The students who get into top SLACs and top universities don't seem to be picking the former

[Anonymous]

OP is right. It’s a trend. Many SLACS were hurting financially before Covid, and weren’t in a good place to take the financial hit. Part of the issue is regional demographics. The college age population is not equally distributed across the US. Add an emphasis on STEM, and increasing cost-consciousness by students, and it’s a bit of a perfect storm. Even higher ranked SLACS are having a problem attracting men.

https://www.cnbc.com/2019/12/03/the-other-college-debt-crisis-schools-are-going-broke.html

https://chroniclet.com/news/203017/oberlin-college-finances-part-of-national-trend-for-liberal-arts-colleges/

Oberlin College is not the only four-year liberal arts college to take measures to improve its finances. Across the country, the number of college-age youths is shrinking as the population ages. That also means undergraduate enrollment is down, which in turn shrinks the amount colleges receive in tuition payments.

Fewer students are expected to graduate high school in the coming years, with a story at EducationNext.com from fall 2018 saying the decline already has taken place in the Midwest and Northeast, where there are more small, private colleges than in other regions of the U.S.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:OP is right. It’s a trend. Many SLACS were hurting financially before Covid, and weren’t in a good place to take the financial hit. Part of the issue is regional demographics. The college age population is not equally distributed across the US. Add an emphasis on STEM, and increasing cost-consciousness by students, and it’s a bit of a perfect storm. Even higher ranked SLACS are having a problem attracting men.

https://www.cnbc.com/2019/12/03/the-other-college-debt-crisis-schools-are-going-broke.html

https://chroniclet.com/news/203017/oberlin-college-finances-part-of-national-trend-for-liberal-arts-colleges/

Oberlin College is not the only four-year liberal arts college to take measures to improve its finances. Across the country, the number of college-age youths is shrinking as the population ages. That also means undergraduate enrollment is down, which in turn shrinks the amount colleges receive in tuition payments.

Fewer students are expected to graduate high school in the coming years, with a story at EducationNext.com from fall 2018 saying the decline already has taken place in the Midwest and Northeast, where there are more small, private colleges than in other regions of the U.S.

SLAC = selective liberal arts college. You are correct that many LACs are hurting financially.

Some SLACs and LACs have no business rejecting some of the people that they are currently rejecting if they would like to stay open.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Yes small regional private colleges, as well as community colleges, are seeing drops in enrollment. Given the expense it’s not strange that kids who might have enjoyed a private college choose a large cheaper state school.

But it’s not some simple rural vs urban thing, that’s a lazy argument. There are plenty of rural state schools that are popular - University of Illinois is pretty much surrounded by cornfields, but its enrollment and prestige are doing just fine.

I know kids who are turned off by urban campuses where you can’t really tell where campus ends and city begins.

You don’t see a difference between a state flagship with 45,000 students in a town with 220,000 people and a SLAC with 3,000 students in a town with 8,000 residents? They may both be surrounded by cornfields, but they are completely different experiences.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:OP is right. It’s a trend. Many SLACS were hurting financially before Covid, and weren’t in a good place to take the financial hit. Part of the issue is regional demographics. The college age population is not equally distributed across the US. Add an emphasis on STEM, and increasing cost-consciousness by students, and it’s a bit of a perfect storm. Even higher ranked SLACS are having a problem attracting men.

https://www.cnbc.com/2019/12/03/the-other-college-debt-crisis-schools-are-going-broke.html

https://chroniclet.com/news/203017/oberlin-college-finances-part-of-national-trend-for-liberal-arts-colleges/

Oberlin College is not the only four-year liberal arts college to take measures to improve its finances. Across the country, the number of college-age youths is shrinking as the population ages. That also means undergraduate enrollment is down, which in turn shrinks the amount colleges receive in tuition payments.

Fewer students are expected to graduate high school in the coming years, with a story at EducationNext.com from fall 2018 saying the decline already has taken place in the Midwest and Northeast, where there are more small, private colleges than in other regions of the U.S.

SLAC = selective liberal arts college. You are correct that many LACs are hurting financially.

Some SLACs and LACs have no business rejecting some of the people that they are currently rejecting if they would like to stay open.

They care too much about their “prestige.” Sure there are a handful who can keep tuition high, and have sufficient prestige to not have to offer merit aid to attract top students, but they are few. Most have gotten themselves in a nasty spiral. You need prestige to lure people into paying full tuition. So most run s deficit, raise tuition to cover costs, offer merit aid to attract top students (spending all the additional tuition $$), run a deficit,…They’ve priced themselves out of the market. The schools that have rich and generous alumni will survive, but absent that many are on borrowed time.

I’m not a SLAC hater. I steered my DC toward them for the emphasis on undergraduate teaching, among other things. However, DC wanted to be in a city, and ended up at a medium sized private university as a compromise. I think that’s why you see the increasing interest in schools like Vanderbilt and Tulane. If I was preparing to spend private school tuition on a very small LAC in a rural location I would be looking at their financials very carefully.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Yes small regional private colleges, as well as community colleges, are seeing drops in enrollment. Given the expense it’s not strange that kids who might have enjoyed a private college choose a large cheaper state school.

But it’s not some simple rural vs urban thing, that’s a lazy argument. There are plenty of rural state schools that are popular - University of Illinois is pretty much surrounded by cornfields, but its enrollment and prestige are doing just fine.

I know kids who are turned off by urban campuses where you can’t really tell where campus ends and city begins.

You don’t see a difference between a state flagship with 45,000 students in a town with 220,000 people and a SLAC with 3,000 students in a town with 8,000 residents? They may both be surrounded by cornfields, but they are completely different experiences.

Please. There are plenty of colleges in cute towns and plenty of large state schools in meh towns.

And you know there are private colleges that in the same towns as state schools, right?

[Anonymous]

I encouraged both my kids to apply to Slacs like Grinnell, Middlebury, Vassar, etc.
They both refused as they found them too remote. Even Williams was crossed off the list.
I personally find their disinterest mystifying but I guess they are city kids. We live in Washington, DC.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I encouraged both my kids to apply to Slacs like Grinnell, Middlebury, Vassar, etc.
They both refused as they found them too remote. Even Williams was crossed off the list.
I personally find their disinterest mystifying but I guess they are city kids. We live in Washington, DC.

I would agree with them.

This isn’t discussed often on here but I was incredibly bored outside of class most of the time at the rural school I attended. I would’ve gone home every often if I could have.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Sad? The truth is that SLACS, especially cold, rural ones, are out of style. They have no lay name recognition and are absurdly expensive with no opportunity to live off-campus later to save $.

This is true and perhaps not irrelevant, but such schools will indeed have name recognition with hiring managers at elite firms that hire out of undergrad. Yes, common folks have never heard of Middlebury, Grinnell, or Kenyon, but the elite-educated set will be well-acquainted with these institutions.

[Anonymous]

I hope my kid applies to and attends a SLAC, for many reasons. As a PP said, they have their whole lives to live in a city, including graduate school.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Sad? The truth is that SLACS, especially cold, rural ones, are out of style. They have no lay name recognition and are absurdly expensive with no opportunity to live off-campus later to save $.

This is true and perhaps not irrelevant, but such schools will indeed have name recognition with hiring managers at elite firms that hire out of undergrad. Yes, common folks have never heard of Middlebury, Grinnell, or Kenyon, but the elite-educated set will be well-acquainted with these institutions.

+1

I work at a prestigious organization and hire a summer intern each year, and the candidates from selective LACs definitely catch my attention.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Sad? The truth is that SLACS, especially cold, rural ones, are out of style. They have no lay name recognition and are absurdly expensive with no opportunity to live off-campus later to save $.

This is true and perhaps not irrelevant, but such schools will indeed have name recognition with hiring managers at elite firms that hire out of undergrad. Yes, common folks have never heard of Middlebury, Grinnell, or Kenyon, but the elite-educated set will be well-acquainted with these institutions.

+1

I work at a prestigious organization and hire a summer intern each year, and the candidates from selective LACs definitely catch my attention.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I encouraged both my kids to apply to Slacs like Grinnell, Middlebury, Vassar, etc.
They both refused as they found them too remote. Even Williams was crossed off the list.
I personally find their disinterest mystifying but I guess they are city kids. We live in Washington, DC.

I would agree with them.

This isn’t discussed often on here but I was incredibly bored outside of class most of the time at the rural school I attended. I would’ve gone home every often if I could have.

I was at a city school and escaped to outdoor adventures whenever I could. Too bad we didn't switch choices...we both would have been happier.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Yes small regional private colleges, as well as community colleges, are seeing drops in enrollment. Given the expense it’s not strange that kids who might have enjoyed a private college choose a large cheaper state school.

But it’s not some simple rural vs urban thing, that’s a lazy argument. There are plenty of rural state schools that are popular - University of Illinois is pretty much surrounded by cornfields, but its enrollment and prestige are doing just fine.

I know kids who are turned off by urban campuses where you can’t really tell where campus ends and city begins.

You don’t see a difference between a state flagship with 45,000 students in a town with 220,000 people and a SLAC with 3,000 students in a town with 8,000 residents? They may both be surrounded by cornfields, but they are completely different experiences.

Please. There are plenty of colleges in cute towns and plenty of large state schools in meh towns.

And you know there are private colleges that in the same towns as state schools, right?

We’ll, yes. That’s the point. What surrounds the town isn’t relevant. What matters is the town itself.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Which LACs are you talking about? LACs outside of the tippy top ARE struggling to fill their classes. Even ones I consider “good” (much better graduation rates than their public counterparts).

+1

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:This is just personal experience, but I know of at least six students this year who had an acceptance from a top 5 SLAC but are turning them down for top universities.

It seems like students these days want to be in major metropolitan areas. and they prefer the university social life. A number of the admits above raised the concern that the LAC social life would feel "dead" by comparison. It seems sad that the hallmark academic and collaborative strengths of LACs seem to be ignored these days. I'm not saying a LAC experience is good for everyone, but I feel like they're admitting students in RD who have no real interest in going to one.

Are they STEM majors?