Do you believe in Hell?

[Anonymous]

So no one thinks we have to account for our sins ever? We can live our lives any ol' way and then just go to sleep?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I'm a Christian. I do not believe in hell, at least not in the way people have been coerced into believing. If you take the time to research the original Biblical text you'll find that nothing like "hell" is ever mentioned in the scripture. Here's a really easy to read link with some examples. http://www.thehypertexts.com/no%20hell%20in%20the%20bible.htm Do some research on the original meaning of the words that were later translated to mean "hell". They aren't even close.

The Hell we are warned about today didn't exist in Biblical times. "Hell" was created by powerful people as a means of control. Nothing more. Think about it logically. If you are a Christian, you know that God is all good. All loving. All compassion. He created you out from an abundance of love. As your Creator, He/She is incapable of causing you pain. Is there anything one of your children could do - anything at all - that would cause you to send him to an eternity of suffering an pain? God's love for us is even greater than the love we have for our children and for each other. He is author of love!

Fundamental Christianity is nothing short of religious abuse. I believe it has damaged many, many people (like the pp who is terrified of hell). Christianity is wonderful! Christ was a living example of God's perfect love. To be a Christian means to be "Christ-like". What could possibly be better than modeling your life after someone who was kind, compassionate, loving, forgiving, generous, enlightened .... All things we should strive to be. Being Christ-like has nothing to do with terrifying people into religious submission.

God is All-good. All-loving. All-powerful. Love. Light. Perfection. Grace. He created you and wants only your highest and best.

Fundamentalists, who depend solely on the Bible for their beliefs, definitely think Hell is a real place. How do you account for that, if it's not in the Bible?

It's in the Bible that they read. But if you go back and read scripture before it was translated and retranslated and before powerful people decided what should and should not be included, it's pretty clear that "hell" didn't exist in the way we are taught that it did.

Sorry, no. The Gospels are intact from when they written, in Greek, in the first century. And in them, Jesus discusses Hell numerous times. Yes, he uses some metaphor, but his descriptions of out darkness, weeping and gnashing of teeth, eternal fire, torment, and everlasting conscious destruction should give anyone pause who claims to be a Christian but denies the reality of Hell. Hell is the backdrop of God's love for us. Hell was prepared for Satan and his angels, who rebelled even while in Heaven and fully aware of exactly who God is. Those who reject Christ are afforded this same eternal dwelling place with those who die in their sin without being forgiven by Christ, whose who ultimately cast their lot against God and with this angelic rebellion. It is God's great love for us that caused him to offer His son, Jesus Christ, who is God in the flesh, as a sacrifice for us to save us from this fate.

Jesus spoke in parables and metaphors all the time. If you've read the Bible, you understand that not everything He said was meant to be taken literally. I think it is a huge mistake to read any ancient text through modern eyes. You absolutely must read the Bible with a keen awareness of the time and place in which it was written. More importantly, we have to remember that we don't have any evidence at all that Jesus ever wrote anything. We can assume He had the ability to read and write because He spent a lot of time at the temple studying and talking with priests. But we don't have a single piece of scripture written by Jesus Himself. So, in addition to considering time and place, we have to consider that fallible people did the best they could to capture the messages Jesus shared. Add to that the countless number of discrepancies caused by multiple translations. I love the Bible! I've studied and taught classes for years on the different authors, subjects, and books. I always teach with mindfulness and respect for history and context.

And the subject of "hell" does not hold up to scrutiny. Look at the words used in the original scripture. They are nothing like the "hell" we scare people with today. And why didn't God say anything at all about hell to Cain? For heaven's sake (*snert) he killed his brother in cold blood! Noah? The wicked perished, but there is nothing about eternal suffering. The cities of Sodom and Gomorrah (they were burned in the here and now, but for eternity, nope.)? There are countless examples of horribly wicked people who suffered on earth, but nothing to suggest eternal suffering.

New testament? Go look at the definition of "Hades". That word can actually mean either punishment or reward depending on how it is used. Most Biblical scholars believe the authors were describing a place of forgetfulness. Unawareness of God. The word "Tartarus" simply refers to a pit. A great metaphor for life without spiritual enlightenment. Jesus Christ used the word "Gehenna". "Gehenna" is actually a physical place here on earth. To me it's pretty clear that Jesus was speaking metaphorically while trying to describe a life (or death) lived in separation from God. Many people interpret Gehenna to be a place where the wicked go until they are able to reconcile themselves with Sprit. Nothing at all indicates a place of eternal torment.

A loving God. The Creator of this Universe. All Good. All Love. All Knowing. All Powerful. That God simply does not send His creation to an eternity of suffering and pain. And that God did not need to send His Son to suffer in order to "save" people. Sorry, but that makes no sense at all. Jesus came to earth as a perfect example of God's love. He was an expression of God on earth. We should all try to be the same. His death was meant as an example of sacrificial love. God didn't send His Son to earth to die for my sins. God is perfectly capable of forgiveness without torturing and killing his Son to achieve that. Jesus chose that path because His death was an example we as humans could relate to. There is no greater sacrifice than death.

I suggest anyone who believes in eternal torment spend some time away from church and in quiet meditation and prayer. I think the answer becomes very clear.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:So no one thinks we have to account for our sins ever? We can live our lives any ol' way and then just go to sleep?

I think we account for them here on earth. And I think we probably do account for them after we die. But not by spending eternity in "hell". I think we probably keep trying until we finally get it right. We return to work on the things that we didn't get right the last time. We are on this planet to learn to be more loving and more compassionate. But that's certainly not Biblical...just my thoughts.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:So no one thinks we have to account for our sins ever? We can live our lives any ol' way and then just go to sleep?

Human societies have established justice systems to protect people and to punish them. Sometimes they work well and sometimes they don't and sometimes guilty people are never caught and brought to justice.

It pleasant to think that there's some supernatural justice system, where everyone gets what's coming to them but it seems like a fantasy. Even in this supernatural system, people of different beliefs have different ideas of what happens -- 72 virgins in heaven for martyrdom or an eternity in hell for killing innocent people?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:So no one thinks we have to account for our sins ever? We can live our lives any ol' way and then just go to sleep?

I think we account for them here on earth. And I think we probably do account for them after we die. But not by spending eternity in "hell". I think we probably keep trying until we finally get it right. We return to work on the things that we didn't get right the last time. We are on this planet to learn to be more loving and more compassionate. But that's certainly not Biblical...just my thoughts.

So you believe in reincarnation?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:So no one thinks we have to account for our sins ever? We can live our lives any ol' way and then just go to sleep?

I think we account for them here on earth. And I think we probably do account for them after we die. But not by spending eternity in "hell". I think we probably keep trying until we finally get it right. We return to work on the things that we didn't get right the last time. We are on this planet to learn to be more loving and more compassionate. But that's certainly not Biblical...just my thoughts.

So you believe in reincarnation?

I didn't used to. But I think I might. I've read some pretty compelling stories about people who claim to remember parts of past lives. The ones from children really make me wonder. And to me it makes sense. If "hell" is separation from God, then life on earth would be hell. I'm wondering if maybe we just keep trying until we finally get it right. I'm not trying to prove my point. It's just something I've been thinking a lot about lately.

[Anonymous]

Yes, Jesus spoke in parables and metaphors, but don't parables and metaphors have meaning? If your parable and metaphor includes fire, torment, wailing, darkness and destruction, it's probably a metaphor for something very, very bad. I simply don't understand this reasoning that Jesus spoke in metaphors, therefore I'll make it mean whatever.

[Anonymous]

When you die, you just die. There's nothig afterwards. You don't get rewards for being good or punishment for being bad. Why do you all need to cling to an imagined afterlife to make your lives on earth meaningful? You all sound so sad.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I'm a Christian. I do not believe in hell, at least not in the way people have been coerced into believing. If you take the time to research the original Biblical text you'll find that nothing like "hell" is ever mentioned in the scripture. Here's a really easy to read link with some examples. http://www.thehypertexts.com/no%20hell%20in%20the%20bible.htm Do some research on the original meaning of the words that were later translated to mean "hell". They aren't even close.

The Hell we are warned about today didn't exist in Biblical times. "Hell" was created by powerful people as a means of control. Nothing more. Think about it logically. If you are a Christian, you know that God is all good. All loving. All compassion. He created you out from an abundance of love. As your Creator, He/She is incapable of causing you pain. Is there anything one of your children could do - anything at all - that would cause you to send him to an eternity of suffering an pain? God's love for us is even greater than the love we have for our children and for each other. He is author of love!

Fundamental Christianity is nothing short of religious abuse. I believe it has damaged many, many people (like the pp who is terrified of hell). Christianity is wonderful! Christ was a living example of God's perfect love. To be a Christian means to be "Christ-like". What could possibly be better than modeling your life after someone who was kind, compassionate, loving, forgiving, generous, enlightened .... All things we should strive to be. Being Christ-like has nothing to do with terrifying people into religious submission.

God is All-good. All-loving. All-powerful. Love. Light. Perfection. Grace. He created you and wants only your highest and best.

Fundamentalists, who depend solely on the Bible for their beliefs, definitely think Hell is a real place. How do you account for that, if it's not in the Bible?

It's in the Bible that they read. But if you go back and read scripture before it was translated and retranslated and before powerful people decided what should and should not be included, it's pretty clear that "hell" didn't exist in the way we are taught that it did.

Sorry, no. The Gospels are intact from when they written, in Greek, in the first century. And in them, Jesus discusses Hell numerous times. Yes, he uses some metaphor, but his descriptions of out darkness, weeping and gnashing of teeth, eternal fire, torment, and everlasting conscious destruction should give anyone pause who claims to be a Christian but denies the reality of Hell. Hell is the backdrop of God's love for us. Hell was prepared for Satan and his angels, who rebelled even while in Heaven and fully aware of exactly who God is. Those who reject Christ are afforded this same eternal dwelling place with those who die in their sin without being forgiven by Christ, whose who ultimately cast their lot against God and with this angelic rebellion. It is God's great love for us that caused him to offer His son, Jesus Christ, who is God in the flesh, as a sacrifice for us to save us from this fate.

Jesus spoke in parables and metaphors all the time. If you've read the Bible, you understand that not everything He said was meant to be taken literally. I think it is a huge mistake to read any ancient text through modern eyes. You absolutely must read the Bible with a keen awareness of the time and place in which it was written. More importantly, we have to remember that we don't have any evidence at all that Jesus ever wrote anything. We can assume He had the ability to read and write because He spent a lot of time at the temple studying and talking with priests. But we don't have a single piece of scripture written by Jesus Himself. So, in addition to considering time and place, we have to consider that fallible people did the best they could to capture the messages Jesus shared. Add to that the countless number of discrepancies caused by multiple translations. I love the Bible! I've studied and taught classes for years on the different authors, subjects, and books. I always teach with mindfulness and respect for history and context.

And the subject of "hell" does not hold up to scrutiny. Look at the words used in the original scripture. They are nothing like the "hell" we scare people with today. And why didn't God say anything at all about hell to Cain? For heaven's sake (*snert) he killed his brother in cold blood! Noah? The wicked perished, but there is nothing about eternal suffering. The cities of Sodom and Gomorrah (they were burned in the here and now, but for eternity, nope.)? There are countless examples of horribly wicked people who suffered on earth, but nothing to suggest eternal suffering.

New testament? Go look at the definition of "Hades". That word can actually mean either punishment or reward depending on how it is used. Most Biblical scholars believe the authors were describing a place of forgetfulness. Unawareness of God. The word "Tartarus" simply refers to a pit. A great metaphor for life without spiritual enlightenment. Jesus Christ used the word "Gehenna". "Gehenna" is actually a physical place here on earth. To me it's pretty clear that Jesus was speaking metaphorically while trying to describe a life (or death) lived in separation from God. Many people interpret Gehenna to be a place where the wicked go until they are able to reconcile themselves with Sprit. Nothing at all indicates a place of eternal torment.

A loving God. The Creator of this Universe. All Good. All Love. All Knowing. All Powerful. That God simply does not send His creation to an eternity of suffering and pain. And that God did not need to send His Son to suffer in order to "save" people. Sorry, but that makes no sense at all. Jesus came to earth as a perfect example of God's love. He was an expression of God on earth. We should all try to be the same. His death was meant as an example of sacrificial love. God didn't send His Son to earth to die for my sins. God is perfectly capable of forgiveness without torturing and killing his Son to achieve that. Jesus chose that path because His death was an example we as humans could relate to. There is no greater sacrifice than death.

I suggest anyone who believes in eternal torment spend some time away from church and in quiet meditation and prayer. I think the answer becomes very clear.

It depends what you mean by "literally." The Bible doesn't record Jesus just ruminating on things and making up stories. Everything he said had a literal truth to it, regardless of whether that truth was portrayed using any number of different types of communication. If you called me from somewhere and said, "What's the weather like there," and I said, "It's raining cats and dogs," you know there aren't animals falling from the sky, but you would be foolish to conclude from that that it's a sunny day.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:When you die, you just die. There's nothig afterwards. You don't get rewards for being good or punishment for being bad. Why do you all need to cling to an imagined afterlife to make your lives on earth meaningful? You all sound so sad.

Many people were taught to believe these things as children, and in many ways, our majority Christian society supports these beliefs, so it can be hard to look at them with adult eyes.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:So no one thinks we have to account for our sins ever? We can live our lives any ol' way and then just go to sleep?

I think we account for them here on earth. And I think we probably do account for them after we die. But not by spending eternity in "hell". I think we probably keep trying until we finally get it right. We return to work on the things that we didn't get right the last time. We are on this planet to learn to be more loving and more compassionate. But that's certainly not Biblical...just my thoughts.

and this is based on what?

[Anonymous]

Non-religious person here. I don't believe in Hell as it is often thought of. Not an after life sort of thing. I believe Hell exists or has existed right here on Earth. Auschwitz, for example.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:When you die, you just die. There's nothig afterwards. You don't get rewards for being good or punishment for being bad. Why do you all need to cling to an imagined afterlife to make your lives on earth meaningful? You all sound so sad.

Many people were taught to believe these things as children, and in many ways, our majority Christian society supports these beliefs, so it can be hard to look at them with adult eyes.

How above it all you are with your adult ways.

[Anonymous]

Anyone who has been to Ikea on a Sunday knows that Hell is very real.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:When you die, you just die. There's nothig afterwards. You don't get rewards for being good or punishment for being bad. Why do you all need to cling to an imagined afterlife to make your lives on earth meaningful? You all sound so sad.

Many people were taught to believe these things as children, and in many ways, our majority Christian society supports these beliefs, so it can be hard to look at them with adult eyes.

How above it all you are with your adult ways.

Not at all. We all change in many ways as we become adults. We don't cry as easily; we don't feel as helpless (because we aren't); we learn how to make decisions for ourselves; and we figure things more out for ourselves instead of relying on an authority.

In some cases, we keep the same beliefs and behaviors that we had as children - we may still be kind, or jealous, or decisive or credulous. We may think about some things in more detail, using internal and external resources not available to us as children, or we may think about some things less or not at all. Attitudes about religion certainly fit in with things we may or may not relate to differently when we're adults.