Why are youth and high school sports so competitive to get into now?

[Anonymous]

The bottom line is that over time inefficiencies get eliminated from the system and more resources are required to compete.

30+ years ago Texas high schools went on a size binge in order to become more dominant in sports. The natural culmination is Allen high school with well over 1000 students per graduating class. Historically that would have comfortably been sufficient for three high schools. Instead, those 2000 or so boys all compete for spots on one football team, one basketball team, etc….

Parents with resources also pour money into development in a way not previously seen. It’s basically an open secret that in college football, the QB position is mostly dominated by kids from wealthy, in tact families. The Colorado head coach basically admitted that those are part of the recruiting criteria when he looks for QBs. One of the most successful high school coaches in the country said that leading the Southlake Carrol football team was the easiest job in the country because all the kids had personal trainers and position coaches. He just had to show up and draw up plays.

The problem is noticeable in other ways. At our (non-DC) local powerhouse high school, the multi-sport athlete is basically extinct. Gone are the days when a great athlete could simply wake up and transition from a fall sport to a winter sport. The coaches require specialization.

There are outlier high schools. Particularly in the elite/small private school world and under resourced public schools. There a great athlete can still play three sports a year.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:IMO the underlying mechanism too few facilities, gyms, fields, courts, pools, etc. In my area there are several "great" schools that have graduating classes of six hundred plus students three times the size of my graduating class.

The manifestation is that parents employ hired guns to train their kids to ensure that the kids will have spots. These hired guns use all kinds of techniques to ensure parents get what they pay for including, teaching unsafe or dirty play. These hired guns often monopolize public resources. Contracting soccer fields near schools or contracting pools and control both the access to teams and training reducing the game to a pay for play scheme.

The unsuspecting kids from families that aren't familiar with a sport trying to have fun are literally driven off the field.

This statement is NOT accurate. If you go to Langley High School on weekends, the football field is literally emptied during the summer (also on weekends during school year), and anyone can use the field to practice soccer. There is an adjacent grass field right next to the football field and anyone can use that field.

Practice what? Practice being a field cone on a soccer club's scout team.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:The bottom line is that over time inefficiencies get eliminated from the system and more resources are required to compete.

30+ years ago Texas high schools went on a size binge in order to become more dominant in sports. The natural culmination is Allen high school with well over 1000 students per graduating class. Historically that would have comfortably been sufficient for three high schools. Instead, those 2000 or so boys all compete for spots on one football team, one basketball team, etc….

Parents with resources also pour money into development in a way not previously seen. It’s basically an open secret that in college football, the QB position is mostly dominated by kids from wealthy, in tact families. The Colorado head coach basically admitted that those are part of the recruiting criteria when he looks for QBs. One of the most successful high school coaches in the country said that leading the Southlake Carrol football team was the easiest job in the country because all the kids had personal trainers and position coaches. He just had to show up and draw up plays.

The problem is noticeable in other ways. At our (non-DC) local powerhouse high school, the multi-sport athlete is basically extinct. Gone are the days when a great athlete could simply wake up and transition from a fall sport to a winter sport. The coaches require specialization.

There are outlier high schools. Particularly in the elite/small private school world and under resourced public schools. There a great athlete can still play three sports a year.

+1

A lot of high schools are absolutely huge now. In many sports only top travel players have a shot at making JV, much less varsity. Obviously this trickles down and makes the youth sports scene far more competitive- working towards making a HS roster by age 10. It is crazy.

There at exceptions. Many smaller privates in my area have plenty of availability on rosters- most students can make any team they want (though they may not see much playing time) and can play multiple seasonal sports. In the small town where I grew up (high school has about 800 students 9-12) it is much the same. Many all-conference varsity players on those teams would be iffy to make JV at huge suburban high schools.

Huge high schools are the driver of most of this- especially in UMC areas.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:The bottom line is that over time inefficiencies get eliminated from the system and more resources are required to compete.

30+ years ago Texas high schools went on a size binge in order to become more dominant in sports. The natural culmination is Allen high school with well over 1000 students per graduating class. Historically that would have comfortably been sufficient for three high schools. Instead, those 2000 or so boys all compete for spots on one football team, one basketball team, etc….

Parents with resources also pour money into development in a way not previously seen. It’s basically an open secret that in college football, the QB position is mostly dominated by kids from wealthy, in tact families. The Colorado head coach basically admitted that those are part of the recruiting criteria when he looks for QBs. One of the most successful high school coaches in the country said that leading the Southlake Carrol football team was the easiest job in the country because all the kids had personal trainers and position coaches. He just had to show up and draw up plays.

The problem is noticeable in other ways. At our (non-DC) local powerhouse high school, the multi-sport athlete is basically extinct. Gone are the days when a great athlete could simply wake up and transition from a fall sport to a winter sport. The coaches require specialization.

There are outlier high schools. Particularly in the elite/small private school world and under resourced public schools. There a great athlete can still play three sports a year.

This is a true statement. My child attended a different wealthy public HS with the same coach mentioned above and will back up that most of the kids had trainers and coaches paid for by the parents from a very early age. That is shocking about recruiting looking for intact families. Do you have a link?

[Anonymous]

Agree with the PP regarding the quality of rec sports being significantly lacking in the competition for resources (coaches, facilities). Both HS and club teams are naturally focused on building and maintaining winning programs, which then shifts the onus of player development at the entry/basic level to private lessons supplemented by clinics - especially if you get a 'late start' on a sport.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The bottom line is that over time inefficiencies get eliminated from the system and more resources are required to compete.

30+ years ago Texas high schools went on a size binge in order to become more dominant in sports. The natural culmination is Allen high school with well over 1000 students per graduating class. Historically that would have comfortably been sufficient for three high schools. Instead, those 2000 or so boys all compete for spots on one football team, one basketball team, etc….

Parents with resources also pour money into development in a way not previously seen. It’s basically an open secret that in college football, the QB position is mostly dominated by kids from wealthy, in tact families. The Colorado head coach basically admitted that those are part of the recruiting criteria when he looks for QBs. One of the most successful high school coaches in the country said that leading the Southlake Carrol football team was the easiest job in the country because all the kids had personal trainers and position coaches. He just had to show up and draw up plays.

The problem is noticeable in other ways. At our (non-DC) local powerhouse high school, the multi-sport athlete is basically extinct. Gone are the days when a great athlete could simply wake up and transition from a fall sport to a winter sport. The coaches require specialization.

There are outlier high schools. Particularly in the elite/small private school world and under resourced public schools. There a great athlete can still play three sports a year.

+1

A lot of high schools are absolutely huge now. In many sports only top travel players have a shot at making JV, much less varsity. Obviously this trickles down and makes the youth sports scene far more competitive- working towards making a HS roster by age 10. It is crazy.

There at exceptions. Many smaller privates in my area have plenty of availability on rosters- most students can make any team they want (though they may not see much playing time) and can play multiple seasonal sports. In the small town where I grew up (high school has about 800 students 9-12) it is much the same. Many all-conference varsity players on those teams would be iffy to make JV at huge suburban high schools.

Huge high schools are the driver of most of this- especially in UMC areas.

https://larrybrownsports.com/college-football/deion-sanders-attributes-recruits-two-parents/611610?amp

Sanders had a candid conversation about recruiting during an appearance on “The Rich Eisen Show” ahead of the Super Bowl. He spoke about how he tries to find quarterbacks who come from two-parent households and get good grades in school.

“We want mother, father, you know, dual parents,” Sanders said, as transcribed by Outkick’s Dan Zaksheske. “We want that kid to be 3.5 [GPA] and up because he’s got to be smart. He can’t make bad decisions off the field. At all. Because he has to be a leader of men. There are so many different attributes and what we look for when we see a quarterback. And, (we) would love a coach’s son.”

Sanders threw that last line in because his son, Shedeur Sanders, is expected to be Colorado’s starting quarterback next season. The Hall of Fame defensive back went on to say that his staff also tries to find offensive linemen from two-parent households with a “strong father that they adhere to.” Sanders joked (maybe?) that defensive linemen are a different story.

“Defensive linemen, it’s totally opposite — single mama, trying to get it, he’s on free lunch,” Sanders said. “I’m talking about just trying to make it. He’s trying to rescue mama, like mama barely made the flight. I want him to just go get it. There are whole different attributes that you look for in different positions.”

[Anonymous]

Reminds me of a Freakonomics about long snappers…some guy who is the leading trainer of long snappers (like 80% of his kids go to Power 4 schools) said that the best long snappers are built like a Mack truck and dumb as a rock.

Can’t think too much as a long snapper. It’s grab football, snap and repeat. Thousands of times.

[Anonymous]

Let your kids try a variety of rec sports in K-3. They are very low cost and very low commitment. Then you can determine what they enjoy and excel at. If they dislike sports don’t bother but it’s worth exploring for fun and social reasons. You can wait until 10-11 for travel sports if by that age it looks like they might have an interest in a school team. It’s not too late as long as they aren’t starting from zero. Don’t assume your child won’t like sports or be good enough for a team until they’ve at least tried. I have a child who due to disabilities had poor coordination. I never in a million years thought he would enjoy sports or excel but DH insisted on signing him up with his classmates. It turned out my son enjoyed it immensely and begged to work with DH outside of practices. He got better and better. He’s a HS athlete and his sport brings him so much joy. I always thank DH for insisting. The flip side is that our other son who at a young age dreamed of HS sports dropped them after 8th grade. It still wasn’t a waste at all. He made friends and became good enough to enjoy pick up games of soccer or baseball. Not everything is about playing in college or even about making a HS team.

[Anonymous]

It’s all about money, of course. More people making as much as they can off the American obsession with sports. Parents throwing money at those people so they and their kid can say they are on travel.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I don't believe this is even a NOVA issue since it is happening all over America, whether it is California, Texas, Massachusetts, and so on. You have to put your kid in competitive sports at a young age to even have a chance of playing at the high school level. There aren't many rec options once you get to the middle school level, and every school team by then has competitive tryouts. There is no way to pick up a new sport by late elementary or middle school. Kids have to determine their interests at their young age or else it is too late. I don't want to encourage my kids to get into sports because I know it is going to suck for them in the end.

It is especially frustrating when there is basically nothing you get in return for investing so much into youth sports. Most kids will never play in the NCAA, and varsity sports don't matter much for college admissions. I don't know how it is reasonable for any family to invest so much time and money and risking their health for basically nothing.

Lol. Wow. Most people who play sports from pickup at the local park to pronhall of famers play because it is fun. And exercise. Also some people do go far sstarting late. Why not just do rec for a couple of sports and have fun meeting people and exercising

what a terrible attitude

The rec experiences in many sports aren't all that great. It's part of the hired gun problem. You would expect that the kids that are in competitive programs would seek better competition, but nope there they are swimming in summer leagues playing in rec tournaments, practicing their slide tackles on kids. So, you have kids practicing three or more times per week all year long with professional coaches playing against kids that have had maybe a dozen practices in the year. See what I mean, driven from the field.

Then most of the rec leagues have reduced scope of play. We did rec league basketball four practices four games. Yeah, it was fun, but not enough. Most of the rec kids just don't want to keep doing if after a season or two.

I can confirm the bolded part (but it may be different for different sports). One year in, you have a lot of player turn around and you feel that your kid cannot make progress because the level is so low. You look around and find clubs, then you realize that your kid is terrible compared to the kids who were playing club. You have the frustrating choice of continuing rec or the costly choice of moving to club. There is rarely something in between. I would not call this a hired gun problem though, it is capitalism at it's finest.

The bolded does not have to be true. My 12 year old is in a rec league where a lot of kids simply decided not to play travel (just do a bunch of rec sports). The level of play is fairly high and the kids who have left over the past few years are often inferior to the kids who stay. Many quality coaches. Teams stick together for years. Families practice on their own outside of practice so kids get quality reps even without many team practices a week, so the kids progress well.

Unfortunately for my younger kids this stopped being true after my 12 year old, and so we do see the bolded. Tons of turnover, low level of play because everyone feels they have to get out.

But it's a collective action problem. Not an inherent to rec problem.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:IMO the underlying mechanism too few facilities, gyms, fields, courts, pools, etc. In my area there are several "great" schools that have graduating classes of six hundred plus students three times the size of my graduating class.

The manifestation is that parents employ hired guns to train their kids to ensure that the kids will have spots. These hired guns use all kinds of techniques to ensure parents get what they pay for including, teaching unsafe or dirty play. These hired guns often monopolize public resources. Contracting soccer fields near schools or contracting pools and control both the access to teams and training reducing the game to a pay for play scheme.

The unsuspecting kids from families that aren't familiar with a sport trying to have fun are literally driven off the field.

This statement is NOT accurate. If you go to Langley High School on weekends, the football field is literally emptied during the summer (also on weekends during school year), and anyone can use the field to practice soccer. There is an adjacent grass field right next to the football field and anyone can use that field.

Practice what? Practice being a field cone on a soccer club's scout team.

The point is that these fields are available for kids to practice without having being part of pay for play.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:A lot of high schools are absolutely huge now. In many sports only top travel players have a shot at making JV, much less varsity. Obviously this trickles down and makes the youth sports scene far more competitive- working towards making a HS roster by age 10. It is crazy.

There at exceptions. Many smaller privates in my area have plenty of availability on rosters- most students can make any team they want (though they may not see much playing time) and can play multiple seasonal sports. In the small town where I grew up (high school has about 800 students 9-12) it is much the same. Many all-conference varsity players on those teams would be iffy to make JV at huge suburban high schools.

Huge high schools are the driver of most of this- especially in UMC areas.

Competition is insane at schools in expensive neighborhood because everyone has $$$. Schools like McLean, Langley, and Oakton are always like this.

[Anonymous]

Surprised no one has mentioned recruiting at public schools which is supposed to be prohibited

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Surprised no one has mentioned recruiting at public schools which is supposed to be prohibited

How do you recruit at public schools like Langley High School if you do not live in the school pyramid?

[Anonymous]

I think part of it is that for white kids who are “average” academically it has gotten so much harder to get into the type of universities that were once considered safety schools. So parents are looking for every type of edge. Not even looking for an athletic scholarship, but just a slight advantage in admissions.