His Father Paid $400,000 to Get Him Into Georgetown. Now He’s Suing the School.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Oh FFS.

He knew he was admitted fraud.

His defense is: you should have stopped me from doing illegal things earlier

Having to transfer isn’t a life sentence. And it will only follow him because he committed a crime and then filed a lawsuit and went public.

And 3.18 isn’t really “good grades”.

All of this.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Oh FFS.

He knew he was admitted fraud.

His defense is: you should have stopped me from doing illegal things earlier

Having to transfer isn’t a life sentence. And it will only follow him because he committed a crime and then filed a lawsuit and went public.

And 3.18 isn’t really “good grades”.

3.18 is fine. We can't all be in the top half of the class.

He signed his name on an application that included tennis.

[Anonymous]

I thought the article said he was told the tennis coach was going to write a recommendation for him? That's different than if he was told the coach was going to pretend he's a recruit. If the student met the coach a couple time and the coach wrote a recommendation it would be using a connections, but not illegal. If that's all that was disclosed to the student, he shouldn't be published. Redoing three years of undergrad is brutal.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I thought the article said he was told the tennis coach was going to write a recommendation for him? That's different than if he was told the coach was going to pretend he's a recruit. If the student met the coach a couple time and the coach wrote a recommendation it would be using a connections, but not illegal. If that's all that was disclosed to the student, he shouldn't be published. Redoing three years of undergrad is brutal.

punished

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:His defense is that it's the university's fault because it should have known that he was lying on his application? That's ridiculous. And this isn't a life sentence--he's not going to prison, he's being kicked out of school. Which he deserves. He should get the credits for the classes he took, but otherwise, I'm not sympathetic. If he has a hard time getting admitted into another school because he's a liar--well, maybe he shouldn't have lied. People talk about how poor people need to learn to take responsibility for their choices, well, so do rich people, right?

Agreed. The kid is suing because he knows he's not going to be able to transfer to a Georgetown caliber school (with a 3.1 GPA), and he's making a Hail Mary lawsuit pass.

+1 to PP. if this student were a freshman and not a junior with just a year of undergrad left, it might be less likely that he would sue, I think. But he's got three years in, and wants that Georgetown name on the degree. I'm not sure what that will gain for him, if he wins, because the most basic Googke search will turn up the fraud allegation with his name attached--for the rest of his life.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I thought the article said he was told the tennis coach was going to write a recommendation for him? That's different than if he was told the coach was going to pretend he's a recruit. If the student met the coach a couple time and the coach wrote a recommendation it would be using a connections, but not illegal. If that's all that was disclosed to the student, he shouldn't be published. Redoing three years of undergrad is brutal.

punished

Seems ridiculous. Did he read his own application before submitting? And did he know the tennis coach well enough for that to be plausible?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:His defense is that it's the university's fault because it should have known that he was lying on his application? That's ridiculous. And this isn't a life sentence--he's not going to prison, he's being kicked out of school. Which he deserves. He should get the credits for the classes he took, but otherwise, I'm not sympathetic. If he has a hard time getting admitted into another school because he's a liar--well, maybe he shouldn't have lied. People talk about how poor people need to learn to take responsibility for their choices, well, so do rich people, right?

Agreed. The kid is suing because he knows he's not going to be able to transfer to a Georgetown caliber school (with a 3.1 GPA), and he's making a Hail Mary lawsuit pass.

+1 to PP. if this student were a freshman and not a junior with just a year of undergrad left, it might be less likely that he would sue, I think. But he's got three years in, and wants that Georgetown name on the degree. I'm not sure what that will gain for him, if he wins, because the most basic Googke search will turn up the fraud allegation with his name attached--for the rest of his life.

+! he should just quietly go to Mason and get on with his life. If he isn't careful his name will become a verb.

[Anonymous]

This is what happens when the system doesn't treat everyone fairly and is not transparent. When people perceive that others are being held to a different standard and information is not readily available at a granular level to let parents decide whether or not a child really has a good chance to get in, parents get desperate and do crazy things. I come from a country with rampant corruption and the reason this country is so corrupt is because the elites have set up a system that encourages cheating and fraudulent activity. The people in the system just react to incentives.

The real culprits here are neither the parents nor the kids. It is the colleges. They participate in this system where information that really matters is hard to obtain and hidden in "aggregated useless statistics" and then they make the admission process a mystery and aren't really transparent about what goes on in the admission meetings.
Parents and kids are just trying to survive in this system.

Its like blaming the woman for prostituting herself, when she is trying to feed herself by selling her body because the market is setup that way.

[Anonymous]

Some wealthy person can start a private university to finish out all of these expelled kids.

BTW, a friend’s son was expelled for disciplinary reasons at the end of his junior year. Another university took 2 years of credits. So he only lost one year’s credit and tuition. Six years later, he’s doing fine.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:This is what happens when the system doesn't treat everyone fairly and is not transparent. When people perceive that others are being held to a different standard and information is not readily available at a granular level to let parents decide whether or not a child really has a good chance to get in, parents get desperate and do crazy things. I come from a country with rampant corruption and the reason this country is so corrupt is because the elites have set up a system that encourages cheating and fraudulent activity. The people in the system just react to incentives.

The real culprits here are neither the parents nor the kids. It is the colleges. They participate in this system where information that really matters is hard to obtain and hidden in "aggregated useless statistics" and then they make the admission process a mystery and aren't really transparent about what goes on in the admission meetings.
Parents and kids are just trying to survive in this system.

Its like blaming the woman for prostituting herself, when she is trying to feed herself by selling her body because the market is setup that way.

I take issue with your comparison of a woman who prostitutes herself because she needs the money and a parent paying $400k to bribe their kid into a school he wouldn't have been accepted to. One is a victim of poverty/economic circumstance while the other is a privileged person who can't accept that he can't have everything he wants in life.

[Anonymous]

I'm with Georgetown here. I also hope Georgetown and other universities find a way to rescind or revoke the diplomas of those who graduated before the scandal broke. It doesn't matter if they successfully completed their classes or not; their admission was still fraudulent. Students are legally responsible for the accuracy of their applications and cannot disclaim knowledge of the fraudulent schemes.

[Anonymous]

"is not transparent."

The system is very transparent. The parent knew 100% that the son HAD NO CHANCE of getting in without paying $400k.

Or do you think they pay $400k to everyone who works for them?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I'm with Georgetown here. I also hope Georgetown and other universities find a way to rescind or revoke the diplomas of those who graduated before the scandal broke. It doesn't matter if they successfully completed their classes or not; their admission was still fraudulent. Students are legally responsible for the accuracy of their applications and cannot disclaim knowledge of the fraudulent schemes.

I don’t get this logic at all. Isn’t the actual work more important than how one got in? I made up an overseas high school when I never attended high school (grew up in a cult that didn’t believe in education beyond middle school). I graduated with a 3.9 GPA while fully supporting myself. I realize this is different than the privileged circumstances we’re discussing here, but I still think the kids should get credit for their work. I think it’s reasonable for colleges to expel them on a case by case basis but not to strip them of degrees or credits they’ve earned.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I'm with Georgetown here. I also hope Georgetown and other universities find a way to rescind or revoke the diplomas of those who graduated before the scandal broke. It doesn't matter if they successfully completed their classes or not; their admission was still fraudulent. Students are legally responsible for the accuracy of their applications and cannot disclaim knowledge of the fraudulent schemes.

I don’t get this logic at all. Isn’t the actual work more important than how one got in? I made up an overseas high school when I never attended high school (grew up in a cult that didn’t believe in education beyond middle school). I graduated with a 3.9 GPA while fully supporting myself. I realize this is different than the privileged circumstances we’re discussing here, but I still think the kids should get credit for their work. I think it’s reasonable for colleges to expel them on a case by case basis but not to strip them of degrees or credits they’ve earned.

So what is the point of punishing those who cheated to get in? As long as they get away with it for four years, they're scot-free, but if they get caught before they get their diplomas, then the hammer comes down? That makes no sense either.

These kids could not have gotten in on their own merit, and they took spaces away from other kids. Maybe kids like you were, or like I was, or like a bunch of other kids whose parents did not or do not have the resources to cheat, lie, and steal a place from someone else. Lots of kids who deserve to get in -- and who also could have done the work -- got cheated out of a potential slot by all these students whose rich parents were willing to pay a fortune to guarantee admittance. I think there is a ton wrong with our gameable admissions systems, but I'm absolutely opposed to rewarding cheaters just because their cheats weren't discovered until they'd already gotten the piece of paper.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I'm with Georgetown here. I also hope Georgetown and other universities find a way to rescind or revoke the diplomas of those who graduated before the scandal broke. It doesn't matter if they successfully completed their classes or not; their admission was still fraudulent. Students are legally responsible for the accuracy of their applications and cannot disclaim knowledge of the fraudulent schemes.

I don’t get this logic at all. Isn’t the actual work more important than how one got in? I made up an overseas high school when I never attended high school (grew up in a cult that didn’t believe in education beyond middle school). I graduated with a 3.9 GPA while fully supporting myself. I realize this is different than the privileged circumstances we’re discussing here, but I still think the kids should get credit for their work. I think it’s reasonable for colleges to expel them on a case by case basis but not to strip them of degrees or credits they’ve earned.

Wait, what?! New thread pls on your life story. Sounds fascinating.