French or Spanish?

[Anonymous]

I think everyone has named just about every reason to learn a foreign language and many have discussed the ability to use Spanish in the US and the DC area specficially. However I don't think anyone has said that is actually a life skill. I can not tell you the number of times not speaking Spanish has put me at a disadvantage. The Spanish language community is so large in the DC area (as it is now in many metropolitan areas) that there are many industries that manage to operate quite successfully by speaking little English. Obviously some people can and obviously I am speaking of blue collar jobs related to construction, contracting and house cleaning, not to mention nannies, but hello! Who doesn't use those services? I suppose some would argue that if one works in the US they should speak English, but English is not our national language and I dare say it never will be. But the point is that I could use Spanish every single day and I could use it to communicate with people and this need will only get bigger.

I admit I prefer French but I'm sorry, there is no comparison. Sure many international organizations operate in English and French but to say that French is more useful in Europe (or anywhere else in the world) than Spanish is wrong. I actually think French is going to become less and less popular. I lived in Germany, Italy and the UK and there is only one language today that I wish I spoke and that is Spanish. Hands down. Now I just need to convince my kids to want to learn it too!

I should also mention we spend a lot of time in the Miami area and I actually got married there. I am quite certain that not speaking Spanish cost us about 10%!

[Anonymous]

op - I also can't get my head around the idea that your child will never have any contact with Spanish speakers. That is the craziest thing I have ever heard. this isn't about who you work with but OTHER people in the world who you might occasionally want to show some respect. I am sorry but that really offends me!

[Anonymous]

Professionally French vs. Spanish is a tough call and I think it depends. I have worked in and around development for almost 20 years as have many friends and my DH. French and Spanish are pretty close when you compare Latin America and Francophone Africa (in terms of places to go and ways to be useful) and I suppose one could argue that unless your Spanish is exceptional there will always be lots of people with better language b/c they could be native speakers which is certainly less true of French. I can't say that in my dealings with international organizations that French will get you any further. France has basically done a great job of bullying the international community into using French based of their antiquated world view of themselves. I do hope some of the Spanish speaking nations are going to start standing up for themselves! In any event I think professionally they could be seen as close but then when you add the real world opportunities to use Spanish on a daily basis I think the contest is over.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:23:46 Spanish is also spoken in Spain. Spanish versus French: Double the speakers worldwide, 400 m. versus 200 m. Much more Spanish spoken in the U.S. in large cities. Not clear why you'd study a language only if you though you wanted to live someplace where it's spoken. It's hard to live in Ancient Rome these days but Latin instruction is resurgent in the U.S.

Because we want DC to have the option of living elsewhere, in another country when he grows up. And because it's not out of the realm of possibility for us to move to a different country. And I'm fairly certain we are not likely to live in latin america.

What if we/he choose to live in Europe? What is the most commonly spoken language in Europe? I was told that the Spanish spoken in Spain is different than the Spanish spoken in Latin American countries. No? French is spoken in France as well as in Switzerland btw.

Yes, I can see that the ability to speak spanish is very valuable for those jobs where the applicant must come in contact with the spanish-speaking population. Don't want to reveal my job, but I have zero contact with the spanish-speaking population. But I am thinking also of other occupations where I question whether it's ever going to be necessray for them to speak spanish - neurologists, plastic surgeons, CEO's, university professor, patent or corporate lawyer, physicist, aernonautical engineer, etc..too many to list. How likely is it that spanish will be a real requirement for these type of occupations?

So I speak English and am proficient in French. While my ear is not great for Spanish, there are tons of cognates, so I'm able to read Spanish fairly well and cobble basic sentences together. Where do I get to use my French? Well, Quebec, where I've never visited. France, where I get to visit on occasion, but less frequently with kids. The French Antilles. Well, it has been nearly 20 years since I spent time in that part of the Caribbean. Haiti, not planning to visit any time soon. Yes, there are large chunks of Francophone West and Central Africa, but I don't work in those places anymore.

Now where do I get to practice Spanish? Well, just this morning with a nanny near our house. Then when I was buying some fruit at a stand. Probably later tonight when we go to Las Placitas for dinner. If your DC learns Spanish, and has any aptitude, then s/he can hack away at French when s/he is in France or in the Francophone section of Switzerland (as opposed to the German or Italian sections of the country).

Regarding occupations and language requirements: how old is your DC? Has s/he said they want to be either a neurologist, patent lawyer, or CEO? You may want to focus on skills, such as language acquisition, and leave the job search to them.

[Anonymous]

I am really enjoying hearing how people have used their foreign language training and learning a lot.

Ultimately as I and others noted earlier, the main thing is to get DC to do what excites him/her. Learn another language, any language, while you're young and you'll benefit the rest of your life -- whether you use that language or have the confidence to know you can learn another language if you want.

And (if getting ahead matters to you) you'll be way ahead of most Americans! Go for it!

[Anonymous]

FWIW Spanish was much more popular at my child's elementary school until the new French teacher started making crepes and handing out chocolate croissants and Noel candies. The mass exodus to French was astounding. I was mean and told my kids to stick with Spanish because they had already started. And as a bonus my daughter only had 7 kids in her language class.

[Anonymous]

My wife and I, who both took French in high school and college, talked to my kids about this decision last spring, when they had to choose between French and Spanish.

We acknowledge the practical value of Spanish for hiring cheap labor. But there's more to life than hiring cheap labor.

For the kids' academic careers, French will serve them better. The English language has been influenced far more extensively by French than by Spanish. French is much more useful for reading science, literature, history or philosophy.

Spanish is useful, like typing is useful, maybe even necessary. But life is more than negotiating with immigrants. A better education includes French.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:My wife and I, who both took French in high school and college, talked to my kids about this decision last spring, when they had to choose between French and Spanish.

We acknowledge the practical value of Spanish for hiring cheap labor. But there's more to life than hiring cheap labor.

For the kids' academic careers, French will serve them better. The English language has been influenced far more extensively by French than by Spanish. French is much more useful for reading science, literature, history or philosophy.

Spanish is useful, like typing is useful, maybe even necessary. But life is more than negotiating with immigrants. A better education includes French.

This is written tongue in cheek, right?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:My wife and I, who both took French in high school and college, talked to my kids about this decision last spring, when they had to choose between French and Spanish.

We acknowledge the practical value of Spanish for hiring cheap labor. But there's more to life than hiring cheap labor.

For the kids' academic careers, French will serve them better. The English language has been influenced far more extensively by French than by Spanish. French is much more useful for reading science, literature, history or philosophy.

Spanish is useful, like typing is useful, maybe even necessary. But life is more than negotiating with immigrants. A better education includes French.

This is written tongue in cheek, right?

I sure hope so. Or they realize that their children have such limited intellect that they will be barely able to master French, let alone use those Romance language skills for Italian, Portuguese, or Spanish.

[Anonymous]

Why must anyone learn Spanish simply because so much of the blue collar population in the U.S. speak Spanish? What if they are not blue collar and they prefer their children to avoid such jobs? We live in a competitive area where children are competing to get into difficult schools. Clearly parents are very concerned and involved in grooming their children's education. For what? So they can acquire blue collar jobs or be in regular contact with blue collar job holders?

It sounds harsh, but the reality is that parents in the DC metro area who send their children to competetive schools would like their children to hold well paying jobs, many of which do not require the ability to speak Spanish.

I've hired nannies and spanish speaking workers but, frankly, if the person does not speak enough English and can't bring someone along to translate but I need them to speak English for the job, I don't hire them, period.

[Anonymous]

Whoah!
Study what you want but let's leave the class prejudice out of it!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Why must anyone learn Spanish simply because so much of the blue collar population in the U.S. speak Spanish? What if they are not blue collar and they prefer their children to avoid such jobs? We live in a competitive area where children are competing to get into difficult schools. Clearly parents are very concerned and involved in grooming their children's education. For what? So they can acquire blue collar jobs or be in regular contact with blue collar job holders?

It sounds harsh, but the reality is that parents in the DC metro area who send their children to competetive schools would like their children to hold well paying jobs, many of which do not require the ability to speak Spanish.

I've hired nannies and spanish speaking workers but, frankly, if the person does not speak enough English and can't bring someone along to translate but I need them to speak English for the job, I don't hire them, period.

Wow, last time I went to the theater at El Teatro de la Luna in Arlington or the Gala Theater in Columbia Heights, I had no idea I was dealing with the "blue collar" population. When I listened to the poets and musicians at Por Eso La Palabra at the Folger Shakespeare Library, I didn't realize that they were a bunch of maids who couldn't speak English (not that there's anything wrong with that). And now I'm reading a beautiful novel by the gifted Nicaraguan writer Gioconda Belli. Guess she must be a day laborer! (Not that there's anything wrong with that, either.)

Really, please, study what you want, it's okay! (I've studied Russian, Latin, French, German, and Spanish.) But to reject Spanish because working class people speak it -- very short-sighted!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Why must anyone learn Spanish simply because so much of the blue collar population in the U.S. speak Spanish? What if they are not blue collar and they prefer their children to avoid such jobs? We live in a competitive area where children are competing to get into difficult schools. Clearly parents are very concerned and involved in grooming their children's education. For what? So they can acquire blue collar jobs or be in regular contact with blue collar job holders?

It sounds harsh, but the reality is that parents in the DC metro area who send their children to competetive schools would like their children to hold well paying jobs, many of which do not require the ability to speak Spanish.

I've hired nannies and spanish speaking workers but, frankly, if the person does not speak enough English and can't bring someone along to translate but I need them to speak English for the job, I don't hire them, period.

Wow, last time I went to the theater at El Teatro de la Luna in Arlington or the Gala Theater in Columbia Heights, I had no idea I was dealing with the "blue collar" population. When I listened to the poets and musicians at Por Eso La Palabra at the Folger Shakespeare Library, I didn't realize that they were a bunch of maids who couldn't speak English (not that there's anything wrong with that). And now I'm reading a beautiful novel by the gifted Nicaraguan writer Gioconda Belli. Guess she must be a day laborer! (Not that there's anything wrong with that, either.)

Really, please, study what you want, it's okay! (I've studied Russian, Latin, French, German, and Spanish.) But to reject Spanish because working class people speak it -- very short-sighted!

Not only is it short-sighted, but appallingly ignorant. The ability to speak a second (or third) language, regardless if it is Spanish, French or Drupal, may be the key to their future economic success.

Our nanny does not speak great English, but both our DC were accepted at Big 3 schools. Oh, perhaps they were admitted because they triumphed over her cooing to them in her native tongue. Or because she fostered a strong sense of self-confidence and a love for learning. Shocking that a blue collar person would have such abilities.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Why must anyone learn Spanish simply because so much of the blue collar population in the U.S. speak Spanish? What if they are not blue collar and they prefer their children to avoid such jobs? We live in a competitive area where children are competing to get into difficult schools. Clearly parents are very concerned and involved in grooming their children's education. For what? So they can acquire blue collar jobs or be in regular contact with blue collar job holders?

It sounds harsh, but the reality is that parents in the DC metro area who send their children to competetive schools would like their children to hold well paying jobs, many of which do not require the ability to speak Spanish.

I've hired nannies and spanish speaking workers but, frankly, if the person does not speak enough English and can't bring someone along to translate but I need them to speak English for the job, I don't hire them, period.

What's wrong with talking to blue collar people? They are just as human as you, you know. God forbid you have contact with a lowly commoner, your highness!

I have tan skin, and I can't tell you how many times people assume I speak no English, or that I'm a nanny or that I work in a nail salon. I don't speak Spanish or French, I have a degree and own my own business; yet you would probably assume I'm blue collar nothing if you saw me walking down the street.

[Anonymous]

21:06 I don't think the goal of studying a language is to be able to communicate with locals who happen to work in these positions. In your travels in Spanish speaking countries you meet doctors, lawyers, authors, actors, educators, artists etc. etc. etc. The literature of Spain and Latin America is rich, the cinema, too.