Date-of-Application-Based Wait Lists

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

I applied to Yu Ying online and got a very good waitlist number. I do not think YY gives advantage to those who show up in person, based on my experience. I applied at the stroke of 8am on the morning the lottery opened.

What would you have done if you did not have internet service in your residence that day, and the library with the free internet access was closed because it was only 8 a.m., and your equally impoverished friends and relatives also did not have internet access?

Oh, and you couldn't camp out the night before / morning of because you were at your $8.74 an hour job as an elder care worker doing the overnight shift and no vacation/flex-time option? ie, you don't show up, you are fired?

I think I've pretty accurately described the situation of many of DC's poorest single moms. I guess the "early bird" waitlist schools don't need them.

But you do not need to show up in person as the guardian - you only need someone to be there to hand it in. You do not know a single person who could be there? A neighbor, cousin, grandparent, friend?

[Anonymous]

I believe that the date-of-application waitlists really do pose a hardship for poorer parents. But I don't quite understand folks who are so very up in arms. Are you lobbying for that aspect of the charter law to be changed? Unlike so many other aspects of the charter system that folks rail against, I think that this change would not be particularly difficult, politically.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

I applied to Yu Ying online and got a very good waitlist number. I do not think YY gives advantage to those who show up in person, based on my experience. I applied at the stroke of 8am on the morning the lottery opened.

What would you have done if you did not have internet service in your residence that day, and the library with the free internet access was closed because it was only 8 a.m., and your equally impoverished friends and relatives also did not have internet access?

Oh, and you couldn't camp out the night before / morning of because you were at your $8.74 an hour job as an elder care worker doing the overnight shift and no vacation/flex-time option? ie, you don't show up, you are fired?

I think I've pretty accurately described the situation of many of DC's poorest single moms. I guess the "early bird" waitlist schools don't need them.

But you do not need to show up in person as the guardian - you only need someone to be there to hand it in. You do not know a single person who could be there? A neighbor, cousin, grandparent, friend?

You could hire one of those line-sitters outside of Congressional hearings! Yes! This gets better and better? Tell me more about my options!

[Anonymous]

People are focusing on wait lists will forgetting that the drawn slots for actual spots at both Stokes and YY are completely random admission. So your poor impoverished single mom has an equal shot as your hooty, snooty parent from any where else.

The waitlist is ordered by time of arrival. You could rail against it, but I personally think that in the scheme of things if you are looking to create diverse; integrated schools, the best way to do that is more widely market so that your initial applicant pull for the random drawing is diverse by income level. Before you argue that poor single moms are being turned away because of the wait list ordering, and ask how many are in the initial applicant pool to begin with.

The self selection that goes on in application pools (deciding what schools to even apply for) happens way before the wait list is even a factor.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

I applied to Yu Ying online and got a very good waitlist number. I do not think YY gives advantage to those who show up in person, based on my experience. I applied at the stroke of 8am on the morning the lottery opened.

What would you have done if you did not have internet service in your residence that day, and the library with the free internet access was closed because it was only 8 a.m., and your equally impoverished friends and relatives also did not have internet access?

Oh, and you couldn't camp out the night before / morning of because you were at your $8.74 an hour job as an elder care worker doing the overnight shift and no vacation/flex-time option? ie, you don't show up, you are fired?

I think I've pretty accurately described the situation of many of DC's poorest single moms. I guess the "early bird" waitlist schools don't need them.

But you do not need to show up in person as the guardian - you only need someone to be there to hand it in. You do not know a single person who could be there? A neighbor, cousin, grandparent, friend?

You could hire one of those line-sitters outside of Congressional hearings! Yes! This gets better and better? Tell me more about my options!

It is not long ago that DCPS PreK was done though lines. People hired individuals to wait for them and this was done away with.

[Anonymous]

Comparing the YY inital random acceptance to the YY preK class list as of mid-Sept

18 of 33 random admits enrolled, 55%
8 of 10 in the first 10 on wait list, 80%
6 of 10 from 11 - 20 on wait list, 60%
4 of 10 from 21 - 30 on wait list, 40%
4 of 10 from 31 - 40 on wait list, 40%
2 of 4 from 41 -44 on wait list, 50%
Names that did not appear by mid-Sept (there may have been a late Sept shuffle), original wait list number 45 to 229

So if your application was submitted such that your WL number was greater than 45, your chance at admission was 12.6%. The 33 random spots divided by 262. 262 is the sum of the initial wait list (229) plus initial spots offered (33).

If your application was submitted early enough to be on the top 44 slots on the original wait list, your chance of admission was 100%.

At Stokes, there were so many PreS/PreK siblings in 2012-13, that a random lottery was not held. So the chance of admission was directly related to how high on the WL your child was, directly related to when you submitted the application. If you were last on the wait list, your chance of admission was ZERO.

At Washington Latin, all 5th graders were eventually offered slots. It is unknown how many slots were available in 6th, 7th, 8th, or 9th, but I would guess that application submission order made a difference. Latin is going to a randomly ordered wait list for 2013-14 admission.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:People are focusing on wait lists will forgetting that the drawn slots for actual spots at both Stokes and YY are completely random admission. So your poor impoverished single mom has an equal shot as your hooty, snooty parent from any where else.

Uh-huh. So it's fair because it's a lottery for the 10-20 assured slots, but the 200 on the wait list are ordered based on when you show up, application in hand.

[Anonymous]

09:32- I totally agree with you (you quoted me abput my YY app).

I don't like date of application based waitlists for the reasons you mention and because they disadvantage people who are not in the know. But in that post I was responding to someone who thought YY prioritized people who apply in person. I don't think that is the case.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Here is a question: why *wouldn't* a PCS use a pure lottery system to order the waitlist applicants?

Can you articulate a compelling policy reason why a school should NOT go with pure lottery?

(now that we all have the computer technology to do this easily, e.g., spit out random numbers in <5 seconds).

Easy: to get the people who really want to go to the school. More interest by parents = more involvement = better outcome for kids.

Also: to make sure you are fully enrolled. According to the PP above, YY had to make offers to at least 77 families to fill 33 non-sibling slots, and nearly half of the first 44 people to apply turned the school down. That percentage would likely be far lower if the wait list were random.

[Anonymous]

Double posting. I had previously posted that I dislike date of
Application based waitlists. But I was just playing the game the way it's currently set up. I knew that if I was at all interested in YY or Stokes I would have to submit as soon as the lottery opened. So that's what I did. I still don't think it's fair.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

I applied to Yu Ying online and got a very good waitlist number. I do not think YY gives advantage to those who show up in person, based on my experience. I applied at the stroke of 8am on the morning the lottery opened.

What would you have done if you did not have internet service in your residence that day, and the library with the free internet access was closed because it was only 8 a.m., and your equally impoverished friends and relatives also did not have internet access?

Oh, and you couldn't camp out the night before / morning of because you were at your $8.74 an hour job as an elder care worker doing the overnight shift and no vacation/flex-time option? ie, you don't show up, you are fired?

I think I've pretty accurately described the situation of many of DC's poorest single moms. I guess the "early bird" waitlist schools don't need them.

Spare us your "oh so compassionate" scenario. Impoverished people figure it out when it matters to them. There is always a way, though it may be tough: and so will the day to day demands of the curriculum at these schools that have been mentioned. Many will be the roadblocks to a great education around here. Impoverished or not, individuals have to make it happen.

[Anonymous]

You don't have to camp out at stokes. My ps3er got off the wait list and we got there two hours early. Yes, more impoverished families will find doing this harder but a few hours in exchange for a much better shot at a great primary education ( few hours vs many years) is an obvious choice. In all this discussion about fairness... There is no way to ensure a perfectly fair process. Even if it is totally random, is it fair that someone who moves to DC after the lottery is at the very bottom of the list. Is it fair that we have such income inequality in the first place. As long as the rules are clear and upheld, I am in favor of the wait list by date of application received.

[Anonymous]

Love how some are so up in arms about "poor, single, mothers." Like you really want your kids go to school where over 50%, 90% are FARMS. So move to Ward 8 and send your kid to the local public: What a badge of honor - like anyone would ever do this.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Love how some are so up in arms about "poor, single, mothers." Like you really want your kids go to school where over 50%, 90% are FARMS. So move to Ward 8 and send your kid to the local public: What a badge of honor - like anyone would ever do this.

Actually, most posters hate both Yu Ying and poor children. That's why they denounce the school and say that it needs more FARMS kids.

[Anonymous]

^^. PP thanks for the laugh although now I have to clean up the coffee I spit out