn’t signal institutional (or for that matter personal) strength.

Part of Grinnell’s lower retention rate apparently has to do with the high percentage of international students who are, I’ve heard second hand, more likely to transfer or not return. There is a supplemental essay - I think it’s optional but it comes out in January. So they get their extra applications for sure by being free and doing a surprise supplemental (like Hamilton). But it shouldn’t impact fit negatively. They also are using ED heavily now, which I’d imagine will increase retention rates.

Per their website, there isn't a supplement, optional or otherwise. There is a mechanism to submit an optional arts porfolio. In the optional art portfolio section they mention it is possible to submit writing samples. I don't think this is what people mean by supplements, even optional ones, in that it doesn't sound like they are asking the student to optionally write about why they want to go to the college, but they are allowing students to optionally submit more work they have already done for high school or on their own.

https://www.grinnell.edu/admission/apply/first-year/requirements

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Grinnell is frickin loaded. They support kids with a lot of opportunities during their 4 years.

Sure, but all that money can’t change the location. Our DC visited and concluded, despite our efforts, it would be depressing to go there based on the tiny town, isolated location, difficulty with flights (so fewer friends would visit and easier to get stuck in a random connecting airport during a storm, which almost happened during visit), Trump signs on the drive in, multiple gun shops in town (stands out more when there’s so little else), and small/boring (in their view) campus. The academics are, however, first rate, and they are known for their merit aid. Facilities are very good. An alum we know was very positive on their experience from decades ago. Would recommend visiting if possible cause not everyone will react the same way. Some athletes might prefer schools with shorter commutes for league games, as only one other school is in the same state. Did not visit Oberlin or Kenyon.

Yea, well, with a 9 percent acceptance rate and one of the most geographically diverse student bodies of any college in the country, it attracts plenty of applicants who aren’t discouraged by such trivial stuff. Grinnell is doing just fine without your kid.

Wow, a personal dig. Well, my kid is doing fine without Grinnell too, but neither is the point. The point I thought was to help people who haven’t visited understand both the pros and cons so they can decide whether applying or visiting is worth their time. If you re-read my post, I listed both the pros and cons we saw. Your purpose seems different. But I find your immediate reference to admit rate very telling. It’s as if you think legitimate concerns regarding mental health can be overlooked if admit rate is something parents can brag about on anonymous forums.

Since you brought up admit rates, tell me, what do you think Grinnell’s admit rate would be if they required a supplemental essay like most schools? LACs are supposed to be about fit, and this ultra endowed LAC dropped the one part of the application that asks students to explain why they see the college as a fit. Between no supplement and no application fee, I’m honestly surprised they don’t have a much lower acceptance rate than their class of 2027 rate of 13% (not 9% as you say). It costs nothing, time or money, to apply. When they had a supplement their admit rate was in the mid 30s. They dropped it in 2014 and, big surprise, as word got around it costs no money or work to apply to Grinnell, applications went up. Admit rate going down doesn’t fundamentally change the experience. It still has the lowest retention rate of any of the top 15 LACs; in fact students are *twice* as likely not to return after their first year as at the others averaged. If the aforementioned concerns were “trivial” as you dismissively claim, first year transfers out wouldn’t be double its peers.

Grinnell will absolutely be a good fit for some and, as already mentioned in the post you replied to, has a lot of positives. But I think honesty will help not hurt those matches occur. Grinnell’s retention and grad rates have actually dropped as their admit rates have gone down, because no supplemental essay means weaker fits. There’s a reason why USNWR counts retention and graduation rates and not admit rates; practices that drive low admit rates are at best irrelevant to the experience but at worst negatively impacting it. If families want to be spared the difficulty of a transfer or a health crisis, they should learn what they can about both the pros and cons early in the process. Personal attacks because someone shares both positive and negatives doesn’t signal institutional (or for that matter personal) strength.

NP. if I ever reach a point in my life where I can rattle off these sorts of details and opinions about a random college in Iowa that my child does not attend...please just make the call

If a family visited a rural Iowa town it means the interest in the college was more than passing, right? If you are on this site but don't want to know about things like retention rates, or admit rates, or supplements, or campus visits, well, I guess there's some other motivation for you.

it's the level of detail here that is of note (and hence the suggestion by the other PP to "make the call"). yeah, my DC may have written this about Colby, a school about which they had a lot of opinions, many negative, but I wouldn't and I visited the school with them and had some similar observations.

also, how is it any easier to get to Amherst or Williams than it is to Grinnell?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Grinnell is frickin loaded. They support kids with a lot of opportunities during their 4 years.

Sure, but all that money can’t change the location. Our DC visited and concluded, despite our efforts, it would be depressing to go there based on the tiny town, isolated location, difficulty with flights (so fewer friends would visit and easier to get stuck in a random connecting airport during a storm, which almost happened during visit), Trump signs on the drive in, multiple gun shops in town (stands out more when there’s so little else), and small/boring (in their view) campus. The academics are, however, first rate, and they are known for their merit aid. Facilities are very good. An alum we know was very positive on their experience from decades ago. Would recommend visiting if possible cause not everyone will react the same way. Some athletes might prefer schools with shorter commutes for league games, as only one other school is in the same state. Did not visit Oberlin or Kenyon.

Yea, well, with a 9 percent acceptance rate and one of the most geographically diverse student bodies of any college in the country, it attracts plenty of applicants who aren’t discouraged by such trivial stuff. Grinnell is doing just fine without your kid.

Wow, a personal dig. Well, my kid is doing fine without Grinnell too, but neither is the point. The point I thought was to help people who haven’t visited understand both the pros and cons so they can decide whether applying or visiting is worth their time. If you re-read my post, I listed both the pros and cons we saw. Your purpose seems different. But I find your immediate reference to admit rate very telling. It’s as if you think legitimate concerns regarding mental health can be overlooked if admit rate is something parents can brag about on anonymous forums.

Since you brought up admit rates, tell me, what do you think Grinnell’s admit rate would be if they required a supplemental essay like most schools? LACs are supposed to be about fit, and this ultra endowed LAC dropped the one part of the application that asks students to explain why they see the college as a fit. Between no supplement and no application fee, I’m honestly surprised they don’t have a much lower acceptance rate than their class of 2027 rate of 13% (not 9% as you say). It costs nothing, time or money, to apply. When they had a supplement their admit rate was in the mid 30s. They dropped it in 2014 and, big surprise, as word got around it costs no money or work to apply to Grinnell, applications went up. Admit rate going down doesn’t fundamentally change the experience. It still has the lowest retention rate of any of the top 15 LACs; in fact students are *twice* as likely not to return after their first year as at the others averaged. If the aforementioned concerns were “trivial” as you dismissively claim, first year transfers out wouldn’t be double its peers.

Grinnell will absolutely be a good fit for some and, as already mentioned in the post you replied to, has a lot of positives. But I think honesty will help not hurt those matches occur. Grinnell’s retention and grad rates have actually dropped as their admit rates have gone down, because no supplemental essay means weaker fits. There’s a reason why USNWR counts retention and graduation rates and not admit rates; practices that drive low admit rates are at best irrelevant to the experience but at worst negatively impacting it. If families want to be spared the difficulty of a transfer or a health crisis, they should learn what they can about both the pros and cons early in the process. Personal attacks because someone shares both positive and negatives doesn’t signal institutional (or for that matter personal) strength.

Part of Grinnell’s lower retention rate apparently has to do with the high percentage of international students who are, I’ve heard second hand, more likely to transfer or not return. There is a supplemental essay - I think it’s optional but it comes out in January. So they get their extra applications for sure by being free and doing a surprise supplemental (like Hamilton). But it shouldn’t impact fit negatively. They also are using ED heavily now, which I’d imagine will increase retention rates.

Per their website, there isn't a supplement, optional or otherwise. There is a mechanism to submit an optional arts porfolio. In the optional art portfolio section they mention it is possible to submit writing samples. I don't think this is what people mean by supplements, even optional ones, in that it doesn't sound like they are asking the student to optionally write about why they want to go to the college, but they are allowing students to optionally submit more work they have already done for high school or on their own.

https://www.grinnell.edu/admission/apply/first-year/requirements

From what I understand, there are certain colleges out there that don't necessarily advertise a supplemental essay that should be submitted along with the application. It seems like after one has submitted the application, the applicant will get an email asking them to submit a supplemental essay. I heard of this (on this site) regarding another college and assume that is what the poster meant by the supplemental essay coming out in January.

[Anonymous]

Everyone clutching their pearls about gun shops in Iowa should check yelp for gun shops near their kids school. There are at least a dozen gun shops in Boston, oh no better take Harvard MIT BU and Tufts off the list, right?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Grinnell is frickin loaded. They support kids with a lot of opportunities during their 4 years.

Sure, but all that money can’t change the location. Our DC visited and concluded, despite our efforts, it would be depressing to go there based on the tiny town, isolated location, difficulty with flights (so fewer friends would visit and easier to get stuck in a random connecting airport during a storm, which almost happened during visit), Trump signs on the drive in, multiple gun shops in town (stands out more when there’s so little else), and small/boring (in their view) campus. The academics are, however, first rate, and they are known for their merit aid. Facilities are very good. An alum we know was very positive on their experience from decades ago. Would recommend visiting if possible cause not everyone will react the same way. Some athletes might prefer schools with shorter commutes for league games, as only one other school is in the same state. Did not visit Oberlin or Kenyon.

Yea, well, with a 9 percent acceptance rate and one of the most geographically diverse student bodies of any college in the country, it attracts plenty of applicants who aren’t discouraged by such trivial stuff. Grinnell is doing just fine without your kid.

Wow, a personal dig. Well, my kid is doing fine without Grinnell too, but neither is the point. The point I thought was to help people who haven’t visited understand both the pros and cons so they can decide whether applying or visiting is worth their time. If you re-read my post, I listed both the pros and cons we saw. Your purpose seems different. But I find your immediate reference to admit rate very telling. It’s as if you think legitimate concerns regarding mental health can be overlooked if admit rate is something parents can brag about on anonymous forums.

Since you brought up admit rates, tell me, what do you think Grinnell’s admit rate would be if they required a supplemental essay like most schools? LACs are supposed to be about fit, and this ultra endowed LAC dropped the one part of the application that asks students to explain why they see the college as a fit. Between no supplement and no application fee, I’m honestly surprised they don’t have a much lower acceptance rate than their class of 2027 rate of 13% (not 9% as you say). It costs nothing, time or money, to apply. When they had a supplement their admit rate was in the mid 30s. They dropped it in 2014 and, big surprise, as word got around it costs no money or work to apply to Grinnell, applications went up. Admit rate going down doesn’t fundamentally change the experience. It still has the lowest retention rate of any of the top 15 LACs; in fact students are *twice* as likely not to return after their first year as at the others averaged. If the aforementioned concerns were “trivial” as you dismissively claim, first year transfers out wouldn’t be double its peers.

Grinnell will absolutely be a good fit for some and, as already mentioned in the post you replied to, has a lot of positives. But I think honesty will help not hurt those matches occur. Grinnell’s retention and grad rates have actually dropped as their admit rates have gone down, because no supplemental essay means weaker fits. There’s a reason why USNWR counts retention and graduation rates and not admit rates; practices that drive low admit rates are at best irrelevant to the experience but at worst negatively impacting it. If families want to be spared the difficulty of a transfer or a health crisis, they should learn what they can about both the pros and cons early in the process. Personal attacks because someone shares both positive and negatives doesn’t signal institutional (or for that matter personal) strength.

Part of Grinnell’s lower retention rate apparently has to do with the high percentage of international students who are, I’ve heard second hand, more likely to transfer or not return. There is a supplemental essay - I think it’s optional but it comes out in January. So they get their extra applications for sure by being free and doing a surprise supplemental (like Hamilton). But it shouldn’t impact fit negatively. They also are using ED heavily now, which I’d imagine will increase retention rates.

Per their website, there isn't a supplement, optional or otherwise. There is a mechanism to submit an optional arts porfolio. In the optional art portfolio section they mention it is possible to submit writing samples. I don't think this is what people mean by supplements, even optional ones, in that it doesn't sound like they are asking the student to optionally write about why they want to go to the college, but they are allowing students to optionally submit more work they have already done for high school or on their own.

https://www.grinnell.edu/admission/apply/first-year/requirements

From what I understand, there are certain colleges out there that don't necessarily advertise a supplemental essay that should be submitted along with the application. It seems like after one has submitted the application, the applicant will get an email asking them to submit a supplemental essay. I heard of this (on this site) regarding another college and assume that is what the poster meant by the supplemental essay coming out in January.

Denison did that last year. I heard Case does it too. It’s an obvious way for schools to artificially lower acceptance rate because they attract more apps with no essay up front, but then have a better sense of who is truly interested and should be admitted based on who does the supplemental essay.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Grinnell is frickin loaded. They support kids with a lot of opportunities during their 4 years.

Sure, but all that money can’t change the location. Our DC visited and concluded, despite our efforts, it would be depressing to go there based on the tiny town, isolated location, difficulty with flights (so fewer friends would visit and easier to get stuck in a random connecting airport during a storm, which almost happened during visit), Trump signs on the drive in, multiple gun shops in town (stands out more when there’s so little else), and small/boring (in their view) campus. The academics are, however, first rate, and they are known for their merit aid. Facilities are very good. An alum we know was very positive on their experience from decades ago. Would recommend visiting if possible cause not everyone will react the same way. Some athletes might prefer schools with shorter commutes for league games, as only one other school is in the same state. Did not visit Oberlin or Kenyon.

Umm, I visit there every few months and there are no more Trump signs than what I see driving out to the DMV shore. Heck, there are Trumpers living in DC, MoCo, NoVA, so whatever.

I grew up in a rural part of a blue county (also blue) and there are more gun shops there than Grinnell, which is the county seat.

Yes, the location factors make it a challenge, but neither DC picked a college based on ability of HS friends to visit - that's what school breaks are for.

Breaks at schools don't necessarily coincide. Which is how one student on break can travel to another; both of our kids have done so, and both of them have been visited multiple times. Families and grandparents also visit and want easy access. Students, friends, or families can get stuck in airports, more often if using connecting regional flights on small planes during winter. We have heard from more than a few Grinnell families about travel issues and I think they were more upset than my words of caution would suggest. I am truly happy if your experience has been different.

Incidentally, the airport issue wasn't a dealbreaker for us. There was a combination of things. The endless flat cornfields came off as less interesting for our kid than areas one can hike or ski or swim or boat in. And the town was the smallest and had the least to do of any college town we saw. That could be more easily offset if the student body (1750) or campus (120 acres) were larger. And if you are an athlete who prefers studying at an actual desk, then having only one other in-state league school can be a nontrivial challenge. There was some hesitation about the academics as well. The department our child was most interested was smaller than at other schools. I'm sure it was good but there's a critical mass of profs for certain subjects and we felt Grinnell was a little thin in terms of headcount.

All that said, there are students that will love the campus and town, it has a great reputation, great facilities, and great aid. It's also great there are so many internationals, imo. I think it's a fantastic option for some. For prospective families, just do your research, even if the occasional poster on here tells you its overkill to think about what makes up fit for you.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Grinnell is frickin loaded. They support kids with a lot of opportunities during their 4 years.

Sure, but all that money can’t change the location. Our DC visited and concluded, despite our efforts, it would be depressing to go there based on the tiny town, isolated location, difficulty with flights (so fewer friends would visit and easier to get stuck in a random connecting airport during a storm, which almost happened during visit), Trump signs on the drive in, multiple gun shops in town (stands out more when there’s so little else), and small/boring (in their view) campus. The academics are, however, first rate, and they are known for their merit aid. Facilities are very good. An alum we know was very positive on their experience from decades ago. Would recommend visiting if possible cause not everyone will react the same way. Some athletes might prefer schools with shorter commutes for league games, as only one other school is in the same state. Did not visit Oberlin or Kenyon.

Yea, well, with a 9 percent acceptance rate and one of the most geographically diverse student bodies of any college in the country, it attracts plenty of applicants who aren’t discouraged by such trivial stuff. Grinnell is doing just fine without your kid.

Wow, a personal dig. Well, my kid is doing fine without Grinnell too, but neither is the point. The point I thought was to help people who haven’t visited understand both the pros and cons so they can decide whether applying or visiting is worth their time. If you re-read my post, I listed both the pros and cons we saw. Your purpose seems different. But I find your immediate reference to admit rate very telling. It’s as if you think legitimate concerns regarding mental health can be overlooked if admit rate is something parents can brag about on anonymous forums.

Since you brought up admit rates, tell me, what do you think Grinnell’s admit rate would be if they required a supplemental essay like most schools? LACs are supposed to be about fit, and this ultra endowed LAC dropped the one part of the application that asks students to explain why they see the college as a fit. Between no supplement and no application fee, I’m honestly surprised they don’t have a much lower acceptance rate than their class of 2027 rate of 13% (not 9% as you say). It costs nothing, time or money, to apply. When they had a supplement their admit rate was in the mid 30s. They dropped it in 2014 and, big surprise, as word got around it costs no money or work to apply to Grinnell, applications went up. Admit rate going down doesn’t fundamentally change the experience. It still has the lowest retention rate of any of the top 15 LACs; in fact students are *twice* as likely not to return after their first year as at the others averaged. If the aforementioned concerns were “trivial” as you dismissively claim, first year transfers out wouldn’t be double its peers.

Grinnell will absolutely be a good fit for some and, as already mentioned in the post you replied to, has a lot of positives. But I think honesty will help not hurt those matches occur. Grinnell’s retention and grad rates have actually dropped as their admit rates have gone down, because no supplemental essay means weaker fits. There’s a reason why USNWR counts retention and graduation rates and not admit rates; practices that drive low admit rates are at best irrelevant to the experience but at worst negatively impacting it. If families want to be spared the difficulty of a transfer or a health crisis, they should learn what they can about both the pros and cons early in the process. Personal attacks because someone shares both positive and negatives doesn’t signal institutional (or for that matter personal) strength.

Part of Grinnell’s lower retention rate apparently has to do with the high percentage of international students who are, I’ve heard second hand, more likely to transfer or not return. There is a supplemental essay - I think it’s optional but it comes out in January. So they get their extra applications for sure by being free and doing a surprise supplemental (like Hamilton). But it shouldn’t impact fit negatively. They also are using ED heavily now, which I’d imagine will increase retention rates.

Per their website, there isn't a supplement, optional or otherwise. There is a mechanism to submit an optional arts porfolio. In the optional art portfolio section they mention it is possible to submit writing samples. I don't think this is what people mean by supplements, even optional ones, in that it doesn't sound like they are asking the student to optionally write about why they want to go to the college, but they are allowing students to optionally submit more work they have already done for high school or on their own.

https://www.grinnell.edu/admission/apply/first-year/requirements

From what I understand, there are certain colleges out there that don't necessarily advertise a supplemental essay that should be submitted along with the application. It seems like after one has submitted the application, the applicant will get an email asking them to submit a supplemental essay. I heard of this (on this site) regarding another college and assume that is what the poster meant by the supplemental essay coming out in January.

That's true at some places, but Grinnell actually says "no required supplement" on their requirements and deadlines page. There's no mention of an optional supplement, just the optional arts portfolio.