Is FCPS replacing specialized instruction with “inclusion”?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I miss the day teachers gave enrichment assignments for students who needed it. No student was labeled.

+1

Teachers in a mixed classroom can provide proper acceleration. It is not that hard. Sure, some of the instruction is targeted to the whole class, but good teachers have been grouping since forever.

Then they stop trying because they see they’re being punished with more work while the slackers and strugglers get the same grades for doing the bare minimum. SMH. This district really hates excellence.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I miss the day teachers gave enrichment assignments for students who needed it. No student was labeled.

+1

Teachers in a mixed classroom can provide proper acceleration. It is not that hard. Sure, some of the instruction is targeted to the whole class, but good teachers have been grouping since forever.

Then they stop trying because they see they’re being punished with more work while the slackers and strugglers get the same grades for doing the bare minimum. SMH. This district really hates excellence.

Actually, FCPS hates middle-of-the-road, normal (gasp! I said it), average kids. The high achievers have their "own" school (AAP, TJ) and the slackers and IEP kids are catered to and are bent over backwards for.

The "regular" kids fall through the cracks and get lost in the sauce. The silver lining is HS where they can finally thrive with a variety of course options and teachers.

[Anonymous]

If you want to get rid of inclusion, AAP has to go first. Thanks.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:If you want to get rid of inclusion, AAP has to go first. Thanks.

People don’t want to get rid of inclusion. They want effective inclusion that does not allow disruptive kids to derail classes and prevent other kids from learning.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I miss the day teachers gave enrichment assignments for students who needed it. No student was labeled.

+1

Teachers in a mixed classroom can provide proper acceleration. It is not that hard. Sure, some of the instruction is targeted to the whole class, but good teachers have been grouping since forever.

That's not entirely true. In the past, kids who didn't meet a minimum standard failed the grade and needed to retake it. Now, everyone passes and moves onto the next grade level, even if they're years below grade level and putting in no effort to fix that. In the past, teachers perhaps had to accommodate kids ranging from slightly below grade level through several years above. Now, they have to accommodate a range from many years below grade level through many years above. There's too broad of a range of abilities for effective differentiation, especially when teachers are often required by admin to give the lion's share of their time to the below grade level kids.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I miss the day teachers gave enrichment assignments for students who needed it. No student was labeled.

+1

Teachers in a mixed classroom can provide proper acceleration. It is not that hard. Sure, some of the instruction is targeted to the whole class, but good teachers have been grouping since forever.

That's not entirely true. In the past, kids who didn't meet a minimum standard failed the grade and needed to retake it. Now, everyone passes and moves onto the next grade level, even if they're years below grade level and putting in no effort to fix that. In the past, teachers perhaps had to accommodate kids ranging from slightly below grade level through several years above. Now, they have to accommodate a range from many years below grade level through many years above. There's too broad of a range of abilities for effective differentiation, especially when teachers are often required by admin to give the lion's share of their time to the below grade level kids.

The bolded may happen, but it is not common. And, teachers are NOT required to give the lion's share of time to the below grade level kids.

As for retention, it has been many decades since we had wholesale retention.

And, to get many years below grade level, you are talking about middle and high school.
Quit exaggerating.

You do know that teachers effectively taught in one room schoolhouses. Not ideal, but it can be done.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I miss the day teachers gave enrichment assignments for students who needed it. No student was labeled.

+1

Teachers in a mixed classroom can provide proper acceleration. It is not that hard. Sure, some of the instruction is targeted to the whole class, but good teachers have been grouping since forever.

I find this so triggering. I taught before and after the iPhone was introduced. Teaching is so, so much harder after adults and kids had constant access to screens. Difficult kids soak up every extra minute.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I agree that the definition of “least restrictive environment” is a huge issue. No child is getting the attention, care, or instruction that actually meets their needs. The entire classroom is at the mercy of these children who really need specialized care and an appropriate setting that isn’t overwhelming for them, or they need someone capable of a sterner voice and more rigid structure.

Anecdote: kid throwing chair and screaming. The class is evacuated to the hall. This child is obviously struggling in this environment and not getting the structure and physical activity needed and/or emotional support, etc. He is likely not doing well academically and feels overwhelmed and frustrated there (not that the parent is told because everyone gets 2s and 3s). The other children’s education has been halted, but also permanently slowed as they now grapple with fear of their classmate. Oh, and the school doesn’t feel the need to let parents know their children are at the whims of such violent outbursts… because feels. (True story, btw.)

And by necessity, instruction will slow down and children will be even more abandoned to self-study by screen time.

We have friends whose kid is one of the ones throwing chairs. He is working with a private doctor and a therapist and his parents are doing a lot to help him. He is doing better, but he still is easily dysregulated. He is also a solid 3/4 student who is in advanced math. He is stupid smart. He will probably continue to do better as he matures but it has been a struggle. His parents are aware that the other kids and parents are not happy with him being in class but the question is how to help him and meet his academic needs.

I am not saying that the regular classroom is the best place, only that there are kids who struggle with ED who are getting help and who are smart. It is hard.

Sorry. But, what is best for him seems to be interfering with the education of 20plus other kids. That is not a reasonable accomodation.

[Anonymous]

CSS numbers are way down. It is so hard to get a kid placed in CSS now. When they do get there, they often find that they can be much more successful and the class that they left can finally have uninterrupted instruction. It’s insane how low the CSS numbers are. Yes, there are kids in CSS who need more and there aren’t enough private school seats for them, but if schools would stop acting like a CSS equals the JDC it would help a lot. Some kids need a break from gen ed to learn to regulate themselves in a smaller setting and then work their way back to gen ed. Think how much calmer those kids feel every day in class knowing that they are understood, have a support room to go to for breaks, have plenty of movement breaks, counseling weekly, etc?

[Anonymous]

A separate gifted education goes against the very essence, the core values of public education. It holds down, limits students. Labels them. So harmful.

"Least exclusive whenever possible" needs to apply to Gifted Education

[Anonymous]

I think FCPS is actually trending in the other direction in my experience.

Ad hoc, separate small classes (approx 5 kids) have been amazing for my high schooler with an IEP this year. He’s a great kid who has zero behavior issues.

The model last year was to have regular classes with an aide or special education teacher in the room. It was a complete waste of time for the my kid and he barely passed his core subjects.

This year, they are taking that same staff member (that’s being paid irregardless, so let’s use them!) pulling the IEP kids out of the room and doing most of the teaching in a very small group. Nothing has changed with my child’s IEP hours and I think it’s technically supposed to still be an inclusion class. But no one is complaining and the kids are actually learning.
My kid loves the classes that are run like this.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I miss the day teachers gave enrichment assignments for students who needed it. No student was labeled.

+1

Teachers in a mixed classroom can provide proper acceleration. It is not that hard. Sure, some of the instruction is targeted to the whole class, but good teachers have been grouping since forever.

That's not entirely true. In the past, kids who didn't meet a minimum standard failed the grade and needed to retake it. Now, everyone passes and moves onto the next grade level, even if they're years below grade level and putting in no effort to fix that. In the past, teachers perhaps had to accommodate kids ranging from slightly below grade level through several years above. Now, they have to accommodate a range from many years below grade level through many years above. There's too broad of a range of abilities for effective differentiation, especially when teachers are often required by admin to give the lion's share of their time to the below grade level kids.

The bolded may happen, but it is not common. And, teachers are NOT required to give the lion's share of time to the below grade level kids.

As for retention, it has been many decades since we had wholesale retention.

And, to get many years below grade level, you are talking about middle and high school.
Quit exaggerating.

You do know that teachers effectively taught in one room schoolhouses. Not ideal, but it can be done.

In the last 5-10 years it has become common. There are 5th grades that read at a 2nd grade level, it’s not rare. And now we ARE being asked to be accountable for their growth and dedicating a lot time to them, when 10 years ago very few people were inquiring about their progress.

Do you really think kids in a one room schoolhouse were receiving the best education?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I miss the day teachers gave enrichment assignments for students who needed it. No student was labeled.

+1

Teachers in a mixed classroom can provide proper acceleration. It is not that hard. Sure, some of the instruction is targeted to the whole class, but good teachers have been grouping since forever.

That's not entirely true. In the past, kids who didn't meet a minimum standard failed the grade and needed to retake it. Now, everyone passes and moves onto the next grade level, even if they're years below grade level and putting in no effort to fix that. In the past, teachers perhaps had to accommodate kids ranging from slightly below grade level through several years above. Now, they have to accommodate a range from many years below grade level through many years above. There's too broad of a range of abilities for effective differentiation, especially when teachers are often required by admin to give the lion's share of their time to the below grade level kids.

The bolded may happen, but it is not common. And, teachers are NOT required to give the lion's share of time to the below grade level kids.

As for retention, it has been many decades since we had wholesale retention.

And, to get many years below grade level, you are talking about middle and high school.
Quit exaggerating.

You do know that teachers effectively taught in one room schoolhouses. Not ideal, but it can be done.

In the last 5-10 years it has become common. There are 5th grades that read at a 2nd grade level, it’s not rare. And now we ARE being asked to be accountable for their growth and dedicating a lot time to them, when 10 years ago very few people were inquiring about their progress.

Do you really think kids in a one room schoolhouse were receiving the best education?

Read again. Not ideal.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I agree that the definition of “least restrictive environment” is a huge issue. No child is getting the attention, care, or instruction that actually meets their needs. The entire classroom is at the mercy of these children who really need specialized care and an appropriate setting that isn’t overwhelming for them, or they need someone capable of a sterner voice and more rigid structure.

Anecdote: kid throwing chair and screaming. The class is evacuated to the hall. This child is obviously struggling in this environment and not getting the structure and physical activity needed and/or emotional support, etc. He is likely not doing well academically and feels overwhelmed and frustrated there (not that the parent is told because everyone gets 2s and 3s). The other children’s education has been halted, but also permanently slowed as they now grapple with fear of their classmate. Oh, and the school doesn’t feel the need to let parents know their children are at the whims of such violent outbursts… because feels. (True story, btw.)

And by necessity, instruction will slow down and children will be even more abandoned to self-study by screen time.

We have friends whose kid is one of the ones throwing chairs. He is working with a private doctor and a therapist and his parents are doing a lot to help him. He is doing better, but he still is easily dysregulated. He is also a solid 3/4 student who is in advanced math. He is stupid smart. He will probably continue to do better as he matures but it has been a struggle. His parents are aware that the other kids and parents are not happy with him being in class but the question is how to help him and meet his academic needs.

I am not saying that the regular classroom is the best place, only that there are kids who struggle with ED who are getting help and who are smart. It is hard.

Sorry. But, what is best for him seems to be interfering with the education of 20plus other kids. That is not a reasonable accomodation.

+1, the other parents should be upset, their kids are losing instructional time due to your friend’s kid. If he’s super smart, let him miss some school so the others can get some peace.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I miss the day teachers gave enrichment assignments for students who needed it. No student was labeled.

+1

Teachers in a mixed classroom can provide proper acceleration. It is not that hard. Sure, some of the instruction is targeted to the whole class, but good teachers have been grouping since forever.

That's not entirely true. In the past, kids who didn't meet a minimum standard failed the grade and needed to retake it. Now, everyone passes and moves onto the next grade level, even if they're years below grade level and putting in no effort to fix that. In the past, teachers perhaps had to accommodate kids ranging from slightly below grade level through several years above. Now, they have to accommodate a range from many years below grade level through many years above. There's too broad of a range of abilities for effective differentiation, especially when teachers are often required by admin to give the lion's share of their time to the below grade level kids.

The bolded may happen, but it is not common. And, teachers are NOT required to give the lion's share of time to the below grade level kids.

As for retention, it has been many decades since we had wholesale retention.

And, to get many years below grade level, you are talking about middle and high school.
Quit exaggerating.

You do know that teachers effectively taught in one room schoolhouses. Not ideal, but it can be done.

In the last 5-10 years it has become common. There are 5th grades that read at a 2nd grade level, it’s not rare. And now we ARE being asked to be accountable for their growth and dedicating a lot time to them, when 10 years ago very few people were inquiring about their progress.

Do you really think kids in a one room schoolhouse were receiving the best education?

Read again. Not ideal.

Then why mention it? Teaching kids aged 6-12 in one room doesn’t work.