Frienship Heights GEICO development

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Not sure if this goes here or in local politics...

But the public hearing for the Friendship Heights GEICO development is tomorrow. Sign up to testify or send written testimony: https://montgomeryplanningboard.org/agenda-item/october-23-2025/

They're seeking to remove the already approved office density and put in a new plan, and they are requesting a waiver of stormwater management requirements

I live very nearby, but in D.C., not Maryland, so I don't get a say. But I'm all for more housing there instead of that office building. Would help keep the retail on Wisconsin Avenue in business, which has been a problem lately (and would help bring better retail that serves nearby residents rather than whatever the target audience for some of those stores has been). I don't care about traffic because I take Metro to work and my kids walk to school.

Even if you walk, you should start caring because there are a lot of cars hitting pedestrians in Friendship Heights and that's directly related to increased traffic: pedestrians, bikes, and cars. Especially if you have kids

This. Also, car accidents due to County busses being parked on Willard Avenue blocking the intersection in front of Whole Foods. If you travel north on Willard you can only see half of the pedestrian crossing.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:without knowing anything about this - did GEICO submit a plan ages ago when office space was in demand and now they're trying to update the plan to reflect a post-COVID world where we need more apartments and fewer office buildings?

They want to build 500 units without any traffic studies, school inftastructure, stormwater planning...

Anything is better than the depressing eyesore that is currently there. Montgomery County is losing out big time to DC and NoVa in terms of private investment. They don’t have a lot of room to be picky because they are in such a desperate financial situation.

Are you a real estate developer or just careless? No it is not a good idea to add 500 units of housing (ex: 2000 people) to a location without understanding where the kids will go to school and where people will park and where water will drain.

No, I live nearby and have lived in the area for almost 50 years. I have seen Friendship Heights decline ever since it peaked around when the Mazza Gallerie Theater opened two to three decades ago. The neighborhood, and frankly a lot of neighborhoods in Upper NW like Cleveland Park and Tenleytown, were a lot nicer 15-25 years ago and have been declining ever since. To have nice things, like The Heights Food Hall that closed after a couple years, you need to get more people who aren’t retirees to live around the area. I want nice things around where I live, like stores and restaurants. I don’t want to live near a dying commercial strip.

500 residences replacing a depressing Soviet style dilapidates office building is a good thing, period. I don’t know why this is a controversial point to you.

Honey you're looking through rose-colored glasses.

First of all the Mazza Gallerie theater was there a lot longer than three decades. It was already getting threadbare when I saw "Searching for Bobby Fisher" there in 1993.

Second, that entire area was absolutely not a paragon of upscale shopping back then. Sure there was Lord and Taylor and Nieman Marcus but remember what was directly next to the Geico site? Finnegan's Drive-Thru Car Wash, Houlihan's, and Hamburger Hamlet. That's what you consider the peak of the neighborhood?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:without knowing anything about this - did GEICO submit a plan ages ago when office space was in demand and now they're trying to update the plan to reflect a post-COVID world where we need more apartments and fewer office buildings?

They want to build 500 units without any traffic studies, school inftastructure, stormwater planning...

Anything is better than the depressing eyesore that is currently there. Montgomery County is losing out big time to DC and NoVa in terms of private investment. They don’t have a lot of room to be picky because they are in such a desperate financial situation.

Are you a real estate developer or just careless? No it is not a good idea to add 500 units of housing (ex: 2000 people) to a location without understanding where the kids will go to school and where people will park and where water will drain.

No, I live nearby and have lived in the area for almost 50 years. I have seen Friendship Heights decline ever since it peaked around when the Mazza Gallerie Theater opened two to three decades ago. The neighborhood, and frankly a lot of neighborhoods in Upper NW like Cleveland Park and Tenleytown, were a lot nicer 15-25 years ago and have been declining ever since. To have nice things, like The Heights Food Hall that closed after a couple years, you need to get more people who aren’t retirees to live around the area. I want nice things around where I live, like stores and restaurants. I don’t want to live near a dying commercial strip.

500 residences replacing a depressing Soviet style dilapidates office building is a good thing, period. I don’t know why this is a controversial point to you.

Honey you're looking through rose-colored glasses.

First of all the Mazza Gallerie theater was there a lot longer than three decades. It was already getting threadbare when I saw "Searching for Bobby Fisher" there in 1993.

Second, that entire area was absolutely not a paragon of upscale shopping back then. Sure there was Lord and Taylor and Nieman Marcus but remember what was directly next to the Geico site? Finnegan's Drive-Thru Car Wash, Houlihan's, and Hamburger Hamlet. That's what you consider the peak of the neighborhood?

Well, 15 years ago there was no Drive-Thru Car Wash, Houlihan's or Hamburger Hamlet (they weren't there in 2003 either...so not sure when those places existed). There was a Neiman Marcus, Saks Men's store, Saks (still there), Bloomingdales (still there), Williams Sonoma, L&T, Chevy Chase Collection Shops (Jimmy Choo, Cartier, Tiffany, etc.), Nordstrom Rack (maybe it was still Linens n' Things?), Movie Theatre, etc.

I would say 2010 was likely the peak of the neighborhood.

FYI...the Total Wine opened today...Trader Joe's is supposedly less than 2 weeks from opening.

[Anonymous]

I wish they could route the traffic down Wisconsin through an underpass like the one north of DuPont Circle. There’s too much traffic at that intersection.

[Anonymous]

Why is Montgomery County losing all of its businesses?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:No it is not a good idea to add 500 units of housing (ex: 2000 people) to a location without understanding where the kids will go to school and where people will park and where water will drain.

Where is the stormwater going now? It's not like the rain has been holding back until this is redeveloped.

[Anonymous]

This is why housing prices are high in MoCo -- any attempt to build new housing is opposed, so that limits supply and demand is going up = price increases.

Developers already have to pay an impact tax to cover costs of schools/infra/etc when building new developments. They will in this case also.

Also, MCPS enrollment has been on the decline, and they expect that to continue:
https://wtop.com/montgomery-county/2025/10/montgomery-county-schools-see-student-enrollment-drop-project-its-part-of-trend/

So there will be plenty of room in schools for any new kids.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:No it is not a good idea to add 500 units of housing (ex: 2000 people) to a location without understanding where the kids will go to school and where people will park and where water will drain.

Where is the stormwater going now? It's not like the rain has been holding back until this is redeveloped.

This is a good point -- actually having a building there would probably be better for water drainage than having a giant surface parking lot.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I think the problem with the heights and that shopping center in general is it’s so confusing. I can never tell what level I’m on or how to get places.

The main problem is that that area spans two jurisdictions and each individual site is owned by different parties. There is no overall coordination to say turning FH into Pike & Rose as an example. As an example, I have zero understanding of who owns the surface lot between Mazza and the old Lord & Taylor and what function it serves. It's never been available for general parking and right now appears to rent space to a landscaping company to store their equipment.

Not to mention it's a huge waste to turn the old L&T into the bus depot...I guess the bus depot will get developed, but it's strange to move it 1/2 block away and seems like it will take years to actually happen.

Then you have the massive Saks parking lots that serve little purpose and could be incorporated into a grand plan.

That site is a better location for the bus depot than potentially prime real estate on Wisconsin is, I think that plan makes sense. Literally anything would be better than the status quo. (I'd personally root for a giant indoor sports complex with soccer fields, but that's because then my kids could walk to winter soccer practices when the weather's bad instead of having it canceled.)

OMG this would be a much better use of the space than a moving the bus depot.

I know Frumin has mentioned trying to get an indoor ice rink in FH. I don't think the area is at all big enough for a giant indoor sports complex. You might be able to get one or two fields, and then the issue is what happens during the warm months.

Make it 10 stories! Two fields per floor. I don't care if it looms over my house.

Yes!! Take a prime real estate parcel in one of the most expensive parts of the metropolitan area and make it useful and relevant to 0.5% of the metro population!!

I have a good idea too: let’s make this a private aircraft hanger for people who own their planes! We can get the utility down below 0.003%!

I take your point but (a) definitely there are more people in the area who play or have kids who play soccer or other field sports than own planes and (b) Frumin is talking about making that building an ice rink, anyway. I strongly suspect indoor fields would get more use than ice skating.

But ultimately, I don't care what they do with it, really, as long as they develop it so it isn't a bus barn.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:without knowing anything about this - did GEICO submit a plan ages ago when office space was in demand and now they're trying to update the plan to reflect a post-COVID world where we need more apartments and fewer office buildings?

They want to build 500 units without any traffic studies, school inftastructure, stormwater planning...

Anything is better than the depressing eyesore that is currently there. Montgomery County is losing out big time to DC and NoVa in terms of private investment. They don’t have a lot of room to be picky because they are in such a desperate financial situation.

Are you a real estate developer or just careless? No it is not a good idea to add 500 units of housing (ex: 2000 people) to a location without understanding where the kids will go to school and where people will park and where water will drain.

No, I live nearby and have lived in the area for almost 50 years. I have seen Friendship Heights decline ever since it peaked around when the Mazza Gallerie Theater opened two to three decades ago. The neighborhood, and frankly a lot of neighborhoods in Upper NW like Cleveland Park and Tenleytown, were a lot nicer 15-25 years ago and have been declining ever since. To have nice things, like The Heights Food Hall that closed after a couple years, you need to get more people who aren’t retirees to live around the area. I want nice things around where I live, like stores and restaurants. I don’t want to live near a dying commercial strip.

500 residences replacing a depressing Soviet style dilapidates office building is a good thing, period. I don’t know why this is a controversial point to you.

I knew it. You have no ties to Montgomery County schools.

How about if D.C. annexes that land and we can make it our problem instead of Montgomery County's?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:No it is not a good idea to add 500 units of housing (ex: 2000 people) to a location without understanding where the kids will go to school and where people will park and where water will drain.

Where is the stormwater going now? It's not like the rain has been holding back until this is redeveloped.

This is a good point -- actually having a building there would probably be better for water drainage than having a giant surface parking lot.

Have you been to the site? There's quite a lot of green space that will be gone unless someone speaks for the trees

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I think the problem with the heights and that shopping center in general is it’s so confusing. I can never tell what level I’m on or how to get places.

The main problem is that that area spans two jurisdictions and each individual site is owned by different parties. There is no overall coordination to say turning FH into Pike & Rose as an example. As an example, I have zero understanding of who owns the surface lot between Mazza and the old Lord & Taylor and what function it serves. It's never been available for general parking and right now appears to rent space to a landscaping company to store their equipment.

Not to mention it's a huge waste to turn the old L&T into the bus depot...I guess the bus depot will get developed, but it's strange to move it 1/2 block away and seems like it will take years to actually happen.

Then you have the massive Saks parking lots that serve little purpose and could be incorporated into a grand plan.

That site is a better location for the bus depot than potentially prime real estate on Wisconsin is, I think that plan makes sense. Literally anything would be better than the status quo. (I'd personally root for a giant indoor sports complex with soccer fields, but that's because then my kids could walk to winter soccer practices when the weather's bad instead of having it canceled.)

OMG this would be a much better use of the space than a moving the bus depot.

I know Frumin has mentioned trying to get an indoor ice rink in FH. I don't think the area is at all big enough for a giant indoor sports complex. You might be able to get one or two fields, and then the issue is what happens during the warm months.

Make it 10 stories! Two fields per floor. I don't care if it looms over my house.

Yes!! Take a prime real estate parcel in one of the most expensive parts of the metropolitan area and make it useful and relevant to 0.5% of the metro population!!

I have a good idea too: let’s make this a private aircraft hanger for people who own their planes! We can get the utility down below 0.003%!

I take your point but (a) definitely there are more people in the area who play or have kids who play soccer or other field sports than own planes and (b) Frumin is talking about making that building an ice rink, anyway. I strongly suspect indoor fields would get more use than ice skating.

But ultimately, I don't care what they do with it, really, as long as they develop it so it isn't a bus barn.

There is a massive shortage of ice time in the DMV. That's why youth teams have 5am practices and 11pm games.

I personally think an ice rink appeals to too narrow of a population, but it would probably be 100% subscribed the day it opened because right now people are either going down to Ft. Dupont (though that has had a renovation saga) or out to Ashburn or North Bethesda.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I think the problem with the heights and that shopping center in general is it’s so confusing. I can never tell what level I’m on or how to get places.

The main problem is that that area spans two jurisdictions and each individual site is owned by different parties. There is no overall coordination to say turning FH into Pike & Rose as an example. As an example, I have zero understanding of who owns the surface lot between Mazza and the old Lord & Taylor and what function it serves. It's never been available for general parking and right now appears to rent space to a landscaping company to store their equipment.

Not to mention it's a huge waste to turn the old L&T into the bus depot...I guess the bus depot will get developed, but it's strange to move it 1/2 block away and seems like it will take years to actually happen.

Then you have the massive Saks parking lots that serve little purpose and could be incorporated into a grand plan.

That site is a better location for the bus depot than potentially prime real estate on Wisconsin is, I think that plan makes sense. Literally anything would be better than the status quo. (I'd personally root for a giant indoor sports complex with soccer fields, but that's because then my kids could walk to winter soccer practices when the weather's bad instead of having it canceled.)

OMG this would be a much better use of the space than a moving the bus depot.

I know Frumin has mentioned trying to get an indoor ice rink in FH. I don't think the area is at all big enough for a giant indoor sports complex. You might be able to get one or two fields, and then the issue is what happens during the warm months.

Make it 10 stories! Two fields per floor. I don't care if it looms over my house.

Yes!! Take a prime real estate parcel in one of the most expensive parts of the metropolitan area and make it useful and relevant to 0.5% of the metro population!!

I have a good idea too: let’s make this a private aircraft hanger for people who own their planes! We can get the utility down below 0.003%!

That's not true if you have ever been to the St James facility. The place is packed because it's used by school, club and rec teams...it also has a gym membership that is popular...indoor pools open to the general public...it's a pipe dream to think something like that could ever be built in FH, but to claim only 0.5% of the population would use it is absolutely false.

Okay, you tell us: what percentage of ALL households in the region *at a given point in time* have children who play club and/or rec soccer? Not “sports” but specifically soccer.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Not sure if this goes here or in local politics...

But the public hearing for the Friendship Heights GEICO development is tomorrow. Sign up to testify or send written testimony: https://montgomeryplanningboard.org/agenda-item/october-23-2025/

They're seeking to remove the already approved office density and put in a new plan, and they are requesting a waiver of stormwater management requirements

I live very nearby, but in D.C., not Maryland, so I don't get a say. But I'm all for more housing there instead of that office building. Would help keep the retail on Wisconsin Avenue in business, which has been a problem lately (and would help bring better retail that serves nearby residents rather than whatever the target audience for some of those stores has been). I don't care about traffic because I take Metro to work and my kids walk to school.

Even if you walk, you should start caring because there are a lot of cars hitting pedestrians in Friendship Heights and that's directly related to increased traffic: pedestrians, bikes, and cars. Especially if you have kids

This. Also, car accidents due to County busses being parked on Willard Avenue blocking the intersection in front of Whole Foods. If you travel north on Willard you can only see half of the pedestrian crossing.

Not this. There has been a vanishingly small number of car pedestrian accidents in friendship Heights over the past two decades.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I think the problem with the heights and that shopping center in general is it’s so confusing. I can never tell what level I’m on or how to get places.

The main problem is that that area spans two jurisdictions and each individual site is owned by different parties. There is no overall coordination to say turning FH into Pike & Rose as an example. As an example, I have zero understanding of who owns the surface lot between Mazza and the old Lord & Taylor and what function it serves. It's never been available for general parking and right now appears to rent space to a landscaping company to store their equipment.

Not to mention it's a huge waste to turn the old L&T into the bus depot...I guess the bus depot will get developed, but it's strange to move it 1/2 block away and seems like it will take years to actually happen.

Then you have the massive Saks parking lots that serve little purpose and could be incorporated into a grand plan.

That site is a better location for the bus depot than potentially prime real estate on Wisconsin is, I think that plan makes sense. Literally anything would be better than the status quo. (I'd personally root for a giant indoor sports complex with soccer fields, but that's because then my kids could walk to winter soccer practices when the weather's bad instead of having it canceled.)

OMG this would be a much better use of the space than a moving the bus depot.

I know Frumin has mentioned trying to get an indoor ice rink in FH. I don't think the area is at all big enough for a giant indoor sports complex. You might be able to get one or two fields, and then the issue is what happens during the warm months.

Make it 10 stories! Two fields per floor. I don't care if it looms over my house.

Yes!! Take a prime real estate parcel in one of the most expensive parts of the metropolitan area and make it useful and relevant to 0.5% of the metro population!!

I have a good idea too: let’s make this a private aircraft hanger for people who own their planes! We can get the utility down below 0.003%!

That's not true if you have ever been to the St James facility. The place is packed because it's used by school, club and rec teams...it also has a gym membership that is popular...indoor pools open to the general public...it's a pipe dream to think something like that could ever be built in FH, but to claim only 0.5% of the population would use it is absolutely false.

Okay, you tell us: what percentage of ALL households in the region *at a given point in time* have children who play club and/or rec soccer? Not “sports” but specifically soccer.

So, these are multi-sport facilities...and when I say rec, I mean rec for 5 year olds up to and including senior leagues. Nobody said to build just a soccer complex. Literally, somebody mentioned a multi-sportsplex that included soccer fields.