Does everyone on here with kids applying to top 50 schools really have the $80K per year to spend?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:OP here.
I get that $90K is a rounding error for some on here and two weeks' salaries for others.

But I bet that for most of us, $360K is not an insignificant amount.
And yet we're fighting each other for the privilege of paying it.

We are truly idiots for playing into this. Excuse my insult as I include myself in that group.

OP, you had many chances to get there with so little money. When Netflix raised their DVD monthly rental from $7 to $11, it was time to buy Netflix stock. When Apple came out with Iphone, you still had several years to buy the stock to get to $360k. When you were shopping on Amazon, you should have been buying the stock. All in all, ca $30k in any one of them, would have taken you there.
There are so many other companies that were clearly going to do well.
I started really late like in 2020 because of work and visa problems.Almost 20 years down the drain, and I still made it. My older one doesn't want me pay that much for college and wants to go to community college. Younger one is about to get $300k, but outside of 529 ofcourse. Younger DC has 10 years til college. We were never high earners. We had to make money work for us even if we knew nothing about it. Well, almost nothing. It's extremely good time to be in the market and/or enter the market now to forever. Not a financial advice.

First of all, not everyone is a savvy investor. And I'll go further than not many people know much about investing at all. So good for you? But you're expected a tremendous amount of financial know-all for most people. I grew up pretty poor and I can tell you I didn't have any sort of "investing" until I was nearly 30. Partly due to my debt (school) to income ratio and partly due to just not knowing.

Second, you imply that people should give up any sort of luxury, however small, to fund college. And I fundamentally disagree with that. Colleges are overpriced. Loans are predatory. And yet, despite what we say about "you can do well at any college" there aer many that will only hire from ivies, top tiers, etc. I saw that first hand in my own line of work. So people have valid reasons to want those schools.

Where did you work that would only hire from "ivies, top tiers, etc"? Because there really are not many areas that are like that. People do NOT have valid reasons to want those schools. There are literally only ~50-60K freshman matriculating at T25 schools each year. Yet millions of people are happy, succesful in their careers. Do the math, majority of them did not attend T25 schools.

At my aged agency- my incoming class I had 6 Ivy alum and me and two others with state university degrees. We all came in sane grade/step and all make the same 25 years later.

Do they still hire mostly from Ivies/T25 currently? Were those 6 Ivy alums hired because they had actual connections at your aged agency or just because they were Ivy Alums? Because it's very likely many Ivy alums have parent/family connections already and might have gotten that same job even if they went to State U

Ironically, you proved the point that you all make the same are at the same grade now, so really it doesn't matter where you went---quality workers come from any college.

That was my point!! They hire from everywhere. In my field, most have a graduate degree.

Except your example implied your odds were far greater to get the job from the start if you went to an Ivy League school.

No company pays their hires different salaries for the exact same job.

How do you calculate the odds fairly? Is it the school or is it the high performing student? Ivies just have a greater concentration of the latter.

I work for a major F500 consulting firm and in a high performing group within the firm. Most people on here would know my employer. At beginning of summer was the annual email welcoming all the summer interns for the group. Most were from flagship state universities and the rest from various private colleges. Ivies did not dominate. Nowhere close to it. Yes, this is anecdotal and it's just one firm, but people really, greatly overestimate and exaggerate the advantages of going to an Ivy.

-- double Ivy alum who figured this out long time ago.

Look at the size of the classes at different schools. Any Ivy representation each year means that they do have better odds.

dp.. but really smart kids from big flagships can get into the same internships as the few students from ivy league schools. I think the point is that a really smart student can go to a flagship at a fraction of the cost of an Ivy league, and do equally as well.

It really depends on the kid, not necessarily the school.

Pick your sought after employer in any field. Are they hiring 8 times as many Ohio State graduates as Harvard graduates each year?

Actually, what you major in matters more.

An English major from Harvard probably won't be making as much just after graduation as a CS major from U Mich. But even then, a CS major from Harvard would be making the same as a U Mich CS major both working at a FAANG. They don't pay you by the college you went to.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:If you want to compare like for like student, Dunn and Kruger is no longer the most recent large scale study (much to the dismay of mediocre schools everywhere).

"Using a new research design that isolates idiosyncratic variation in admissions decisions for waitlisted applicants, we show that attending an Ivy-Plus college instead of the average highly selective public flagship institution increases students’ chances of reaching the top 1% of the earnings distribution by 60%, nearly doubles their chances of attending an elite graduate school, and triples their chances of working at a prestigious firm."

...

"Using this design, we find that being admitted to an Ivy-Plus college increases students’ chances of
achieving upper-tail success on both monetary and non-monetary dimensions. Relative to those rejected
from the waitlist, applicants admitted from the waitlist are significantly more likely to reach the top 1% of the income distribution, attend an elite graduate school, and work at a prestigious firm. In contrast, we find a small and statistically insignificant impact of admission from the waitlist on mean earning ranks and the
probability of reaching the top quartile of the income distribution; the causal impacts of Ivy-Plus colleges are concentrated entirely in reaching the upper tail of the distribution, consistent with the predominance of students from such colleges in positions of leadership that motivated this study"


https://opportunityinsights.org/wp-content/uploads/2023/07/CollegeAdmissions_Paper.pdf

You can do ok with a degree from a state flagship, but if you want to be really successful, the school matters

The real world is laughing at this.

Work at a F200. 90+% of senior leadership from C-suite down to the MDs and SVPs and VPS did not go to Ivy schools. Many went to utter no name schools. You'd be shocked.

--Double Ivy grad.

I know people will be up in arms, but Ivy grads don’t want to work for F200 companies outside of tech. They want to work at hedge funds, PE funds, VC funds, start their own companies, etc. if my kid wanted to work their way up the ranks of Wal Mart, I would absolutely advise them against an Ivy. If they want to work at Blackstone or Sequoia then yes it helps a ton.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:If you want to compare like for like student, Dunn and Kruger is no longer the most recent large scale study (much to the dismay of mediocre schools everywhere).

"Using a new research design that isolates idiosyncratic variation in admissions decisions for waitlisted applicants, we show that attending an Ivy-Plus college instead of the average highly selective public flagship institution increases students’ chances of reaching the top 1% of the earnings distribution by 60%, nearly doubles their chances of attending an elite graduate school, and triples their chances of working at a prestigious firm."

...

"Using this design, we find that being admitted to an Ivy-Plus college increases students’ chances of
achieving upper-tail success on both monetary and non-monetary dimensions. Relative to those rejected
from the waitlist, applicants admitted from the waitlist are significantly more likely to reach the top 1% of the income distribution, attend an elite graduate school, and work at a prestigious firm. In contrast, we find a small and statistically insignificant impact of admission from the waitlist on mean earning ranks and the
probability of reaching the top quartile of the income distribution; the causal impacts of Ivy-Plus colleges are concentrated entirely in reaching the upper tail of the distribution, consistent with the predominance of students from such colleges in positions of leadership that motivated this study"


https://opportunityinsights.org/wp-content/uploads/2023/07/CollegeAdmissions_Paper.pdf

You can do ok with a degree from a state flagship, but if you want to be really successful, the school matters

The real world is laughing at this.

Work at a F200. 90+% of senior leadership from C-suite down to the MDs and SVPs and VPS did not go to Ivy schools. Many went to utter no name schools. You'd be shocked.

--Double Ivy grad.

I know people will be up in arms, but Ivy grads don’t want to work for F200 companies outside of tech. They want to work at hedge funds, PE funds, VC funds, start their own companies, etc. if my kid wanted to work their way up the ranks of Wal Mart, I would absolutely advise them against an Ivy. If they want to work at Blackstone or Sequoia then yes it helps a ton.

And this my friends is why the parent pressure never stops. Most Ivy grads don’t not end up in PE or VC or KKR or sequoia. They end up in a law firm, or a NFP, or Pfizer, or being SAHMs. The largest employer for Harvard grads is Teach for America. Think of your friends who went to an Ivy League school. Now think of how many of them are partners at Blackstone. Gimme a break. Give your kids a break. They’ll be fine even if they don’t end up in finance, good grief.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:If you want to compare like for like student, Dunn and Kruger is no longer the most recent large scale study (much to the dismay of mediocre schools everywhere).

"Using a new research design that isolates idiosyncratic variation in admissions decisions for waitlisted applicants, we show that attending an Ivy-Plus college instead of the average highly selective public flagship institution increases students’ chances of reaching the top 1% of the earnings distribution by 60%, nearly doubles their chances of attending an elite graduate school, and triples their chances of working at a prestigious firm."

...

"Using this design, we find that being admitted to an Ivy-Plus college increases students’ chances of
achieving upper-tail success on both monetary and non-monetary dimensions. Relative to those rejected
from the waitlist, applicants admitted from the waitlist are significantly more likely to reach the top 1% of the income distribution, attend an elite graduate school, and work at a prestigious firm. In contrast, we find a small and statistically insignificant impact of admission from the waitlist on mean earning ranks and the
probability of reaching the top quartile of the income distribution; the causal impacts of Ivy-Plus colleges are concentrated entirely in reaching the upper tail of the distribution, consistent with the predominance of students from such colleges in positions of leadership that motivated this study"


https://opportunityinsights.org/wp-content/uploads/2023/07/CollegeAdmissions_Paper.pdf

You can do ok with a degree from a state flagship, but if you want to be really successful, the school matters

The real world is laughing at this.

Work at a F200. 90+% of senior leadership from C-suite down to the MDs and SVPs and VPS did not go to Ivy schools. Many went to utter no name schools. You'd be shocked.

--Double Ivy grad.

THIS^^^^

Partner is a CEO, has been at 3 companies. At all 3 companies, only 1 person at each had an Ivy degree or a T25 degree. Majority went to no name or their state schools, so not even 25-50 ranked. So how did they get to their positions? By hard work, drive and determination. It's what you do with your knowledge and degree and the relationships you build over time in the workforce that enable you to be successful---it's not attending Harvard or Yale.

The example of CEOs and even VPs is pretty pointless. Most people, even most Ivy grads, are not CEOs. More useful is comparing salaries for the same major at various schools.

For example, salary at age 45 for economics major:
Harvard: $181k
Yale: $210k
Amherst: $180k
Ohio State: $79k
Penn State: $99k
UVA: $127k
W&M: $98k

Significant difference between (Ivy or elite SLAC) and (state flagship or good in-state school).

But this thread is about people who have the money but don’t see the value.

A William & Mary grad who paid 180 vs 400k for Harvard at 20. And invested that 220k or used it for a down payment or paid for a grad school degree is likely far better off 25 years later.

[Anonymous]

Right. Do the math on the Yale Econ BA vs the WM Econ BA w a masters degree from U Chicago.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:If you want to compare like for like student, Dunn and Kruger is no longer the most recent large scale study (much to the dismay of mediocre schools everywhere).

"Using a new research design that isolates idiosyncratic variation in admissions decisions for waitlisted applicants, we show that attending an Ivy-Plus college instead of the average highly selective public flagship institution increases students’ chances of reaching the top 1% of the earnings distribution by 60%, nearly doubles their chances of attending an elite graduate school, and triples their chances of working at a prestigious firm."

...

"Using this design, we find that being admitted to an Ivy-Plus college increases students’ chances of
achieving upper-tail success on both monetary and non-monetary dimensions. Relative to those rejected
from the waitlist, applicants admitted from the waitlist are significantly more likely to reach the top 1% of the income distribution, attend an elite graduate school, and work at a prestigious firm. In contrast, we find a small and statistically insignificant impact of admission from the waitlist on mean earning ranks and the
probability of reaching the top quartile of the income distribution; the causal impacts of Ivy-Plus colleges are concentrated entirely in reaching the upper tail of the distribution, consistent with the predominance of students from such colleges in positions of leadership that motivated this study"


https://opportunityinsights.org/wp-content/uploads/2023/07/CollegeAdmissions_Paper.pdf

You can do ok with a degree from a state flagship, but if you want to be really successful, the school matters

They're not going to listen, even though it demonstrates what should be plain as day: people fight for admission because it does matter. The other half of the research showing private school advantage in college admissions was also compelling.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:If you want to compare like for like student, Dunn and Kruger is no longer the most recent large scale study (much to the dismay of mediocre schools everywhere).

"Using a new research design that isolates idiosyncratic variation in admissions decisions for waitlisted applicants, we show that attending an Ivy-Plus college instead of the average highly selective public flagship institution increases students’ chances of reaching the top 1% of the earnings distribution by 60%, nearly doubles their chances of attending an elite graduate school, and triples their chances of working at a prestigious firm."

...

"Using this design, we find that being admitted to an Ivy-Plus college increases students’ chances of
achieving upper-tail success on both monetary and non-monetary dimensions. Relative to those rejected
from the waitlist, applicants admitted from the waitlist are significantly more likely to reach the top 1% of the income distribution, attend an elite graduate school, and work at a prestigious firm. In contrast, we find a small and statistically insignificant impact of admission from the waitlist on mean earning ranks and the
probability of reaching the top quartile of the income distribution; the causal impacts of Ivy-Plus colleges are concentrated entirely in reaching the upper tail of the distribution, consistent with the predominance of students from such colleges in positions of leadership that motivated this study"


https://opportunityinsights.org/wp-content/uploads/2023/07/CollegeAdmissions_Paper.pdf

You can do ok with a degree from a state flagship, but if you want to be really successful, the school matters

The real world is laughing at this.

Work at a F200. 90+% of senior leadership from C-suite down to the MDs and SVPs and VPS did not go to Ivy schools. Many went to utter no name schools. You'd be shocked.

--Double Ivy grad.

THIS^^^^

Partner is a CEO, has been at 3 companies. At all 3 companies, only 1 person at each had an Ivy degree or a T25 degree. Majority went to no name or their state schools, so not even 25-50 ranked. So how did they get to their positions? By hard work, drive and determination. It's what you do with your knowledge and degree and the relationships you build over time in the workforce that enable you to be successful---it's not attending Harvard or Yale.

The example of CEOs and even VPs is pretty pointless. Most people, even most Ivy grads, are not CEOs. More useful is comparing salaries for the same major at various schools.

For example, salary at age 45 for economics major:
Harvard: $181k
Yale: $210k
Amherst: $180k
Ohio State: $79k
Penn State: $99k
UVA: $127k
W&M: $98k

Significant difference between (Ivy or elite SLAC) and (state flagship or good in-state school).

I don’t think you take much from this. This is “average” and Econ majors go many different directions- like the software guy. Some teach, etc.

Fwiw, I’m a Bio major (gen low paying degree) from VT and was making $180k at 45.

Where you live matters too.

There are also a decent number of people (mostly women) who drag down the "average" because they are not working full time or are in mommy tracked jobs.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:If you want to compare like for like student, Dunn and Kruger is no longer the most recent large scale study (much to the dismay of mediocre schools everywhere).

"Using a new research design that isolates idiosyncratic variation in admissions decisions for waitlisted applicants, we show that attending an Ivy-Plus college instead of the average highly selective public flagship institution increases students’ chances of reaching the top 1% of the earnings distribution by 60%, nearly doubles their chances of attending an elite graduate school, and triples their chances of working at a prestigious firm."

...

"Using this design, we find that being admitted to an Ivy-Plus college increases students’ chances of
achieving upper-tail success on both monetary and non-monetary dimensions. Relative to those rejected
from the waitlist, applicants admitted from the waitlist are significantly more likely to reach the top 1% of the income distribution, attend an elite graduate school, and work at a prestigious firm. In contrast, we find a small and statistically insignificant impact of admission from the waitlist on mean earning ranks and the
probability of reaching the top quartile of the income distribution; the causal impacts of Ivy-Plus colleges are concentrated entirely in reaching the upper tail of the distribution, consistent with the predominance of students from such colleges in positions of leadership that motivated this study"


https://opportunityinsights.org/wp-content/uploads/2023/07/CollegeAdmissions_Paper.pdf

You can do ok with a degree from a state flagship, but if you want to be really successful, the school matters

The real world is laughing at this.

Work at a F200. 90+% of senior leadership from C-suite down to the MDs and SVPs and VPS did not go to Ivy schools. Many went to utter no name schools. You'd be shocked.

--Double Ivy grad.

THIS^^^^

Partner is a CEO, has been at 3 companies. At all 3 companies, only 1 person at each had an Ivy degree or a T25 degree. Majority went to no name or their state schools, so not even 25-50 ranked. So how did they get to their positions? By hard work, drive and determination. It's what you do with your knowledge and degree and the relationships you build over time in the workforce that enable you to be successful---it's not attending Harvard or Yale.

The example of CEOs and even VPs is pretty pointless. Most people, even most Ivy grads, are not CEOs. More useful is comparing salaries for the same major at various schools.

For example, salary at age 45 for economics major:
Harvard: $181k
Yale: $210k
Amherst: $180k
Ohio State: $79k
Penn State: $99k
UVA: $127k
W&M: $98k

Significant difference between (Ivy or elite SLAC) and (state flagship or good in-state school).

But this thread is about people who have the money but don’t see the value.

A William & Mary grad who paid 180 vs 400k for Harvard at 20. And invested that 220k or used it for a down payment or paid for a grad school degree is likely far better off 25 years later.

Yeah, if the WM grad invest that 220k, he’ll have 2.2mm in his vanguard aaccount at 45 when the Yale grad is making 210k a year.

This who thread is about is a 80-90k/yr school worth it. Saying they make 100k more a year 25 years later isn’t the flex you think it is.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:If you want to compare like for like student, Dunn and Kruger is no longer the most recent large scale study (much to the dismay of mediocre schools everywhere).

"Using a new research design that isolates idiosyncratic variation in admissions decisions for waitlisted applicants, we show that attending an Ivy-Plus college instead of the average highly selective public flagship institution increases students’ chances of reaching the top 1% of the earnings distribution by 60%, nearly doubles their chances of attending an elite graduate school, and triples their chances of working at a prestigious firm."

...

"Using this design, we find that being admitted to an Ivy-Plus college increases students’ chances of
achieving upper-tail success on both monetary and non-monetary dimensions. Relative to those rejected
from the waitlist, applicants admitted from the waitlist are significantly more likely to reach the top 1% of the income distribution, attend an elite graduate school, and work at a prestigious firm. In contrast, we find a small and statistically insignificant impact of admission from the waitlist on mean earning ranks and the
probability of reaching the top quartile of the income distribution; the causal impacts of Ivy-Plus colleges are concentrated entirely in reaching the upper tail of the distribution, consistent with the predominance of students from such colleges in positions of leadership that motivated this study"


https://opportunityinsights.org/wp-content/uploads/2023/07/CollegeAdmissions_Paper.pdf

You can do ok with a degree from a state flagship, but if you want to be really successful, the school matters

The real world is laughing at this.

Work at a F200. 90+% of senior leadership from C-suite down to the MDs and SVPs and VPS did not go to Ivy schools. Many went to utter no name schools. You'd be shocked.

--Double Ivy grad.

THIS^^^^

Partner is a CEO, has been at 3 companies. At all 3 companies, only 1 person at each had an Ivy degree or a T25 degree. Majority went to no name or their state schools, so not even 25-50 ranked. So how did they get to their positions? By hard work, drive and determination. It's what you do with your knowledge and degree and the relationships you build over time in the workforce that enable you to be successful---it's not attending Harvard or Yale.

The example of CEOs and even VPs is pretty pointless. Most people, even most Ivy grads, are not CEOs. More useful is comparing salaries for the same major at various schools.

For example, salary at age 45 for economics major:
Harvard: $181k
Yale: $210k
Amherst: $180k
Ohio State: $79k
Penn State: $99k
UVA: $127k
W&M: $98k

Significant difference between (Ivy or elite SLAC) and (state flagship or good in-state school).

I don’t think you take much from this. This is “average” and Econ majors go many different directions- like the software guy. Some teach, etc.

Fwiw, I’m a Bio major (gen low paying degree) from VT and was making $180k at 45.

Where you live matters too.

There are also a decent number of people (mostly women) who drag down the "average" because they are not working full time or are in mommy tracked jobs.

Why assume that’s not your kid. Come to drop off at my kids Brooklyn public grade school. You’ll find plenty of sahm Ivy grad dads who have vague jobs as artists/writers. The moms who went to Michigan are the ones paying the mortgage.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:If you want to compare like for like student, Dunn and Kruger is no longer the most recent large scale study (much to the dismay of mediocre schools everywhere).

"Using a new research design that isolates idiosyncratic variation in admissions decisions for waitlisted applicants, we show that attending an Ivy-Plus college instead of the average highly selective public flagship institution increases students’ chances of reaching the top 1% of the earnings distribution by 60%, nearly doubles their chances of attending an elite graduate school, and triples their chances of working at a prestigious firm."

...

"Using this design, we find that being admitted to an Ivy-Plus college increases students’ chances of
achieving upper-tail success on both monetary and non-monetary dimensions. Relative to those rejected
from the waitlist, applicants admitted from the waitlist are significantly more likely to reach the top 1% of the income distribution, attend an elite graduate school, and work at a prestigious firm. In contrast, we find a small and statistically insignificant impact of admission from the waitlist on mean earning ranks and the
probability of reaching the top quartile of the income distribution; the causal impacts of Ivy-Plus colleges are concentrated entirely in reaching the upper tail of the distribution, consistent with the predominance of students from such colleges in positions of leadership that motivated this study"


https://opportunityinsights.org/wp-content/uploads/2023/07/CollegeAdmissions_Paper.pdf

You can do ok with a degree from a state flagship, but if you want to be really successful, the school matters

The real world is laughing at this.

Work at a F200. 90+% of senior leadership from C-suite down to the MDs and SVPs and VPS did not go to Ivy schools. Many went to utter no name schools. You'd be shocked.

--Double Ivy grad.

THIS^^^^

Partner is a CEO, has been at 3 companies. At all 3 companies, only 1 person at each had an Ivy degree or a T25 degree. Majority went to no name or their state schools, so not even 25-50 ranked. So how did they get to their positions? By hard work, drive and determination. It's what you do with your knowledge and degree and the relationships you build over time in the workforce that enable you to be successful---it's not attending Harvard or Yale.

The example of CEOs and even VPs is pretty pointless. Most people, even most Ivy grads, are not CEOs. More useful is comparing salaries for the same major at various schools.

For example, salary at age 45 for economics major:
Harvard: $181k
Yale: $210k
Amherst: $180k
Ohio State: $79k
Penn State: $99k
UVA: $127k
W&M: $98k

Significant difference between (Ivy or elite SLAC) and (state flagship or good in-state school).

But this thread is about people who have the money but don’t see the value.

A William & Mary grad who paid 180 vs 400k for Harvard at 20. And invested that 220k or used it for a down payment or paid for a grad school degree is likely far better off 25 years later.

Let’s be honest…most parents aren’t giving their kid the delta, so the parent is better off (though in theory the kid my inherit it down the road).

Also, i don’t believe grad school = more $$. Plenty of folks with graduate degrees that are struggling.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:If you want to compare like for like student, Dunn and Kruger is no longer the most recent large scale study (much to the dismay of mediocre schools everywhere).

"Using a new research design that isolates idiosyncratic variation in admissions decisions for waitlisted applicants, we show that attending an Ivy-Plus college instead of the average highly selective public flagship institution increases students’ chances of reaching the top 1% of the earnings distribution by 60%, nearly doubles their chances of attending an elite graduate school, and triples their chances of working at a prestigious firm."

...

"Using this design, we find that being admitted to an Ivy-Plus college increases students’ chances of
achieving upper-tail success on both monetary and non-monetary dimensions. Relative to those rejected
from the waitlist, applicants admitted from the waitlist are significantly more likely to reach the top 1% of the income distribution, attend an elite graduate school, and work at a prestigious firm. In contrast, we find a small and statistically insignificant impact of admission from the waitlist on mean earning ranks and the
probability of reaching the top quartile of the income distribution; the causal impacts of Ivy-Plus colleges are concentrated entirely in reaching the upper tail of the distribution, consistent with the predominance of students from such colleges in positions of leadership that motivated this study"


https://opportunityinsights.org/wp-content/uploads/2023/07/CollegeAdmissions_Paper.pdf

You can do ok with a degree from a state flagship, but if you want to be really successful, the school matters

The real world is laughing at this.

Work at a F200. 90+% of senior leadership from C-suite down to the MDs and SVPs and VPS did not go to Ivy schools. Many went to utter no name schools. You'd be shocked.

--Double Ivy grad.

THIS^^^^

Partner is a CEO, has been at 3 companies. At all 3 companies, only 1 person at each had an Ivy degree or a T25 degree. Majority went to no name or their state schools, so not even 25-50 ranked. So how did they get to their positions? By hard work, drive and determination. It's what you do with your knowledge and degree and the relationships you build over time in the workforce that enable you to be successful---it's not attending Harvard or Yale.

The example of CEOs and even VPs is pretty pointless. Most people, even most Ivy grads, are not CEOs. More useful is comparing salaries for the same major at various schools.

For example, salary at age 45 for economics major:
Harvard: $181k
Yale: $210k
Amherst: $180k
Ohio State: $79k
Penn State: $99k
UVA: $127k
W&M: $98k

Significant difference between (Ivy or elite SLAC) and (state flagship or good in-state school).

Unlike you, I went to an Ivy and also have a professional degree from another Ivy. I know where my classmates ended up.

These surveys are meaningless. Comparing Harvard to Ohio state is meaningless because the range of student capabilities is apples and oranges. But if you compare the top 5% of Ohio state econ grads to Harvard econ grads, then you get a very different set of numbers.

Some of the best and brightest kids in the country do go to Harvard and the other elite colleges. Which is not surprising. And they will do extremely well. And they will still have done extremely well had they gone to Ohio state.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:If you want to compare like for like student, Dunn and Kruger is no longer the most recent large scale study (much to the dismay of mediocre schools everywhere).

"Using a new research design that isolates idiosyncratic variation in admissions decisions for waitlisted applicants, we show that attending an Ivy-Plus college instead of the average highly selective public flagship institution increases students’ chances of reaching the top 1% of the earnings distribution by 60%, nearly doubles their chances of attending an elite graduate school, and triples their chances of working at a prestigious firm."

...

"Using this design, we find that being admitted to an Ivy-Plus college increases students’ chances of
achieving upper-tail success on both monetary and non-monetary dimensions. Relative to those rejected
from the waitlist, applicants admitted from the waitlist are significantly more likely to reach the top 1% of the income distribution, attend an elite graduate school, and work at a prestigious firm. In contrast, we find a small and statistically insignificant impact of admission from the waitlist on mean earning ranks and the
probability of reaching the top quartile of the income distribution; the causal impacts of Ivy-Plus colleges are concentrated entirely in reaching the upper tail of the distribution, consistent with the predominance of students from such colleges in positions of leadership that motivated this study"


https://opportunityinsights.org/wp-content/uploads/2023/07/CollegeAdmissions_Paper.pdf

You can do ok with a degree from a state flagship, but if you want to be really successful, the school matters

The real world is laughing at this.

Work at a F200. 90+% of senior leadership from C-suite down to the MDs and SVPs and VPS did not go to Ivy schools. Many went to utter no name schools. You'd be shocked.

--Double Ivy grad.

THIS^^^^

Partner is a CEO, has been at 3 companies. At all 3 companies, only 1 person at each had an Ivy degree or a T25 degree. Majority went to no name or their state schools, so not even 25-50 ranked. So how did they get to their positions? By hard work, drive and determination. It's what you do with your knowledge and degree and the relationships you build over time in the workforce that enable you to be successful---it's not attending Harvard or Yale.

The example of CEOs and even VPs is pretty pointless. Most people, even most Ivy grads, are not CEOs. More useful is comparing salaries for the same major at various schools.

For example, salary at age 45 for economics major:
Harvard: $181k
Yale: $210k
Amherst: $180k
Ohio State: $79k
Penn State: $99k
UVA: $127k
W&M: $98k

Significant difference between (Ivy or elite SLAC) and (state flagship or good in-state school).

I don’t think you take much from this. This is “average” and Econ majors go many different directions- like the software guy. Some teach, etc.

Fwiw, I’m a Bio major (gen low paying degree) from VT and was making $180k at 45.

Where you live matters too.

lol, I can tell you’re not an Econ major.

Pick any major and compare them across those schools. There will be a significant difference in earnings.

And the school you went to will likely influence where you live.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:If you want to compare like for like student, Dunn and Kruger is no longer the most recent large scale study (much to the dismay of mediocre schools everywhere).

"Using a new research design that isolates idiosyncratic variation in admissions decisions for waitlisted applicants, we show that attending an Ivy-Plus college instead of the average highly selective public flagship institution increases students’ chances of reaching the top 1% of the earnings distribution by 60%, nearly doubles their chances of attending an elite graduate school, and triples their chances of working at a prestigious firm."

...

"Using this design, we find that being admitted to an Ivy-Plus college increases students’ chances of
achieving upper-tail success on both monetary and non-monetary dimensions. Relative to those rejected
from the waitlist, applicants admitted from the waitlist are significantly more likely to reach the top 1% of the income distribution, attend an elite graduate school, and work at a prestigious firm. In contrast, we find a small and statistically insignificant impact of admission from the waitlist on mean earning ranks and the
probability of reaching the top quartile of the income distribution; the causal impacts of Ivy-Plus colleges are concentrated entirely in reaching the upper tail of the distribution, consistent with the predominance of students from such colleges in positions of leadership that motivated this study"


https://opportunityinsights.org/wp-content/uploads/2023/07/CollegeAdmissions_Paper.pdf

You can do ok with a degree from a state flagship, but if you want to be really successful, the school matters

The real world is laughing at this.

Work at a F200. 90+% of senior leadership from C-suite down to the MDs and SVPs and VPS did not go to Ivy schools. Many went to utter no name schools. You'd be shocked.

--Double Ivy grad.

THIS^^^^

Partner is a CEO, has been at 3 companies. At all 3 companies, only 1 person at each had an Ivy degree or a T25 degree. Majority went to no name or their state schools, so not even 25-50 ranked. So how did they get to their positions? By hard work, drive and determination. It's what you do with your knowledge and degree and the relationships you build over time in the workforce that enable you to be successful---it's not attending Harvard or Yale.

The example of CEOs and even VPs is pretty pointless. Most people, even most Ivy grads, are not CEOs. More useful is comparing salaries for the same major at various schools.

For example, salary at age 45 for economics major:
Harvard: $181k
Yale: $210k
Amherst: $180k
Ohio State: $79k
Penn State: $99k
UVA: $127k
W&M: $98k

Significant difference between (Ivy or elite SLAC) and (state flagship or good in-state school).

But this thread is about people who have the money but don’t see the value.

A William & Mary grad who paid 180 vs 400k for Harvard at 20. And invested that 220k or used it for a down payment or paid for a grad school degree is likely far better off 25 years later.

You’re not really wealthy if you have to care about the “value” of Harvard. None of those people are going to make their kid live at home and commute to GMU, which would be the Best Value Ever for them. They’re just pretending Ivy somehow isn’t worth it.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:If you want to compare like for like student, Dunn and Kruger is no longer the most recent large scale study (much to the dismay of mediocre schools everywhere).

"Using a new research design that isolates idiosyncratic variation in admissions decisions for waitlisted applicants, we show that attending an Ivy-Plus college instead of the average highly selective public flagship institution increases students’ chances of reaching the top 1% of the earnings distribution by 60%, nearly doubles their chances of attending an elite graduate school, and triples their chances of working at a prestigious firm."

...

"Using this design, we find that being admitted to an Ivy-Plus college increases students’ chances of
achieving upper-tail success on both monetary and non-monetary dimensions. Relative to those rejected
from the waitlist, applicants admitted from the waitlist are significantly more likely to reach the top 1% of the income distribution, attend an elite graduate school, and work at a prestigious firm. In contrast, we find a small and statistically insignificant impact of admission from the waitlist on mean earning ranks and the
probability of reaching the top quartile of the income distribution; the causal impacts of Ivy-Plus colleges are concentrated entirely in reaching the upper tail of the distribution, consistent with the predominance of students from such colleges in positions of leadership that motivated this study"


https://opportunityinsights.org/wp-content/uploads/2023/07/CollegeAdmissions_Paper.pdf

You can do ok with a degree from a state flagship, but if you want to be really successful, the school matters

The real world is laughing at this.

Work at a F200. 90+% of senior leadership from C-suite down to the MDs and SVPs and VPS did not go to Ivy schools. Many went to utter no name schools. You'd be shocked.

--Double Ivy grad.

THIS^^^^

Partner is a CEO, has been at 3 companies. At all 3 companies, only 1 person at each had an Ivy degree or a T25 degree. Majority went to no name or their state schools, so not even 25-50 ranked. So how did they get to their positions? By hard work, drive and determination. It's what you do with your knowledge and degree and the relationships you build over time in the workforce that enable you to be successful---it's not attending Harvard or Yale.

The example of CEOs and even VPs is pretty pointless. Most people, even most Ivy grads, are not CEOs. More useful is comparing salaries for the same major at various schools.

For example, salary at age 45 for economics major:
Harvard: $181k
Yale: $210k
Amherst: $180k
Ohio State: $79k
Penn State: $99k
UVA: $127k
W&M: $98k

Significant difference between (Ivy or elite SLAC) and (state flagship or good in-state school).

Unlike you, I went to an Ivy and also have a professional degree from another Ivy. I know where my classmates ended up.

These surveys are meaningless. Comparing Harvard to Ohio state is meaningless because the range of student capabilities is apples and oranges. But if you compare the top 5% of Ohio state econ grads to Harvard econ grads, then you get a very different set of numbers.

Some of the best and brightest kids in the country do go to Harvard and the other elite colleges. Which is not surprising. And they will do extremely well. And they will still have done extremely well had they gone to Ohio state.

It is apples to apples to compare everyone in the same major at different schools, Supposed Ivy Grad.

[Anonymous]

But the English major at Harvard earnings are 45k. In no universe does that make financial sense