MCYO audtions

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:MCYO is a very cutthroat and toxic environment, my daughter is in young Artist, she has been there for the past three years. The auditions seems inclusive and make it look like they accept people of all races, but they only pick Asians (really Chinese) to play for their orchestra. It’s terribly one sided, quite obvious, initially jarring and totally unfair in my opinion and I AM Chinese. The student violinist are very competitive and clique and don’t like new people joining. The clique groups are made up of kids who have been in mcyo for the past five years. I don’t want to discourage you from auditioning…but just wanted you to be aware of the MCYO culture.

My daughter is one of the concertmasters of YA this year and she has made friends with all her seatmates. In fact, my daughter, who is NOT Chinese, has been part of three orchestras in MCYO - Prep Strings, Chamber Strings and YA - and has consistently loved the experience. The two conductors Mr. Orozco and Mrs. Poling are amusing and engaging and are excellent at their job.

In all the years we've been part of this organization, I can guarantee that there has been no toxicity and nothing has been cutthroat. The conductors go to great lengths to share the top seats, every year. They do not offer solos, or very short ones, because again, their goal is to have students play together, instead of giving more limelight to the more talented students.

People have the wrong idea about MCYO because they are racist - they see it has a majority of Asian students; and because parents don't understand how something that is audition-based and high level could not be cut-throat. But it's not. Once you're in, there is no cutthroat. And if don't get in, you can always audition the following year. During the audition, it's the best players who get in, regardless of ethnicity. Surely that's how it should be! Don't you want kids to be rewarded for their hard work? My daughter has worked VERY hard for years to play at the level she does. She and all the other students who work hard deserve to be there.

Do you know why it seems you always see the same kids every year? It's because they love it, and want to return, and have the level to be accepted back every year. There is no other orchestra they could apply to that has that level of play. They cannot go anywhere else. And yet MCYO makes them audition anyway, because they want to make sure they are being fair.

It's disheartening to see posters such as the one above dragging the good name of MCYO through the mud.

If they want to be fair…shouldn’t they do blind auditions?

I cannot imagine given the staff that they are looking at race at all. But, many of us often would never think to even apply. I looked at it for my child, ruled it out thinking no way, reached out just out of curiosity and they encouraged us to apply, talked me through it all and my child got in. All the staff we have dealt with have gone above and beyond for our family regularly and really responsive. We are not Asian.

I think the cost is a huge issue although they have financial aid between the orchestra costs and the private lesson requirements it really adds up. Plus, you have to pay extra for the concerts.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Just curious: is the experience different for string players vs. wind/brass? My kid plays a brass instrument, and over the years I’ve noticed far fewer Asian musicians in the school “band” ensembles than in the “orchestras.”

They’re now playing in a non-MCYO symphonic (combined) orchestra, and I still notice the preponderance of Asian strings players over other instruments. I wonder if that could account for the differing experiences with MCYO? The early seriousness of the Suzuki method is appealing to families who really value serious musical education, but there’s not really anything comparable for, say, aspiring 6yo French horn players.

I think you make a good point here. As for the different experiences, I think when people are quite serious about anything, be it strings, or theatre, or sports, there are going to be some people who are really jealous or competitive in a bad way. On the whole though, we have had a good experience in the strings community, and my daughter is one of these Asian kids who started young.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:MCYO is a very cutthroat and toxic environment, my daughter is in young Artist, she has been there for the past three years. The auditions seems inclusive and make it look like they accept people of all races, but they only pick Asians (really Chinese) to play for their orchestra. It’s terribly one sided, quite obvious, initially jarring and totally unfair in my opinion and I AM Chinese. The student violinist are very competitive and clique and don’t like new people joining. The clique groups are made up of kids who have been in mcyo for the past five years. I don’t want to discourage you from auditioning…but just wanted you to be aware of the MCYO culture.

My daughter is one of the concertmasters of YA this year and she has made friends with all her seatmates. In fact, my daughter, who is NOT Chinese, has been part of three orchestras in MCYO - Prep Strings, Chamber Strings and YA - and has consistently loved the experience. The two conductors Mr. Orozco and Mrs. Poling are amusing and engaging and are excellent at their job.

In all the years we've been part of this organization, I can guarantee that there has been no toxicity and nothing has been cutthroat. The conductors go to great lengths to share the top seats, every year. They do not offer solos, or very short ones, because again, their goal is to have students play together, instead of giving more limelight to the more talented students.

People have the wrong idea about MCYO because they are racist - they see it has a majority of Asian students; and because parents don't understand how something that is audition-based and high level could not be cut-throat. But it's not. Once you're in, there is no cutthroat. And if don't get in, you can always audition the following year. During the audition, it's the best players who get in, regardless of ethnicity. Surely that's how it should be! Don't you want kids to be rewarded for their hard work? My daughter has worked VERY hard for years to play at the level she does. She and all the other students who work hard deserve to be there.

Do you know why it seems you always see the same kids every year? It's because they love it, and want to return, and have the level to be accepted back every year. There is no other orchestra they could apply to that has that level of play. They cannot go anywhere else. And yet MCYO makes them audition anyway, because they want to make sure they are being fair.

It's disheartening to see posters such as the one above dragging the good name of MCYO through the mud.

I'm not the one that posted about MCYO being toxic, but that's what I've heard from 3 separate kids in DD's studio, all of whom do well for themselves. Two are older, and have said that they no longer encounter it, at the upper levels. I have NOT heard that there is discrimination; pretty much all YO have a higher number of East Asians than anyone else, and that's a priorities thing, and not anything else, IMO (we're not East Asian). What I have heard of is kids speaking along the lines of "they're ONLY a second violin", like that's some sort of character flaw. Or 'You only practice two hours a day? I practice 4-6 hours. You can't be good if you don't practice that much', that sort of talk.

What I have heard of AY is along similar lines. Snootiness.

[Anonymous]

It is interesting that there seems to be such a focus on violin over other instruments. I am not a music person but as an outsider I don't understand why. My kid chose a difficult brass instrument and I think it worked out really well for him. Not a lot of kids play it so the orchestras are happy he is trying out and they are looking for a reason to take him (vs looking for a reason to reject him because they have so many kids playing his instrument).

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:It is interesting that there seems to be such a focus on violin over other instruments. I am not a music person but as an outsider I don't understand why. My kid chose a difficult brass instrument and I think it worked out really well for him. Not a lot of kids play it so the orchestras are happy he is trying out and they are looking for a reason to take him (vs looking for a reason to reject him because they have so many kids playing his instrument).

All the lower level orchestras are strings only, of which, violin is the dominant instrument (in sheer numbers). Usually, by the time kids are old/skilled enough to be playing in full orchestras, all the petty nonsense is behind them.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:MCYO is a very cutthroat and toxic environment, my daughter is in young Artist, she has been there for the past three years. The auditions seems inclusive and make it look like they accept people of all races, but they only pick Asians (really Chinese) to play for their orchestra. It’s terribly one sided, quite obvious, initially jarring and totally unfair in my opinion and I AM Chinese. The student violinist are very competitive and clique and don’t like new people joining. The clique groups are made up of kids who have been in mcyo for the past five years. I don’t want to discourage you from auditioning…but just wanted you to be aware of the MCYO culture.

My daughter is one of the concertmasters of YA this year and she has made friends with all her seatmates. In fact, my daughter, who is NOT Chinese, has been part of three orchestras in MCYO - Prep Strings, Chamber Strings and YA - and has consistently loved the experience. The two conductors Mr. Orozco and Mrs. Poling are amusing and engaging and are excellent at their job.

In all the years we've been part of this organization, I can guarantee that there has been no toxicity and nothing has been cutthroat. The conductors go to great lengths to share the top seats, every year. They do not offer solos, or very short ones, because again, their goal is to have students play together, instead of giving more limelight to the more talented students.

People have the wrong idea about MCYO because they are racist - they see it has a majority of Asian students; and because parents don't understand how something that is audition-based and high level could not be cut-throat. But it's not. Once you're in, there is no cutthroat. And if don't get in, you can always audition the following year. During the audition, it's the best players who get in, regardless of ethnicity. Surely that's how it should be! Don't you want kids to be rewarded for their hard work? My daughter has worked VERY hard for years to play at the level she does. She and all the other students who work hard deserve to be there.

Do you know why it seems you always see the same kids every year? It's because they love it, and want to return, and have the level to be accepted back every year. There is no other orchestra they could apply to that has that level of play. They cannot go anywhere else. And yet MCYO makes them audition anyway, because they want to make sure they are being fair.

It's disheartening to see posters such as the one above dragging the good name of MCYO through the mud.

I'm not the one that posted about MCYO being toxic, but that's what I've heard from 3 separate kids in DD's studio, all of whom do well for themselves. Two are older, and have said that they no longer encounter it, at the upper levels. I have NOT heard that there is discrimination; pretty much all YO have a higher number of East Asians than anyone else, and that's a priorities thing, and not anything else, IMO (we're not East Asian). What I have heard of is kids speaking along the lines of "they're ONLY a second violin", like that's some sort of character flaw. Or 'You only practice two hours a day? I practice 4-6 hours. You can't be good if you don't practice that much', that sort of talk.

What I have heard of AY is along similar lines. Snootiness.

That’s in any sport or music. It’s kids being kids. Mine never experienced that. All the kids in the instrument support and help each other.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:MCYO is a very cutthroat and toxic environment, my daughter is in young Artist, she has been there for the past three years. The auditions seems inclusive and make it look like they accept people of all races, but they only pick Asians (really Chinese) to play for their orchestra. It’s terribly one sided, quite obvious, initially jarring and totally unfair in my opinion and I AM Chinese. The student violinist are very competitive and clique and don’t like new people joining. The clique groups are made up of kids who have been in mcyo for the past five years. I don’t want to discourage you from auditioning…but just wanted you to be aware of the MCYO culture.

My daughter is one of the concertmasters of YA this year and she has made friends with all her seatmates. In fact, my daughter, who is NOT Chinese, has been part of three orchestras in MCYO - Prep Strings, Chamber Strings and YA - and has consistently loved the experience. The two conductors Mr. Orozco and Mrs. Poling are amusing and engaging and are excellent at their job.

In all the years we've been part of this organization, I can guarantee that there has been no toxicity and nothing has been cutthroat. The conductors go to great lengths to share the top seats, every year. They do not offer solos, or very short ones, because again, their goal is to have students play together, instead of giving more limelight to the more talented students.

People have the wrong idea about MCYO because they are racist - they see it has a majority of Asian students; and because parents don't understand how something that is audition-based and high level could not be cut-throat. But it's not. Once you're in, there is no cutthroat. And if don't get in, you can always audition the following year. During the audition, it's the best players who get in, regardless of ethnicity. Surely that's how it should be! Don't you want kids to be rewarded for their hard work? My daughter has worked VERY hard for years to play at the level she does. She and all the other students who work hard deserve to be there.

Do you know why it seems you always see the same kids every year? It's because they love it, and want to return, and have the level to be accepted back every year. There is no other orchestra they could apply to that has that level of play. They cannot go anywhere else. And yet MCYO makes them audition anyway, because they want to make sure they are being fair.

It's disheartening to see posters such as the one above dragging the good name of MCYO through the mud.

I'm not the one that posted about MCYO being toxic, but that's what I've heard from 3 separate kids in DD's studio, all of whom do well for themselves. Two are older, and have said that they no longer encounter it, at the upper levels. I have NOT heard that there is discrimination; pretty much all YO have a higher number of East Asians than anyone else, and that's a priorities thing, and not anything else, IMO (we're not East Asian). What I have heard of is kids speaking along the lines of "they're ONLY a second violin", like that's some sort of character flaw. Or 'You only practice two hours a day? I practice 4-6 hours. You can't be good if you don't practice that much', that sort of talk.

What I have heard of AY is along similar lines. Snootiness.

Kids are annoying and they are act this way whether they are in sports or music. It is our jobs as parents to tell them to cut it out.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:MCYO is a very cutthroat and toxic environment, my daughter is in young Artist, she has been there for the past three years. The auditions seems inclusive and make it look like they accept people of all races, but they only pick Asians (really Chinese) to play for their orchestra. It’s terribly one sided, quite obvious, initially jarring and totally unfair in my opinion and I AM Chinese. The student violinist are very competitive and clique and don’t like new people joining. The clique groups are made up of kids who have been in mcyo for the past five years. I don’t want to discourage you from auditioning…but just wanted you to be aware of the MCYO culture.

My daughter is one of the concertmasters of YA this year and she has made friends with all her seatmates. In fact, my daughter, who is NOT Chinese, has been part of three orchestras in MCYO - Prep Strings, Chamber Strings and YA - and has consistently loved the experience. The two conductors Mr. Orozco and Mrs. Poling are amusing and engaging and are excellent at their job.

In all the years we've been part of this organization, I can guarantee that there has been no toxicity and nothing has been cutthroat. The conductors go to great lengths to share the top seats, every year. They do not offer solos, or very short ones, because again, their goal is to have students play together, instead of giving more limelight to the more talented students.

People have the wrong idea about MCYO because they are racist - they see it has a majority of Asian students; and because parents don't understand how something that is audition-based and high level could not be cut-throat. But it's not. Once you're in, there is no cutthroat. And if don't get in, you can always audition the following year. During the audition, it's the best players who get in, regardless of ethnicity. Surely that's how it should be! Don't you want kids to be rewarded for their hard work? My daughter has worked VERY hard for years to play at the level she does. She and all the other students who work hard deserve to be there.

Do you know why it seems you always see the same kids every year? It's because they love it, and want to return, and have the level to be accepted back every year. There is no other orchestra they could apply to that has that level of play. They cannot go anywhere else. And yet MCYO makes them audition anyway, because they want to make sure they are being fair.

It's disheartening to see posters such as the one above dragging the good name of MCYO through the mud.

I'm not the one that posted about MCYO being toxic, but that's what I've heard from 3 separate kids in DD's studio, all of whom do well for themselves. Two are older, and have said that they no longer encounter it, at the upper levels. I have NOT heard that there is discrimination; pretty much all YO have a higher number of East Asians than anyone else, and that's a priorities thing, and not anything else, IMO (we're not East Asian). What I have heard of is kids speaking along the lines of "they're ONLY a second violin", like that's some sort of character flaw. Or 'You only practice two hours a day? I practice 4-6 hours. You can't be good if you don't practice that much', that sort of talk.

What I have heard of AY is along similar lines. Snootiness.

I’m actually curious… by around the age I think the OP described (11?) are many of the string players in MCYO practicing 2 or more hrs per day? That is a lot for an upper elementary-aged child!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:It is interesting that there seems to be such a focus on violin over other instruments. I am not a music person but as an outsider I don't understand why. My kid chose a difficult brass instrument and I think it worked out really well for him. Not a lot of kids play it so the orchestras are happy he is trying out and they are looking for a reason to take him (vs looking for a reason to reject him because they have so many kids playing his instrument).

All the lower level orchestras are strings only, of which, violin is the dominant instrument (in sheer numbers). Usually, by the time kids are old/skilled enough to be playing in full orchestras, all the petty nonsense is behind them.

if you pick a less common instrument you can avoid a lot of it altogether.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:MCYO is a very cutthroat and toxic environment, my daughter is in young Artist, she has been there for the past three years. The auditions seems inclusive and make it look like they accept people of all races, but they only pick Asians (really Chinese) to play for their orchestra. It’s terribly one sided, quite obvious, initially jarring and totally unfair in my opinion and I AM Chinese. The student violinist are very competitive and clique and don’t like new people joining. The clique groups are made up of kids who have been in mcyo for the past five years. I don’t want to discourage you from auditioning…but just wanted you to be aware of the MCYO culture.

My daughter is one of the concertmasters of YA this year and she has made friends with all her seatmates. In fact, my daughter, who is NOT Chinese, has been part of three orchestras in MCYO - Prep Strings, Chamber Strings and YA - and has consistently loved the experience. The two conductors Mr. Orozco and Mrs. Poling are amusing and engaging and are excellent at their job.

In all the years we've been part of this organization, I can guarantee that there has been no toxicity and nothing has been cutthroat. The conductors go to great lengths to share the top seats, every year. They do not offer solos, or very short ones, because again, their goal is to have students play together, instead of giving more limelight to the more talented students.

People have the wrong idea about MCYO because they are racist - they see it has a majority of Asian students; and because parents don't understand how something that is audition-based and high level could not be cut-throat. But it's not. Once you're in, there is no cutthroat. And if don't get in, you can always audition the following year. During the audition, it's the best players who get in, regardless of ethnicity. Surely that's how it should be! Don't you want kids to be rewarded for their hard work? My daughter has worked VERY hard for years to play at the level she does. She and all the other students who work hard deserve to be there.

Do you know why it seems you always see the same kids every year? It's because they love it, and want to return, and have the level to be accepted back every year. There is no other orchestra they could apply to that has that level of play. They cannot go anywhere else. And yet MCYO makes them audition anyway, because they want to make sure they are being fair.

It's disheartening to see posters such as the one above dragging the good name of MCYO through the mud.

I'm not the one that posted about MCYO being toxic, but that's what I've heard from 3 separate kids in DD's studio, all of whom do well for themselves. Two are older, and have said that they no longer encounter it, at the upper levels. I have NOT heard that there is discrimination; pretty much all YO have a higher number of East Asians than anyone else, and that's a priorities thing, and not anything else, IMO (we're not East Asian). What I have heard of is kids speaking along the lines of "they're ONLY a second violin", like that's some sort of character flaw. Or 'You only practice two hours a day? I practice 4-6 hours. You can't be good if you don't practice that much', that sort of talk.

What I have heard of AY is along similar lines. Snootiness.

I’m actually curious… by around the age I think the OP described (11?) are many of the string players in MCYO practicing 2 or more hrs per day? That is a lot for an upper elementary-aged child!

There definitely are kids that are that committed to their instruments by that age (and younger). Don’t know how well represented they are in any YOs. Mine practices an hour daily, but between school orchestra, YO, and lessons, ends up playing a lot more. Her longest days are about 5 hours of music.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:It is interesting that there seems to be such a focus on violin over other instruments. I am not a music person but as an outsider I don't understand why. My kid chose a difficult brass instrument and I think it worked out really well for him. Not a lot of kids play it so the orchestras are happy he is trying out and they are looking for a reason to take him (vs looking for a reason to reject him because they have so many kids playing his instrument).

All the lower level orchestras are strings only, of which, violin is the dominant instrument (in sheer numbers). Usually, by the time kids are old/skilled enough to be playing in full orchestras, all the petty nonsense is behind them.

if you pick a less common instrument you can avoid a lot of it altogether.

The kid chose the instrument. We avoid it by having her play in one of the lesser orchestras. It’s been a great experience for her.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:It is interesting that there seems to be such a focus on violin over other instruments. I am not a music person but as an outsider I don't understand why. My kid chose a difficult brass instrument and I think it worked out really well for him. Not a lot of kids play it so the orchestras are happy he is trying out and they are looking for a reason to take him (vs looking for a reason to reject him because they have so many kids playing his instrument).

All the lower level orchestras are strings only, of which, violin is the dominant instrument (in sheer numbers). Usually, by the time kids are old/skilled enough to be playing in full orchestras, all the petty nonsense is behind them.

if you pick a less common instrument you can avoid a lot of it altogether.

The kid chose the instrument. We avoid it by having her play in one of the lesser orchestras. It’s been a great experience for her.

But are the kids who start violin when they super young really choosing it?

[Anonymous]

I too have wondered why Asian kids focus so heavily on piano and violin. You would think a few more would try horn or tuba or bassoon, all of which are desperate to find players. It’s a lot easier to get a bassoon spot at an Ivy League orchestra than it is a violin spot.

My kid plays the French horn and she has really benefited from the lack of competition. She has a really good ear (honed through piano lessons and choir from a young age), and loves playing, but it’s also nice that it’s easier to be a “star” in her realm. To be a star violinist takes at least 2 hrs of practice a day by middle school and then more from then on. Not so for the more obscure instruments.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I too have wondered why Asian kids focus so heavily on piano and violin. You would think a few more would try horn or tuba or bassoon, all of which are desperate to find players. It’s a lot easier to get a bassoon spot at an Ivy League orchestra than it is a violin spot.

My kid plays the French horn and she has really benefited from the lack of competition. She has a really good ear (honed through piano lessons and choir from a young age), and loves playing, but it’s also nice that it’s easier to be a “star” in her realm. To be a star violinist takes at least 2 hrs of practice a day by middle school and then more from then on. Not so for the more obscure instruments.

I think the reason is that Asian parents value what kids learn from early music training as much as or more than the music or instrument - the violin is difficult because it requires a lot of concentration and mental effort but physically is easy to play. Woodwind instruments require breath control, embouchure, etc. There are fractional violins and cellos for young children but for woodwind instruments, a child needs to be nearly full grown to be able to start playing it. Soprano recorders are the notable exception, fwiw.

So a child can start violin very young and learn discipline and also learn to play nice music with relaxation while a child must be older to start French horn or bassoon or flute. Then after years of practice, they learn to play with relaxation, but physically, it is more demanding.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:MCYO is a very cutthroat and toxic environment, my daughter is in young Artist, she has been there for the past three years. The auditions seems inclusive and make it look like they accept people of all races, but they only pick Asians (really Chinese) to play for their orchestra. It’s terribly one sided, quite obvious, initially jarring and totally unfair in my opinion and I AM Chinese. The student violinist are very competitive and clique and don’t like new people joining. The clique groups are made up of kids who have been in mcyo for the past five years. I don’t want to discourage you from auditioning…but just wanted you to be aware of the MCYO culture.

My daughter is one of the concertmasters of YA this year and she has made friends with all her seatmates. In fact, my daughter, who is NOT Chinese, has been part of three orchestras in MCYO - Prep Strings, Chamber Strings and YA - and has consistently loved the experience. The two conductors Mr. Orozco and Mrs. Poling are amusing and engaging and are excellent at their job.

In all the years we've been part of this organization, I can guarantee that there has been no toxicity and nothing has been cutthroat. The conductors go to great lengths to share the top seats, every year. They do not offer solos, or very short ones, because again, their goal is to have students play together, instead of giving more limelight to the more talented students.

People have the wrong idea about MCYO because they are racist - they see it has a majority of Asian students; and because parents don't understand how something that is audition-based and high level could not be cut-throat. But it's not. Once you're in, there is no cutthroat. And if don't get in, you can always audition the following year. During the audition, it's the best players who get in, regardless of ethnicity. Surely that's how it should be! Don't you want kids to be rewarded for their hard work? My daughter has worked VERY hard for years to play at the level she does. She and all the other students who work hard deserve to be there.

Do you know why it seems you always see the same kids every year? It's because they love it, and want to return, and have the level to be accepted back every year. There is no other orchestra they could apply to that has that level of play. They cannot go anywhere else. And yet MCYO makes them audition anyway, because they want to make sure they are being fair.

It's disheartening to see posters such as the one above dragging the good name of MCYO through the mud.

If they want to be fair…shouldn’t they do blind auditions?

I cannot imagine given the staff that they are looking at race at all. But, many of us often would never think to even apply. I looked at it for my child, ruled it out thinking no way, reached out just out of curiosity and they encouraged us to apply, talked me through it all and my child got in. All the staff we have dealt with have gone above and beyond for our family regularly and really responsive. We are not Asian.

I think the cost is a huge issue although they have financial aid between the orchestra costs and the private lesson requirements it really adds up. Plus, you have to pay extra for the concerts.

Just curious how much MCYO tuition is? I can't find anything on their website on tuition fees. Is it true the audience pays $10 a ticket for the concerts?