FAFSA - is middle-class waste time applying?

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I would like to hear more from UMC people about how College is a special consumer good where family income shouldn’t matter and the net price should be essentially zero when literally everything else in the world is allocated by family wealth, including “free” public school (you have to be able to afford to live in the district).

You thought it was fair when you bought your way into everything else in your lifestyle, well now welcome to the big leagues.

I don't think UMC families are saying that they should be given aid. Just lamenting that they cannot afford it, even if some insist that they can. Many of us have 529 accounts, but those funds didn't grow that much, even putting in more than $2500 per year per account, and we have multiple kids. It's enough for in state, but not 80k per year. When we started saving college was a bit cheaper. Several years ago, when my DC was in MS, we looked at an expensive private. It was $60K/year. Now it's closer to $85k per year. Saving $240k is doable. Saving closer to $350K is much harder.

If you still have 20 working years, I could see how you think you can afford to pull back on funding retirement, and save later, but if you are 55+, you don't have that luxury.

Obviously, saving only $2500/year/kid is not going to produce enough for $80K/year schools in 18 years (which will cost way more than 80K then).

Majority of kids have to pick schools they can afford, most cannot afford 80K/year, or they could but smartly realize that saved money would be nice to have for grad school.

Read bolded.. we saved way more than $2500 per year per account. We have two accounts per child. Still not enough to cover $80K per year per child given that the 529 didn't grow that much.

So why write it that way? How much did you save per year? Why did the 529 not grow that much? If you dont have it all in the growth market, it may not. But that is on you, as there are 529s that allow you to do that. You can pick one (may not be your state's) that allows you to select the MF to invest in. American Funds in VA is an excellent example. My kid's funds earned 8-9% annual on average during the aggressive years. We didn't pull back until age 15/16 to less aggressive.

DP. Even with 8-9% growth, saving 20K year since 2007 only gets you to ~600K after you factor in expense ratios etc. Not enough to cover 2 kids at 80-90K schools (and that is not even Harvard but say Amherst/Colorado College.) And this simple calculation doesn't actually account for the real fluctuations (e.g. crash in 2008/2009 and again in 2020. Yes, there were rebounds, but plugging in actual numbers and accounting for management fees only gets you to the number I quoted above. Colllege costs are ridiculous right now. And before you jump in with state options, DC doesn't have a state university (obv) and DCTAG helps but not as much.

If you chose to live in DC and have kids, you know there is no state option. So you have 18 years to consider moving to MD/VA if you want that option. It's all about choices, but this wasn't a surprise to you.

Yes college costs have increased drastically. But there are still plenty of excellent options for attending with no or minimal debt. Search merit at "2nd tier" schools or lower. My own 1500/3.98UW/9 AP kid got $42K/year at a T50 so instead of 80k+/year it would only be $40K. Could have gotten even more if they'd searched schools in the 60-120 range (didn't Because we don't need the merit, but point is they could find plenty of good options if needed).
So if you take off the blinders of believing you need to attend a T25 school, you can find something affordable for you.

For the life of me I cannot understand why the residential areas of DC aren't just returned to Maryland. DC is basically a Maryland city. They should be Maryland residents.

Today, because DC wants to be a state, to tilt Congress and electoral College Democratic, and so the mayor can be a Governor.

The real question is why it didnt retrocede 100-200 years ago

Today, many of the tax paying DC residents want it to have status as a U.S. state to have representation in Congress.

^^^ fixed that for you

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I would like to hear more from UMC people about how College is a special consumer good where family income shouldn’t matter and the net price should be essentially zero when literally everything else in the world is allocated by family wealth, including “free” public school (you have to be able to afford to live in the district).

You thought it was fair when you bought your way into everything else in your lifestyle, well now welcome to the big leagues.

I don't think UMC families are saying that they should be given aid. Just lamenting that they cannot afford it, even if some insist that they can. Many of us have 529 accounts, but those funds didn't grow that much, even putting in more than $2500 per year per account, and we have multiple kids. It's enough for in state, but not 80k per year. When we started saving college was a bit cheaper. Several years ago, when my DC was in MS, we looked at an expensive private. It was $60K/year. Now it's closer to $85k per year. Saving $240k is doable. Saving closer to $350K is much harder.

If you still have 20 working years, I could see how you think you can afford to pull back on funding retirement, and save later, but if you are 55+, you don't have that luxury.

Obviously, saving only $2500/year/kid is not going to produce enough for $80K/year schools in 18 years (which will cost way more than 80K then).

Majority of kids have to pick schools they can afford, most cannot afford 80K/year, or they could but smartly realize that saved money would be nice to have for grad school.

Read bolded.. we saved way more than $2500 per year per account. We have two accounts per child. Still not enough to cover $80K per year per child given that the 529 didn't grow that much.

So why write it that way? How much did you save per year? Why did the 529 not grow that much? If you dont have it all in the growth market, it may not. But that is on you, as there are 529s that allow you to do that. You can pick one (may not be your state's) that allows you to select the MF to invest in. American Funds in VA is an excellent example. My kid's funds earned 8-9% annual on average during the aggressive years. We didn't pull back until age 15/16 to less aggressive.

DP. Even with 8-9% growth, saving 20K year since 2007 only gets you to ~600K after you factor in expense ratios etc. Not enough to cover 2 kids at 80-90K schools (and that is not even Harvard but say Amherst/Colorado College.) And this simple calculation doesn't actually account for the real fluctuations (e.g. crash in 2008/2009 and again in 2020. Yes, there were rebounds, but plugging in actual numbers and accounting for management fees only gets you to the number I quoted above. Colllege costs are ridiculous right now. And before you jump in with state options, DC doesn't have a state university (obv) and DCTAG helps but not as much.

If you chose to live in DC and have kids, you know there is no state option. So you have 18 years to consider moving to MD/VA if you want that option. It's all about choices, but this wasn't a surprise to you.

Yes college costs have increased drastically. But there are still plenty of excellent options for attending with no or minimal debt. Search merit at "2nd tier" schools or lower. My own 1500/3.98UW/9 AP kid got $42K/year at a T50 so instead of 80k+/year it would only be $40K. Could have gotten even more if they'd searched schools in the 60-120 range (didn't Because we don't need the merit, but point is they could find plenty of good options if needed).
So if you take off the blinders of believing you need to attend a T25 school, you can find something affordable for you.

For the life of me I cannot understand why the residential areas of DC aren't just returned to Maryland. DC is basically a Maryland city. They should be Maryland residents.

Today, because DC wants to be a state, to tilt Congress and electoral College Democratic, and so the mayor can be a Governor.

The real question is why it didnt retrocede 100-200 years ago

DC should not be a state.

They are a smallish medium sized city that should really belong to Maryland.

Wyoming, Alaska, Vermont, and North Dakota have similar populations to DC. Are they smallish medium sized cities?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I would like to hear more from UMC people about how College is a special consumer good where family income shouldn’t matter and the net price should be essentially zero when literally everything else in the world is allocated by family wealth, including “free” public school (you have to be able to afford to live in the district).

You thought it was fair when you bought your way into everything else in your lifestyle, well now welcome to the big leagues.

I don't think UMC families are saying that they should be given aid. Just lamenting that they cannot afford it, even if some insist that they can. Many of us have 529 accounts, but those funds didn't grow that much, even putting in more than $2500 per year per account, and we have multiple kids. It's enough for in state, but not 80k per year. When we started saving college was a bit cheaper. Several years ago, when my DC was in MS, we looked at an expensive private. It was $60K/year. Now it's closer to $85k per year. Saving $240k is doable. Saving closer to $350K is much harder.

If you still have 20 working years, I could see how you think you can afford to pull back on funding retirement, and save later, but if you are 55+, you don't have that luxury.

Obviously, saving only $2500/year/kid is not going to produce enough for $80K/year schools in 18 years (which will cost way more than 80K then).

Majority of kids have to pick schools they can afford, most cannot afford 80K/year, or they could but smartly realize that saved money would be nice to have for grad school.

Read bolded.. we saved way more than $2500 per year per account. We have two accounts per child. Still not enough to cover $80K per year per child given that the 529 didn't grow that much.

So why write it that way? How much did you save per year? Why did the 529 not grow that much? If you dont have it all in the growth market, it may not. But that is on you, as there are 529s that allow you to do that. You can pick one (may not be your state's) that allows you to select the MF to invest in. American Funds in VA is an excellent example. My kid's funds earned 8-9% annual on average during the aggressive years. We didn't pull back until age 15/16 to less aggressive.

DP. Even with 8-9% growth, saving 20K year since 2007 only gets you to ~600K after you factor in expense ratios etc. Not enough to cover 2 kids at 80-90K schools (and that is not even Harvard but say Amherst/Colorado College.) And this simple calculation doesn't actually account for the real fluctuations (e.g. crash in 2008/2009 and again in 2020. Yes, there were rebounds, but plugging in actual numbers and accounting for management fees only gets you to the number I quoted above. Colllege costs are ridiculous right now. And before you jump in with state options, DC doesn't have a state university (obv) and DCTAG helps but not as much.

If you chose to live in DC and have kids, you know there is no state option. So you have 18 years to consider moving to MD/VA if you want that option. It's all about choices, but this wasn't a surprise to you.

Yes college costs have increased drastically. But there are still plenty of excellent options for attending with no or minimal debt. Search merit at "2nd tier" schools or lower. My own 1500/3.98UW/9 AP kid got $42K/year at a T50 so instead of 80k+/year it would only be $40K. Could have gotten even more if they'd searched schools in the 60-120 range (didn't Because we don't need the merit, but point is they could find plenty of good options if needed).
So if you take off the blinders of believing you need to attend a T25 school, you can find something affordable for you.

For the life of me I cannot understand why the residential areas of DC aren't just returned to Maryland. DC is basically a Maryland city. They should be Maryland residents.

Today, because DC wants to be a state, to tilt Congress and electoral College Democratic, and so the mayor can be a Governor.

The real question is why it didnt retrocede 100-200 years ago

DC should not be a state.

They are a smallish medium sized city that should really belong to Maryland.

Wyoming, Alaska, Vermont, and North Dakota have similar populations to DC. Are they smallish medium sized cities?

No but they also aren’t the seat of the Federal government. DC residents already have vast influence on national policy. Can literally walk around and have a greater chance of having a conversation with a senator or representative—than their own constituents have back home.

[Anonymous]

OP, I can relate but you had to know, you weren’t going to get much sympathy. But thats okay. Generally, there are solutions to every problem even of your own doing. I will be the first to admit we weren’t the best in terms of financial literacy, and not save as much as we could have for college with the benefit of hindsight. But dwelling on that does nothing for you so let’s get down to some answers and facts.

1. Always fill out the FAFSA. It costs you nothing to do so.

2. Whatever schools you all are interested in, just google the “name” of the school and “merit aid.” You will get direct links to the referenced school’s scholarships and merit aid page where you can get very specific information on the types of aid available and the stats (grades, SAT scores) needed to be eligible.

For instance, my son is a rising senior in public school. He is in the IB program, has a 3.8 unweighted gpa and 4.27 weighted gpa with a 1310 SAT (will take it a couple more times). He is also a track athlete and is getting recruited by some schools.

One division 1 private school that costs approximately $60k is interested in him and offers 31k in academic merit scholarships for incoming students with his stats. And if he hits certain times for track he can get up to another $22k. A few LAC have already informed him he could get $22k and $36k respectively for his grades alone. There are also other schools where he could get a full ride for academics alone not based on any financial need. But those are competitive but you have to be in it to win it.

Here are some schools that cost upwards of 70-80k but offer Merit aid to cut it in half:

Dickinson (PA)
Ursinus (PA)
Washington College (MD)
Lynchburg (VA)

Here are some that costs 50-60k but offer Merit to cut in half:

Stevenson (MD)
Mount St Marys (MD)

Here are some that offer full ride scholarships, they are HBCUs but you are not prevented from applying if you aren’t black

North Carolina A&T
Delaware State
Coppin State

And lastly there are vast number of private scholarships that could make up the difference if you get merit aid from those schools to begin with.

You have a pension, benefits and a TSP. You can take out Parent Plus Loans, you can pay it back from TSP or other means you may have or you can work 10 more years after they finish and get the loans forgiven via public service student loan forgiveness program, just make sure they are consolidated into the proper repayment plan to count.