Would surveillance testing get us back full-time? (APS)

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:It should be a goal for fall probably but there’s 3 months left this school year. They’re already planning for next year . At this point, riding out this school year is the best we can do. Nothing massive can change between now and June.

If they are planning for next year, what are they thinking?

Exactly.. I've heard nothing but silence regarding planning for the fall. The SB can't walk and chew gum at the same time.

+1. APS isn't planning for the fall. They're just trying to get through reopening this month.

From what I can tell, most actual planning seems to happen at the school level anyways. Our principal has told us that her plan is to open normally in the fall, so nothing needs to be done now.

APS will worry about fall reopening in August, then delay the start of school because they aren't prepared. #theAPSway

I assume they will have four options.

Normal school.

Normal school with mask wearing.

Current hybrid/concurrent approach.

Distance Learning

That’s it. There won’t be a 3ft model or ventilation changes or air scrubbers b/c they takes lots of money for equipment which they may not even need in the Fall. There won’t be Google Jamboards or ceiling mounted camera or such that could help concurrent work smoother. It’s this or normal, with masks maybe.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:It should be a goal for fall probably but there’s 3 months left this school year. They’re already planning for next year . At this point, riding out this school year is the best we can do. Nothing massive can change between now and June.

If they are planning for next year, what are they thinking?

Exactly.. I've heard nothing but silence regarding planning for the fall. The SB can't walk and chew gum at the same time.

+1. APS isn't planning for the fall. They're just trying to get through reopening this month.

From what I can tell, most actual planning seems to happen at the school level anyways. Our principal has told us that her plan is to open normally in the fall, so nothing needs to be done now.

APS will worry about fall reopening in August, then delay the start of school because they aren't prepared. #theAPSway

Yup.. We need to put pressure now for them to figure this out.

Great - so you are advocating re: ventilation issues, outdoor lunch, and surveillance testing?

I'm advocating for whatever is needed for full-time, in-person learning. I'm personally comfortable with going back full-time now, with masks and proper hygiene. But that's just me and everyone has their own level of risk tolerance.

[Anonymous]

I don't think surveillance testing would get us back full-time and I don't even think it is a good idea. I have a whole bunch of reasons for this.
1. I am not aware of any studies showing that surveillance testing has reduced spread.
2. Despite the hysteria, the vast majority of COVID spread comes from symptomatic and pre-symptomatic cases. There is very little evidence that truly asymptomatic (as opposed to presymptomatic) spread is happening.
3. The PCR tests are incredibly sensitive and do not distinguish between live and dead virus. Someone can continue to test positive for months after an infection- this is why the CDC specifically recommends against requiring a test to allow a ill person to resume activities. 'Surveillance' testing is likely to pick up on these dead cases-- this can plunge a class into quarantine, exclude kids from school, who have no biological way of spreading virus.
4. This would not satisfy those who don't want us to return. It will never be safe enough to justify leaving the couch, having to rehire the dog walker, and working in person 5 days a week.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:It should be a goal for fall probably but there’s 3 months left this school year. They’re already planning for next year . At this point, riding out this school year is the best we can do. Nothing massive can change between now and June.

If they are planning for next year, what are they thinking?

Exactly.. I've heard nothing but silence regarding planning for the fall. The SB can't walk and chew gum at the same time.

+1. APS isn't planning for the fall. They're just trying to get through reopening this month.

From what I can tell, most actual planning seems to happen at the school level anyways. Our principal has told us that her plan is to open normally in the fall, so nothing needs to be done now.

APS will worry about fall reopening in August, then delay the start of school because they aren't prepared. #theAPSway

Yup.. We need to put pressure now for them to figure this out.

Great - so you are advocating re: ventilation issues, outdoor lunch, and surveillance testing?

I'm advocating for whatever is needed for full-time, in-person learning. I'm personally comfortable with going back full-time now, with masks and proper hygiene. But that's just me and everyone has their own level of risk tolerance.

Surface transmission isn't the focus anymore - airborne transmission is.

If you want full-time, in-person you should advocate for the things that will actually make that possible.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I don't think surveillance testing would get us back full-time and I don't even think it is a good idea. I have a whole bunch of reasons for this.
1. I am not aware of any studies showing that surveillance testing has reduced spread.
2. Despite the hysteria, the vast majority of COVID spread comes from symptomatic and pre-symptomatic cases. There is very little evidence that truly asymptomatic (as opposed to presymptomatic) spread is happening.
3. The PCR tests are incredibly sensitive and do not distinguish between live and dead virus. Someone can continue to test positive for months after an infection- this is why the CDC specifically recommends against requiring a test to allow a ill person to resume activities. 'Surveillance' testing is likely to pick up on these dead cases-- this can plunge a class into quarantine, exclude kids from school, who have no biological way of spreading virus.
4. This would not satisfy those who don't want us to return. It will never be safe enough to justify leaving the couch, having to rehire the dog walker, and working in person 5 days a week.

This is a TIRED straw man argument. No one is advocating for DL or hybrid b/c they want to stay on the couch.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:It should be a goal for fall probably but there’s 3 months left this school year. They’re already planning for next year . At this point, riding out this school year is the best we can do. Nothing massive can change between now and June.

If they are planning for next year, what are they thinking?

Exactly.. I've heard nothing but silence regarding planning for the fall. The SB can't walk and chew gum at the same time.

+1. APS isn't planning for the fall. They're just trying to get through reopening this month.

From what I can tell, most actual planning seems to happen at the school level anyways. Our principal has told us that her plan is to open normally in the fall, so nothing needs to be done now.

APS will worry about fall reopening in August, then delay the start of school because they aren't prepared. #theAPSway

Yup.. We need to put pressure now for them to figure this out.

Great - so you are advocating re: ventilation issues, outdoor lunch, and surveillance testing?

I'm advocating for whatever is needed for full-time, in-person learning. I'm personally comfortable with going back full-time now, with masks and proper hygiene. But that's just me and everyone has their own level of risk tolerance.

Surface transmission isn't the focus anymore - airborne transmission is.

If you want full-time, in-person you should advocate for the things that will actually make that possible.

Yeah I was curious what proper hygiene means. They should wash their hands before touching communal items but id every one is masked it should be non issue.

Now the fact most masks are at best 60% effective, if you have an infected student in class so it can spread.

The assumption is people will not be testing nor carrying if their kids catch COVID. That’s the only way to return without vaccinated kids. There won’t be any quarantining, testing, or tracing — otherwise 5 day school will be a bust.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I don't think surveillance testing would get us back full-time and I don't even think it is a good idea. I have a whole bunch of reasons for this.
1. I am not aware of any studies showing that surveillance testing has reduced spread.
2. Despite the hysteria, the vast majority of COVID spread comes from symptomatic and pre-symptomatic cases. There is very little evidence that truly asymptomatic (as opposed to presymptomatic) spread is happening.
3. The PCR tests are incredibly sensitive and do not distinguish between live and dead virus. Someone can continue to test positive for months after an infection- this is why the CDC specifically recommends against requiring a test to allow a ill person to resume activities. 'Surveillance' testing is likely to pick up on these dead cases-- this can plunge a class into quarantine, exclude kids from school, who have no biological way of spreading virus.
4. This would not satisfy those who don't want us to return. It will never be safe enough to justify leaving the couch, having to rehire the dog walker, and working in person 5 days a week.

This is a TIRED straw man argument. No one is advocating for DL or hybrid b/c they want to stay on the couch.

Honestly- I disagree. In the Summer it was all about how we needed a vaccine. Teachers have been vaccinated, yet they are still super resistant to returning. There is more going on here, then just fear of the virus.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I don't think surveillance testing would get us back full-time and I don't even think it is a good idea. I have a whole bunch of reasons for this.
1. I am not aware of any studies showing that surveillance testing has reduced spread.
2. Despite the hysteria, the vast majority of COVID spread comes from symptomatic and pre-symptomatic cases. There is very little evidence that truly asymptomatic (as opposed to presymptomatic) spread is happening.
3. The PCR tests are incredibly sensitive and do not distinguish between live and dead virus. Someone can continue to test positive for months after an infection- this is why the CDC specifically recommends against requiring a test to allow a ill person to resume activities. 'Surveillance' testing is likely to pick up on these dead cases-- this can plunge a class into quarantine, exclude kids from school, who have no biological way of spreading virus.
4. This would not satisfy those who don't want us to return. It will never be safe enough to justify leaving the couch, having to rehire the dog walker, and working in person 5 days a week.

This is a TIRED straw man argument. No one is advocating for DL or hybrid b/c they want to stay on the couch.

Honestly- I disagree. In the Summer it was all about how we needed a vaccine. Teachers have been vaccinated, yet they are still super resistant to returning. There is more going on here, then just fear of the virus.

It's simply because it's been all too easy for the past year. No teaching from March - June, then asynchronous Mondays followed by reduced hours with lots of days off, all remote. If they were back hybrid in the fall, this wouldn't be such a big deal, but it's gone on for so long it's hard to turn the corner.

[Anonymous]

Whether teachers are resistant or not, they are returning, in most cases 4 days a week in person. Their personal feelings don’t affect your kid. If they don’t want to return they aren’t getting paid and are either quitting or taking unpaid leave. So yes, your argument doesn’t hold weight. Give it up. You told teachers over and over that if they didn’t want to return they should quit or take leave and they are! And now you’re mad that all these unemployed but eminently qualified educators aren’t materializing like you thought. Hint: it’s because they don’t exist.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I don't think surveillance testing would get us back full-time and I don't even think it is a good idea. I have a whole bunch of reasons for this.
1. I am not aware of any studies showing that surveillance testing has reduced spread.
2. Despite the hysteria, the vast majority of COVID spread comes from symptomatic and pre-symptomatic cases. There is very little evidence that truly asymptomatic (as opposed to presymptomatic) spread is happening.
3. The PCR tests are incredibly sensitive and do not distinguish between live and dead virus. Someone can continue to test positive for months after an infection- this is why the CDC specifically recommends against requiring a test to allow a ill person to resume activities. 'Surveillance' testing is likely to pick up on these dead cases-- this can plunge a class into quarantine, exclude kids from school, who have no biological way of spreading virus.
4. This would not satisfy those who don't want us to return. It will never be safe enough to justify leaving the couch, having to rehire the dog walker, and working in person 5 days a week.

This is a TIRED straw man argument. No one is advocating for DL or hybrid b/c they want to stay on the couch.

Honestly- I disagree. In the Summer it was all about how we needed a vaccine. Teachers have been vaccinated, yet they are still super resistant to returning. There is more going on here, then just fear of the virus.

Not true.

[Anonymous]

Why is any of this necessary once all adults have access to the vaccine? Teachers have been vaccinated now but most parents haven’t, so I understand it’s important to keep kids healthy so they don’t get sick and bring it home to their families. But if everyone 16+ has access to a vaccine by May, that gives several months for every adult who wants one to get one. Covid is much less dangerous than the flu for kids. Even though more kids have died from Covid, it’s a tiny percentage of all the kids who have caught it, and many kids have no symptoms at all. We don’t do surveillance testing for the flu or strep throat, no masks to closing classes for 14 days for anything else, do we really have to keep every kid from contracting Covid at all costs??

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I don't think surveillance testing would get us back full-time and I don't even think it is a good idea. I have a whole bunch of reasons for this.
1. I am not aware of any studies showing that surveillance testing has reduced spread.
2. Despite the hysteria, the vast majority of COVID spread comes from symptomatic and pre-symptomatic cases. There is very little evidence that truly asymptomatic (as opposed to presymptomatic) spread is happening.
3. The PCR tests are incredibly sensitive and do not distinguish between live and dead virus. Someone can continue to test positive for months after an infection- this is why the CDC specifically recommends against requiring a test to allow a ill person to resume activities. 'Surveillance' testing is likely to pick up on these dead cases-- this can plunge a class into quarantine, exclude kids from school, who have no biological way of spreading virus.
4. This would not satisfy those who don't want us to return. It will never be safe enough to justify leaving the couch, having to rehire the dog walker, and working in person 5 days a week.

This is a TIRED straw man argument. No one is advocating for DL or hybrid b/c they want to stay on the couch.

Honestly- I disagree. In the Summer it was all about how we needed a vaccine. Teachers have been vaccinated, yet they are still super resistant to returning. There is more going on here, then just fear of the virus.

Not true.

Teachers were resistant to returning due to lack of trust that the plans would keep them safe and because they weren't vaccinated -NOT LAZINESS. I guarantee that once teachers are vaccinated and given how draining concurrent teaching is, most teachers will WANT to be in person next year as much as possible and hope for a low number of students doing DL.

[Anonymous]

Please remember to include safety measures that will protect kids with health conditions who would get seriously sick if they caught COVID. That seems to be lost in conversations about how all adults who want a vaccine will have one by the fall. Kids won't have vaccines by the fall. What about their health?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I don't think surveillance testing would get us back full-time and I don't even think it is a good idea. I have a whole bunch of reasons for this.
1. I am not aware of any studies showing that surveillance testing has reduced spread.
2. Despite the hysteria, the vast majority of COVID spread comes from symptomatic and pre-symptomatic cases. There is very little evidence that truly asymptomatic (as opposed to presymptomatic) spread is happening.
3. The PCR tests are incredibly sensitive and do not distinguish between live and dead virus. Someone can continue to test positive for months after an infection- this is why the CDC specifically recommends against requiring a test to allow a ill person to resume activities. 'Surveillance' testing is likely to pick up on these dead cases-- this can plunge a class into quarantine, exclude kids from school, who have no biological way of spreading virus.
4. This would not satisfy those who don't want us to return. It will never be safe enough to justify leaving the couch, having to rehire the dog walker, and working in person 5 days a week.

This is a TIRED straw man argument. No one is advocating for DL or hybrid b/c they want to stay on the couch.

Honestly- I disagree. In the Summer it was all about how we needed a vaccine. Teachers have been vaccinated, yet they are still super resistant to returning. There is more going on here, then just fear of the virus.

When you say you want a vaccine, they meant, everyone in the classroom vaccinated, and everyone in their family. Not sure why you thought it just meant for themselves and not their loved ones or students?

I would feel awful as a teacher if I had a cluster of kids get sick, and be forever second guessing my hygiene protocols. And you know some parents whose kid ends up in the hospital is going to blame the teacher for not protecting them.

[Anonymous]

I think surveillance testing is the answer. They would need to spend the summer developing policy and procedures.

How would they handle siblings?
Would they required a PCR test to return to school?
How would they handle Jr high and HS where the groups of kids mix more.

Do they know who are siblings, cousins, living in the same house?