Canceling $10k of student loan debt is stupid.

[Anonymous]

I think we need to go after the PPP abuses. Get a list of all individuals and corporations who grabbed them and publicize the list.

But it won't happen. Why? Because behind these people is a lot of money and power. These people control the media. That is why you don't hear about the PPP abuses.

You have to go to the alternative media sources to get an inkling that Senators and Congressmen all abused the PPP program (after voting in favor of it), or extremely wealthy people with billionaire FILs, such as Jared Kushner.

There was a lot of publicity about Ruth's Steak House, and a lot of public shaming. They returned the PPP money.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Ok, so I survived cancer and I don't see why other people can't do the same. Why is the government working on curing cancer for these lazy people.

Yes, that is a really dumb argument and...

+1 million. I think people need to look inside themselves and think about why they want people to suffer the same thing they found difficult.

There are two kinds of people: those who think I struggled so you should too, and those who think I don’t want others to struggle like I did.

You forgot the third kind: Those who just want free handouts and have others foot the bill.

Or the fourth kind: I recognize that some of us are lucky enough not to need loan forgiveness and can pay plenty of taxes, so I don't complain about benefits that help people who are less fortunate than I am.

+1 There's more of us thank you think.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Ok, so I survived cancer and I don't see why other people can't do the same. Why is the government working on curing cancer for these lazy people.

Yes, that is a really dumb argument and...

+1 million. I think people need to look inside themselves and think about why they want people to suffer the same thing they found difficult.

There are two kinds of people: those who think I struggled so you should too, and those who think I don’t want others to struggle like I did.

You forgot the third kind: Those who just want free handouts and have others foot the bill.

Or the fourth kind: I recognize that some of us are lucky enough not to need loan forgiveness and can pay plenty of taxes, so I don't complain about benefits that help people who are less fortunate than I am.

It's not luck, it's making good choices about what to study. We should not subsidize poor life choices - it will lead to even more poor life choices.

No. Most of the people who don't need loan forgiveness are children of wealthy parents. But people like you try to equate poverty and laziness and wealth to merit. They are not equivalent.

[Anonymous]

I paid off well north of $200k in student loans from college and law school. While I’m happy that people are getting debt relief, and I don’t want people to unnecessarily suffer, I am frustrated by the narrative that every person getting loans forgiven simply never had a shot to pay them off. Those people exist for sure - and I’m happy to give them help even if they maybe didn’t make the best decisions on school and major. I do think the system is predatory.

But let’s not pretend like there aren’t people getting loan forgiveness who simply deprioritized pay back because they didn’t care all that much. Because they would rather job hop, buy nice clothes, engage in super nice travel. They made a choice not to really work on loans and they just got a $10k windfall. On top of the freeze during COVID. Man, having 0 interest would have helped me out so much when I was paying back my loans.

That’s what frustrates me. I don’t want offers to suffer, but man, I would love some of that money back I sent to the government.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Ok, so I survived cancer and I don't see why other people can't do the same. Why is the government working on curing cancer for these lazy people.

Yes, that is a really dumb argument and...

+1 million. I think people need to look inside themselves and think about why they want people to suffer the same thing they found difficult.

There are two kinds of people: those who think I struggled so you should too, and those who think I don’t want others to struggle like I did.

You forgot the third kind: Those who just want free handouts and have others foot the bill.

Or the fourth kind: I recognize that some of us are lucky enough not to need loan forgiveness and can pay plenty of taxes, so I don't complain about benefits that help people who are less fortunate than I am.

It's not luck, it's making good choices about what to study. We should not subsidize poor life choices - it will lead to even more poor life choices.

Do you have some documentation showing that people with debt disproportionately received what you are calling useless degrees? Because I know plenty of teachers, govt employees, and other gainfully employed people with student debt. Plenty of people get over their head and take on too much debt relative to their expected salaries, but I’d chalk that up to a lack of financial literacy more than anything else.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I paid off well north of $200k in student loans from college and law school. While I’m happy that people are getting debt relief, and I don’t want people to unnecessarily suffer, I am frustrated by the narrative that every person getting loans forgiven simply never had a shot to pay them off. Those people exist for sure - and I’m happy to give them help even if they maybe didn’t make the best decisions on school and major. I do think the system is predatory.

But let’s not pretend like there aren’t people getting loan forgiveness who simply deprioritized pay back because they didn’t care all that much. Because they would rather job hop, buy nice clothes, engage in super nice travel. They made a choice not to really work on loans and they just got a $10k windfall. On top of the freeze during COVID. Man, having 0 interest would have helped me out so much when I was paying back my loans.

That’s what frustrates me. I don’t want offers to suffer, but man, I would love some of that money back I sent to the government.

The 1%er has spoken

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I think we need to go after the PPP abuses. Get a list of all individuals and corporations who grabbed them and publicize the list.

But it won't happen. Why? Because behind these people is a lot of money and power. These people control the media. That is why you don't hear about the PPP abuses.

You have to go to the alternative media sources to get an inkling that Senators and Congressmen all abused the PPP program (after voting in favor of it), or extremely wealthy people with billionaire FILs, such as Jared Kushner.

There was a lot of publicity about Ruth's Steak House, and a lot of public shaming. They returned the PPP money.

Absolutely this. These people are now getting WSJ, Bezos, and other media to go on the attack out of fear there won't be any bailout money left for their grift during the next recession.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I paid off well north of $200k in student loans from college and law school. While I’m happy that people are getting debt relief, and I don’t want people to unnecessarily suffer, I am frustrated by the narrative that every person getting loans forgiven simply never had a shot to pay them off. Those people exist for sure - and I’m happy to give them help even if they maybe didn’t make the best decisions on school and major. I do think the system is predatory.

But let’s not pretend like there aren’t people getting loan forgiveness who simply deprioritized pay back because they didn’t care all that much. Because they would rather job hop, buy nice clothes, engage in super nice travel. They made a choice not to really work on loans and they just got a $10k windfall. On top of the freeze during COVID. Man, having 0 interest would have helped me out so much when I was paying back my loans.

That’s what frustrates me. I don’t want offers to suffer, but man, I would love some of that money back I sent to the government.

You big law grinders are not only privileged but a very sad example of what to do with a privileged life. Please don't offer advice to student loan debtors.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Canceling any debt is stupid. You borrowed, you pay.

I agree, we should eliminate bankruptcy and bring back debtors prisons. Maybe airline executives would do a better job with that incentive. Or are you only talking about 18 year old kids being forced to make life altering decisions?

Any means any

The problem is that the current system requires poor people to pay back all their debt while wealthy people and corporations (who carry WAY more debt) are often able to escape debt via lawyers and other legal mechanisms designed to help them discharge debt for less than they owe.

Student debt is unique in that it can't be discharged in bankruptcy. It's also unsecured debt -- it's not like you can sell the underlying education to pay off your loans the way you can with a house. We need a policy solution to the problem of ballooning student debt because it impacts the economy very negatively. It keeps people from buying homes (or even moving out of their parents homes into rentals), it is impacting the birth rate, it limits the ability of people to open businesses or invest. We need a longterm solution to student debt, and that probably includes some amount of debt forgiveness for people who are already buried in debt, followed by rule changes to prevent people from ever getting this deep in debt to begin with.

-- Signed, someone who paid off 80k in student loans myself and does not oppose debt forgiveness for others because it's a smart policy decision and is not actually about personal fairness to me

+1 Well said.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I think we need to go after the PPP abuses. Get a list of all individuals and corporations who grabbed them and publicize the list.

But it won't happen. Why? Because behind these people is a lot of money and power. These people control the media. That is why you don't hear about the PPP abuses.

You have to go to the alternative media sources to get an inkling that Senators and Congressmen all abused the PPP program (after voting in favor of it), or extremely wealthy people with billionaire FILs, such as Jared Kushner.

There was a lot of publicity about Ruth's Steak House, and a lot of public shaming. They returned the PPP money.

Absolutely this. These people are now getting WSJ, Bezos, and other media to go on the attack out of fear there won't be any bailout money left for their grift during the next recession.

The corporations are freaking out because they'll be less likely to trick borrowers into refinancing into bad private loans now too. I must get at least one refinancing solicitation a week.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I paid off well north of $200k in student loans from college and law school. While I’m happy that people are getting debt relief, and I don’t want people to unnecessarily suffer, I am frustrated by the narrative that every person getting loans forgiven simply never had a shot to pay them off. Those people exist for sure - and I’m happy to give them help even if they maybe didn’t make the best decisions on school and major. I do think the system is predatory.

But let’s not pretend like there aren’t people getting loan forgiveness who simply deprioritized pay back because they didn’t care all that much. Because they would rather job hop, buy nice clothes, engage in super nice travel. They made a choice not to really work on loans and they just got a $10k windfall. On top of the freeze during COVID. Man, having 0 interest would have helped me out so much when I was paying back my loans.

That’s what frustrates me. I don’t want offers to suffer, but man, I would love some of that money back I sent to the government.

The 1%er has spoken

+1 Jared Kushner, who received $6 million from the govt in PPP loans during the pandemic to his various businesses is also against student loan forgiveness. Bailouts are only for the rich!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Ok, so I survived cancer and I don't see why other people can't do the same. Why is the government working on curing cancer for these lazy people.

Yes, that is a really dumb argument and...

+1 million. I think people need to look inside themselves and think about why they want people to suffer the same thing they found difficult.

There are two kinds of people: those who think I struggled so you should too, and those who think I don’t want others to struggle like I did.

You forgot the third kind: Those who just want free handouts and have others foot the bill.

Or the fourth kind: I recognize that some of us are lucky enough not to need loan forgiveness and can pay plenty of taxes, so I don't complain about benefits that help people who are less fortunate than I am.

It's not luck, it's making good choices about what to study. We should not subsidize poor life choices - it will lead to even more poor life choices.

Do you have some documentation showing that people with debt disproportionately received what you are calling useless degrees? Because I know plenty of teachers, govt employees, and other gainfully employed people with student debt. Plenty of people get over their head and take on too much debt relative to their expected salaries, but I’d chalk that up to a lack of financial literacy more than anything else.

+1 Or having a bad run due to a once in a century pandemic. The Government did a much bigger bailout of businesses during the pandemic. Not sure why people object to helping individuals for the same reason.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Ok, so I survived cancer and I don't see why other people can't do the same. Why is the government working on curing cancer for these lazy people.

Yes, that is a really dumb argument and...

+1 million. I think people need to look inside themselves and think about why they want people to suffer the same thing they found difficult.

Democrat thesaurus: Hard work/personal responsibility/smart choices/sacrifice = suffering

Republican Thesaurus: individual borrowing forgiveness = bailout, freeloading; tax cuts for billionaires and handouts to corporations = “incentivizing competitiveness”

Such a crock of bullshit.

+1 Democrats--as part of a once in a century pandemic support, will spend $300 bn to do partial student loan forgiveness for people with lower incomes who borrowed to improve their opportunities for employment
Republicans-as part of a once in a century pandemic support, did loan forgiveness for nearly $800 bn to "small businesses" which were mostly well-connected Republicans and rich owners like Reese Witherspoon and Tom Brady and Jared Kushner.

+1 Exactly. Those people had hundreds of thousands, often millions of loans forgiven EACH. And there were a ton of sham companies that were created to get loans and have loans forgiven. If you haven't been moaning about the unfairness of this program for years then you really don't have any rights to complain about the student loan forgiveness that 87% goes to LMC and MC borrowers.

+2 They've already documented that $80 bn of those benefits went to businesses that were fraudulent (so basically outright theft of taxpayer dollars). I really don't get why people don't get mad about this, but are all triggered when loans to poor students get their debt forgiven. It's like people accept that the rich get richer, but the poor should remain poor.

We can and should debate the merits of the PPP program. But, what happened yesterday was very different. Yesterday, the president transferred the debt of people who AGREED to repay it, to people who not only DID NOT agree to the debt, but who received none of the benefits of the debt. This is troubling policy and I suspect many purple states Democrats are going to get wiped out in November.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Ok, so I survived cancer and I don't see why other people can't do the same. Why is the government working on curing cancer for these lazy people.

Yes, that is a really dumb argument and...

+1 million. I think people need to look inside themselves and think about why they want people to suffer the same thing they found difficult.

Democrat thesaurus: Hard work/personal responsibility/smart choices/sacrifice = suffering

Republican Thesaurus: individual borrowing forgiveness = bailout, freeloading; tax cuts for billionaires and handouts to corporations = “incentivizing competitiveness”

Such a crock of bullshit.

+1 Democrats--as part of a once in a century pandemic support, will spend $300 bn to do partial student loan forgiveness for people with lower incomes who borrowed to improve their opportunities for employment
Republicans-as part of a once in a century pandemic support, did loan forgiveness for nearly $800 bn to "small businesses" which were mostly well-connected Republicans and rich owners like Reese Witherspoon and Tom Brady and Jared Kushner.

+1 Exactly. Those people had hundreds of thousands, often millions of loans forgiven EACH. And there were a ton of sham companies that were created to get loans and have loans forgiven. If you haven't been moaning about the unfairness of this program for years then you really don't have any rights to complain about the student loan forgiveness that 87% goes to LMC and MC borrowers.

+2 They've already documented that $80 bn of those benefits went to businesses that were fraudulent (so basically outright theft of taxpayer dollars). I really don't get why people don't get mad about this, but are all triggered when loans to poor students get their debt forgiven. It's like people accept that the rich get richer, but the poor should remain poor.

We can and should debate the merits of the PPP program. But, what happened yesterday was very different. Yesterday, the president transferred the debt of people who AGREED to repay it, to people who not only DID NOT agree to the debt, but who received none of the benefits of the debt. This is troubling policy and I suspect many purple states Democrats are going to get wiped out in November.

You're also ignoring that many of these debts on income based repayment would be forgiven after a certain period anyway. So while they did agree to pay the government originally agreed to forgive after a certain amount of years. That's always been a part of the process.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Ok, so I survived cancer and I don't see why other people can't do the same. Why is the government working on curing cancer for these lazy people.

Yes, that is a really dumb argument and...

+1 million. I think people need to look inside themselves and think about why they want people to suffer the same thing they found difficult.

Democrat thesaurus: Hard work/personal responsibility/smart choices/sacrifice = suffering

Republican Thesaurus: individual borrowing forgiveness = bailout, freeloading; tax cuts for billionaires and handouts to corporations = “incentivizing competitiveness”

Such a crock of bullshit.

+1 Democrats--as part of a once in a century pandemic support, will spend $300 bn to do partial student loan forgiveness for people with lower incomes who borrowed to improve their opportunities for employment
Republicans-as part of a once in a century pandemic support, did loan forgiveness for nearly $800 bn to "small businesses" which were mostly well-connected Republicans and rich owners like Reese Witherspoon and Tom Brady and Jared Kushner.

+1 Exactly. Those people had hundreds of thousands, often millions of loans forgiven EACH. And there were a ton of sham companies that were created to get loans and have loans forgiven. If you haven't been moaning about the unfairness of this program for years then you really don't have any rights to complain about the student loan forgiveness that 87% goes to LMC and MC borrowers.

+2 They've already documented that $80 bn of those benefits went to businesses that were fraudulent (so basically outright theft of taxpayer dollars). I really don't get why people don't get mad about this, but are all triggered when loans to poor students get their debt forgiven. It's like people accept that the rich get richer, but the poor should remain poor.

We can and should debate the merits of the PPP program. But, what happened yesterday was very different. Yesterday, the president transferred the debt of people who AGREED to repay it, to people who not only DID NOT agree to the debt, but who received none of the benefits of the debt. This is troubling policy and I suspect many purple states Democrats are going to get wiped out in November.

Really? Can you pull your credit report and it shows you now have someone else's debt? A pay stub showing your taxes went up?