Did anyone else think the chinese gymnast did not look at least 16 years of age?

[Anonymous]

PP is right about age being an advantage.. good article about this in sports illustrated..
http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/2008/olympics/2008/writers/em_swift/08/14/underage.olympians/index.html?bcnn=yes

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Just out of curiosity, I put the vital statistics - 16 years old, 4'7" tall, 68 pounds- of Deng Linlin (the aforementioned Chinese gymnast) into the CDC's body mass calculator for teens. This are the results they gave me:

"Based on the height and weight entered, the BMI is 15.8, placing the BMI-for-age below the 1st percentile for girls aged 16 years. This teen is underweight and should be seen by a healthcare provider for further assessment to determine possible causes of underweight."

Please don't make the argument that you liked the Chinese gymnasts better because they are healthier. And please don't lecture us on health issues if you have no problem with a 68 pound 16 year old. At that point it becomes some very weird body distortion issue on your part.

This is kind of a silly argument, isn't it? Because none of us believe this girl is actually 16.

A BMI of 15.8 is only SLIGHTLY below weight for a 14 year old (16.1 is the cutoff for the normal range), and WITHIN the normal range for a 12 year old (which I suspect is what she is).

I thought the Chinese girls were beautiful and healthy pre-teens and teens (putting aside the issue of gymnastics). I thought the American women were lovely and healthy young ladies.

[Anonymous]

I posted earlier. Good SI interview with Swift, thanks for posting. I'm actually very angry about this and I can't believe there isn't more outrage than there is. Strip their medals. If you watched the team final -- look at those girls and compare them to Liukin or even Johnson (at 16) or the Romanians versus those little girls on the Chinese team. It is 'institutionalized cheating.' The Chinese did in the 90s in swimming when as many as 30 swimmers on the Chinese team were caught up in a steroid scandal.

I feel for these athletes who play by the rules -- like that US swimmer living in McLean (who's now well into middle age) who competed against the East Germans and said she heard men's voices in the women's lockerroom. It was the steroid-head E. Germans. They lost medals to these cheaters. Terrible. And the same thing is happening now with the Chinese gymnasts. It's child abuse to have their developing bodies take that kind of abuse and they are at unfair advantage. It's wrong and I agree with the article, against everything the Olympics stands for.

[Anonymous]

I think the intense athletics involved in gymnastics makes one look younger. I thought Nastia Liukin was 16 yo, but she's 18. She looks younger than her age. Plus from a cultural perspective, Asians look at Western people and think they look old for their age.

[Anonymous]

Then why are the Chinese having such a hard producing the documentation? A: Because they are lying about the ages of these young children. This has nothing to with "cultural perspective." Some of these girls still have their baby teeth. Other countries are following the rules and getting ripped off in the process and it's not fair. I feel for the US teams and the other teams who are playing fairly.

http://www.time.com/time/world/article/0,8599,1832312,00.html?imw=Y

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Then why are the Chinese having such a hard producing the documentation? A: Because they are lying about the ages of these young children. This has nothing to with "cultural perspective." Some of these girls still have their baby teeth. Other countries are following the rules and getting ripped off in the process and it's not fair. I feel for the US teams and the other teams who are playing fairly.

http://www.time.com/time/world/article/0,8599,1832312,00.html?imw=Y

The Americans are not the only ones suffering from agony of defeat because they missed the thrill of victory. During the gymnastics event last night, one of the commentators mentioned that the Korean gymnast had lost the gold and placed at the bronze level because of a 0.5 point deficit. He "lost" the gold because the judges started him off at the wrong starting score of 9.9 rather than 10.0. In terms of correct points earned, the Korean won the gold, but due to mathematic errors with the judges, the gold went to Paul Hamm, an American. How disappointing, agonizing, and rip-offy is that?

There are controversies in every Olympics. I feel for the athletes when they work so hard to reach this far and they don't get what they earned and deserve.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I posted earlier. Good SI interview with Swift, thanks for posting. I'm actually very angry about this and I can't believe there isn't more outrage than there is. Strip their medals. If you watched the team final -- look at those girls and compare them to Liukin or even Johnson (at 16) or the Romanians versus those little girls on the Chinese team. It is 'institutionalized cheating.' The Chinese did in the 90s in swimming when as many as 30 swimmers on the Chinese team were caught up in a steroid scandal.

I feel for these athletes who play by the rules -- like that US swimmer living in McLean (who's now well into middle age) who competed against the East Germans and said she heard men's voices in the women's lockerroom. It was the steroid-head E. Germans. They lost medals to these cheaters. Terrible. And the same thing is happening now with the Chinese gymnasts. It's child abuse to have their developing bodies take that kind of abuse and they are at unfair advantage. It's wrong and I agree with the article, against everything the Olympics stands for.

I posted the SI article too- I feel the same- very angry. This form of institutionalized cheating is disgraceful and should NOT be allowed.

[Anonymous]

This is kind of a silly argument, isn't it? Because none of us believe this girl is actually 16.

A BMI of 15.8 is only SLIGHTLY below weight for a 14 year old (16.1 is the cutoff for the normal range), and WITHIN the normal range for a 12 year old (which I suspect is what she is).

I thought the Chinese girls were beautiful and healthy pre-teens and teens (putting aside the issue of gymnastics). I thought the American women were lovely and healthy young ladies.

If she is 12, it makes it even worse that her body is considered closer to some physical ideal, while gymnasts like Nastia Liukin (5'2, 99 lbs., 18 years old) are called mutton. That is the only silly argument on this thread (actually, it is beyond silly - it is actually quite sick).

[Anonymous]

The poster who believes that the Chinese gymnasts are healthier than the American gymnasts because they are thinner -- you need a reality check. To expect an eighteen-year-old athlete to have the same body type as a twelve-year-old is seriously messed up. Our bodies change during puberty for a reason, and to hold up a prepubescent girl's body as a womanly ideal is, quite simply, dangerous.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Then why are the Chinese having such a hard producing the documentation? A: Because they are lying about the ages of these young children. This has nothing to with "cultural perspective." Some of these girls still have their baby teeth. Other countries are following the rules and getting ripped off in the process and it's not fair. I feel for the US teams and the other teams who are playing fairly.

http://www.time.com/time/world/article/0,8599,1832312,00.html?imw=Y

The Americans are not the only ones suffering from agony of defeat because they missed the thrill of victory. During the gymnastics event last night, one of the commentators mentioned that the Korean gymnast had lost the gold and placed at the bronze level because of a 0.5 point deficit. He "lost" the gold because the judges started him off at the wrong starting score of 9.9 rather than 10.0. In terms of correct points earned, the Korean won the gold, but due to mathematic errors with the judges, the gold went to Paul Hamm, an American. How disappointing, agonizing, and rip-offy is that?

There are controversies in every Olympics. I feel for the athletes when they work so hard to reach this far and they don't get what they earned and deserve.

This isn't some scoring error I'm talking about. Nor am I saying that the Americans are the "only ones suffering" I mentioned other countries' as well. Paul Hamm's medal controvery four years ago (he withdrew, like his brother, b/c of injury in Beijing) was unfortunate, sure, but not really relevant to this discussion -- one of blatant, obvious cheating by the Chinese government. Gymnastics is very subjective and not immune from scoring errors and politics too, when some countries' judges deliberately score athletes from some countries lower.

[Anonymous]

After being snatched away from their families at 3 years old they've probably been fed rice, veggies, and water to keep their small frame

[Anonymous]

The IOC has always reeked with corruption, and they simply look the other way to appease certain federations, like the Chinese and, at other times, the Russians. Kind of like how the French got nailed to the wall for the figure skating dance/pairs deal at the 2002 Winter Olympics, but the Russians, who were the other half of the deal, were never held accountable. The Russian officials, that is - the Russian pair team did have to share the gold, ultimately (and that was only because of intense media pressure).

[Anonymous]

Irrespective of how old the Chinese girls actually are looking up their BMI based on US numbers is silly when the US numbers are based on heavier women. So it may be underweight here, but not in China where not everyone has access to McDonalds and all the other crap we have here. "Average" and "normal" is totally different here versus China and it's not good analysis to compare the two populations.

Whether or not these girls are 12 or 16, see in four years what they look like.

[Anonymous]

I don't think you actually get what the BMI is. It is NOT an average weight range - it is a mathematical formula used to assess healthy weight levels. It doesn't get more or less applicable depending on the nationality of the person being assessed. That is exactly the point being made - that BMI is an actual health-based indicator, not some subjective aesthetic criteria, which makes it more useful that just saying a 68 pound gymnast looks better and a 98 pound gymnast is "mutton".

[Anonymous]

But what criteria determines what is average BMI? You think they make up the ranges out of a hat?