If you like "differentiated instruction"

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Also-CAS scores have nothing to do with it. 3rd graders went in this from 2nd grade class with no testing history on CAS.

Dollars to doughnuts that DCPS starts DC-CAS testing in the second grade real soon.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Not delusional in the least. The immersion model doesn't presuppose one language over the other. That's the whole idea. It is developmentally appropriate that the students have some difficulty learning both languages, but if the teachers are teaching the same concepts in both languages, the children will have less difficulty. You simply cannot say they are "failing" at the young age of 8 years old. That is what is DELUSIONAL!!

As the parent of a very intelligent 8 y.o. boy with Asperger's, I can assure you that you have no idea what you're talking about.

What you're saying is all very nice in theory. However when a child has difficulty with speech pragmatics in English, the solution is not to put him in a foreign language for ever other day.

You people who think there's one model of schooling for everyone make me wish I could kick you in the teeth. That's probably what it would take for you to see enough stars to actually see the light.

Not that I want to go around kicking people in the teeth, but PP has an excellent point. Take a look at the scientific research - Thomas and Collier, Tabors, Cummins, Clark (just to name a few). Most conclude that if a child does not have a sound academic base in his/her native language, ANY language acquisition will be challenging and flawed. Since language acquisition in Early Childhood (3 - 6 years old) is primarily auditory (with the exception of early readers), any child exposed to a second language before age 8 (when they really get into grammar and syntax and the academic study of language) will experience difficulty - especially if the second language is not supported in the home (which I assume is true for most YY families). This doesn't even take into account Gardner's theory of multiple intelligences regarding how each child's brain processes input differently and therefor NO ONE can learn the same/at the same rate in the same environment! Of course "one size fits all" is ridiculous for education, and NO, tracking is not the answer. Differentiated instruction starts to address the issue, but it's hard to truly achieve that when teaching in a dual-language immersion environment. Such a program inherently has other aims and priorities to its curriculum. It sounds like PP really knows her/his child and his unique strengths and needs. You can't rely on general ed. teachers to do the same for each student, regardless of experience - not enough hours in the day for that.

Totally unrelated to differentiated instruction, but I have to ask...

Why are parents pushing this bilingual education model on their young children?! Do you all read and speak to your children in the target language at home? It's one thing if you have systems in place to support your child's second language acquisition while he/she continues to master his/her primary tongue, but if after their school experience they do not have the opportunity to extend that learning and continually utilize the second language in an essential and functional manner, then why?

Because they want to give their children the gift of a second language? There are many countries, with excellent education systems (better than ours, certainly) wherein students begin a second language in childhood, and sometimes even a third in adolescence. Most Finish students, for example, speak Finish, Swedish, and English - even if their parents only speak Finish. It seems to be only Americans who think learning one language is sufficient and learning a second is too challenging.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:
Why are parents pushing this bilingual education model on their young children?! Do you all read and speak to your children in the target language at home? It's one thing if you have systems in place to support your child's second language acquisition while he/she continues to master his/her primary tongue, but if after their school experience they do not have the opportunity to extend that learning and continually utilize the second language in an essential and functional manner, then why?


Because they want to give their children the gift of a second language? There are many countries, with excellent education systems (better than ours, certainly) wherein students begin a second language in childhood, and sometimes even a third in adolescence. Most Finish students, for example, speak Finish, Swedish, and English - even if their parents only speak Finish. It seems to be only Americans who think learning one language is sufficient and learning a second is too challenging.

It's b/c most Americans expect everyone else to speak English, part of the stereotype for the "ugly American." Most elites in every other country speak at least two languages. It's funny lots of foreigners speak better English than many Americans who only speak English

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

It's b/c most Americans expect everyone else to speak English, part of the stereotype for the "ugly American." Most elites in every other country speak at least two languages. It's funny lots of foreigners speak better English than many Americans who only speak English

You fit the stereotype for "ugly foreigner." Spiritually ugly, that is.

[Anonymous]

"Spiritually ugly" b/c what? It isn't true or b/c you don't like hearing it. Ask any college instructor or look at DCPS.

[Anonymous]

Perhaps rather than beating up on immersion programs on an anonymous web forum, concerned parents can take up educational activism to increase good quality schools for 'average" kids. If a typical child cannot read at grade level by 3rd grade then it is more than the school staff's issue, it is the parent's fault too. If your kid is not reading independently simple sentences by the end of 1st grade, alarm bells should be going off and as a parent you should seek out help not wait for a 3rd grade standardized test.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Perhaps rather than beating up on immersion programs on an anonymous web forum, concerned parents can take up educational activism to increase good quality schools for 'average" kids. If a typical child cannot read at grade level by 3rd grade then it is more than the school staff's issue, it is the parent's fault too. If your kid is not reading independently simple sentences by the end of 1st grade, alarm bells should be going off and as a parent you should seek out help not wait for a 3rd grade standardized test.

Stop it. If you keep making sense like that around here, sooner or later people will come to expect it. And then what will happen to the DCUM mosh-pit?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Perhaps rather than beating up on immersion programs on an anonymous web forum, concerned parents can take up educational activism to increase good quality schools for 'average" kids. If a typical child cannot read at grade level by 3rd grade then it is more than the school staff's issue, it is the parent's fault too. If your kid is not reading independently simple sentences by the end of 1st grade, alarm bells should be going off and as a parent you should seek out help not wait for a 3rd grade standardized test.

PP (and advocate) here... My point was that parents blindly place their children in these programs without having done any research on what it actually takes to raise/educate a bilingual child. I would advocate (anonymously here, yes) that families understand their children's unique qualities and needs AND have a real understanding of the education model they are signing up for. I actually think that dual-language immersion programs should be more common than they are, and it would be wonderful if the States could eventually catch up to other nations that teach foreign language starting in early childhood. The difference is that foreign language instruction and dual-language immersion are two different things. Can you honestly tell me that the families that attend a school such as YY regularly exercise their child's knowledge of the Mandarin language?! If you really want your child to get ahead and have the amazing advantage of being multilingual, then set the example and learn a foreign language yourself! It is so frustrating to read these posts time and time again, by people who have no actual knowledge to back up their opinions. EVERY parent should be an educational advocate and, of course, realize that the parent is the primary educator of the child.

[Anonymous]

"hat families understand their children's unique qualities and needs AND have a real understanding of the education model they are signing up for."

Yeah, cuz everyone has that figured out for their 4 year old. So. damn. tired. of YY boosters.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:
Why are parents pushing this bilingual education model on their young children?! Do you all read and speak to your children in the target language at home? It's one thing if you have systems in place to support your child's second language acquisition while he/she continues to master his/her primary tongue, but if after their school experience they do not have the opportunity to extend that learning and continually utilize the second language in an essential and functional manner, then why?


Because they want to give their children the gift of a second language? There are many countries, with excellent education systems (better than ours, certainly) wherein students begin a second language in childhood, and sometimes even a third in adolescence. Most Finish students, for example, speak Finish, Swedish, and English - even if their parents only speak Finish. It seems to be only Americans who think learning one language is sufficient and learning a second is too challenging.

What do the other countries do with their poor native speakers / readers? Are they tracked out of the English program and into Finnish only?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:
Why are parents pushing this bilingual education model on their young children?! Do you all read and speak to your children in the target language at home? It's one thing if you have systems in place to support your child's second language acquisition while he/she continues to master his/her primary tongue, but if after their school experience they do not have the opportunity to extend that learning and continually utilize the second language in an essential and functional manner, then why?


Because they want to give their children the gift of a second language? There are many countries, with excellent education systems (better than ours, certainly) wherein students begin a second language in childhood, and sometimes even a third in adolescence. Most Finish students, for example, speak Finish, Swedish, and English - even if their parents only speak Finish. It seems to be only Americans who think learning one language is sufficient and learning a second is too challenging.

What do the other countries do with their poor native speakers / readers? Are they tracked out of the English program and into Finnish only?

Not really an issue, approx. 5% of the population in Finland, Sweden, Denmark, Switzerland, etc. are poor. They don't have to deal with poverty and the low educational achievement that typically comes with it.

[Anonymous]

Thanks.