Does Rhee deserve credit

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Let's remember that Fenty did not announce he was in favor of taking over the schools under the day after the Democratic primary, which made him the presumptive Mayor. That felt like a fraud on voters (at least to this voter) since it was a reversal of his earlier position. And let's not forget that when he hired Rhee, he was by law supposed to consult with the Council about his prospective choice ahead of the hire, but he did not, he sprang it on them as a fait accompli. Fenty's been a huge disappointment.

Totally.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Let's remember that Fenty did not announce he was in favor of taking over the schools under the day after the Democratic primary, which made him the presumptive Mayor. That felt like a fraud on voters (at least to this voter) since it was a reversal of his earlier position. And let's not forget that when he hired Rhee, he was by law supposed to consult with the Council about his prospective choice ahead of the hire, but he did not, he sprang it on them as a fait accompli. Fenty's been a huge disappointment.

Totally.

Very well stated and so true.

[Anonymous]

To OP's question, didn't Rhee openly cite previous superintendent Janney for test-taking infrastructure improvements and scores bumps? Seems like she's not interested in taking any indepth score credit early on.

In general it seems like a lot of the substance is getting lost in the immature (IMO) communication style of the Rhee regime. It's frutrating for me as a parent and certainly for some of the teachers I speak to. I can't even imagine what it's like for the principals.

On the media front, as a parent I appreciate Rhee's stated purpose to draw attention to schools in a by-any-means-necessary way. But it feels like the media hype and political posturing could have been handled more constructively. Especially from someone like Rhee who knew the DC education and political landscape. Time magazine aside, Rhee is not some outsider who swept into town with no context. (As did Janney and others before him.)

Guess I had high expectations that Rhee would be more astute at re-working the system from the inside.

Personally, I'd love to see Arne Duncan take over the schools.

Time to put away childish things Adrien and Michelle....

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:To OP's question, didn't Rhee openly cite previous superintendent Janney for test-taking infrastructure improvements and scores bumps? Seems like she's not interested in taking any indepth score credit early on.

In general it seems like a lot of the substance is getting lost in the immature (IMO) communication style of the Rhee regime. It's frutrating for me as a parent and certainly for some of the teachers I speak to. I can't even imagine what it's like for the principals.

On the media front, as a parent I appreciate Rhee's stated purpose to draw attention to schools in a by-any-means-necessary way. But it feels like the media hype and political posturing could have been handled more constructively. Especially from someone like Rhee who knew the DC education and political landscape. Time magazine aside, Rhee is not some outsider who swept into town with no context. (As did Janney and others before him.)

Guess I had high expectations that Rhee would be more astute at re-working the system from the inside.

Personally, I'd love to see Arne Duncan take over the schools.

Time to put away childish things Adrien and Michelle....

Agree with the above, except she hugely hyped small gains last spring and gave out weird cash rewards to faculty at improved schools in the fall back to school mandatory kick-off. Did not seem extremely professional or relevant to a long-term improvement vision.

[Anonymous]

jsteele wrote:

Anonymous wrote:
Again, I never heard her endorse McCain. If you can find a link that shows her doing so, even obliquely, that would be helpful. My memory of her responses to questions about the presidential election were that she went out of her way not to endorse or express a preference, but that she did call out aspects of each candidate's educational platform for critique.

I didn't say she endorsed McCain, I said she endorsed his plan.

Actually, you said just that -- "along with Rhee's hints of being a McCain supporter" is the quote, I believe.

Here is one example of her doing so:

"Schools Chancellor Michelle Rhee, in comments on Thursday night at a gathering of the Korean-American Coalition’s D.C. chapter, endorsed the education plan of Arizona Republican John McCain 'far and away' over those of either Obama or Hillary Clinton."

http://www.washingtoncitypaper.com/blogs/citydesk/2008/05/02/rhee-mccain-has-best-education-plan/

This actually proves my original point -- that Rhee wants to see NCLB live on, and Obama was highly critical of it. So, again, not sure why it should surprise anyone that her belief in NCLB would lead her to praise McCain's education plan (such as it was). And, more to my earlier point, she made the point that she's a longstanding Democrat yet preferred the Republican's approach on education -- she was attempting to show the strength of her belief in NCLB, even if it meant "betraying" her overall political beliefs. You obviously don't agree with her position (and neither do I), but from her perspective, NCLB is absolutely crucial to the success of underperforming urban schools, and I don't see how that's not a principled stand. You seem to be looking at symbolic value -- black president, wife makes appearances at DC schools -- and she's looking on a practical level at what she thinks will allow her to manage her urban school system most successfully. I guess I'd rather hear her say outright what she thinks works and doesn't work rather than avoid ruffling feathers -- and in a Democratic city like DC, I can't see how it hurts anyone to hear a different perspective on this point.

Also, that article is from the primary season. I heard an interview with Rhee after the presidential debate between McCain and Obama where she criticized both of them pretty equally and went out of her way not to endorse either. Maybe she was hiding the ball at that point and knew that her preferences were already out there.

This is pretty much a dead horse, but I'm beating it only because I think that politics is a red-herring in the larger discussion of how much credit she deserves for changes in the school system. If she deserves any credit, then fact that she adheres to the NCLB "accountability" (and anti-union) approach is part of that, and the fact that her views lined up with McCain's on those issues shouldn't matter. I can't believe I'm saying this, but the fact that she actually spoke approvingly of a Republican in a city that revered his Democratic opponent doesn't by default invalidate her point.

[jsteele]

Anonymous wrote:

Actually, you said just that -- "along with Rhee's hints of being a McCain supporter" is the quote, I believe.

You are obviously a very educated person and clearly you understand the difference between "hints" and an endorsement. With that in mind, why are you debating this?

Anonymous wrote:
This actually proves my original point -- that Rhee wants to see NCLB live on, and Obama was highly critical of it.

No, this actually proves that you are not familiar with Obama's position regarding NCLB. It is true that the article says that Obama was highly critical of NCLB, but that is likely due to the reporter's similar lack of understanding of Obama's position. Obama was critical of the funding shortfalls and over-reliance on testing, but overall wanted (and I assume wants) to strengthen NCLB and increase its funding.

Anonymous wrote:
Also, that article is from the primary season. I heard an interview with Rhee after the presidential debate between McCain and Obama where she criticized both of them pretty equally and went out of her way not to endorse either. Maybe she was hiding the ball at that point and knew that her preferences were already out there.

Again, I never said that she endorsed McCain. I said she hinted at supporting him and she did endorse his education plan. McCain and Obama were not very different in their positions regarding NCLB. It is a mystery why Rhee even mentioned NCLB, unless she was similarly uninformed or the strong reliance on testing is more important to her than increased funding. However, there is no ambiguity regarding the issue of unions. Rhee repeatedly criticized Democrats for their support of teachers' unions. Rhee has actively fought with the WTU. Clearly, she was more aligned with McCain on that issue. Simple logic suggests that if two candidates differ mildly on one issue but strongly on a second, the second issue plays a more important role.

We are only discussing this because of my stated opinion that support for McCain over Obama was a sign of Rhee being out of touch with DC's school system. You seem to be saying that Rhee was not a McCain supporter, that it shouldn't matter who she supported, but if she did support McCain you see that as a welcome sign of independence. That covers a lot of bases. Regardless, I stand by my position that anyone who prioritized union-busting over the inspirational value represented by Obama was out of touch with DC's public school system.