MAP-R & Reading Group Assignment

[Anonymous]

Holy helicopter parent Op. your kid is old enough to advocate for herself. If she’s bored in her current reading group, she should ask to be put in the higher one.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:When my dd was younger, she was stuck on a reading level for a while and I asked the teacher about it. She said she was good at oral reading and discussing the book, but her reading level was constrained by her writing-- the measure for reading level was based on a written response, and her responses weren't meeting the expectation in various ways (I think it was about not writing enough details, etc though I don't recall exactly). So it could be that the skills tested in MAP-R aren't the same as the skills for reading-level assignment. It is a good question to ask at the November conferences, along with what skills you can work on to move her up.

Regardless of your opinion about your daughters writing ability OP, this is the most likely reason for the current reading level placement. All of my kids were advanced readers and several actual reading levels above their assigned reading group because their analysis skills as demonstrated by their written responses didn't match their reading level. Sure, they were bored by their reading group books, but they had plenty of other reading books at higher levels they read at the same time. It's not going to hurt your daughter to be in the assigned reading group.

[Anonymous]

This is really not something I would worry about. If she bored then read a book at home. Might as well get used to it because in middle school everyone is "advanced" and things get really boring in English class.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:
why a tutor over summer?

This started when DD's reading teacher was sick for a month last Spring. She was given a Chromebook and didn't have a reading class during that time. Even when the teacher wasn't absent it was common for her to only have a reading group once a week since she was in the highest group.

At that point, we felt a tutor was in her best interests since the school was dropping the ball. It ended up being 8 one hour sessions spread out over the summer. It probably wouldn't have been necessary if the school brought in a substitute when the teacher was absent or ensured every group met twice a week.

It is unfortunate when things like this happen. Our kids deserve better.
Disagree. OP's DC was fine before OP had a tutor for her and is fine now. It's unfortunate when life happens, but it doesn't harm kids.

I know the nerve of some parents! They really expect the school to get a substitute. That brat should be grateful the school gives them a Chromebook which is a reasonable surrogate for a teacher anyway.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:When my dd was younger, she was stuck on a reading level for a while and I asked the teacher about it. She said she was good at oral reading and discussing the book, but her reading level was constrained by her writing-- the measure for reading level was based on a written response, and her responses weren't meeting the expectation in various ways (I think it was about not writing enough details, etc though I don't recall exactly). So it could be that the skills tested in MAP-R aren't the same as the skills for reading-level assignment. It is a good question to ask at the November conferences, along with what skills you can work on to move her up.

Regardless of your opinion about your daughters writing ability OP, this is the most likely reason for the current reading level placement. All of my kids were advanced readers and several actual reading levels above their assigned reading group because their analysis skills as demonstrated by their written responses didn't match their reading level. Sure, they were bored by their reading group books, but they had plenty of other reading books at higher levels they read at the same time. It's not going to hurt your daughter to be in the assigned reading group.

The most likely reason is the child's previous teacher had them at the previous level last year and this is the next step in the progression. I remember when my DS was in first grade the teacher assured me they were at the right level even when I was skeptical. A few months later the resource teacher does an honest assessment and "oops your child is seven levels higher than we previously thought..."

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:This is really not something I would worry about. If she bored then read a book at home. Might as well get used to it because in middle school everyone is "advanced" and things get really boring in English class.

Exactly.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I think this OP illustrates a lot of the challenges MCPS is dealing with:

1. The danger of a little bit of knowledge - Mclass and MAP are not measuring exactly the same skill set, and Mclass is arguably a more nuanced tool than MAP for determining reading group.

2. Parents overly invested in student ranking

3. Parent using private tutors to push a pretty normal kid ahead, and then complaining that they weren't able to buy their way into the desired ranking

4. Using private tutors and then complaining that MCPS isn't willing to teach beyond the curriculum just because parents moved their child more quickly by paying for that curriculum to be delivered on an expedited basis

You must be a teacher or administrator at my kid's school. At my kid's ES you were a crazy helicopter parent if your child was more advanced than the curriculum. A troublemaker if you wanted them to get harder work. Really just getting in the way of the real job, closing the achievement gap.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:When my dd was younger, she was stuck on a reading level for a while and I asked the teacher about it. She said she was good at oral reading and discussing the book, but her reading level was constrained by her writing-- the measure for reading level was based on a written response, and her responses weren't meeting the expectation in various ways (I think it was about not writing enough details, etc though I don't recall exactly). So it could be that the skills tested in MAP-R aren't the same as the skills for reading-level assignment. It is a good question to ask at the November conferences, along with what skills you can work on to move her up.

Regardless of your opinion about your daughters writing ability OP, this is the most likely reason for the current reading level placement. All of my kids were advanced readers and several actual reading levels above their assigned reading group because their analysis skills as demonstrated by their written responses didn't match their reading level. Sure, they were bored by their reading group books, but they had plenty of other reading books at higher levels they read at the same time. It's not going to hurt your daughter to be in the assigned reading group.

The most likely reason is the child's previous teacher had them at the previous level last year and this is the next step in the progression. I remember when my DS was in first grade the teacher assured me they were at the right level even when I was skeptical. A few months later the resource teacher does an honest assessment and "oops your child is seven levels higher than we previously thought..."

+1. This has also been our experience.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Holy helicopter parent Op. your kid is old enough to advocate for herself. If she’s bored in her current reading group, she should ask to be put in the higher one.

You sound nuts, OP. If you have a strong reader, yes, the 3rd grade readings even for the top group are really awful. Who cares? Life isn't always perfect. FWIW, DD had a much higher MAP than your child and just read a lot of books on her own. She was in the highest reading group which I believe was an S or T but I never really even knew the level of the group at the time because it doesn't really matter. Just have her read what she wants at home and if you feel inclined discuss the books with her. The things people have time to worry about!!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Holy helicopter parent Op. your kid is old enough to advocate for herself. If she’s bored in her current reading group, she should ask to be put in the higher one.

You sound nuts, OP. If you have a strong reader, yes, the 3rd grade readings even for the top group are really awful. Who cares? Life isn't always perfect. FWIW, DD had a much higher MAP than your child and just read a lot of books on her own. She was in the highest reading group which I believe was an S or T but I never really even knew the level of the group at the time because it doesn't really matter. Just have her read what she wants at home and if you feel inclined discuss the books with her. The things people have time to worry about!!

I know! So what if your kid isn’t being challenged and got lost in the school’s bureaucracy. They’ll eventually learn to read on their own if they’re smart. The school has almost no obligation to challenge them let alone teach them. You should be grateful they’re reading over grade level and beyond that you should expect nothing.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I think this OP illustrates a lot of the challenges MCPS is dealing with:

1. The danger of a little bit of knowledge - Mclass and MAP are not measuring exactly the same skill set, and Mclass is arguably a more nuanced tool than MAP for determining reading group.

2. Parents overly invested in student ranking


3. Parent using private tutors to push a pretty normal kid ahead, and then complaining that they weren't able to buy their way into the desired ranking

4. Using private tutors and then complaining that MCPS isn't willing to teach beyond the curriculum just because parents moved their child more quickly by paying for that curriculum to be delivered on an expedited basis

You must be a teacher or administrator at my kid's school. At my kid's ES you were a crazy helicopter parent if your child was more advanced than the curriculum. A troublemaker if you wanted them to get harder work. Really just getting in the way of the real job, closing the achievement gap.

I thought 90% of the parents here sent their kids to Dr Li?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:When my dd was younger, she was stuck on a reading level for a while and I asked the teacher about it. She said she was good at oral reading and discussing the book, but her reading level was constrained by her writing-- the measure for reading level was based on a written response, and her responses weren't meeting the expectation in various ways (I think it was about not writing enough details, etc though I don't recall exactly). So it could be that the skills tested in MAP-R aren't the same as the skills for reading-level assignment. It is a good question to ask at the November conferences, along with what skills you can work on to move her up.

Regardless of your opinion about your daughters writing ability OP, this is the most likely reason for the current reading level placement. All of my kids were advanced readers and several actual reading levels above their assigned reading group because their analysis skills as demonstrated by their written responses didn't match their reading level. Sure, they were bored by their reading group books, but they had plenty of other reading books at higher levels they read at the same time. It's not going to hurt your daughter to be in the assigned reading group.

The most likely reason is the child's previous teacher had them at the previous level last year and this is the next step in the progression. I remember when my DS was in first grade the teacher assured me they were at the right level even when I was skeptical. A few months later the resource teacher does an honest assessment and "oops your child is seven levels higher than we previously thought..."

+1. This has also been our experience.

It was the same for us too. Teachers have limited time to assess kids. It’s not especially thorough or exact but they’re doing their best under less than perfect circumstances. Your instincts are probably right since you know your own kid. Get all the facts and talk through your concerns.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Did your DD tell you that she is not challenged and bored, or are you inferring that? The difference between P (38) and R (40) aren't huge, she might be bored and unchallenged in the R group too.

She was given an 80-page chapter book the first day their group met and was asked to read the first few chapters. She took the initiative to finish that day and complained to me that it was too easy and boring. She has been reading chapter books for almost a year in S-T range. Also, we'd hired a reading tutor over the summer who a resource teacher at a nearby school. She assessed her at S. Mostly trying to determine the best way to broach this with the teacher in a thoughtful and collaborative manner.

Reading quickly and saying it is easy does not necessarily mean she grasped all of the details and nuances (and many kids will find books boring even if they are the right level). Ask her questions like, "What is it about the characters that you like or don't like?";" "If you could come up with a different title for the book, what would it be?"; "Pretend you are the author and write an alternative ending." If her answers to these questions are nuanced and detailed, then have a conversation with the teacher about it. I'd suggest doing it at the scheduled November conferences since they are only about a month away and by that time, the teacher will have more time to observe your child. If you'd like, you could send the teacher a note a couple of weeks in advance of the conference letting her know you want to have that conversation at the conference-- that way, she may take particular notice during reading groups and/or re-read her reading assessment in advance so that she is prepared for the conversation.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Did your DD tell you that she is not challenged and bored, or are you inferring that? The difference between P (38) and R (40) aren't huge, she might be bored and unchallenged in the R group too.

She was given an 80-page chapter book the first day their group met and was asked to read the first few chapters. She took the initiative to finish that day and complained to me that it was too easy and boring. She has been reading chapter books for almost a year in S-T range. Also, we'd hired a reading tutor over the summer who a resource teacher at a nearby school. She assessed her at S. Mostly trying to determine the best way to broach this with the teacher in a thoughtful and collaborative manner.

Reading quickly and saying it is easy does not necessarily mean she grasped all of the details and nuances (and many kids will find books boring even if they are the right level). Ask her questions like, "What is it about the characters that you like or don't like?";" "If you could come up with a different title for the book, what would it be?"; "Pretend you are the author and write an alternative ending." If her answers to these questions are nuanced and detailed, then have a conversation with the teacher about it. I'd suggest doing it at the scheduled November conferences since they are only about a month away and by that time, the teacher will have more time to observe your child. If you'd like, you could send the teacher a note a couple of weeks in advance of the conference letting her know you want to have that conversation at the conference-- that way, she may take particular notice during reading groups and/or re-read her reading assessment in advance so that she is prepared for the conversation.

The OPs pint was their child’s map-r score made it clear their comprehension was far higher than the group assignment per the county’s own chart. Seems some parents fail to grasp basic details too.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Did your DD tell you that she is not challenged and bored, or are you inferring that? The difference between P (38) and R (40) aren't huge, she might be bored and unchallenged in the R group too.

She was given an 80-page chapter book the first day their group met and was asked to read the first few chapters. She took the initiative to finish that day and complained to me that it was too easy and boring. She has been reading chapter books for almost a year in S-T range. Also, we'd hired a reading tutor over the summer who a resource teacher at a nearby school. She assessed her at S. Mostly trying to determine the best way to broach this with the teacher in a thoughtful and collaborative manner.

Reading quickly and saying it is easy does not necessarily mean she grasped all of the details and nuances (and many kids will find books boring even if they are the right level). Ask her questions like, "What is it about the characters that you like or don't like?";" "If you could come up with a different title for the book, what would it be?"; "Pretend you are the author and write an alternative ending." If her answers to these questions are nuanced and detailed, then have a conversation with the teacher about it. I'd suggest doing it at the scheduled November conferences since they are only about a month away and by that time, the teacher will have more time to observe your child. If you'd like, you could send the teacher a note a couple of weeks in advance of the conference letting her know you want to have that conversation at the conference-- that way, she may take particular notice during reading groups and/or re-read her reading assessment in advance so that she is prepared for the conversation.

The OPs pint was their child’s map-r score made it clear their comprehension was far higher than the group assignment per the county’s own chart. Seems some parents fail to grasp basic details too.

MAP R and MAP M are also multiple choice tests. Scores can be artificially high or low. It is also one snapshot whereas when the teacher reads with a kid to get a reading level, they get a much better sense of where the kid’s strengths and weaknesses are. MAP is one data point for a reason.