Standardized Testing time counts towards IEP hours????

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I mean, what do parents want the service providers to do? PARCC is all hands on deck, every special ed staffer, multiple hours a day for 2-4 weeks at a time. There's no choice, no way out of it. It's physically impossible to fit this all in, plus make sure your whole caseload gets their hours, plus attend the 15 middle school IEP transition meetings that are scheduled when there isn't PARCC. Time just doesn't function that way. And there's no help coming to make up missed hours, because the year is ending and the school system thinks their employees can make 2+2=6, and it wasn't just your kid that got missed, it was 40 others. What do you want them to do?

From a parents perspective, the employees just lie and use any excuse possible not to follow IEPS. It really stinks. Really disappointed in how dishonest and bad special ed teachers are.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I mean, what do parents want the service providers to do? PARCC is all hands on deck, every special ed staffer, multiple hours a day for 2-4 weeks at a time. There's no choice, no way out of it. It's physically impossible to fit this all in, plus make sure your whole caseload gets their hours, plus attend the 15 middle school IEP transition meetings that are scheduled when there isn't PARCC. Time just doesn't function that way. And there's no help coming to make up missed hours, because the year is ending and the school system thinks their employees can make 2+2=6, and it wasn't just your kid that got missed, it was 40 others. What do you want them to do?

I want my child's IEP implemented as we agreed. If there is a resource issue, the teacher should raise it with her administrators. They should not be bullshitting me that testing counts as service hours.

Pardon me while I fall over laughing. What will that accomplish? There are resource issues at every level, every day, all the time. There is no magical extra floating resource teacher or SLP or OT for admin to request be sent out to help the school-based staff make up all their service hours, or a magical supply of test examiners and accommodators that central office can send out to cover testing so these staff can do their regular jobs. Help isn't coming. They'll be told "Sorry, you'll just have to make it work," like they already have been all year with a hundred other issues. Should it be that way, of course not, but it is.

So file a complaint. Complain to your union. Talk to an ombudsman. Call a reporter. Whisper to a trusted parent about what's going on so she can file a complaint. As long as you keep up the pretense and spew bullshit, you are complicit.

+ 1,000,000. Come on teachers/administers. Have a little integrity here.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I mean, what do parents want the service providers to do? PARCC is all hands on deck, every special ed staffer, multiple hours a day for 2-4 weeks at a time. There's no choice, no way out of it. It's physically impossible to fit this all in, plus make sure your whole caseload gets their hours, plus attend the 15 middle school IEP transition meetings that are scheduled when there isn't PARCC. Time just doesn't function that way. And there's no help coming to make up missed hours, because the year is ending and the school system thinks their employees can make 2+2=6, and it wasn't just your kid that got missed, it was 40 others. What do you want them to do?

From a parents perspective, the employees just lie and use any excuse possible not to follow IEPS. It really stinks. Really disappointed in how dishonest and bad special ed teachers are.

It’s comments like this that make good teachers quit. It’s demoralizing to hear people say these things when you are doing you absolute best to service every kid every day with extremely limited resources.

[Anonymous]

The only other alternative is for the spcial educator to get a sub for some part of the testing time. It puts the IEP in compliance but your child will not be better off for it. When there is a special ed sub, they are being pulled out of their classroom for little benefit. Subs are limited in education and training and I promise you they are better off with it.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:The only other alternative is for the spcial educator to get a sub for some part of the testing time. It puts the IEP in compliance but your child will not be better off for it. When there is a special ed sub, they are being pulled out of their classroom for little benefit. Subs are limited in education and training and I promise you they are better off with it.

No, the alternative is to write the IEP correctly in a way that doesn't fake hours by claiming OP's child is getting service hours just by sitting in PARCC.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The only other alternative is for the spcial educator to get a sub for some part of the testing time. It puts the IEP in compliance but your child will not be better off for it. When there is a special ed sub, they are being pulled out of their classroom for little benefit. Subs are limited in education and training and I promise you they are better off with it.

No, the alternative is to write the IEP correctly in a way that doesn't fake hours by claiming OP's child is getting service hours just by sitting in PARCC.

An IEP is to help a student access the curriculum. Providing accommodations on assessments is helping the child access the curriculum. Does it suck? Yea. Just as much as it suck for every child taking PARCC and every staff member that has to administer it. But in reality, they are receiving supports that are outline on their IEP. The IEP is allowing them to be testing in a small group, reduced distractions, etc. They ARE receiving supports and services from their IEP during that time. Those services may not be geared directly towards the goals on their IEP but they are helping them access the same assessment that everyone else is taking.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I mean, what do parents want the service providers to do? PARCC is all hands on deck, every special ed staffer, multiple hours a day for 2-4 weeks at a time. There's no choice, no way out of it. It's physically impossible to fit this all in, plus make sure your whole caseload gets their hours, plus attend the 15 middle school IEP transition meetings that are scheduled when there isn't PARCC. Time just doesn't function that way. And there's no help coming to make up missed hours, because the year is ending and the school system thinks their employees can make 2+2=6, and it wasn't just your kid that got missed, it was 40 others. What do you want them to do?

From a parents perspective, the employees just lie and use any excuse possible not to follow IEPS. It really stinks. Really disappointed in how dishonest and bad special ed teachers are.

Right, because those teachers would rather administer PARCC instead of teaching??? Are you serious right now? You are calling special ed teacher dishonest and bad because they have to administer a state mandated assessment. Dishonest and bad because they spend their time reading the same test over and over again so your child can have the assessments outlined on their IEP. Dishonest would be not giving your child the accommodations stated on their IEP, that would be illegal. Administering an assessment with the outline accommodations IS following an IEP.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The only other alternative is for the spcial educator to get a sub for some part of the testing time. It puts the IEP in compliance but your child will not be better off for it. When there is a special ed sub, they are being pulled out of their classroom for little benefit. Subs are limited in education and training and I promise you they are better off with it.

No, the alternative is to write the IEP correctly in a way that doesn't fake hours by claiming OP's child is getting service hours just by sitting in PARCC.

Would you actually be fine with that, though? If I came to an IEP meeting with an IEP that said your kid would get 9 months of services instead of 10, that would alleviate all your concerns?

As a special ed teacher, I spent a great deal of my time and energy on advocating for my kids. Recently, I've gone up the chain to advocate for changes in how a field trip was set up, and changes in how some after school sports were operating, or for changes in the curriculum that were in my student's best interest. But I can only choose so many issues. The fact that IEPs aren't written with a separate section to describe how kids will be supported during PARCC (beyond the extensive accommodation section we're already creating) is no where near the top of that list.

I'm also laughing at the idea that this issue, of teacher time being eaten up by testing instead of instruction is something hidden or under the table. Teachers and teachers' unions have been incredibly vocal on this issue. Their complaints are all over the media. If you didn't know that instruction basically stops, for all kids, during PARCC, you haven't been paying attention.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The only other alternative is for the spcial educator to get a sub for some part of the testing time. It puts the IEP in compliance but your child will not be better off for it. When there is a special ed sub, they are being pulled out of their classroom for little benefit. Subs are limited in education and training and I promise you they are better off with it.

No, the alternative is to write the IEP correctly in a way that doesn't fake hours by claiming OP's child is getting service hours just by sitting in PARCC.

An IEP is to help a student access the curriculum. Providing accommodations on assessments is helping the child access the curriculum. Does it suck? Yea. Just as much as it suck for every child taking PARCC and every staff member that has to administer it. But in reality, they are receiving supports that are outline on their IEP. The IEP is allowing them to be testing in a small group, reduced distractions, etc. They ARE receiving supports and services from their IEP during that time. Those services may not be geared directly towards the goals on their IEP but they are helping them access the same assessment that everyone else is taking.

Well we don't know what supports OP's child is getting, only that they claim they can be provided by the general ed teacher - so I assume it's something like seating or extra time, not a scribe. Are you seriously trying to claim that the hours that a kid is seated at the front of the class should be counted as actual hours of services in the IEP? No, that is absurd.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The only other alternative is for the spcial educator to get a sub for some part of the testing time. It puts the IEP in compliance but your child will not be better off for it. When there is a special ed sub, they are being pulled out of their classroom for little benefit. Subs are limited in education and training and I promise you they are better off with it.

No, the alternative is to write the IEP correctly in a way that doesn't fake hours by claiming OP's child is getting service hours just by sitting in PARCC.

An IEP is to help a student access the curriculum. Providing accommodations on assessments is helping the child access the curriculum. Does it suck? Yea. Just as much as it suck for every child taking PARCC and every staff member that has to administer it. But in reality, they are receiving supports that are outline on their IEP. The IEP is allowing them to be testing in a small group, reduced distractions, etc. They ARE receiving supports and services from their IEP during that time. Those services may not be geared directly towards the goals on their IEP but they are helping them access the same assessment that everyone else is taking.

Well we don't know what supports OP's child is getting, only that they claim they can be provided by the general ed teacher - so I assume it's something like seating or extra time, not a scribe. Are you seriously trying to claim that the hours that a kid is seated at the front of the class should be counted as actual hours of services in the IEP? No, that is absurd.

IEP service hours are the hours that a child needs help to be able to access the curriculum. If PARCC is what is going on in the curriculum, and all a child needs to access PARCC is preferential seating (hard to imagine that in a kid with an IEP, but OK), then that child's needs are being met. If the child needs more substantial help during weeks when reading instruction is part of the curriculum, then they should get it.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The only other alternative is for the spcial educator to get a sub for some part of the testing time. It puts the IEP in compliance but your child will not be better off for it. When there is a special ed sub, they are being pulled out of their classroom for little benefit. Subs are limited in education and training and I promise you they are better off with it.

No, the alternative is to write the IEP correctly in a way that doesn't fake hours by claiming OP's child is getting service hours just by sitting in PARCC.

Would you actually be fine with that, though? If I came to an IEP meeting with an IEP that said your kid would get 9 months of services instead of 10, that would alleviate all your concerns?

As a special ed teacher, I spent a great deal of my time and energy on advocating for my kids. Recently, I've gone up the chain to advocate for changes in how a field trip was set up, and changes in how some after school sports were operating, or for changes in the curriculum that were in my student's best interest. But I can only choose so many issues. The fact that IEPs aren't written with a separate section to describe how kids will be supported during PARCC (beyond the extensive accommodation section we're already creating) is no where near the top of that list.

I'm also laughing at the idea that this issue, of teacher time being eaten up by testing instead of instruction is something hidden or under the table. Teachers and teachers' unions have been incredibly vocal on this issue. Their complaints are all over the media. If you didn't know that instruction basically stops, for all kids, during PARCC, you haven't been paying attention.

Absolutely that's what I want - the service hours to be written clearly. It's not rocket science. If you know in advance that several weeks are going to be taken up with testing then you just subtract that from the total number of hours for the year. Similarly if a service was scheduled for Fridays then they should write the actual number of hours since so many Fridays are off.

And don't fake services either. It's one thing to say "No services for 2 weeks during PARCC" and another to claim that sitting taking the PARCC counts for service hours when there's nothing being provided other than seating.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The only other alternative is for the spcial educator to get a sub for some part of the testing time. It puts the IEP in compliance but your child will not be better off for it. When there is a special ed sub, they are being pulled out of their classroom for little benefit. Subs are limited in education and training and I promise you they are better off with it.

No, the alternative is to write the IEP correctly in a way that doesn't fake hours by claiming OP's child is getting service hours just by sitting in PARCC.

An IEP is to help a student access the curriculum. Providing accommodations on assessments is helping the child access the curriculum. Does it suck? Yea. Just as much as it suck for every child taking PARCC and every staff member that has to administer it. But in reality, they are receiving supports that are outline on their IEP. The IEP is allowing them to be testing in a small group, reduced distractions, etc. They ARE receiving supports and services from their IEP during that time. Those services may not be geared directly towards the goals on their IEP but they are helping them access the same assessment that everyone else is taking.

Well we don't know what supports OP's child is getting, only that they claim they can be provided by the general ed teacher - so I assume it's something like seating or extra time, not a scribe. Are you seriously trying to claim that the hours that a kid is seated at the front of the class should be counted as actual hours of services in the IEP? No, that is absurd.

IEP service hours are the hours that a child needs help to be able to access the curriculum. If PARCC is what is going on in the curriculum, and all a child needs to access PARCC is preferential seating (hard to imagine that in a kid with an IEP, but OK), then that child's needs are being met. If the child needs more substantial help during weeks when reading instruction is part of the curriculum, then they should get it.

You're missing the point. Of course a child should get any support they need during testing. But if they aren't getting direct supports like a scribe, testing hours are not a service hours. By your logic, any accomodations would be service hours! that's absurd. The rest of the IEP doesn't count accommodations as hours during non-PARCC time. What's happening here is that the school is using this as a dumb way to account for the fact that they are too short staffed during PARCC to provide regular IEP services.

[Anonymous]

Seriously. People are doing the best they can. Teachers HATE PARCC. Your child is no more important than any other persons child. If you are that concerned get a substitute license and sub during PARCC. Do something to help the school instead of getting on an anonymous forum and complain.

[Anonymous]

To me it matters what the support hours are.

If it's time with a special education teacher working on the reading or math curriculum -- then calling PARCC time specialized instruction makes more sense because that essentially IS the curriculum for everyone during that period.

However if the child is missing time with a related service provider (OT/PT/SLP) I'd be more annoyed.

But honestly OP you're on week 3 of having an IEP. You would not win a legal argument that your child is being denied FAPE, unless they didn't quickly (e.g. 2 weeks) get back to normal.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The only other alternative is for the spcial educator to get a sub for some part of the testing time. It puts the IEP in compliance but your child will not be better off for it. When there is a special ed sub, they are being pulled out of their classroom for little benefit. Subs are limited in education and training and I promise you they are better off with it.

No, the alternative is to write the IEP correctly in a way that doesn't fake hours by claiming OP's child is getting service hours just by sitting in PARCC.

An IEP is to help a student access the curriculum. Providing accommodations on assessments is helping the child access the curriculum. Does it suck? Yea. Just as much as it suck for every child taking PARCC and every staff member that has to administer it. But in reality, they are receiving supports that are outline on their IEP. The IEP is allowing them to be testing in a small group, reduced distractions, etc. They ARE receiving supports and services from their IEP during that time. Those services may not be geared directly towards the goals on their IEP but they are helping them access the same assessment that everyone else is taking.

Yes, this! Thank you for explaining this well. PARCC testing is state-mandated and schools do not have a choice. One of the pages of the IEP is a discussion of PARCC accommodations and which tests the child will participate in throughout the year. Service does indeed include provision of those accommodations, supplementary aids, and modifications needed to enable the child to participate along with his/her peers. The IEP goals are meant to be meant in one year and do not necessarily require pull out instruction with a special ed teacher.