Why are some professional degrees masters and some "doctorates"?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:It seems that in the female-dominated professions there is less push to give the professional degree a doctorate. Which speaks volumes about sexist assumptions in our society.

Yes the Big Three professional degrees (JD, MD, DDS) are now roughly at gender-parity but female-dominated fields like Elementary Education, Social Work or Librarianship they say a Master's is sufficient.

I'm not sure about that. Have any masters become doctorates in the last 40 years? I certainly agree the professions with doctorates have greater gender equality problems, but I think most of the push to create professional doctorates predates women being allowed to be "professionals" at all.

That's kind of the point, isn't it? 40 years ago most social workers and librarians were women, but their professional degrees were (and are) "mere" masters.

[Anonymous]

It's not gender, nor is it anything but academics.

Some graduate degrees are continuations of what are, commonly even if FAR from universally, undergraduate programs. Think, an MA in Poli Sci.

Other graduate degrees are entirely separate, stand-alone programs, and include either research or professional practice components, causing the degrees to be terminal within their respective disciplines. JD, MD, DDS.

Still other degrees may commonly be viewed as terminal for practical purposes, but there are possibilities for further education, and these degrees also proceed from subject-matter than could at least be started to some degree at the Baccalaureate level. MBA, MFA.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:It seems that in the female-dominated professions there is less push to give the professional degree a doctorate. Which speaks volumes about sexist assumptions in our society.

Yes the Big Three professional degrees (JD, MD, DDS) are now roughly at gender-parity but female-dominated fields like Elementary Education, Social Work or Librarianship they say a Master's is sufficient.

I'm not sure about that. Have any masters become doctorates in the last 40 years? I certainly agree the professions with doctorates have greater gender equality problems, but I think most of the push to create professional doctorates predates women being allowed to be "professionals" at all.

That's kind of the point, isn't it? 40 years ago most social workers and librarians were women, but their professional degrees were (and are) "mere" masters.

I'm saying 40 is the most recent case. Most of the professional degrees are considerably older, and in fact pre-date the modern Ph.D.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:It's not gender, nor is it anything but academics.

Some graduate degrees are continuations of what are, commonly even if FAR from universally, undergraduate programs. Think, an MA in Poli Sci.

Other graduate degrees are entirely separate, stand-alone programs, and include either research or professional practice components, causing the degrees to be terminal within their respective disciplines. JD, MD, DDS.

Still other degrees may commonly be viewed as terminal for practical purposes, but there are possibilities for further education, and these degrees also proceed from subject-matter than could at least be started to some degree at the Baccalaureate level. MBA, MFA.

This makes sense, though Library Science seems to be the exception to the rule.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I'd say an academic masters is higher than a JD.

If you have an English MA, say, you have more extensive knowledge. A JD is just the basic law degree.

Law School is 3 years. At UVA a maters in english takes 3 semesters.

"number of students, the most desirable plan is a rigorous course of study at the MA level. The MA may be completed in three full semesters, though students opting to write an MA thesis often take a fourth semester"

http://www.engl.virginia.edu/graduate

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I'd say an academic masters is higher than a JD.

If you have an English MA, say, you have more extensive knowledge. A JD is just the basic law degree.

Law School is 3 years. At UVA a maters in english takes 3 semesters.

"number of students, the most desirable plan is a rigorous course of study at the MA level. The MA may be completed in three full semesters, though students opting to write an MA thesis often take a fourth semester"

http://www.engl.virginia.edu/graduate

Not sure what your point is. Law school has no prereqs, so the first year is just bringing people up to speed.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I'd say an academic masters is higher than a JD.

If you have an English MA, say, you have more extensive knowledge. A JD is just the basic law degree.

BS...and I don't mean "Bachelor of Science." I have an English MA. But I don't have the knowledge to have a man sentenced to death, or to help him walk free. No one dies on my table.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I'd say an academic masters is higher than a JD.

If you have an English MA, say, you have more extensive knowledge. A JD is just the basic law degree.

Law School is 3 years. At UVA a maters in english takes 3 semesters.

"number of students, the most desirable plan is a rigorous course of study at the MA level. The MA may be completed in three full semesters, though students opting to write an MA thesis often take a fourth semester"

http://www.engl.virginia.edu/graduate

Not sure what your point is. Law school has no prereqs, so the first year is just bringing people up to speed.

Don't you need a bachelors to get into law school?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I'd say an academic masters is higher than a JD.

If you have an English MA, say, you have more extensive knowledge. A JD is just the basic law degree.

Law School is 3 years. At UVA a maters in english takes 3 semesters.

"number of students, the most desirable plan is a rigorous course of study at the MA level. The MA may be completed in three full semesters, though students opting to write an MA thesis often take a fourth semester"

http://www.engl.virginia.edu/graduate

Not sure what your point is. Law school has no prereqs, so the first year is just bringing people up to speed.

Don't you need a bachelors to get into law school?

Yes, you do.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:What makes a JD or PharmD, say, an MLS, MBA, MSW, MFA, M.Arch. etc. so fundamentally different that they get "doctoral" degrees? There is no original research component for any of these degrees. Degree inflation?

You do a thesis for doctoral degree; you don't for master degrees:
http://www.wisegeek.org/what-is-a-phd.htm

It really all depends on what you want to be when you grow up.

Nope, not true at all. Many MA programs will allow you to do 30 hours of coursework for the degree but some still require a thesis, which is considered the equivalent of two classes. I wrote a thesis for my MA and a dissertation for my PHd.

+1. Most master's require a thesis. DH's STEM masters was a 3 year program. I think a PhD was only a year more of coursework.

Lawyers are not doctors. Truly only academic teachers/professors and MDs should hold that title.

Your obsession with lawyers are not doctors is just weird. Who really cares what they are called? I'm a JD/MA (English) and in formal legal settings (briefings & correspondence to the Court) other attorneys sometimes put "Esquire" after my name. In the 20 years since I have graduated from law school (and passed 3 bars), exactly no one has called me Dr. My Last Name. In fact, I've never head of any JD being referred to as Dr. Last Name. That would be weird and I would correct them. It's not an academic doctorate, it's a professional one, and no one is pretending otherwise. That said, law school is a very tough path that prepares you for direct entry into professional practice (after passing the bar, of course). Saying it it less rigorous than an MA in liberal arts makes you look ridiculous. I did a 4 year JD/MA joint program, and put 85% of my time and effort in the JD piece. JD/MBAs were also common in my school, and, once again, it was 3 tough years of JD (with some business law classes to cross count) and a "slacker" year to finish the MBA.

Np here. In other parts of the world, lawyers are called Dr. Last Name. I don't know exactly which countries do this or why, but I worked for an immigration lawyer while I was an undergrad and his South American clients called him Dr. Last Name.

[Anonymous]

I have an MLS and have been a law librarian for many years. I have to remind myself that the federal attorneys I help only have one more year of education than I have - particularly when they make two to three times as much!!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Law school was more work because you were learning a new subject, not because the degree is "more advanced" or "intellectual." It's the entry-level, basic law degree. An MA in say, English or history, means you have some background in the area and you can do more advanced work.

+1

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I'd say an academic masters is higher than a JD.

If you have an English MA, say, you have more extensive knowledge. A JD is just the basic law degree.

This is ridiculous. I have a Master's Degree in Public Policy. My JD was 10 times harder to get, plus, I had to take the bar exam.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I'd say an academic masters is higher than a JD.

If you have an English MA, say, you have more extensive knowledge. A JD is just the basic law degree.

Law School is 3 years. At UVA a maters in english takes 3 semesters.

"number of students, the most desirable plan is a rigorous course of study at the MA level. The MA may be completed in three full semesters, though students opting to write an MA thesis often take a fourth semester"

http://www.engl.virginia.edu/graduate

Not sure what your point is. Law school has no prereqs, so the first year is just bringing people up to speed.

You clearly have never been to a law school. The first year is not bringing people up to speed. It's learning a new discipline. Do you want to take Torts and Civ Pro. Those exams were hard as hell. I still dream about them and I also have my Master's Degree. I had to do a thesis, but it did not match the pain of studying for the bar.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I'd say an academic masters is higher than a JD.

If you have an English MA, say, you have more extensive knowledge. A JD is just the basic law degree.

This is ridiculous. I have a Master's Degree in Public Policy. My JD was 10 times harder to get, plus, I had to take the bar exam.

Yes, the JD degree is soooooo hard to get. Such an achievement. Therefore, we should pay you big bucks for what you do.