We are NEVER going back until covid is 100% gone - MCPS has no leadership

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

If the logistics can be worked out, hybrid potentially reduces class size, reduces risk by having kids in buildings fewer days, and allows teachers to develop some level of comfort that promised PPE, sanitation, and enforcement of policies like masking will be followed.

I keep seeing everyone say that hybrid is too complicated with minimal payoff. I don't see schools going face to face full time any time soon. Why doesn't anyone listen to all of the private school kids who are going to school using some hybrid model and are happy with even a few days a week in person?

If I can work out how to get wings, I can potentially fly.

They need to try. Just try. Obviously, the first hurdle is transportation. However, the problem is that there is no way to assess whether than can be overcome without some proposal on the table. You can ask families whether they will need bus transportation, but if the question is asked in a vacuum, the answers won't be meaningful. Parents need to know how many days the kids would be going, what the start and finish times would be, etc. in order to give an answer. Then, if enough people say that they will drive their own kids, you can work from there to try to provide buses.

There is no need, and no reason as far as I can tell, to go to all of this trouble just for hybrid. If they're going to do it, they should do it for the real thing, i.e., a regular school day/week.

I guess you don't see the need for social distancing? That's the reason for hybrid.

But we don’t even know yet if hybrid is needed for social distancing, do we? The first step is to figure out how many families want to return in person, and how many will need transportation. The transportation needs are unclear right now given that many parents who do not normally drive their kids could if need be.

Besides all the logistical hurdles with hybrid, many families will need childcare on the days their kids aren’t in school. So a classroom cohort may be scattered the rest of the week. So all the additional mixing could negate whatever gains you get from reduced class sizes, which again may be small enough without having to resort to hybrid.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:
I'm in favor of full F2F now, but I just don't think the MCPS leadership has the leadership capacity to pull it off now/next year without interim steps. Their inaction is always excused away with "it's too hard because they're too big...so they shouldn't even try."

Agreed. In the BOE meeting a week ago, they said they will _start_ to look for funding to upgrade HVAC systems. It's amazing they are just thinking about this now. They've had months.

Meanwhile, the Elrich admin has tens of millions of federal grant money from the CARES act they need to spend by the end of this year, and haven't figured out what to do with it:
http://www.theseventhstate.com/?p=13978

JFC! I just can’t with the incompetence of this county. Unbelievable.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:
I'm in favor of full F2F now, but I just don't think the MCPS leadership has the leadership capacity to pull it off now/next year without interim steps. Their inaction is always excused away with "it's too hard because they're too big...so they shouldn't even try."

Agreed. In the BOE meeting a week ago, they said they will _start_ to look for funding to upgrade HVAC systems. It's amazing they are just thinking about this now. They've had months.

Meanwhile, the Elrich admin has tens of millions of federal grant money from the CARES act they need to spend by the end of this year, and haven't figured out what to do with it:
http://www.theseventhstate.com/?p=13978

JFC! I just can’t with the incompetence of this county. Unbelievable.

Its shocking isnt it? And he approved tens of millions in hazard pay assuming FEMA would reimburse the county; welp, he was wrong. So now we're in the hole even more, with tens of millions of other undisbursed aid intended for small businesses, renters, or hungry families.

This dude is so out of touch with reality. He's the epitome of a local politician fat cat who has never been held accountable once in his life. So guess what he's gonna try to do? Hike our property taxes, for sure.

This dude needs to GO

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

If the logistics can be worked out, hybrid potentially reduces class size, reduces risk by having kids in buildings fewer days, and allows teachers to develop some level of comfort that promised PPE, sanitation, and enforcement of policies like masking will be followed.

I keep seeing everyone say that hybrid is too complicated with minimal payoff. I don't see schools going face to face full time any time soon. Why doesn't anyone listen to all of the private school kids who are going to school using some hybrid model and are happy with even a few days a week in person?

If I can work out how to get wings, I can potentially fly.

They need to try. Just try. Obviously, the first hurdle is transportation. However, the problem is that there is no way to assess whether than can be overcome without some proposal on the table. You can ask families whether they will need bus transportation, but if the question is asked in a vacuum, the answers won't be meaningful. Parents need to know how many days the kids would be going, what the start and finish times would be, etc. in order to give an answer. Then, if enough people say that they will drive their own kids, you can work from there to try to provide buses.

There is no need, and no reason as far as I can tell, to go to all of this trouble just for hybrid. If they're going to do it, they should do it for the real thing, i.e., a regular school day/week.

I guess you don't see the need for social distancing? That's the reason for hybrid.

NP. No, there is no need for social distancing (in the sense of everybody 6 feet apart) in elementary school if you keep classes together as cohorts. Other countries have been doing it successfully without having outbreaks (individual cases yes, but no outbreaks).

Are those countries providing students with transportation that does not align with cohorts? That's where the cohort idea falls apart in my mind.

Yes, other countries have school buses, including France and the UK, whose schools are open and buses are operating.

If busses are really the concern, it would be good to know that. Transportation is a tractable problem, but it would be good to know if that's where people think we should devote our resources. Elementary schools, in particular, have a relatively small catchment area, and a fairly large percentage of kids in a walkable distance.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:
I'm in favor of full F2F now, but I just don't think the MCPS leadership has the leadership capacity to pull it off now/next year without interim steps. Their inaction is always excused away with "it's too hard because they're too big...so they shouldn't even try."

Agreed. In the BOE meeting a week ago, they said they will _start_ to look for funding to upgrade HVAC systems. It's amazing they are just thinking about this now. They've had months.

Meanwhile, the Elrich admin has tens of millions of federal grant money from the CARES act they need to spend by the end of this year, and haven't figured out what to do with it:
http://www.theseventhstate.com/?p=13978

JFC! I just can’t with the incompetence of this county. Unbelievable.

Its shocking isnt it? And he approved tens of millions in hazard pay assuming FEMA would reimburse the county; welp, he was wrong. So now we're in the hole even more, with tens of millions of other undisbursed aid intended for small businesses, renters, or hungry families.

This dude is so out of touch with reality. He's the epitome of a local politician fat cat who has never been held accountable once in his life. So guess what he's gonna try to do? Hike our property taxes, for sure.

This dude needs to GO

You need to stop watching Fox news or lay off the crack. None of this is true.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:
I'm in favor of full F2F now, but I just don't think the MCPS leadership has the leadership capacity to pull it off now/next year without interim steps. Their inaction is always excused away with "it's too hard because they're too big...so they shouldn't even try."

Agreed. In the BOE meeting a week ago, they said they will _start_ to look for funding to upgrade HVAC systems. It's amazing they are just thinking about this now. They've had months.

Meanwhile, the Elrich admin has tens of millions of federal grant money from the CARES act they need to spend by the end of this year, and haven't figured out what to do with it:
http://www.theseventhstate.com/?p=13978

Meanwhile, this is what FCPS is reporting on that topic:

"- Ensured all schools and offices have sufficient air ventilation
- Purchased initial allocation of MERV 13 filters (based on availability) and upgrading school HVAC systems where possible
- Purchased HEPA filters and air purifiers for use in select areas
- Continued review of the use of UV-C lighting in classrooms and ventilation systems and its best application
- Third-party health and safety verification for all building"

And FCPS is about the same size as MCPS.. but MCPS is unable to pull this off.

It's upper management. I bet all the building maintenance guys are sitting around itching for some projects like this, because they really do care and they'd love to get their buildings upgraded.. but they can't do anything without the supplies to do so.

Utter failure by MCPS. I'm voting against both BOE incumbents.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

If the logistics can be worked out, hybrid potentially reduces class size, reduces risk by having kids in buildings fewer days, and allows teachers to develop some level of comfort that promised PPE, sanitation, and enforcement of policies like masking will be followed.

I keep seeing everyone say that hybrid is too complicated with minimal payoff. I don't see schools going face to face full time any time soon. Why doesn't anyone listen to all of the private school kids who are going to school using some hybrid model and are happy with even a few days a week in person?

If I can work out how to get wings, I can potentially fly.

They need to try. Just try. Obviously, the first hurdle is transportation. However, the problem is that there is no way to assess whether than can be overcome without some proposal on the table. You can ask families whether they will need bus transportation, but if the question is asked in a vacuum, the answers won't be meaningful. Parents need to know how many days the kids would be going, what the start and finish times would be, etc. in order to give an answer. Then, if enough people say that they will drive their own kids, you can work from there to try to provide buses.

There is no need, and no reason as far as I can tell, to go to all of this trouble just for hybrid. If they're going to do it, they should do it for the real thing, i.e., a regular school day/week.

I guess you don't see the need for social distancing? That's the reason for hybrid.

NP. No, there is no need for social distancing (in the sense of everybody 6 feet apart) in elementary school if you keep classes together as cohorts. Other countries have been doing it successfully without having outbreaks (individual cases yes, but no outbreaks).

Are those countries providing students with transportation that does not align with cohorts? That's where the cohort idea falls apart in my mind.

Yes, other countries have school buses, including France and the UK, whose schools are open and buses are operating.

If busses are really the concern, it would be good to know that. Transportation is a tractable problem, but it would be good to know if that's where people think we should devote our resources. Elementary schools, in particular, have a relatively small catchment area, and a fairly large percentage of kids in a walkable distance.

Ummm I cant speak for France but the UK does not have school buses. We have to make our own way to school. Students ride the public bus with everyone else if they need to take a bus to school.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

If the logistics can be worked out, hybrid potentially reduces class size, reduces risk by having kids in buildings fewer days, and allows teachers to develop some level of comfort that promised PPE, sanitation, and enforcement of policies like masking will be followed.

I keep seeing everyone say that hybrid is too complicated with minimal payoff. I don't see schools going face to face full time any time soon. Why doesn't anyone listen to all of the private school kids who are going to school using some hybrid model and are happy with even a few days a week in person?

If I can work out how to get wings, I can potentially fly.

They need to try. Just try. Obviously, the first hurdle is transportation. However, the problem is that there is no way to assess whether than can be overcome without some proposal on the table. You can ask families whether they will need bus transportation, but if the question is asked in a vacuum, the answers won't be meaningful. Parents need to know how many days the kids would be going, what the start and finish times would be, etc. in order to give an answer. Then, if enough people say that they will drive their own kids, you can work from there to try to provide buses.

There is no need, and no reason as far as I can tell, to go to all of this trouble just for hybrid. If they're going to do it, they should do it for the real thing, i.e., a regular school day/week.

I guess you don't see the need for social distancing? That's the reason for hybrid.

NP. No, there is no need for social distancing (in the sense of everybody 6 feet apart) in elementary school if you keep classes together as cohorts. Other countries have been doing it successfully without having outbreaks (individual cases yes, but no outbreaks).

Are those countries providing students with transportation that does not align with cohorts? That's where the cohort idea falls apart in my mind.

Yes, other countries have school buses, including France and the UK, whose schools are open and buses are operating.

If busses are really the concern, it would be good to know that. Transportation is a tractable problem, but it would be good to know if that's where people think we should devote our resources. Elementary schools, in particular, have a relatively small catchment area, and a fairly large percentage of kids in a walkable distance.

Canada buses its students. The buses do not align with classroom cohorts, but things have been pretty good here. We have cases in individual schools, but very few outbreaks originating in schools.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

If the logistics can be worked out, hybrid potentially reduces class size, reduces risk by having kids in buildings fewer days, and allows teachers to develop some level of comfort that promised PPE, sanitation, and enforcement of policies like masking will be followed.

I keep seeing everyone say that hybrid is too complicated with minimal payoff. I don't see schools going face to face full time any time soon. Why doesn't anyone listen to all of the private school kids who are going to school using some hybrid model and are happy with even a few days a week in person?

If I can work out how to get wings, I can potentially fly.

They need to try. Just try. Obviously, the first hurdle is transportation. However, the problem is that there is no way to assess whether than can be overcome without some proposal on the table. You can ask families whether they will need bus transportation, but if the question is asked in a vacuum, the answers won't be meaningful. Parents need to know how many days the kids would be going, what the start and finish times would be, etc. in order to give an answer. Then, if enough people say that they will drive their own kids, you can work from there to try to provide buses.

There is no need, and no reason as far as I can tell, to go to all of this trouble just for hybrid. If they're going to do it, they should do it for the real thing, i.e., a regular school day/week.

I guess you don't see the need for social distancing? That's the reason for hybrid.

But we don’t even know yet if hybrid is needed for social distancing, do we? The first step is to figure out how many families want to return in person, and how many will need transportation. The transportation needs are unclear right now given that many parents who do not normally drive their kids could if need be.

Besides all the logistical hurdles with hybrid, many families will need childcare on the days their kids aren’t in school. So a classroom cohort may be scattered the rest of the week. So all the additional mixing could negate whatever gains you get from reduced class sizes, which again may be small enough without having to resort to hybrid.

This is a good point. While I acknowledge the transportation issue is challenging (though, I certainly think it is possible to sufficiently mitigate risk there), beyond that I really don't see a big impediment to getting elementary and k/pre-k kids back full time (with a virtual option for those that aren't comfortable with that).

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

If the logistics can be worked out, hybrid potentially reduces class size, reduces risk by having kids in buildings fewer days, and allows teachers to develop some level of comfort that promised PPE, sanitation, and enforcement of policies like masking will be followed.

I keep seeing everyone say that hybrid is too complicated with minimal payoff. I don't see schools going face to face full time any time soon. Why doesn't anyone listen to all of the private school kids who are going to school using some hybrid model and are happy with even a few days a week in person?

If I can work out how to get wings, I can potentially fly.

They need to try. Just try. Obviously, the first hurdle is transportation. However, the problem is that there is no way to assess whether than can be overcome without some proposal on the table. You can ask families whether they will need bus transportation, but if the question is asked in a vacuum, the answers won't be meaningful. Parents need to know how many days the kids would be going, what the start and finish times would be, etc. in order to give an answer. Then, if enough people say that they will drive their own kids, you can work from there to try to provide buses.

There is no need, and no reason as far as I can tell, to go to all of this trouble just for hybrid. If they're going to do it, they should do it for the real thing, i.e., a regular school day/week.

I guess you don't see the need for social distancing? That's the reason for hybrid.

NP. No, there is no need for social distancing (in the sense of everybody 6 feet apart) in elementary school if you keep classes together as cohorts. Other countries have been doing it successfully without having outbreaks (individual cases yes, but no outbreaks).

Are those countries providing students with transportation that does not align with cohorts? That's where the cohort idea falls apart in my mind.

Yes, other countries have school buses, including France and the UK, whose schools are open and buses are operating.

If busses are really the concern, it would be good to know that. Transportation is a tractable problem, but it would be good to know if that's where people think we should devote our resources. Elementary schools, in particular, have a relatively small catchment area, and a fairly large percentage of kids in a walkable distance.

Canada buses its students. The buses do not align with classroom cohorts, but things have been pretty good here. We have cases in individual schools, but very few outbreaks originating in schools.

Canada also has school-based before and aftercare that do not align with classroom cohorts. Again, the schools are doing pretty well. I should also mention that I am in Ontario and there is no 6-feet distancing in the classroom (maybe 3-feet distancing at most?). We cannot do the 6-feet distancing and have full time F2F school, We don't have the resources.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:


And FCPS is about the same size as MCPS[b.. but MCPS is unable to pull this off.

It's upper management. I bet all the building maintenance guys are sitting around itching for some projects like this, because they really do care and they'd love to get their buildings upgraded.. but they can't do anything without the supplies to do so.

Utter failure by MCPS. I'm voting against both BOE incumbents.

What planet are you on? FCPS has approximately 45,000 students and MCPS has approximately 160,000 students. Not even close!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

If the logistics can be worked out, hybrid potentially reduces class size, reduces risk by having kids in buildings fewer days, and allows teachers to develop some level of comfort that promised PPE, sanitation, and enforcement of policies like masking will be followed.

I keep seeing everyone say that hybrid is too complicated with minimal payoff. I don't see schools going face to face full time any time soon. Why doesn't anyone listen to all of the private school kids who are going to school using some hybrid model and are happy with even a few days a week in person?

If I can work out how to get wings, I can potentially fly.

They need to try. Just try. Obviously, the first hurdle is transportation. However, the problem is that there is no way to assess whether than can be overcome without some proposal on the table. You can ask families whether they will need bus transportation, but if the question is asked in a vacuum, the answers won't be meaningful. Parents need to know how many days the kids would be going, what the start and finish times would be, etc. in order to give an answer. Then, if enough people say that they will drive their own kids, you can work from there to try to provide buses.

There is no need, and no reason as far as I can tell, to go to all of this trouble just for hybrid. If they're going to do it, they should do it for the real thing, i.e., a regular school day/week.

I guess you don't see the need for social distancing? That's the reason for hybrid.

NP. No, there is no need for social distancing (in the sense of everybody 6 feet apart) in elementary school if you keep classes together as cohorts. Other countries have been doing it successfully without having outbreaks (individual cases yes, but no outbreaks).

Are those countries providing students with transportation that does not align with cohorts? That's where the cohort idea falls apart in my mind.

Yes, other countries have school buses, including France and the UK, whose schools are open and buses are operating.

If busses are really the concern, it would be good to know that. Transportation is a tractable problem, but it would be good to know if that's where people think we should devote our resources. Elementary schools, in particular, have a relatively small catchment area, and a fairly large percentage of kids in a walkable distance.

Canada buses its students. The buses do not align with classroom cohorts, but things have been pretty good here. We have cases in individual schools, but very few outbreaks originating in schools.

Canada also has school-based before and aftercare that do not align with classroom cohorts. Again, the schools are doing pretty well. I should also mention that I am in Ontario and there is no 6-feet distancing in the classroom (maybe 3-feet distancing at most?). We cannot do the 6-feet distancing and have full time F2F school, We don't have the resources.

That's great to hear. Are kids required to wear masks?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:
I'm in favor of full F2F now, but I just don't think the MCPS leadership has the leadership capacity to pull it off now/next year without interim steps. Their inaction is always excused away with "it's too hard because they're too big...so they shouldn't even try."

Agreed. In the BOE meeting a week ago, they said they will _start_ to look for funding to upgrade HVAC systems. It's amazing they are just thinking about this now. They've had months.

Meanwhile, the Elrich admin has tens of millions of federal grant money from the CARES act they need to spend by the end of this year, and haven't figured out what to do with it:
http://www.theseventhstate.com/?p=13978

Meanwhile, this is what FCPS is reporting on that topic:

"- Ensured all schools and offices have sufficient air ventilation
- Purchased initial allocation of MERV 13 filters (based on availability) and upgrading school HVAC systems where possible
- Purchased HEPA filters and air purifiers for use in select areas
- Continued review of the use of UV-C lighting in classrooms and ventilation systems and its best application
- Third-party health and safety verification for all building"

And FCPS is about the same size as MCPS.. but MCPS is unable to pull this off.

It's upper management. I bet all the building maintenance guys are sitting around itching for some projects like this, because they really do care and they'd love to get their buildings upgraded.. but they can't do anything without the supplies to do so.

Utter failure by MCPS. I'm voting against both BOE incumbents.

Plus, FCPS procurement has been busy as well. Apparently they're sitting on a mountain of PPE now (100,000 re-usable cloth masks for students, 200,000 re-usable masks for teachers that have already been distributed to schools, 1.5 million disposable masks, tens of thousands of child and adult face shields, etc.) They're even outfitting classrooms with teacher plexiglass and added six months of custodial hour overtime for enhanced cleaning.

[Anonymous]

Cloth masks aren't PPE. PPE protects me when I wear it. Whereas with cloth masks, my cloth mask protects you.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:


And FCPS is about the same size as MCPS[b.. but MCPS is unable to pull this off.

It's upper management. I bet all the building maintenance guys are sitting around itching for some projects like this, because they really do care and they'd love to get their buildings upgraded.. but they can't do anything without the supplies to do so.

Utter failure by MCPS. I'm voting against both BOE incumbents.

What planet are you on? FCPS has approximately 45,000 students and MCPS has approximately 160,000 students. Not even close!

DP. Fairfax County Public Schools, not Frederick County (MD) Public Schools.

Note that the PP is assuming that the challengers can't be worse than the incumbents. I think that's a mistaken assumption.