Merge or Not To Merge IAC and MAC

[Anonymous]

The lack of government sponsored recreational sports has led to the single sport club athlete. This in turn has led to a bunch of schools with too many varsity level sports and not enough players to play. Even mighty GP had to give into eliminating the 3rd football team. SSSAS, Bullis, EP can't field independent varsity and jv teams in a number of sports. Landon and a bunch of other schools have 2-3 member sports like air rifle, squash, water polo. The IAC is essentially an independent conference.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:The lack of government sponsored recreational sports has led to the single sport club athlete. This in turn has led to a bunch of schools with too many varsity level sports and not enough players to play. Even mighty GP had to give into eliminating the 3rd football team. SSSAS, Bullis, EP can't field independent varsity and jv teams in a number of sports. Landon and a bunch of other schools have 2-3 member sports like air rifle, squash, water polo. The IAC is essentially an independent conference.

Let’s say what you say is true.

How does any of that lead to a realignment of conferences in the DMV?

What you seem to be suggesting is a bunch of different Conference alignments in the various sports.

How could that be managed and who would do it?

What I’ve seen is schools actually adding sports. Hockey and rugby didn’t exist in the IAC that many years ago. Now there seems to a high interest and participation in them.

Prep fielded freshman, JV and varsity football teams when they had 400 boys. Now they have 500 - 550 and don’t have enough players? That doesn’t seem right?

[Anonymous]

Prep is looking less and less of a Catholic school these days.

The admin continues to chase full pay Chinese, Korean and South American families who will pay 2 - 3x the tuition.

Save me the men for others' rhetoric.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The lack of government sponsored recreational sports has led to the single sport club athlete. This in turn has led to a bunch of schools with too many varsity level sports and not enough players to play. Even mighty GP had to give into eliminating the 3rd football team. SSSAS, Bullis, EP can't field independent varsity and jv teams in a number of sports. Landon and a bunch of other schools have 2-3 member sports like air rifle, squash, water polo. The IAC is essentially an independent conference.

Let’s say what you say is true.

How does any of that lead to a realignment of conferences in the DMV?

What you seem to be suggesting is a bunch of different Conference alignments in the various sports.

How could that be managed and who would do it?

What I’ve seen is schools actually adding sports. Hockey and rugby didn’t exist in the IAC that many years ago. Now there seems to a high interest and participation in them.

Prep fielded freshman, JV and varsity football teams when they had 400 boys. Now they have 500 - 550 and don’t have enough players? That doesn’t seem right?

It just seems kind of silly to be awarding IAC title flags in several of the IAC sports. The IAC is already so small and non competitive for most schools, the Title flag seems a little silly. SSSAS and EP aren't even trying. STA had a nice year in football because of literally 2 players but they have de-emphasized sports to a large degree. You are left with 3 schools, with one of them mortgaging themselves to death, who put any effort into sports.

GP got rid of their 3rd football team. They highly encourage freshman to join the team to create a bonding experience in their first semester of the school. This year's freshman/jv team had 5 sophomores. Any other kid who was any good was moved to varsity. This means kids aren't continuing to play after their first year. GP has gone heavily back to recruiting AA players and this forced the traditional full or mostly full pay student to the back of the roster and, subsequently, off the program for lack of playing time. Combine that with the nanny state of suburban moms and kids don't play. Right now, GP has a transfer problem because the admin has fallen back into the trap of athletic glory will lead to donations. It doesn't.

[Anonymous]

So the total number of kids playing football is similar to what it was when there were three teams?

There was always a drop-off of boys playing football after freshman year. You correctly point out the Prep treated freshman football as a class-building thing.

The level of competition in the major sports has ratcheted up in the IAC led by Prep, Landon and Bullis. If I were at either of the other three schools I’d be unhappy. Their choice is to join the madness or to battle it out for fourth place.

The direction on this has to come from the top of the school. The football-centric AD couldn’t do this on his own.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The lack of government sponsored recreational sports has led to the single sport club athlete. This in turn has led to a bunch of schools with too many varsity level sports and not enough players to play. Even mighty GP had to give into eliminating the 3rd football team. SSSAS, Bullis, EP can't field independent varsity and jv teams in a number of sports. Landon and a bunch of other schools have 2-3 member sports like air rifle, squash, water polo. The IAC is essentially an independent conference.

Let’s say what you say is true.

How does any of that lead to a realignment of conferences in the DMV?

What you seem to be suggesting is a bunch of different Conference alignments in the various sports.

How could that be managed and who would do it?

What I’ve seen is schools actually adding sports. Hockey and rugby didn’t exist in the IAC that many years ago. Now there seems to a high interest and participation in them.

Prep fielded freshman, JV and varsity football teams when they had 400 boys. Now they have 500 - 550 and don’t have enough players? That doesn’t seem right?

It just seems kind of silly to be awarding IAC title flags in several of the IAC sports. The IAC is already so small and non competitive for most schools, the Title flag seems a little silly. SSSAS and EP aren't even trying. STA had a nice year in football because of literally 2 players but they have de-emphasized sports to a large degree. You are left with 3 schools, with one of them mortgaging themselves to death, who put any effort into sports.

GP got rid of their 3rd football team. They highly encourage freshman to join the team to create a bonding experience in their first semester of the school. This year's freshman/jv team had 5 sophomores. Any other kid who was any good was moved to varsity. This means kids aren't continuing to play after their first year. GP has gone heavily back to recruiting AA players and this forced the traditional full or mostly full pay student to the back of the roster and, subsequently, off the program for lack of playing time. Combine that with the nanny state of suburban moms and kids don't play. Right now, GP has a transfer problem because the admin has fallen back into the trap of athletic glory will lead to donations. It doesn't.

"Right now, GP has a transfer problem because the admin has fallen back into the trap of athletic glory will lead to donations. It doesn't."

Know several area high schools and colleges that would argue successfully against this point.

[Anonymous]

"Right now, GP has a transfer problem because the admin has fallen back into the trap of athletic glory will lead to donations. It doesn't."

Know several area high schools and colleges that would argue successfully against this point.

Let me guess. SJC - they are almost completely dependent on the generosity of Plank. He rebuilt the school and placed his old employees at the school. They are still a comparatively lower academic school without a real endowment. They might've closed without him.
DeMatha - they've been following this model for 50 years. No one confuses them with a top academic school. It also took them 45 years to build a gym.
Sidwell Friends and a number of other similar schools have chosen to bring in basketball players to entertain the students.
Paul VI - on serious athletic decline from the campus move.
Gonzaga - great school but supported by 1100 students. It took them forever to raise enough money to rehab.
Montrose Christian, Flint Hill, or anywhere else Stu Vetter coached failed.

Colleges - apples and oranges.

[Anonymous]

STA has not de-emphasized sports in any way. That was ten years ago.
In the last five years, they have about the same number of IAC titles as Prep and Landon.
STA does not recruit like prep and bullis and they rarely take transfers, so maybe that's what the pp means about de-emphasizing.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

"Right now, GP has a transfer problem because the admin has fallen back into the trap of athletic glory will lead to donations. It doesn't."

Know several area high schools and colleges that would argue successfully against this point.

Let me guess. SJC - they are almost completely dependent on the generosity of Plank. He rebuilt the school and placed his old employees at the school. They are still a comparatively lower academic school without a real endowment. They might've closed without him.
DeMatha - they've been following this model for 50 years. No one confuses them with a top academic school. It also took them 45 years to build a gym.
Sidwell Friends and a number of other similar schools have chosen to bring in basketball players to entertain the students.
Paul VI - on serious athletic decline from the campus move.
Gonzaga - great school but supported by 1100 students. It took them forever to raise enough money to rehab.
Montrose Christian, Flint Hill, or anywhere else Stu Vetter coached failed.

Colleges - apples and oranges.

There so much incorrect with this post, it’s hard to even know where to begin.

The SJC recovery was well underway before Plank started helping. It started with the admission of girls. The new buildings and fields bear the names of other donors. It’s ridiculous to say that SJC would be closed without Plank’s contributions.

Isn’t PVI currently #1 in boy’s basketball? I don’t remember anything like that when the school was in Fairfax.

Crazy stuff.

[Anonymous]

Think the sports world is crazy now?

Wait till we start to feel the real impact of the millions of dollars in NIL and college funds that are starting to be. Given to football and basketball players.

Instead of a scholarship and meal money, college athletes are going to be given thousands of dollars to play. Some college players will make more than professionals.

This new “pot of gold” will attract more to high school basketball and football teams because the value of a scholarship has now been significantly increased.

[Anonymous]

"GP got rid of their 3rd football team. They highly encourage freshman to join the team to create a bonding experience in their first semester of the school. This year's freshman/jv team had 5 sophomores. Any other kid who was any good was moved to varsity. This means kids aren't continuing to play after their first year. GP has gone heavily back to recruiting AA players and this forced the traditional full or mostly full pay student to the back of the roster and, subsequently, off the program for lack of playing time. Combine that with the nanny state of suburban moms and kids don't play. Right now, GP has a transfer problem because the admin has fallen back into the trap of athletic glory will lead to donations. It doesn't."

This is pretty spot on, and why GP has now reached a tipping point. The school has aggressively ramped up its recruiting across several sports, and the traditional full-pay families are taking notice. Combined with the boarding elements, the makeup of Prep's student body is also changing. Look at GP's basketball team if you need an example. I don't see many CYO basketball players on its roster anymore. The school is now is 2x and even 3x larger than the rest of its peers in the IAC.

The only school in the IAC that measures its own athletic success to GP, is archrival Landon. (though those days seem to be fading). Landon likely wants to keep GP in the IAC or whatever the future makeup of the league looks like (whether a combined IAC - MAC takes place). St. Albans might fight to keep GP in the league because of its alumni and the history between the schools (similar to Landon). The smaller co-ed schools (Bullis, SSSA and Episcopal) likely will wish the Hoyas farewell. Prep is nearly 3x the size of Episcopal and Saint Stephen's when you compare the male enrollments. I don't see why any of the smaller MAC schools wouldn't want to form a new league with the IAC if Prep remains part of it. And yes these conversations have been taking place for the past year or two.

Unless things drastically change, Prep is likely moving to the WCAC or independent, whether the community likes it or not...

[Anonymous]

Each of the IAC schools have changed pretty dramatically over the last 30+ years and that's had big impacts on sports. 3 are now coed, 4 start in kindergarten or 3rd grade or had those grades and grew them (GP + EHS are the only pure High Schools). SSSAS merged 2 schools and has 3 campuses. Landon (75 acres), Bullis (102 acres) & EHS (130 acres) have space to increase HS student populations but expanded into coed or lower schools instead. Prep increased from 95 per class to 125 - had the room but also necessary b/c of poor financial decisions by a past President.

Most of the changes weren't driven by sports but have had big impacts. In the 80's and 90's, schools were fairly equal in size between 300 and 385 boys (in 1988, Prep was 380 and EHS 320...whereas in 2025 Prep is 500 and EHS is 230 boys + 230 girls).

Can't diminish the impact Landon and STA get from their lower schools as feeders into HS. Each school recruits in its own way, some more aggressive than others and some have more resources. STA recruits but is limited due to admissions standards and can't do what other schools do to get kids in. Boarding has some impact for Prep, but the biggest difference is prior to the 2000's, Prep got most of it's 70/75 day students from Catholic schools close in (Mercy, MD, BS, Little Flower, Redeemer, St. Barts, St. Patricks, etc...), whereas, now they have 100 day students and they've expanded the footprint further out in Montgomery County, Howard County, DC and Virginia + added publics into the mix. Look at their strong baseball teams over the last 5+ years - not many boarders, if any, more kids from upper Montgomery and Howard County.... 2 of the best baseball players who are now D1 moved from Landon to Prep after 8th grade - they were local but moved b/c of Prep's stronger program.

Still, if you look at last 5+ years results - Landon (wrestling & hockey), STA (cross country, soccer and tennis), Bullis (basketball + track & field) and Prep (swim & dive, baseball + football) each dominated in certain sports. Then you have sports w/ swings like lacrosse with Prep winning a few in a row and then Landon has seen a resurgence the last 2 years. SSSAS and EHS bring very little.

Unlikely IAC kicks Prep out (Landon & STA and to some degree Bullis like the rivalry and tradition) - more likely EHS + SSSAS look elsewhere and the 4 remaining have to figure it out... Prep to WCAC and others to MAC. Not ideal, but might be what ends up happening, even if alums don't like it.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:STA has not de-emphasized sports in any way. That was ten years ago.
In the last five years, they have about the same number of IAC titles as Prep and Landon.
STA does not recruit like prep and bullis and they rarely take transfers, so maybe that's what the pp means about de-emphasizing.

Results are a little wonky b/c Covid cancelled some seasons. 2019/2020 thru fall and winter of this year:

Regular season titles:

GP - 22
STA - 16
Landon - 10
Bullis - 7
EHS - 1
SSAS - 1

Looks like STA has won every regular season title in XC, Soccer and Tennis in that timeframe.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:STA has not de-emphasized sports in any way. That was ten years ago.
In the last five years, they have about the same number of IAC titles as Prep and Landon.
STA does not recruit like prep and bullis and they rarely take transfers, so maybe that's what the pp means about de-emphasizing.

Results are a little wonky b/c Covid cancelled some seasons. 2019/2020 thru fall and winter of this year:

Regular season titles:

GP - 22
STA - 16
Landon - 10
Bullis - 7
EHS - 1
SSAS - 1

Looks like STA has won every regular season title in XC, Soccer and Tennis in that timeframe.

Great. Now do a little more work and add in the tournament results. The players care about the tournaments !

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Each of the IAC schools have changed pretty dramatically over the last 30+ years and that's had big impacts on sports. 3 are now coed, 4 start in kindergarten or 3rd grade or had those grades and grew them (GP + EHS are the only pure High Schools). SSSAS merged 2 schools and has 3 campuses. Landon (75 acres), Bullis (102 acres) & EHS (130 acres) have space to increase HS student populations but expanded into coed or lower schools instead. Prep increased from 95 per class to 125 - had the room but also necessary b/c of poor financial decisions by a past President.

Most of the changes weren't driven by sports but have had big impacts. In the 80's and 90's, schools were fairly equal in size between 300 and 385 boys (in 1988, Prep was 380 and EHS 320...whereas in 2025 Prep is 500 and EHS is 230 boys + 230 girls).

Can't diminish the impact Landon and STA get from their lower schools as feeders into HS. Each school recruits in its own way, some more aggressive than others and some have more resources. STA recruits but is limited due to admissions standards and can't do what other schools do to get kids in. Boarding has some impact for Prep, but the biggest difference is prior to the 2000's, Prep got most of it's 70/75 day students from Catholic schools close in (Mercy, MD, BS, Little Flower, Redeemer, St. Barts, St. Patricks, etc...), whereas, now they have 100 day students and they've expanded the footprint further out in Montgomery County, Howard County, DC and Virginia + added publics into the mix. Look at their strong baseball teams over the last 5+ years - not many boarders, if any, more kids from upper Montgomery and Howard County.... 2 of the best baseball players who are now D1 moved from Landon to Prep after 8th grade - they were local but moved b/c of Prep's stronger program.

Still, if you look at last 5+ years results - Landon (wrestling & hockey), STA (cross country, soccer and tennis), Bullis (basketball + track & field) and Prep (swim & dive, baseball + football) each dominated in certain sports. Then you have sports w/ swings like lacrosse with Prep winning a few in a row and then Landon has seen a resurgence the last 2 years. SSSAS and EHS bring very little.

Unlikely IAC kicks Prep out (Landon & STA and to some degree Bullis like the rivalry and tradition) - more likely EHS + SSSAS look elsewhere and the 4 remaining have to figure it out... Prep to WCAC and others to MAC. Not ideal, but might be what ends up happening, even if alums don't like it.

Great perspective, thank you for sharing