I'm a Muslim. Ask me anything!
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Anonymous
| The whole modesty concept can be confusing because it is about modesty in public, not in private. Even Muslims who observe all the hijab, niqab thing wear whatever at home including bathing suits if they have a private pool. |
Anonymous
Why is that confusing? Do you make no distinction between what you are willing to expose to your family vs. strangers? |
Anonymous
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Actually, in terms of modesty, no--I don't make that distinction. I dress equally modestly in public as I do at home.
There is of course locale specifc dress that would be attention grabbing in other contexts. Fore example, I wear a bathing suit at the beach or pool but not otherwise. My family does get subject to my unmade face and untidy hair, however, when I am home sick--wearing a nightgown and, of course, a bathrobe if I am not in bed. |
Anonymous
Both are actually asked to lower their gaze. The requirements for modest dress differ between the sexes due to fundamental biological distinctions and causes of arousal. I would also like to clarify that women do not cover their hair for men, the ones who do cover, do it because they believe it is a command from their lord and a sign of modesty, kinda like how the catholic nuns still cover their hair to this day. The attitude that hijab and Islamic dress codes exist to protect men are an utter and total fallacy. Isn't there a verse in the Quran about how women should cover their hair and beautiful parts, or something like that? So it's not a complete fabrication by the patriarchy. But the patriarchy in some places did decide that this verse means burkas or niqabs. |
Anonymous
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Here's a Muslim source on the Quranic verse that tells women to cover their chests. A head covering seems to be already assumed in the Quran. There's lots more, but here are some excerpts.
http://www.al-islam.org/hijab-muslim-womens-dress-islamic-or-cultural-sayyid-muhammad-rizvi/quran-and-hijab ...There are two verses in the Qur’an in which Almighty Allah talks about the issue of decency and hijab as defined earlier. The First Verse In Chapter 24 known as an-Nur (the Light), in verse 30, Allah commands Prophet Muhammad as follows: ???? ???????????????? ?????????? ???? ????????????? ?? ??????????? ????????????, ?????? ??????? ??????. “Say to the believing men that: they should cast down their glances and guard their private parts (by being chaste). This is better for them.” This is a command to Muslim men that they should not lustfully look at women (other than their own wives); and in order to prevent any possibility of temptation, they are required to cast their glances downwards. This is known as “hijab of the eyes”. Then in the next verse, Allah commands the Prophet to address the women: ???? ??????????????? ?????????? ???? ?????????????? ?? ?????????? ?????????????... “Say to the believing women that: they should cast down their glances and guard their private parts (by being chaste)…” This is a similar command as given to the men in the previous verse regarding “hijab of the eyes”. This hijab of eyes is similar to the teaching of Jesus where he says, “You have heard that it was said by them of old time, you shall not commit adultery. But I say unto you, That whosoever looks on a woman to lust after her has committed adultery with her already in his heart.”1 So if you see a Muslim casting his/her eyes downwards when he/she is talking to a member of opposite sex, this should not be considered as rude or an indication of lack of confidence — he/she is just abiding by the Qur’anic as well as Biblical teaching. * * * * * After “hijab of the eyes” came the order describing the dress code for women: ?? ??? ?????????? ????????????? ?????? ??? ?????? ??????? ?? ???????????? ????????????? ????? ?????????????... “...and not display their beauty except what is apparent, and they should place their khumur over their bosoms...” There are two issues about this sentence. (1) What is the meaning of “khumur” used in this verse? Khumur ?????? is plural of khimar??????? , the veil covering the head. See any Arabic dictionary like Lisanu ’l-‘Arab, Majma‘u ’l-Bahrayn or al-Munjid. Al-Munjid, which is the most popular dictionary in the Arab world, defines al-khimar as “something with which a woman conceals her head —?? ???? ?? ?????? ????? .” Fakhru ’d-Din al-Turayhi in Majma‘u ’l-Bahrayn (which is a dictionary of Qur’anic and hadith terms) defines al-khimar as “scarf, and it is known as such because the head is covered with it.”2 So the word khimar, by definition, means a piece of cloth that covers the head. (2) Then what does the clause “placing the khumur over the bosoms” mean? According to the commentators of the Qur’an, the women of Medina in the pre-Islamic era used to put their khumur over the head with the two ends tucked behind and tied at the back of the neck, in the process exposing their ears and neck. By saying that, “place the khumur over the bosoms,” Almighty Allah ordered the women to let the two ends of their headgear extend onto their bosoms so that they conceal their ears, the neck, and the upper part of the bosom also.3 This is confirmed by the way the Muslim women of the Prophet’s era understood this commandment of Almighty Allah. The Sunni sources quote Ummu ’l-mu’minin ‘A’isha, the Prophet’s wife, as follows: “I have not seen women better than those of al-Ansar (the inhabitants of Medina): when this verse was revealed, all of them got hold of their aprons, tore them apart, and used them to cover their heads...”4 The meaning of khimar and the context in which the verse was revealed clearly talks about concealing the head and then using the loose ends of the scarf to conceal the neck and the bosom. It is absurd to believe that the Qur’an would use the word khimar (which, by definition, means a cloth that covers the head) only to conceal the bosom with the exclusion of the head! It would be like saying to put on your shirt only around the belly or the waist without covering the chest! Finally the verse goes on to give the list of the mahram – male family members in whose presence the hijab is not required, such as the husband, the father, the father-in-law, the son(s), and others. The Second Verse In Chapter 33 known as al-Ahzab, verse 59, Allah gives the following command to Prophet Muhammad: ??? ???????? ??????????, ???? ???????????? ?? ????????? ?? ?????? ???????????????: ?????????? ??????????? ???? ????????????????... “O Prophet! Say to your wives, your daughters, and the women of the believers that: they should let down upon themselves their jalabib.” What is the meaning of “jalabib”? Jalabib ??????????? is the plural of jilbab????????? , which means a loose outer garment. See any Arabic dictionary like Lisanu ’l-‘Arab, Majma‘u ’l-Bahrayn or al-Munjid. Al-Munjid, for instance, defines jilbab as “the shirt or a wide dress—?????? ?? ????? ??????.” While al-Turayhi, in Majma‘u ’l-Bahrayn, defines it as “a wide dress, wider than the scarf and shorter than a robe, that a woman puts upon her head and lets it down on her bosom...”5 This means that the Islamic dress code for women does not only consist of a scarf that covers the head, the neck and the bosom; it also includes the overall dress that should be long and loose. So, for instance, the combination of a tight, short sweater with tight-fitting jeans with a scarf over the head does not fulfill the requirements of the Islamic dress code. |
Anonymous
That's your opinion. It could have easily been a command to cover the chest only, and the head covering was an unintended consequence due to the nature of that garment. Clearly, whoever wrote the Quran cared about covering the breasts most of all, otherwise it would have clearly said, "cover your hair." Don't invent things where there are none just because a bunch of dudes did before you. |
Anonymous
Isn't there a verse in the Quran about how women should cover their hair and beautiful parts, or something like that? So it's not a complete fabrication by the patriarchy. But the patriarchy in some places did decide that this verse means burkas or niqabs. There is nothing in the Quran about covering hair. It says "your adornments." The patriarchal structure decided it means whatever they wanted it to mean. |
Anonymous
Isn't there a verse in the Quran about how women should cover their hair and beautiful parts, or something like that? So it's not a complete fabrication by the patriarchy. But the patriarchy in some places did decide that this verse means burkas or niqabs. Just that women should cover their "zeinat" or beautiful things. Nothing about hair specifically, but to some it obvious--somehow--that this verse requires women to cover their hair. |
Anonymous
I don't believe you would feel equally mortified exposing your breasts to your husband and your boss, sorry. |
Anonymous
| ^^it is obvious... |
Anonymous
Just to be clear, that's not my opinion, nor did I invent it. It's from the Muslim source at the link I posted with the full excerpt. Your quote removed the link, but you can find it right above. |
Anonymous
It is your opinion to the extend that you delivered it to the discussion by posting it here. "Muslim source" means nothing. It just means a guy wrote something and another guy repeated it. Nothing about it elevates it to the level of Quranic sources - if you believe that Quranic sources mean anything. |
Anonymous
Ha! obviously we are not talking about what goes on in the bedroom, but rather how one goes about one's daily business in the house. I wouldn't bear my breasts to my kids or other family members either! But in Islam it is perfectly fine to wear the most provocative outfit of a miniskirt and crop top or whatever else in the house around one's male relatives as long as one bundles up in public. Personally, I have seen this. But, I think, for most Americans (not trying to speak for everyone, just my observation), there is a very small gap in the modesty of dress worn publicly and in private and the wide gap one sees in Islam is confusing. For us, modesty in the house and in public are pretty much the same thing. Not so in Islam. |
Anonymous
Dear late Mr. Bin Baz and his crew pushed the interpretation it should mean anything and everything - I post it below - commentary in parenthesis: Allaah says (interpretation of the meaning): “And tell the believing women to lower their gaze (from looking at forbidden things), and protect their private parts (from illegal sexual acts) and not to show off their adornment except only that which is apparent (like both eyes for necessity to see the way, or outer palms of hands or one eye or dress like veil, gloves, headcover, apron), and to draw their veils all over Juyoobihinna (i.e. their bodies, faces, necks and bosoms) and not to reveal their adornment except to their husbands, or their fathers, or their husband’s fathers, or their sons, or their husband’s sons, or their brothers or their brother’s sons, or their sister’s sons, or their (Muslim) women (i.e. their sisters in Islam), or the (female) slaves whom their right hands possess, or old male servants who lack vigour, or small children who have no sense of feminine sex. And let them not stamp their feet so as to reveal what they hide of their adornment. And all of you beg Allaah to forgive you all, O believers, that you may be successful” [al-Noor 24:31] This is how the tafsir (Quranic commentary) is written - you paste the Quranic verse and add your parenthesis saying whatever the hell you want to say. Then you find someone to publish, and voila, you're in business. |
Anonymous
Your point isn't clear. Are you saying 1. That verse doesn't exist in the Quran 2. The interpretation is different from your own interpretation. Although, clearly the Muslims who posted that believe it. So as a follow-on question, are you asserting your interpretation is the "correct" interpretation, and therefore are you speaking for all Islam here? 3. Quranic verses don't mean anything (doubt you're saying this). |