Key bridge in Baltimore collapses after cargo ship crashes into it

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The scanner of construction crew/police was released earlier today and it is 90 seconds long. Construction crew in trucks went to either end to block the bridge. One says they were already leaving so they will go ahead and stay parked to block the road. The other is saying they will take the other end.

What pains me is that one person keeps asking: "are there still construction crew in the middle? Can you confirm whether people are still on the bridge? I need everyone off the bridge?" But he isn't sounding frantic or urgent and no one will answer those questions directly except to say, once I get to the end of the bridge to block it I will check. "

Unreal.

They had no idea the bridge was seconds/minutes from collapsing.

Some things in this world are unknowable.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Thanks for the update. Now I understand about the vehicles Wow kudos to police for getting there and stopping traffic. This could have been so much worse. It is horrible for the workers though because it seems to be recovery now. I don’t think anyone is going to feel good going over a suspension bridge and seeing a boat near. Of all the things I have worried about..this was not in the kit but is now for sure. I hope there is a mandate for bridges like this to have some of the safety measures the Sunshine bridge in Florida has after their collapse in 1980. Apparently the new bridge has something underwater that forces a boat away if it comes too close to
pilings. This should be retrofitted for all these large suspension bridges.

Construction started for this bridge in 1972 and completed in '77, before the Sunshine bridge collapse. New bridges are built to withstand greater boat impacts (but the Dali really is gigantic - I wonder if newer bridges would have withstood a direct hit like this).

The natural thing is to fixate on the failure of the bridge and there are certainly many lessons to be learned. It sounds like there could have been a few protective “dolphins” to protect the supports, but the angle of the ship rendered them useless.

The failure that I think we should fixate more on for the future is the ship. That cargo ship was enormous and might have weighed 100,000 metric tons. Or 100,000,000 kgs. It was traveling at 9 knots, or 4.6 m/s. The momentum of that ship was 460,000,000 newton/sec. The supports would have had to be prohibitively large to withstand an impact like that. 100,000 tons is the weight of an aircraft carrier. I have no idea what went wrong with the power on that ship, but I think it’s more important to make sure those ships have multiple redundant fail safes.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Thanks for the update. Now I understand about the vehicles Wow kudos to police for getting there and stopping traffic. This could have been so much worse. It is horrible for the workers though because it seems to be recovery now. I don’t think anyone is going to feel good going over a suspension bridge and seeing a boat near. Of all the things I have worried about..this was not in the kit but is now for sure. I hope there is a mandate for bridges like this to have some of the safety measures the Sunshine bridge in Florida has after their collapse in 1980. Apparently the new bridge has something underwater that forces a boat away if it comes too close to
pilings. This should be retrofitted for all these large suspension bridges.

Construction started for this bridge in 1972 and completed in '77, before the Sunshine bridge collapse. New bridges are built to withstand greater boat impacts (but the Dali really is gigantic - I wonder if newer bridges would have withstood a direct hit like this).

The natural thing is to fixate on the failure of the bridge and there are certainly many lessons to be learned. It sounds like there could have been a few protective “dolphins” to protect the supports, but the angle of the ship rendered them useless.

The failure that I think we should fixate more on for the future is the ship. That cargo ship was enormous and might have weighed 100,000 metric tons. Or 100,000,000 kgs. It was traveling at 9 knots, or 4.6 m/s. The momentum of that ship was 460,000,000 newton/sec. The supports would have had to be prohibitively large to withstand an impact like that. 100,000 tons is the weight of an aircraft carrier. I have no idea what went wrong with the power on that ship, but I think it’s more important to make sure those ships have multiple redundant fail safes.

+1m

[Anonymous]

These big boats go under the bay bridge too don’t they?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:These big boats go under the bay bridge too don’t they?

Yes

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Thanks for the update. Now I understand about the vehicles Wow kudos to police for getting there and stopping traffic. This could have been so much worse. It is horrible for the workers though because it seems to be recovery now. I don’t think anyone is going to feel good going over a suspension bridge and seeing a boat near. Of all the things I have worried about..this was not in the kit but is now for sure. I hope there is a mandate for bridges like this to have some of the safety measures the Sunshine bridge in Florida has after their collapse in 1980. Apparently the new bridge has something underwater that forces a boat away if it comes too close to
pilings. This should be retrofitted for all these large suspension bridges.

Construction started for this bridge in 1972 and completed in '77, before the Sunshine bridge collapse. New bridges are built to withstand greater boat impacts (but the Dali really is gigantic - I wonder if newer bridges would have withstood a direct hit like this).

The natural thing is to fixate on the failure of the bridge and there are certainly many lessons to be learned. It sounds like there could have been a few protective “dolphins” to protect the supports, but the angle of the ship rendered them useless.

The failure that I think we should fixate more on for the future is the ship. That cargo ship was enormous and might have weighed 100,000 metric tons. Or 100,000,000 kgs. It was traveling at 9 knots, or 4.6 m/s. The momentum of that ship was 460,000,000 newton/sec. The supports would have had to be prohibitively large to withstand an impact like that. 100,000 tons is the weight of an aircraft carrier. I have no idea what went wrong with the power on that ship, but I think it’s more important to make sure those ships have multiple redundant fail safes.

+1m

Or tug boats. One would think we would let ships, capable of downing entire bridges, operate without tugs in that area.

Would tug boats have been able to change the ship’s course with that much momentum?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Thanks for the update. Now I understand about the vehicles Wow kudos to police for getting there and stopping traffic. This could have been so much worse. It is horrible for the workers though because it seems to be recovery now. I don’t think anyone is going to feel good going over a suspension bridge and seeing a boat near. Of all the things I have worried about..this was not in the kit but is now for sure. I hope there is a mandate for bridges like this to have some of the safety measures the Sunshine bridge in Florida has after their collapse in 1980. Apparently the new bridge has something underwater that forces a boat away if it comes too close to
pilings. This should be retrofitted for all these large suspension bridges.

Construction started for this bridge in 1972 and completed in '77, before the Sunshine bridge collapse. New bridges are built to withstand greater boat impacts (but the Dali really is gigantic - I wonder if newer bridges would have withstood a direct hit like this).

The natural thing is to fixate on the failure of the bridge and there are certainly many lessons to be learned. It sounds like there could have been a few protective “dolphins” to protect the supports, but the angle of the ship rendered them useless.

The failure that I think we should fixate more on for the future is the ship. That cargo ship was enormous and might have weighed 100,000 metric tons. Or 100,000,000 kgs. It was traveling at 9 knots, or 4.6 m/s. The momentum of that ship was 460,000,000 newton/sec. The supports would have had to be prohibitively large to withstand an impact like that. 100,000 tons is the weight of an aircraft carrier. I have no idea what went wrong with the power on that ship, but I think it’s more important to make sure those ships have multiple redundant fail safes.

+1m

Or tug boats. One would think we would let ships, capable of downing entire bridges, operate without tugs in that area.

Would tug boats have been able to change the ship’s course with that much momentum?

Momentum is conserved in an ideal physics world and mostly conserved in the real world. It’s mass x velocity. Tugboats are tiny in mass but they have huge engines and propellers. Like souped up motorcycles compared to big vans with limited horsepower. If the container ship was going fast, then the tugs would have had less effect. But at slow speeds, the tugs can push the biggest of ships as a team.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Thanks for the update. Now I understand about the vehicles Wow kudos to police for getting there and stopping traffic. This could have been so much worse. It is horrible for the workers though because it seems to be recovery now. I don’t think anyone is going to feel good going over a suspension bridge and seeing a boat near. Of all the things I have worried about..this was not in the kit but is now for sure. I hope there is a mandate for bridges like this to have some of the safety measures the Sunshine bridge in Florida has after their collapse in 1980. Apparently the new bridge has something underwater that forces a boat away if it comes too close to
pilings. This should be retrofitted for all these large suspension bridges.

Construction started for this bridge in 1972 and completed in '77, before the Sunshine bridge collapse. New bridges are built to withstand greater boat impacts (but the Dali really is gigantic - I wonder if newer bridges would have withstood a direct hit like this).

The natural thing is to fixate on the failure of the bridge and there are certainly many lessons to be learned. It sounds like there could have been a few protective “dolphins” to protect the supports, but the angle of the ship rendered them useless.

The failure that I think we should fixate more on for the future is the ship. That cargo ship was enormous and might have weighed 100,000 metric tons. Or 100,000,000 kgs. It was traveling at 9 knots, or 4.6 m/s. The momentum of that ship was 460,000,000 newton/sec. The supports would have had to be prohibitively large to withstand an impact like that. 100,000 tons is the weight of an aircraft carrier. I have no idea what went wrong with the power on that ship, but I think it’s more important to make sure those ships have multiple redundant fail safes.

This!

[Anonymous]

How does police get there so quickly to stop traffic? They just happened to be near?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:How does police get there so quickly to stop traffic? They just happened to be near?

The ship radioed the harbor after the first power failure to let them know the ship might impact. There was a construction crew on the bridge working on potholes and the harbor control was able to get them to move trucks to either end to block traffic so traffic on the bridge, which was already light due to the hour, could be stopped. Police showed up after it happened.

Had this happened at 4pm, it would have been a very different story.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:How does police get there so quickly to stop traffic? They just happened to be near?

The crews working in the bridge blocked the traffic.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:The Baltimore mayor….. wow.

Good luck to his voters.

Sounds like a You thing.

Maybe you’d like to read some of the many accolades that he’s received for handling a tragic situation with grace.

https://www.huffpost.com/entry/baltimore-mayor-response-rebuilding-key-bridge-collapse_n_660336cfe4b033e4cc143933

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:How does police get there so quickly to stop traffic? They just happened to be near?

The ship radioed the harbor after the first power failure to let them know the ship might impact. There was a construction crew on the bridge working on potholes and the harbor control was able to get them to move trucks to either end to block traffic so traffic on the bridge, which was already light due to the hour, could be stopped. Police showed up after it happened.

Had this happened at 4pm, it would have been a very different story.

Are you sure? The news stories are saying police blocked traffic. And the audio recordings seem to be from police scanners.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:How does police get there so quickly to stop traffic? They just happened to be near?

The ship radioed the harbor after the first power failure to let them know the ship might impact. There was a construction crew on the bridge working on potholes and the harbor control was able to get them to move trucks to either end to block traffic so traffic on the bridge, which was already light due to the hour, could be stopped. Police showed up after it happened.

Had this happened at 4pm, it would have been a very different story.

Are you sure? The news stories are saying police blocked traffic. And the audio recordings seem to be from police scanners.

DP but you are correct. Not sure how the story about the construction crew stopping traffic got started. I don't believe they were even aware of what was going.

https://www.fox2detroit.com/news/baltimore-key-bridge-collapse-traffic-cars-on-bridg

Moments later, a police dispatcher put out a call asking officers to stop all traffic on Interstate 695, according to Maryland Transportation Authority first responder radio traffic obtained from the Broadcastify.com archive by the Associated Press.

A construction crew was working on the bridge at the time of the collapse. One officer who stopped traffic radioed that he was going to drive onto the bridge to alert the construction workers. But seconds later, a frantic officer said: "The whole bridge just fell down. Start, start whoever, everybody ... the whole bridge just collapsed."

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:How does police get there so quickly to stop traffic? They just happened to be near?

The crews working in the bridge blocked the traffic.

Nope.