School psychologist gave my child a survey

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:He has a 504 plan for a medical condition and I asked if we could add accommodations for anxiety (he does not have ADHD). The psychologist said she would have to do some data collection to be able to add accommodations for anxiety.

And you presumably consented to the data collection? Take this as a learning opportunity and move on. In the future, you can ask specific questions about the data collection tools that will be used if you'd like that information ahead of time. The Conners is a common questionnaire to use in schools for 504/IEP evaluations.

Stating that an assessment is “common” does not eliminate the requirement of informed consent.

Which was apparently given.

Then why didn’t OP know about it until after it was completed?

You know that’s not properly informed consent, you’re just being obtuse.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:He has a 504 plan for a medical condition and I asked if we could add accommodations for anxiety (he does not have ADHD). The psychologist said she would have to do some data collection to be able to add accommodations for anxiety.

And you presumably consented to the data collection? Take this as a learning opportunity and move on. In the future, you can ask specific questions about the data collection tools that will be used if you'd like that information ahead of time. The Conners is a common questionnaire to use in schools for 504/IEP evaluations.

Stating that an assessment is “common” does not eliminate the requirement of informed consent.

Which was apparently given.

Then why didn’t OP know about it until after it was completed?

You know that’s not properly informed consent, you’re just being obtuse.

OP knew she was consenting, she just didn't realize the extent of the consent. Informed consent is a much broader transfer of power than you seem to believe. Informed consent will never warn you in advance about every single question the psychologist will ask your child. If OP is obsessed with questions of a sexual nature, in the future she can ask whether assessment given to her child include that content or not. The psychologist's jaw will probably drop to the floor.

I've been in 14 IEP/504 meetings for my kids, from K to 12th grade. The counselor or whoever is answering questions or explaining stuff never has time to explain the nitty gritty unless you research things in advance and specifically ask - you have to trust them in a large measure, just as they trust you when they ask you about your child's experiences and behaviors.

Personally I have never had trouble with IEP and 504 teams. I have found them to be conscientious and helpful. But then, I don't mind when my kids are asked those sorts of questions. I'm a research scientist myself, I understand why these questions are included, and it's not shocking to me that they're part of the procedure.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:He has a 504 plan for a medical condition and I asked if we could add accommodations for anxiety (he does not have ADHD). The psychologist said she would have to do some data collection to be able to add accommodations for anxiety.

And you presumably consented to the data collection? Take this as a learning opportunity and move on. In the future, you can ask specific questions about the data collection tools that will be used if you'd like that information ahead of time. The Conners is a common questionnaire to use in schools for 504/IEP evaluations.

Stating that an assessment is “common” does not eliminate the requirement of informed consent.

Which was apparently given.

Then why didn’t OP know about it until after it was completed?

You know that’s not properly informed consent, you’re just being obtuse.

OP knew she was consenting, she just didn't realize the extent of the consent. Informed consent is a much broader transfer of power than you seem to believe. Informed consent will never warn you in advance about every single question the psychologist will ask your child. If OP is obsessed with questions of a sexual nature, in the future she can ask whether assessment given to her child include that content or not. The psychologist's jaw will probably drop to the floor.

I've been in 14 IEP/504 meetings for my kids, from K to 12th grade. The counselor or whoever is answering questions or explaining stuff never has time to explain the nitty gritty unless you research things in advance and specifically ask - you have to trust them in a large measure, just as they trust you when they ask you about your child's experiences and behaviors.

Personally I have never had trouble with IEP and 504 teams. I have found them to be conscientious and helpful. But then, I don't mind when my kids are asked those sorts of questions. I'm a research scientist myself, I understand why these questions are included, and it's not shocking to me that they're part of the procedure.

Being a research scientist I’m sure you’re aware that not being aware of the extent of consent doesn’t count as informed consent. A blanket statement would eliminate much of the informed aspect of consent. Even if the school wouldn’t require this, the testing administration protocol does require it. The test should never have been administered without prior conversation informing the guardian of the specific testing to be administered and obtaining written consent specific to this assessment only after the guardian was properly informed and had an opportunity to ask questions. These things can’t just happen after the test, that’s not informed consent. This is ethics and test administration 101.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:He has a 504 plan for a medical condition and I asked if we could add accommodations for anxiety (he does not have ADHD). The psychologist said she would have to do some data collection to be able to add accommodations for anxiety.

And you presumably consented to the data collection? Take this as a learning opportunity and move on. In the future, you can ask specific questions about the data collection tools that will be used if you'd like that information ahead of time. The Conners is a common questionnaire to use in schools for 504/IEP evaluations.

Stating that an assessment is “common” does not eliminate the requirement of informed consent.

Which was apparently given.

Then why didn’t OP know about it until after it was completed?

You know that’s not properly informed consent, you’re just being obtuse.

OP knew she was consenting, she just didn't realize the extent of the consent. Informed consent is a much broader transfer of power than you seem to believe. Informed consent will never warn you in advance about every single question the psychologist will ask your child. If OP is obsessed with questions of a sexual nature, in the future she can ask whether assessment given to her child include that content or not. The psychologist's jaw will probably drop to the floor.

I've been in 14 IEP/504 meetings for my kids, from K to 12th grade. The counselor or whoever is answering questions or explaining stuff never has time to explain the nitty gritty unless you research things in advance and specifically ask - you have to trust them in a large measure, just as they trust you when they ask you about your child's experiences and behaviors.

Personally I have never had trouble with IEP and 504 teams. I have found them to be conscientious and helpful. But then, I don't mind when my kids are asked those sorts of questions. I'm a research scientist myself, I understand why these questions are included, and it's not shocking to me that they're part of the procedure.

Being a research scientist I’m sure you’re aware that not being aware of the extent of consent doesn’t count as informed consent. A blanket statement would eliminate much of the informed aspect of consent. Even if the school wouldn’t require this, the testing administration protocol does require it. The test should never have been administered without prior conversation informing the guardian of the specific testing to be administered and obtaining written consent specific to this assessment only after the guardian was properly informed and had an opportunity to ask questions. These things can’t just happen after the test, that’s not informed consent. This is ethics and test administration 101.

Oh my dear. Nothing schools require is at the level of the paperwork I need to get access to clinical data for my work. And it will never happen in a public, or private school. You have no idea how different the standards are!

There is just nothing to argue about. Sorry. You can try, and stamp your feet in front of the Principal, but ultimately if you're looking for services and accommodations from the school... you'd be shooting yourself in the foot.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:He has a 504 plan for a medical condition and I asked if we could add accommodations for anxiety (he does not have ADHD). The psychologist said she would have to do some data collection to be able to add accommodations for anxiety.

And you presumably consented to the data collection? Take this as a learning opportunity and move on. In the future, you can ask specific questions about the data collection tools that will be used if you'd like that information ahead of time. The Conners is a common questionnaire to use in schools for 504/IEP evaluations.

Stating that an assessment is “common” does not eliminate the requirement of informed consent.

Which was apparently given.

Then why didn’t OP know about it until after it was completed?

You know that’s not properly informed consent, you’re just being obtuse.

OP knew she was consenting, she just didn't realize the extent of the consent. Informed consent is a much broader transfer of power than you seem to believe. Informed consent will never warn you in advance about every single question the psychologist will ask your child. If OP is obsessed with questions of a sexual nature, in the future she can ask whether assessment given to her child include that content or not. The psychologist's jaw will probably drop to the floor.

I've been in 14 IEP/504 meetings for my kids, from K to 12th grade. The counselor or whoever is answering questions or explaining stuff never has time to explain the nitty gritty unless you research things in advance and specifically ask - you have to trust them in a large measure, just as they trust you when they ask you about your child's experiences and behaviors.

Personally I have never had trouble with IEP and 504 teams. I have found them to be conscientious and helpful. But then, I don't mind when my kids are asked those sorts of questions. I'm a research scientist myself, I understand why these questions are included, and it's not shocking to me that they're part of the procedure.

Being a research scientist I’m sure you’re aware that not being aware of the extent of consent doesn’t count as informed consent. A blanket statement would eliminate much of the informed aspect of consent. Even if the school wouldn’t require this, the testing administration protocol does require it. The test should never have been administered without prior conversation informing the guardian of the specific testing to be administered and obtaining written consent specific to this assessment only after the guardian was properly informed and had an opportunity to ask questions. These things can’t just happen after the test, that’s not informed consent. This is ethics and test administration 101.

Oh my dear. Nothing schools require is at the level of the paperwork I need to get access to clinical data for my work. And it will never happen in a public, or private school. You have no idea how different the standards are!

There is just nothing to argue about. Sorry. You can try, and stamp your feet in front of the Principal, but ultimately if you're looking for services and accommodations from the school... you'd be shooting yourself in the foot.

It’s on you, and only you, to maintain professional ethics. You shouldn’t be administering an assessment if you can’t do so within the ethical guidelines established for an assessment. Don’t use “but I work for the school system” as an excuse for your lack of professionalism.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:He has a 504 plan for a medical condition and I asked if we could add accommodations for anxiety (he does not have ADHD). The psychologist said she would have to do some data collection to be able to add accommodations for anxiety.

And you presumably consented to the data collection? Take this as a learning opportunity and move on. In the future, you can ask specific questions about the data collection tools that will be used if you'd like that information ahead of time. The Conners is a common questionnaire to use in schools for 504/IEP evaluations.

Stating that an assessment is “common” does not eliminate the requirement of informed consent.

Which was apparently given.

Then why didn’t OP know about it until after it was completed?

You know that’s not properly informed consent, you’re just being obtuse.

OP knew she was consenting, she just didn't realize the extent of the consent. Informed consent is a much broader transfer of power than you seem to believe. Informed consent will never warn you in advance about every single question the psychologist will ask your child. If OP is obsessed with questions of a sexual nature, in the future she can ask whether assessment given to her child include that content or not. The psychologist's jaw will probably drop to the floor.

I've been in 14 IEP/504 meetings for my kids, from K to 12th grade. The counselor or whoever is answering questions or explaining stuff never has time to explain the nitty gritty unless you research things in advance and specifically ask - you have to trust them in a large measure, just as they trust you when they ask you about your child's experiences and behaviors.

Personally I have never had trouble with IEP and 504 teams. I have found them to be conscientious and helpful. But then, I don't mind when my kids are asked those sorts of questions. I'm a research scientist myself, I understand why these questions are included, and it's not shocking to me that they're part of the procedure.

Being a research scientist I’m sure you’re aware that not being aware of the extent of consent doesn’t count as informed consent. A blanket statement would eliminate much of the informed aspect of consent. Even if the school wouldn’t require this, the testing administration protocol does require it. The test should never have been administered without prior conversation informing the guardian of the specific testing to be administered and obtaining written consent specific to this assessment only after the guardian was properly informed and had an opportunity to ask questions. These things can’t just happen after the test, that’s not informed consent. This is ethics and test administration 101.

Oh my dear. Nothing schools require is at the level of the paperwork I need to get access to clinical data for my work. And it will never happen in a public, or private school. You have no idea how different the standards are!

There is just nothing to argue about. Sorry. You can try, and stamp your feet in front of the Principal, but ultimately if you're looking for services and accommodations from the school... you'd be shooting yourself in the foot.

Please refer to the Conners Manual, Chapter 2, Administration -section on Ethical and Legal Guidelines for more information.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:He has a 504 plan for a medical condition and I asked if we could add accommodations for anxiety (he does not have ADHD). The psychologist said she would have to do some data collection to be able to add accommodations for anxiety.

And you presumably consented to the data collection? Take this as a learning opportunity and move on. In the future, you can ask specific questions about the data collection tools that will be used if you'd like that information ahead of time. The Conners is a common questionnaire to use in schools for 504/IEP evaluations.

Stating that an assessment is “common” does not eliminate the requirement of informed consent.

Which was apparently given.

Then why didn’t OP know about it until after it was completed?

You know that’s not properly informed consent, you’re just being obtuse.

OP knew she was consenting, she just didn't realize the extent of the consent. Informed consent is a much broader transfer of power than you seem to believe. Informed consent will never warn you in advance about every single question the psychologist will ask your child. If OP is obsessed with questions of a sexual nature, in the future she can ask whether assessment given to her child include that content or not. The psychologist's jaw will probably drop to the floor.

I've been in 14 IEP/504 meetings for my kids, from K to 12th grade. The counselor or whoever is answering questions or explaining stuff never has time to explain the nitty gritty unless you research things in advance and specifically ask - you have to trust them in a large measure, just as they trust you when they ask you about your child's experiences and behaviors.

Personally I have never had trouble with IEP and 504 teams. I have found them to be conscientious and helpful. But then, I don't mind when my kids are asked those sorts of questions. I'm a research scientist myself, I understand why these questions are included, and it's not shocking to me that they're part of the procedure.

Being a research scientist I’m sure you’re aware that not being aware of the extent of consent doesn’t count as informed consent. A blanket statement would eliminate much of the informed aspect of consent. Even if the school wouldn’t require this, the testing administration protocol does require it. The test should never have been administered without prior conversation informing the guardian of the specific testing to be administered and obtaining written consent specific to this assessment only after the guardian was properly informed and had an opportunity to ask questions. These things can’t just happen after the test, that’s not informed consent. This is ethics and test administration 101.

Oh my dear. Nothing schools require is at the level of the paperwork I need to get access to clinical data for my work. And it will never happen in a public, or private school. You have no idea how different the standards are!

There is just nothing to argue about. Sorry. You can try, and stamp your feet in front of the Principal, but ultimately if you're looking for services and accommodations from the school... you'd be shooting yourself in the foot.

It’s on you, and only you, to maintain professional ethics. You shouldn’t be administering an assessment if you can’t do so within the ethical guidelines established for an assessment. Don’t use “but I work for the school system” as an excuse for your lack of professionalism.

I'm not a psychologist, PP, nor do I work for a school, in case you're confused. The school has their own rules, which their employees have to abide by. School psychs are not paid enough, compared to private practice psychologists, to do anything other than follow school guidelines.

If you're not happy, feel free to fight the school. You will lose. But clearly you don't believe me, so have at it.

[Anonymous]

I would also be pissed if someone asked my young elementary kid if they had forced themselves on someone sexually as part of an assessment. Jesus.

[Anonymous]

I'm just saying, if you paid a neuropsychologist 5k, they'd likely give the exact same assessment as part of their work.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:He has a 504 plan for a medical condition and I asked if we could add accommodations for anxiety (he does not have ADHD). The psychologist said she would have to do some data collection to be able to add accommodations for anxiety.

And you presumably consented to the data collection? Take this as a learning opportunity and move on. In the future, you can ask specific questions about the data collection tools that will be used if you'd like that information ahead of time. The Conners is a common questionnaire to use in schools for 504/IEP evaluations.

Stating that an assessment is “common” does not eliminate the requirement of informed consent.

Which was apparently given.

Then why didn’t OP know about it until after it was completed?

You know that’s not properly informed consent, you’re just being obtuse.

No informed consent requires that the parent be notified of each question on the form!

[Anonymous]

Legally, consent for evaluation is only required for initial 504s and IEP. Re-evaluations do not require consent. However, schools make every effort to gain consent and typically only move forward with assessments without consent when a parent has been unresponsive. If it were an initial, consent would be required. It sounds like OP asked for accommodations based on a new condition. The new condition required evidence. The Connors screens for anxiety, depression, autism, and anxiety, among other things. They cannot add new accommodations just based on OPs word. Based on results, a 504 can sometimes become an IEP instead.

[Anonymous]

I think this is the Vanderbilt scale. But I understand OP’s concern. People have really weird ideas of what requires mandatory reporting so I would ONLY want my DS to do an instrument like this with a professional I really trusted to understand my kid is a little weirdo who may very well go for shock value if you asked him that question.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:This is good OP, why don't you want to know these things? I remember having "friends" trying to force me to do sexual things at age 9!

Do you think they admit it on surveys?

As someone who works in this field, you would be surprised how often people will answer questions honestly if you actually ask the question. Sometimes people need to be given the space by having the question asked.

Op, I would also recommend trying to let this go. This is a validated assessment tool, researched, tested, etc. Absolutely nothing will change from you complaining about it. And your son was not harmed by being asked a question on a difficult topic.

Disagree. If he had answered yes to the questions about physical and sexual violence, the school would have called CPS. The post actually made me realize I have to be really careful about what evals my kid does. Because he’s exactly the type to check “yes, I shoot people every day” because he thinks its funny.

[Anonymous]

The more I think about this, the more I think it truly is inappropriate to ask the sexual/physical violence questions to a pre-adolescent who is not presenting with possible ODD/conduct disorder/severe physical aggression. This kid is being screened for anxiety not ODD. I get that these questions are part of a normed instrument but I still don’t think it’s appropriate.

[Anonymous]

It’s being administrated by a trained professional who has to ask follow up questions if certain areas are flagged. It’s not an immediate call to CPS- it’s a flag to stop and ask questions. I’ve given this rating scale to many students and most of them just say “of course not” and move on without being traumatized.