Anyone regret getting child a neuropsych. eval.?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:No! I wish I could do one on my neurotypical kids. Such wonderful insights into what makes them tick, their strengths and weaknesses. So helpful.

Huh. Like how? I already knew all do these going in with my kid with significant challenges so I honestly found them useless. Like no utility served at all. And we already had an ADHD diagnosis and did all the therapy. I think it completely depends on your kid and the issues. Most parents of kids with issues to the degree of mine have also said they’re pretty redundant.

What a lie. My adult and teen kids both have diagnoses and we've been in the special needs sphere for 15+ years. Not a single parent ever said the neuropsych was redundant. In fact, most said they wished they could have done it sooner.

This weirdly aggressive post questioning other people’s experiences is made even more inappropriate by the numerous other posters agreeing with the fact that neurophysiological testing is not always helpful.

[Anonymous]

What’s weird about neuropsych testing is that it is a lot of money and professional time spent on not actually getting to understand the kid as an individual. I have the money to pay for another round of private testing but I don’t find it worthwhile at all to pay for. I would absolutely pay that much money for someone who would sit with my kid, observe him at school and with friends, talk to teachers, talk to parents, look at school records, and then provide actual tailored advice about supports and school choices and additional therapy needs. Infinitely more valuable and even more valuable than a diagnosis.

For just one example - my kid (who has an ASD dx) has been struggling in math. The knee jerk reaction was initially that the school based on neuropsych testing and their flawed understanding of autism wanted to say that because of autism he would struggle with higher level math that required conceptual understanding vs rote memorizing needed for younger years. Well that was totally and completely wrong. We got him into math tutoring and after 6 months with a fantastic tutor who really understands math and has tutored or taught many kids, the tutor was able to explain that the issue had nothing to do with kid’s ability to learn math concepts and that he didn’t even need any additional practice or repetition compared to other kids and completes work in a normal time period when he has heard the lesson. The issue was that he was missing the classroom explanation of concepts (zoning out or doing something else). Tutor’s theory (which I agree with) is that the lack of structure in the class and lack of written materials meant he was missing the cues about when to focus and then did not have any structure or written materials to easily go back and figure out what he had missed when he realized he didn’t know how to do the assignment.

That insight from someone who actually knows my kid was incredibly, incredibly valuable - not just for math but for everything going forward. You could say it was just ADHD (although the neuropsychs *never found ADHD* and teachers consistently said his focus was age appropriate) but even that label would not have identified with such concreteness what this issue is - which is an interplay between attention, attending to social cues, need for structure, playing out in an educational system that has gotten rid of major ways that they help kids self-monitor their learning (books! Syllabi!).

[Anonymous]

I don’t regret it but it was a lot of money to confirm what we already knew.

[Anonymous]

Phenomenal reply to the poster above. Absolutely feel the same!! The neuro “testing” for diagnosis without truly observing child in the classroom for more than a day (we did testing through the school) does not present a broad picture of the child and yes I would agree with actually sitting down with parents and teachers and having a proper discussion about observations would be fantastic rather than relying on a one dimensional paper pen computer questionnaire. One of my daughter’s teachers for instance labeled her as looking glum most times. WTF? When said teacher was actually filling out questionnaire it was an aw week for my daughter who suffers from really bad pollen allergies…..so sleep deprived and suffering of course she would have been appearing that way. Absolutely the lack of proper math explanations offered to children, ie: no math books to look through for examples is stunning to me!and would be absolutely helpful for my daughter as well. We thought about paying for a neuropsych assessment but you just reminded me about why it just might be useless most times.

[Anonymous]

In my case my son went through the whole process of testing and a neuropsych eval at 3. He was in PK3, having a lot of potty training issues at school and was very shy - basically did not speak at all at school. He wouldn't participate in most classroom activities. He was on the very late end of the average range for most milestones - late to sit, late to crawl, walked at 17 months, slow to talk, etc. The charter we attended pushed getting him evaluated for special needs very hard. He had a neuropsych eval that described profound issues and likely autism (he refused to participate in most of the testing). We enrolled him in private PT and OT, plus he got speech therapy at school.

Around age 5 he was "coming out of his shell" at school much more. I also took him to Kennedy Krieger to go over his prior evaluation and talk about his history - they suggested he had early global delays but based on this exam did not see autism and did not recommend further testing. By age 6 he he was participating in activities as much as other students at school and talking more. He seemed to catch up on his coordination. The school special education team told us they didn't think he had autism. He graduated from his IEP in first grade. He's 14 now, a straight A student, plays lots of sports, has lots of friends. Still an introvert, but less so than at a younger age. What can I say? It seems like it was a case of complete misdiagnosis. Maybe neuropsych evaluations on a 4 yr old are just a fallacy. I don't think my son was harmed...all the PT and OT was helpful for him. But it was such a stressful time and I'm not sure how so many professionals were so convinced despite my husband and I and my mom (who is a pediatrician!!) saying we did not think he had autism. Ugh.

The whole process of his diagnosis then un-diagnosis was so hard. I feel like all along he was just very very shy and not developmentally ready to be potty trained and be in a full day school. Looking back on his neuropsych eval it just reads like a made up scenario - it doesn't remotely sound like my child. I think I still have a copy and need to find it and shred it before my teen finds it.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:What’s weird about neuropsych testing is that it is a lot of money and professional time spent on not actually getting to understand the kid as an individual. I have the money to pay for another round of private testing but I don’t find it worthwhile at all to pay for. I would absolutely pay that much money for someone who would sit with my kid, observe him at school and with friends, talk to teachers, talk to parents, look at school records, and then provide actual tailored advice about supports and school choices and additional therapy needs. Infinitely more valuable and even more valuable than a diagnosis.

For just one example - my kid (who has an ASD dx) has been struggling in math. The knee jerk reaction was initially that the school based on neuropsych testing and their flawed understanding of autism wanted to say that because of autism he would struggle with higher level math that required conceptual understanding vs rote memorizing needed for younger years. Well that was totally and completely wrong. We got him into math tutoring and after 6 months with a fantastic tutor who really understands math and has tutored or taught many kids, the tutor was able to explain that the issue had nothing to do with kid’s ability to learn math concepts and that he didn’t even need any additional practice or repetition compared to other kids and completes work in a normal time period when he has heard the lesson. The issue was that he was missing the classroom explanation of concepts (zoning out or doing something else). Tutor’s theory (which I agree with) is that the lack of structure in the class and lack of written materials meant he was missing the cues about when to focus and then did not have any structure or written materials to easily go back and figure out what he had missed when he realized he didn’t know how to do the assignment.

That insight from someone who actually knows my kid was incredibly, incredibly valuable - not just for math but for everything going forward. You could say it was just ADHD (although the neuropsychs *never found ADHD* and teachers consistently said his focus was age appropriate) but even that label would not have identified with such concreteness what this issue is - which is an interplay between attention, attending to social cues, need for structure, playing out in an educational system that has gotten rid of major ways that they help kids self-monitor their learning (books! Syllabi!).

I'm a tutor, and while I absolutely agree that math instruction itself, the instructional environment and the lack of textbooks or useful daily class notes are horrible for all students, but especially neurodivergent students, I also often read neuropsychological reports for kids that I tutor. When I get them, I usually find them helpful. (If they are well-done, and I have seen some truly unprofessional, inadequate and deliberately misleading assessments from public schools.) I can see how objective strengths and weaknesses match up to strengths and weaknesses in what I am teaching. Yes, I can tutor without it, but I may start out with the assumption that a kid takes in auditory information well, or has more memory than they do, so I have to take more time experimenting with different approaches when some testing might allow me to zero in sooner.

I think that the reason PPs are saying that neuropsychological testing is not useful is that there is a conflation of the testing itself and whether that gets the student any useful special instruction or accommodations or other knowledge that might help the parent and child make concrete changes. The sad fact is that even with the best neuropsychological report, public schools are largely unequipped to teach kids with special needs unless they fall into a common diagnostic pattern (like autism). Even though dyslexia is a well-established diagnosis, most schools do not use a dyslexia appropriate instructional package to teach reading. And, schools can barely teach neurotypical students math let alone neurodivergent kids. This is true even for the teaching profession at large, which is mostly NOT evidence based. Entire curriculums are written and provided to students without any beta testing or post-hoc analysis of whether they are effective. As a tutor, I see kids every day in schools that use Illustrative Math and/or Desmos, and I can very easily see where these curriculums are going wrong. Universities like UCSD are ringing alarm bells about the absence of math skills in students entering college.

[Anonymous]

My kids weren't tested until early in HS. Wish we'd done it sooner. But, that timing was especially helpful for DS because the psychologist discussion and the report really helped him see not just his challenges but his strengths. It really helped for him to see in black and white that he really is gifted with math. After that he decided he was going to major in math in college and that gave him a concrete goal. Made him more willing to engage with the recommended executive function and writing coaching.

For DD, it didn't seem to add much beyond an inattentive ADHD diagnosis so she could start meds. But I do think it was helpful to validate for her that she's not lazy and incompetent, she has a speciifc challenge with her brain.

[Anonymous]

Ours was a total waste. DS was having significant issues at school, and it came back super wishy washy. "He's insanely smart but not far enough into any criteria to explain any issues, there's nothing you can do."

I'm still 99% sure he has ADHD (DH's entire family does, half of my family does) along with potential autism (the other half of my family is on the spectrum) but not willing to spend another $3-5k to go elsewhere and do another one due to fear it still wouldn't show anything.

[Anonymous]

We found it helpful. One DS was tested at six years old and it put us on the right track immediately. He has dyslexia and it was very helpful to push us to get the right intervention and really lean into it. It’s made all the difference in the world.

The 2nd DS was a bit of a surprise. We didn’t know what the heck was going on with him and got him tested when he was 10 because we thought he had dyslexia because of the genetic factor. Nope. Very very much ADHD. We didn’t know what ADHD could look like and thought it was x when it can be y, z, and m. Almost off the charts. Reading intervention/tutoring would do zero for all that and the only thing that helped him academically and socially is stimulants. He’s in such a better place now and he has an improved understanding of his reactions and impulses.

None of the above would have been possible without the neuro-psych.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:We found it helpful. One DS was tested at six years old and it put us on the right track immediately. He has dyslexia and it was very helpful to push us to get the right intervention and really lean into it. It’s made all the difference in the world.

The 2nd DS was a bit of a surprise. We didn’t know what the heck was going on with him and got him tested when he was 10 because we thought he had dyslexia because of the genetic factor. Nope. Very very much ADHD. We didn’t know what ADHD could look like and thought it was x when it can be y, z, and m. Almost off the charts. Reading intervention/tutoring would do zero for all that and the only thing that helped him academically and socially is stimulants. He’s in such a better place now and he has an improved understanding of his reactions and impulses.

None of the above would have been possible without the neuro-psych.

You don’t need a “full neuropsych” to diagnose the issues you listed.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:We found it helpful. One DS was tested at six years old and it put us on the right track immediately. He has dyslexia and it was very helpful to push us to get the right intervention and really lean into it. It’s made all the difference in the world.

The 2nd DS was a bit of a surprise. We didn’t know what the heck was going on with him and got him tested when he was 10 because we thought he had dyslexia because of the genetic factor. Nope. Very very much ADHD. We didn’t know what ADHD could look like and thought it was x when it can be y, z, and m. Almost off the charts. Reading intervention/tutoring would do zero for all that and the only thing that helped him academically and socially is stimulants. He’s in such a better place now and he has an improved understanding of his reactions and impulses.

None of the above would have been possible without the neuro-psych.

You don’t need a “full neuropsych” to diagnose the issues you listed.

You are correct. With the first one, we did the psycho educational testing instead. But with the second one, we absolutely needed the full neuropysch. Trust me.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:We found it helpful. One DS was tested at six years old and it put us on the right track immediately. He has dyslexia and it was very helpful to push us to get the right intervention and really lean into it. It’s made all the difference in the world.

The 2nd DS was a bit of a surprise. We didn’t know what the heck was going on with him and got him tested when he was 10 because we thought he had dyslexia because of the genetic factor. Nope. Very very much ADHD. We didn’t know what ADHD could look like and thought it was x when it can be y, z, and m. Almost off the charts. Reading intervention/tutoring would do zero for all that and the only thing that helped him academically and socially is stimulants. He’s in such a better place now and he has an improved understanding of his reactions and impulses.

None of the above would have been possible without the neuro-psych.

You don’t need a “full neuropsych” to diagnose the issues you listed.

You are correct. With the first one, we did the psycho educational testing instead. But with the second one, we absolutely needed the full neuropysch. Trust me.

Not sure why? ADHD is not actually diagnosed through neuropsychological tests (or exclusively that way).

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:We found it helpful. One DS was tested at six years old and it put us on the right track immediately. He has dyslexia and it was very helpful to push us to get the right intervention and really lean into it. It’s made all the difference in the world.

The 2nd DS was a bit of a surprise. We didn’t know what the heck was going on with him and got him tested when he was 10 because we thought he had dyslexia because of the genetic factor. Nope. Very very much ADHD. We didn’t know what ADHD could look like and thought it was x when it can be y, z, and m. Almost off the charts. Reading intervention/tutoring would do zero for all that and the only thing that helped him academically and socially is stimulants. He’s in such a better place now and he has an improved understanding of his reactions and impulses.

None of the above would have been possible without the neuro-psych.

You don’t need a “full neuropsych” to diagnose the issues you listed.

You are correct. With the first one, we did the psycho educational testing instead. But with the second one, we absolutely needed the full neuropysch. Trust me.

Not sure why? ADHD is not actually diagnosed through neuropsychological tests (or exclusively that way).

DP

How often do you post here? How many times do people have to explain to you that some cases do need a clinician to spend a lot of time with the child and reviewing documents and questionnaires to diagnose. Like with my kid, the cognitive testing showed she was solidly average in everything except one area and that contributed to the diagnosis in addition to the condition specific diagnostic assessment.

Sometimes early intervention doesn't matter. But it often does and to get it (either for insurance to pay or just to know your kid needs it) you need a diagnosis, the earlier the better. That might mean getting the diagnosis before it is obvious to a pediatrician who might spend 15 minutes with a kid 2-3 times per year.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:What’s weird about neuropsych testing is that it is a lot of money and professional time spent on not actually getting to understand the kid as an individual. I have the money to pay for another round of private testing but I don’t find it worthwhile at all to pay for. I would absolutely pay that much money for someone who would sit with my kid, observe him at school and with friends, talk to teachers, talk to parents, look at school records, and then provide actual tailored advice about supports and school choices and additional therapy needs. Infinitely more valuable and even more valuable than a diagnosis.

For just one example - my kid (who has an ASD dx) has been struggling in math. The knee jerk reaction was initially that the school based on neuropsych testing and their flawed understanding of autism wanted to say that because of autism he would struggle with higher level math that required conceptual understanding vs rote memorizing needed for younger years. Well that was totally and completely wrong. We got him into math tutoring and after 6 months with a fantastic tutor who really understands math and has tutored or taught many kids, the tutor was able to explain that the issue had nothing to do with kid’s ability to learn math concepts and that he didn’t even need any additional practice or repetition compared to other kids and completes work in a normal time period when he has heard the lesson. The issue was that he was missing the classroom explanation of concepts (zoning out or doing something else). Tutor’s theory (which I agree with) is that the lack of structure in the class and lack of written materials meant he was missing the cues about when to focus and then did not have any structure or written materials to easily go back and figure out what he had missed when he realized he didn’t know how to do the assignment.

That insight from someone who actually knows my kid was incredibly, incredibly valuable - not just for math but for everything going forward. You could say it was just ADHD (although the neuropsychs *never found ADHD* and teachers consistently said his focus was age appropriate) but even that label would not have identified with such concreteness what this issue is - which is an interplay between attention, attending to social cues, need for structure, playing out in an educational system that has gotten rid of major ways that they help kids self-monitor their learning (books! Syllabi!).

Well, every tutor and parent will agree that the lack of textbooks and chronological written materials for teaching something as foundational as math, algebra, geometry and calculus is one of THE dumbest things public school math departments have agreed to do.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:We found it helpful. One DS was tested at six years old and it put us on the right track immediately. He has dyslexia and it was very helpful to push us to get the right intervention and really lean into it. It’s made all the difference in the world.

The 2nd DS was a bit of a surprise. We didn’t know what the heck was going on with him and got him tested when he was 10 because we thought he had dyslexia because of the genetic factor. Nope. Very very much ADHD. We didn’t know what ADHD could look like and thought it was x when it can be y, z, and m. Almost off the charts. Reading intervention/tutoring would do zero for all that and the only thing that helped him academically and socially is stimulants. He’s in such a better place now and he has an improved understanding of his reactions and impulses.

None of the above would have been possible without the neuro-psych.

You don’t need a “full neuropsych” to diagnose the issues you listed.

You are correct. With the first one, we did the psycho educational testing instead. But with the second one, we absolutely needed the full neuropysch. Trust me.

Not sure why? ADHD is not actually diagnosed through neuropsychological tests (or exclusively that way).

It was necessary in our case. While we also expected dyslexia, which was wrong, there were other things at play. He also has a diagnosis of DMDD, which is a tricky thing to tease out from ADHD.