How much does charisma help in admissions?

[Anonymous]

I’m a HS teacher and it helps but not in the way you are thinking. Students with charisma AND initiative can sometimes have more impressive ECs because they have put themselves out there more. It MIGHT be easier for me to write their recommendation letter if we have a relationship.

Notice I said they need charisma and initiative because it’s still the ECs, as just one part of the application process.

And no, charisma is not the only thing that makes a good recommendation letter but I can think of some stand out students with charisma who I had an easy time writing letters for because I had a lot of things to say. I can also think of many others without charisma in this same situation.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I’m a HS teacher and it helps but not in the way you are thinking. Students with charisma AND initiative can sometimes have more impressive ECs because they have put themselves out there more. It MIGHT be easier for me to write their recommendation letter if we have a relationship.

Notice I said they need charisma and initiative because it’s still the ECs, as just one part of the application process.

And no, charisma is not the only thing that makes a good recommendation letter but I can think of some stand out students with charisma who I had an easy time writing letters for because I had a lot of things to say. I can also think of many others without charisma in this same situation.

I mean, thanks, but being a HS teacher doesn't make you an expert on college admissions.

[Anonymous]

And adding to my post, I would not write about charisma in the recommendation. If your kid is a natural leader in class, I would write about that. I would tell personal stories about her. Not all teachers do this and many, unfortunately, use a form letter since they write so many or even AI now.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I don't know about charisma, but I think PQs are the most important part of your application. You want the reader to like you. For t10 schools, they're investing in you. So you need to submit an application that reads: (a) I'm a good investment because I'm going to be a change maker in x area, and (b) you want to help me make that happen.

Charisma in person can land as overconfidence on paper.

The qualities people like on paper are genuineness, open, forthcoming, funny, intelligent, capable,,uniqueness, humble, kind.

[Anonymous]

I don't think it helps as much as it used to, OP. Most colleges don't have real interviews. I have only read the first few posts and it's possible that it will be reflected int he recommendations letters but letters depend on a lot of other factors, too, like the recommenders writing skills. Academics (course rigor, grades, scores etc) are by far the most important part of every application.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I’m a HS teacher and it helps but not in the way you are thinking. Students with charisma AND initiative can sometimes have more impressive ECs because they have put themselves out there more. It MIGHT be easier for me to write their recommendation letter if we have a relationship.

Notice I said they need charisma and initiative because it’s still the ECs, as just one part of the application process.

And no, charisma is not the only thing that makes a good recommendation letter but I can think of some stand out students with charisma who I had an easy time writing letters for because I had a lot of things to say. I can also think of many others without charisma in this same situation.

I mean, thanks, but being a HS teacher doesn't make you an expert on college admissions.

Neither does being a random dc area parent, yet here you are asking for advice from them.

The Hs teacher is right. A more charismatic kid might be well known amongst the teachers, if they stand out then the teacher would have more unique things to say about them than “they worked hard in class.” I have been told by multiple teachers that my kid is not afraid to talk in class and is a natural leader, but in a productive and supportive way (not just dominating the conversation or project). I think that will translate well to recommendations from those teachers.

[Anonymous]

OP - you asked about whether charisma will help at T10. From what I’ve seen, no. Not without the other stats and EC’s. Student council is fine, but not unusual. It might help some with T50 because LOR’s may have more to talk about if your D is a leader in classes and her broader school community. But there are boatloads of kids with delightful personalities and great people skills + top stats & EC’s applying to the T10’s. Look lower.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I don't know about charisma, but I think PQs are the most important part of your application. You want the reader to like you. For t10 schools, they're investing in you. So you need to submit an application that reads: (a) I'm a good investment because I'm going to be a change maker in x area, and (b) you want to help me make that happen.

Charisma in person can land as overconfidence on paper.

The qualities people like on paper are genuineness, open, forthcoming, funny, intelligent, capable,,uniqueness, humble, kind.

those are all PQs, sure.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I’m a HS teacher and it helps but not in the way you are thinking. Students with charisma AND initiative can sometimes have more impressive ECs because they have put themselves out there more. It MIGHT be easier for me to write their recommendation letter if we have a relationship.

Notice I said they need charisma and initiative because it’s still the ECs, as just one part of the application process.

And no, charisma is not the only thing that makes a good recommendation letter but I can think of some stand out students with charisma who I had an easy time writing letters for because I had a lot of things to say. I can also think of many others without charisma in this same situation.

I mean, thanks, but being a HS teacher doesn't make you an expert on college admissions.

Neither does being a random dc area parent, yet here you are asking for advice from them.

The Hs teacher is right. A more charismatic kid might be well known amongst the teachers, if they stand out then the teacher would have more unique things to say about them than “they worked hard in class.” I have been told by multiple teachers that my kid is not afraid to talk in class and is a natural leader, but in a productive and supportive way (not just dominating the conversation or project). I think that will translate well to recommendations from those teachers.

I wouldn’t call it charisma, but personality can come through on an application to the applicant’s benefit, particularly in the essays and LORs.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I’m a HS teacher and it helps but not in the way you are thinking. Students with charisma AND initiative can sometimes have more impressive ECs because they have put themselves out there more. It MIGHT be easier for me to write their recommendation letter if we have a relationship.

Notice I said they need charisma and initiative because it’s still the ECs, as just one part of the application process.

And no, charisma is not the only thing that makes a good recommendation letter but I can think of some stand out students with charisma who I had an easy time writing letters for because I had a lot of things to say. I can also think of many others without charisma in this same situation.

I mean, thanks, but being a HS teacher doesn't make you an expert on college admissions.

Neither does being a random dc area parent, yet here you are asking for advice from them.

The Hs teacher is right. A more charismatic kid might be well known amongst the teachers, if they stand out then the teacher would have more unique things to say about them than “they worked hard in class.” I have been told by multiple teachers that my kid is not afraid to talk in class and is a natural leader, but in a productive and supportive way (not just dominating the conversation or project). I think that will translate well to recommendations from those teachers.

Um, I'm not the OP.

[Anonymous]

Generic "elected to school student government" kids with 80th percentile grades aren't getting into Harvard.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:The posters talking about Harvard are ridiculous. On the Harvard 1-6 scale, this student would rank a 3 AT BEST on the academic scale and more likely a 3- or 4.

To score a 1 or 2 on the “personal” scale, the student would need:

1. Truly outstanding qualities of character, student displays enormous courage in the face of seemingly insurmountable obstacles in life. Demonstration of the ability to lead or inspire those around them: unqualified and unwavering support from their recommenders

2. Very strong qualities of character, strong leadership, maturity beyond their years; uncommon authenticity, unselfish or humility.

Data from the Harvard lawsuit shows that virtually no one gets a 1 on the personal scale. So this student can reasonably expect a 2 at the very, very best and even that is unlikely.

This academic and personal mix ain’t getting nobody into Harvard, and it’s not clear at all that other top schools use anything even resembling the same scale.

This student will not get a 2. Generic outgoing kid in school-level student government isn't a 2. That's not unusually "strong leadership" or "character." It's pretty "usual" for the Harvard applicant pool.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:This is laughable. Grades and test scores are 80 percent of the game. Extracurriculars then come into play, but they don't mean shit if you don't have the primary goods. Then after that comes the essays and the recs. Having "charisma" doesn't do much.

You are not serious.

Harvard admissions gives a personality score which is as important as the academic score.

Oh, get real. This kid is top 20% in grades and test scores. They are not getting into Harvard no matter how much “charisma“ they have. Try again.

The kid also isn't going to be at the higher end of the personality score. The higher ends of the personality score really take into account unusual stories of overcoming adversity or personal responsibility or maturity (for example, ex-military students). Charisma alone won't get you an exceptional score.

[Anonymous]

As a parent you are, of course, hoping your kid can break into that magical T10. The reality is that other factors, like demographics, hooks & athletic recruitment make far more difference in the admissions process. But have your kid apply to their dream schools- it’s a lottery and you can’t win unless you buy the ticket.

[Anonymous]

This is unintentionally hilarious.