Does anyone have language immersion regrets?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:We have neighbors who moved their kids from DCI to private for HS. They were huge proponents of immersion in the early years so I have wondered why they would leave DCI after MS. They have alluded to the social piece being the issue, not the immersion.

DCI is a pretty tiered school- if you’re great at math you can have a ton of opportunities for accelerated math and extracurriculars.

If you’re great at language you can take multiple classes in that language, go on trips, etc. there are tons of opportunities for you.

If you’re a poor student or bad at math or language it won’t be the same experience.

It's all relative. I don't see too many parents of means knocking themselves out to ensure that kids excel in math or language or anything else at DCI. But we're not on the Spanish track. Maybe those parents take immersion seriously overall.

Admins and teachers don't encourage families to enroll in various summer immersion programs. Yes, there's the odd trip abroad for 9th and 10th graders, but it's all fairly gimmicky, two week fun trips to see the sites.

IMHO, you're on your own for too much at DCI if you're aiming high for IB Diploma. You're out of step with the school culture.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:We have neighbors who moved their kids from DCI to private for HS. They were huge proponents of immersion in the early years so I have wondered why they would leave DCI after MS. They have alluded to the social piece being the issue, not the immersion.

DCI is a pretty tiered school- if you’re great at math you can have a ton of opportunities for accelerated math and extracurriculars.

If you’re great at language you can take multiple classes in that language, go on trips, etc. there are tons of opportunities for you.

If you’re a poor student or bad at math or language it won’t be the same experience.

It's all relative. I don't see too many parents of means knocking themselves out to ensure that kids excel in math or language or anything else at DCI. But we're not on the Spanish track. Maybe those parents take immersion seriously overall.

Admins and teachers don't encourage families to enroll in various summer immersion programs. Yes, there's the odd trip abroad for 9th and 10th graders, but it's all fairly gimmicky, two week fun trips to see the sites.

IMHO, you're on your own for too much at DCI if you're aiming high for IB Diploma. You're out of step with the school culture.

It’s because you are not in the spanish track. That bar is set much higher, families are much more invested.

The other tracks takes non-feeder kids with families not so much invested in the language but more so about getting into middle/high school track.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:We have neighbors who moved their kids from DCI to private for HS. They were huge proponents of immersion in the early years so I have wondered why they would leave DCI after MS. They have alluded to the social piece being the issue, not the immersion.

DCI is a pretty tiered school- if you’re great at math you can have a ton of opportunities for accelerated math and extracurriculars.

If you’re great at language you can take multiple classes in that language, go on trips, etc. there are tons of opportunities for you.

If you’re a poor student or bad at math or language it won’t be the same experience.

It's all relative. I don't see too many parents of means knocking themselves out to ensure that kids excel in math or language or anything else at DCI. But we're not on the Spanish track. Maybe those parents take immersion seriously overall.

Admins and teachers don't encourage families to enroll in various summer immersion programs. Yes, there's the odd trip abroad for 9th and 10th graders, but it's all fairly gimmicky, two week fun trips to see the sites.

IMHO, you're on your own for too much at DCI if you're aiming high for IB Diploma. You're out of step with the school culture.

We are at a spanish feeder. The families we know and are friends with fall into these categories -at least one native speaking parent, non-hispanic parent but who is fluent in spanish (lived abroad, peace corp, study abroad, etc..), have spanish au pair or babysitter,

We don’t speak spanish or fit into any of the above categories. But we do put DS into summer immersion programs. Admin at our school doesn’t need to encourage anything.

BTW the top performing kids in our grade also tend to be in the highest spanish group. Not at DCI yet, but I can see the tracking if it’s the same group of kids in the highest math and spanish track from our school.

[Anonymous]

I wish that admins would encourage teachers to a better job prepping DCI juniors and seniors not only for the IB language exams in the other subjects, along with corresponding AP exams. We've been buying our own IBD subject prep guides, Secrets Preps, Mometrix, Oxford Study guides etc. We've also been buying AP prep guides. The school could easily make these latest guides available to students. DCI's working assumption is that simply earning the Diploma is enough for high performers. We're shooting for a points total in the high 30s+ because we're looking at colleges abroad with published totals cut-offs in admissions. The program would be higher caliber if the adults in charge cared about students earning high IB exam scores.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I wish that admins would encourage teachers to a better job prepping DCI juniors and seniors not only for the IB language exams in the other subjects, along with corresponding AP exams. We've been buying our own IBD subject prep guides, Secrets Preps, Mometrix, Oxford Study guides etc. We've also been buying AP prep guides. The school could easily make these latest guides available to students. DCI's working assumption is that simply earning the Diploma is enough for high performers. We're shooting for a points total in the high 30s+ because we're looking at colleges abroad with published totals cut-offs in admissions. The program would be higher caliber if the adults in charge cared about students earning high IB exam scores.

“We’re shooting” is loony tunes. Seriously. I remember signing up for AP exams myself when my school didn’t offer corresponding courses and asking my teachers for suggested textbooks or checking books out of the library to study for AP exams. No SAT prep classes - just studying by myself. Yes, times have changed - but you are not shooting for anything - your kid may be. Teaching your kid to advocate for themselves, to study without force-feeding them the material is a critical life skill. Having a crappy teacher or guidance counselor and navigating around that is also a part of approaching adulthood. You don’t need a guidance counselor’s permission to sign up for an exam.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I wish that admins would encourage teachers to a better job prepping DCI juniors and seniors not only for the IB language exams in the other subjects, along with corresponding AP exams. We've been buying our own IBD subject prep guides, Secrets Preps, Mometrix, Oxford Study guides etc. We've also been buying AP prep guides. The school could easily make these latest guides available to students. DCI's working assumption is that simply earning the Diploma is enough for high performers. We're shooting for a points total in the high 30s+ because we're looking at colleges abroad with published totals cut-offs in admissions. The program would be higher caliber if the adults in charge cared about students earning high IB exam scores.

“We’re shooting” is loony tunes. Seriously. I remember signing up for AP exams myself when my school didn’t offer corresponding courses and asking my teachers for suggested textbooks or checking books out of the library to study for AP exams. No SAT prep classes - just studying by myself. Yes, times have changed - but you are not shooting for anything - your kid may be. Teaching your kid to advocate for themselves, to study without force-feeding them the material is a critical life skill. Having a crappy teacher or guidance counselor and navigating around that is also a part of approaching adulthood. You don’t need a guidance counselor’s permission to sign up for an exam.

Not pp, but I'm wondering if other US-based IB schools offer AP tests on their campuses.

[Anonymous]

Shooting isn’t looney, it’s smart and logical, particulary if you’re looking at colleges abroad because you’re in the fi aid donut.

I have nephews at Meridian HS in Falls Church City, the only other full IB public high school I know of in the DMV (with DCI). My sibling tells me that Meridian students are encouraged to double up on a few AP exams, and that the school offers two dozen.

If you’ve got teens in the DCI high school and don’t want to wind up with language immersion regrets, you can pay attention to what more serious and better established IBD programs in the burbs are doing. Copy them.

[Anonymous]

My older DCI student took AP Chinese at JR twice, in 10th grade (3) and again in 11th (5).

Not helpful that DCI doesn’t bother with APs, which makes things needlessly difficult for ambitious poor kids.

[Anonymous]

As pps have pointed out, DCI doesn't have a track record of hiring first-rate college counselors. Their inexperienced counselors seem to have been conditioned by admins to advise parents that student don't need to double up on AP exams, that this approach is overkill. While that may be true for admissions to most BA programs, it's obviously not the case for the most highly competitive colleges, at least for UMC applicants. Those colleges want to see top standardized test scores with applications.

I'm guessing that, over time, as more DCI students have a decent shot of admission to colleges admitting in the single digits and teens, DCI resistance to AP testing will break down under pressure from parents. As has been pointed out, it's not difficult to take AP exams at other DC public schools. Our family does its part to spread the word about how to seek out AP testing, and the value of it for those aiming high in admissions. Kids need to know how to prep for AP language exams, which emphasize grammar and vocab to a greater extent than IBD language exams. If the school isn't going to tell us this, we can tell one another, share resources, team up to get kids to testing etc.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:As pps have pointed out, DCI doesn't have a track record of hiring first-rate college counselors. Their inexperienced counselors seem to have been conditioned by admins to advise parents that student don't need to double up on AP exams, that this approach is overkill. While that may be true for admissions to most BA programs, it's obviously not the case for the most highly competitive colleges, at least for UMC applicants. Those colleges want to see top standardized test scores with applications.

I'm guessing that, over time, as more DCI students have a decent shot of admission to colleges admitting in the single digits and teens, DCI resistance to AP testing will break down under pressure from parents. As has been pointed out, it's not difficult to take AP exams at other DC public schools. Our family does its part to spread the word about how to seek out AP testing, and the value of it for those aiming high in admissions. Kids need to know how to prep for AP language exams, which emphasize grammar and vocab to a greater extent than IBD language exams. If the school isn't going to tell us this, we can tell one another, share resources, team up to get kids to testing etc.

Would you be willing to post this on the parent email list? I know a few parents of freshmen who want to learn more and would welcome a discussion.

[Anonymous]

Sorry, no. We've already been criticized by admins and a few parents for being helicopter parents spreading misinformation about the need to double up on AP testing for families aiming for the most highly competitive colleges and for colleges abroad. What we're doing is quietly coordinating with other parents we know and trust in the 10th grade cohort. I encourage like-minded parents of freshman to start thinking in terms of the unfortunate timing of IBD exams for applicants to top American colleges. You want to look ahead to asking admins to permit the 2 standard level exams in the spring of junior year that Geneva freely allows. No need to take no for an answer. You also want to look at taking the AP language exam for the target language in the spring of 10th grade and again in the spring of 11th grade if the kid didn't score a 5 the first time around. It's easiest to double up on AP languages and sciences, where the curriculum is most similar to IBD but be sure to have the kid prep off standard AP guides (Princeton Review, Barrons etc.). You can start setting goals for 11th grade AP exams in bio, chem, maybe one or two of the physics, maybe environmental systems/studies. You can also look at Cambridge Intl exams which are given at British curriculum intl schools in this country in May and Nov. Some of the British schools will let outside students enroll. Cambridge exams are more similar to IB exams than AP (no multiple choice). We know that a few DCI seniors have taken Cambridge language exams (AS-Level or A-Level) in Nov to have the score to submit with college applications over the winter of senior year. See the Cambridge Intl exam web site for info and a list of schools where the tests are given. Good luck.

[Anonymous]

This. Pays to be realistic, pays to plan ahead.

Relying on poor advice from DCI can lead to…to immersion regrets.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Sorry, no. We've already been criticized by admins and a few parents for being helicopter parents spreading misinformation about the need to double up on AP testing for families aiming for the most highly competitive colleges and for colleges abroad. What we're doing is quietly coordinating with other parents we know and trust in the 10th grade cohort. I encourage like-minded parents of freshman to start thinking in terms of the unfortunate timing of IBD exams for applicants to top American colleges. You want to look ahead to asking admins to permit the 2 standard level exams in the spring of junior year that Geneva freely allows. No need to take no for an answer. You also want to look at taking the AP language exam for the target language in the spring of 10th grade and again in the spring of 11th grade if the kid didn't score a 5 the first time around. It's easiest to double up on AP languages and sciences, where the curriculum is most similar to IBD but be sure to have the kid prep off standard AP guides (Princeton Review, Barrons etc.). You can start setting goals for 11th grade AP exams in bio, chem, maybe one or two of the physics, maybe environmental systems/studies. You can also look at Cambridge Intl exams which are given at British curriculum intl schools in this country in May and Nov. Some of the British schools will let outside students enroll. Cambridge exams are more similar to IB exams than AP (no multiple choice). We know that a few DCI seniors have taken Cambridge language exams (AS-Level or A-Level) in Nov to have the score to submit with college applications over the winter of senior year. See the Cambridge Intl exam web site for info and a list of schools where the tests are given. Good luck.

If people are interesting in Oxbridge (the A levels), I can speak with some authority here. My sister sat for the A levels out of an IB school overseas and got into a college at Oxford (ended up at St Andrew’s by choice). For American students applying in it’s fairly common to take a gap year to get all the dates and test scores lined up. I don’t know if I strongly recommend it, but it’s acceptable and common enough behavior.

[Anonymous]

One thing about the A levels is you are pretty much constrained to major in the subjects you take the test in. That may not be the language you took, unless you really want to major in it at university.

[Anonymous]

Huh? I'm British, took four A-Levels, did a univ course in a subject I hadn't studied at A-Level, in the 90s. Moreover, the UK univ admissions system, via UCAS, seems far more flexible now than it was 30 years ago. Agree with pp above that it's not a bad idea to take a Cambridge language exam in Nov of senior year from DCI rather than waiting to take a SL or HL IB language exam in June of senior year. Cambridge gives AS-Level exams (half an A, level comparable to IBD SL) and A-Levels (comparable to IBD HL).

It's also a good idea for the kid to take the AP exam for their language at a different school after doing some specific prep. Sidwell Friends, BASIS, Gonzaga, J-R and Walls give AP Chinese in DC and many schools give French and Spanish. Just not difficult for outside students to sign up via the College Board web site.