Downtown DC is a storefront ghost

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Out: storefronts and bricks and mortar stores

In: high density urban living and restaurants / eateries

Yes! They need to turn this vacant office space into housing ASAP. People would gladly live downtown and then some of the shops/restaurants/life will come back.

There is no "ASAP" with what you propose. Any meaningful residential conversions will take decades. In the case of most office buildings, it would be more cost-effective to tear them down and build residential in its place. You can't just snap your fingers and convert an office building into apartments.

This one at 20th & L seems to have taken under two years:

https://www.prnewswire.com/news-releases/first-large-scale-office-to-residential-conversion-in-dcs-downtown-nears-completion-302085578.html

Your one data point isn't very convincing.

"It’s hard to do a conversion. Office buildings weren’t constructed to be lived in.

"They don’t have the plumbing and electrical guts that homes require. Ceilings need to be high enough that these additions won’t drop them below regulation height, which is typically at least seven feet.

"There’s also the issue of windows. If the building is very wide, apartments or rooms near the center won’t have any.

"Even if building suitability were not an issue, the financial challenges are daunting. Developers are hesitant to take loans with mortgage rates at a 20-year high. Banks are wary of financing new projects. But the largest hurdle is that office towers remain too expensive. The market has changed post-pandemic, but many sellers aren’t prepared to slash prices enough — or to take a loss."

https://www.washingtonpost.com/opinions/interactive/2023/city-downtown-conversion-office-building/

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Out: storefronts and bricks and mortar stores

In: high density urban living and restaurants / eateries

Yes! They need to turn this vacant office space into housing ASAP. People would gladly live downtown and then some of the shops/restaurants/life will come back.

There is no "ASAP" with what you propose. Any meaningful residential conversions will take decades. In the case of most office buildings, it would be more cost-effective to tear them down and build residential in its place. You can't just snap your fingers and convert an office building into apartments.

As soon as possible could mean decades. Hence the "possible." They need to start now.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Out: storefronts and bricks and mortar stores

In: high density urban living and restaurants / eateries

Yes! They need to turn this vacant office space into housing ASAP. People would gladly live downtown and then some of the shops/restaurants/life will come back.

There is no "ASAP" with what you propose. Any meaningful residential conversions will take decades. In the case of most office buildings, it would be more cost-effective to tear them down and build residential in its place. You can't just snap your fingers and convert an office building into apartments.

not only is there no ASAP, there is no "they". Just WHO is "they" and what are they to do? Tell us precisely and legally what "they" shoulf do. Ignorant PPs who make these naive, sweeping statements have no idea the complexity of such a situation. are the builfings privately owned? Then "they" can do nothing.What is the property zoned at? etc etc

They = the city government and private companies can work together to figure out a solution. So naive! Gasp!

The DMV is leading the country in office to condo conversions. https://www.fox5dc.com/news/dc-metro-area-leads-nation-in-converting-empty-offices-into-apartments

"They" must be doing something!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Out: storefronts and bricks and mortar stores

In: high density urban living and restaurants / eateries

Yes! They need to turn this vacant office space into housing ASAP. People would gladly live downtown and then some of the shops/restaurants/life will come back.

Yeah, no thanks. I like my quiet yard and my trees and my front porch swing and my fishpond in the backyard. You can keep the living downtown, with the teenage carjackers, free range crazy homeless, tent encampments and urine and fecal stench. That’s all you.

I also do not want to live downtown, but the popularity of neighborhoods like Navy Yard and the Wharf for residential (largely for young professionals, most of whom appear to have a lot of money to burn) indicate that there is absolutely a market for this kind of housing. You have to invest in making it nice, which means being willing to clear out homeless encampments and prosecute crime. Which we should be doing anyway.

Even if I don't want to live in the downtown core, I think we'd all benefit from having a downtown that was economically healthy. I do not want to live in a dying city -- I don't want DC to become Baltimore with sky high taxes paired with terrible city services, and struggling to get economic investment. For this reason I'm very much in favor of revitalizing downtown with an eye towards residential, entertainment, and public spaces. And I will happy come in from my house and spend money in a neighborhood like that (as I presently do in Navy Yard, the Wharf, Union Market, Georgetown, etc.) provided I can feel safe and it's actually got something to offer me.

DC needs a mayor like Fenty, who understood that economic investment is central to a city's well being and was willing to go the distance to get companies to invest. Bowser sucks at this.

[Anonymous]

I've said this before but I think DC should also invest in making downtown more of a tourist destination. There are hotels downtown, but they are targeted much more at business/political travelers and not at tourists in town for pleasure. Many tourists who spend their days visiting the monuments and museums wind up staying in Rosslyn or Pentagon/Crystal city and coming in on buses.

DC should create an initiative to attract hotel developers to downtown, with incentives for anyone willing to re-develop existing office space. They should study what it would take to get tourists to stay downtown (I guarantee one need would be greater crime enforcement, but there are probably other things too -- I think some kind of shuttle that ran between downtown hotels and the mall would be a big selling point for families). More tourists will also make it possible to fill in more of the street-level retail, since tourists have to eat and drink and are more inclined to shop than the average office dweller anyway.

There should be federal money for this as well -- it's about bringing tourists into the nation's capitol. Including foreign tourists, there are diplomatic incentives!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Out: storefronts and bricks and mortar stores

In: high density urban living and restaurants / eateries

Yes! They need to turn this vacant office space into housing ASAP. People would gladly live downtown and then some of the shops/restaurants/life will come back.

Yeah, no thanks. I like my quiet yard and my trees and my front porch swing and my fishpond in the backyard. You can keep the living downtown, with the teenage carjackers, free range crazy homeless, tent encampments and urine and fecal stench. That’s all you.

Not everything has to be for you, and you don't have to post your opinion on threads about topics you're not interested in.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Things are shifting, much of it as a result of cultural change driven by the pandemic, and there will be ramifications that aren't good. Urban spaces are going to see decline, the question is how much and how bad is it going to get; I think it might get really bad.

A lot of the buildings will be torn down and rebuilt as housing. People still want to live in center cities and with the theater, museums, art, music and sports, there are a lot of reasons to like downtown DC, but it will take time. This is all a result of the work shift to 3 days in the office that many are doing now.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Out: storefronts and bricks and mortar stores

In: high density urban living and restaurants / eateries

Yes! They need to turn this vacant office space into housing ASAP. People would gladly live downtown and then some of the shops/restaurants/life will come back.

Yeah, no thanks. I like my quiet yard and my trees and my front porch swing and my fishpond in the backyard. You can keep the living downtown, with the teenage carjackers, free range crazy homeless, tent encampments and urine and fecal stench. That’s all you.

What you describe is such a small part of downtown, it is sad but I guess your perception is 'reality"

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Out: storefronts and bricks and mortar stores

In: high density urban living and restaurants / eateries

Yes! They need to turn this vacant office space into housing ASAP. People would gladly live downtown and then some of the shops/restaurants/life will come back.

There is no "ASAP" with what you propose. Any meaningful residential conversions will take decades. In the case of most office buildings, it would be more cost-effective to tear them down and build residential in its place. You can't just snap your fingers and convert an office building into apartments.

not only is there no ASAP, there is no "they". Just WHO is "they" and what are they to do? Tell us precisely and legally what "they" shoulf do. Ignorant PPs who make these naive, sweeping statements have no idea the complexity of such a situation. are the builfings privately owned? Then "they" can do nothing.What is the property zoned at? etc etc

The city and federal government are providing incentives for these conversions. It has actually been in the works for decades, since Tony Williams and Marion Berry were mayors, to have a more functional, 24 hour downtown.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Out: storefronts and bricks and mortar stores

In: high density urban living and restaurants / eateries

Yes! They need to turn this vacant office space into housing ASAP. People would gladly live downtown and then some of the shops/restaurants/life will come back.

Yeah, no thanks. I like my quiet yard and my trees and my front porch swing and my fishpond in the backyard. You can keep the living downtown, with the teenage carjackers, free range crazy homeless, tent encampments and urine and fecal stench. That’s all you.

I also do not want to live downtown, but the popularity of neighborhoods like Navy Yard and the Wharf for residential (largely for young professionals, most of whom appear to have a lot of money to burn) indicate that there is absolutely a market for this kind of housing. You have to invest in making it nice, which means being willing to clear out homeless encampments and prosecute crime. Which we should be doing anyway.

Even if I don't want to live in the downtown core, I think we'd all benefit from having a downtown that was economically healthy. I do not want to live in a dying city -- I don't want DC to become Baltimore with sky high taxes paired with terrible city services, and struggling to get economic investment. For this reason I'm very much in favor of revitalizing downtown with an eye towards residential, entertainment, and public spaces. And I will happy come in from my house and spend money in a neighborhood like that (as I presently do in Navy Yard, the Wharf, Union Market, Georgetown, etc.) provided I can feel safe and it's actually got something to offer me.

DC needs a mayor like Fenty, who understood that economic investment is central to a city's well being and was willing to go the distance to get companies to invest. Bowser sucks at this.

Bowser is no different than Fenty. In this case, it was the people working for Fenty, some of whom were part of Bowser's early years. At this point, she has burned through that brain-power and is left with third-tier administrators. She should never have been elected to a third term. Fenty was no visionary, and neither is Bowser.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I've said this before but I think DC should also invest in making downtown more of a tourist destination. There are hotels downtown, but they are targeted much more at business/political travelers and not at tourists in town for pleasure. Many tourists who spend their days visiting the monuments and museums wind up staying in Rosslyn or Pentagon/Crystal city and coming in on buses.

DC should create an initiative to attract hotel developers to downtown, with incentives for anyone willing to re-develop existing office space. They should study what it would take to get tourists to stay downtown (I guarantee one need would be greater crime enforcement, but there are probably other things too -- I think some kind of shuttle that ran between downtown hotels and the mall would be a big selling point for families). More tourists will also make it possible to fill in more of the street-level retail, since tourists have to eat and drink and are more inclined to shop than the average office dweller anyway.

There should be federal money for this as well -- it's about bringing tourists into the nation's capitol. Including foreign tourists, there are diplomatic incentives!

By virtue of location, the suburban hotels are cheaper.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Out: storefronts and bricks and mortar stores

In: high density urban living and restaurants / eateries

Out: high density urban living where the last pandemic spread like crazy and the next one will too.

In: living exurban or rural on a big piece of property and working from home.

Working from home is an oxymoron.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:The tax situation in DC is going to become dire. CRE is the foundation of the services we have come to expect.

What services are there really in DC, besides just funding the vagrant-industrial complex? You go to the suburbs and they have tons more actual communities amenities like rec centers, cultural events, workshops, etc.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I've said this before but I think DC should also invest in making downtown more of a tourist destination. There are hotels downtown, but they are targeted much more at business/political travelers and not at tourists in town for pleasure. Many tourists who spend their days visiting the monuments and museums wind up staying in Rosslyn or Pentagon/Crystal city and coming in on buses.

DC should create an initiative to attract hotel developers to downtown, with incentives for anyone willing to re-develop existing office space. They should study what it would take to get tourists to stay downtown (I guarantee one need would be greater crime enforcement, but there are probably other things too -- I think some kind of shuttle that ran between downtown hotels and the mall would be a big selling point for families). More tourists will also make it possible to fill in more of the street-level retail, since tourists have to eat and drink and are more inclined to shop than the average office dweller anyway.

There should be federal money for this as well -- it's about bringing tourists into the nation's capitol. Including foreign tourists, there are diplomatic incentives!

By virtue of location, the suburban hotels are cheaper.

If you built micro rooms and other more efficient uses of space downtown, you could compete on cost. Especially if you could offer convenient and inexpensive transportation to DC tourist sites -- tourists could avoid renting cars or paying for transportation into the city.

It would be especially appealing to international visitors who are used to this kind of arrangement in other foreign cities. Midwesterners might sill prefer to stay in Northern Virginia, but that has to do with preferring to be somewhere with parking and that looks more familiar to them, not cost.

If you target younger travelers and foreign travelers, there are big incentives to offering a downtown core with hotels, restaurants, and easy transportation to museums and other points of interest.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The tax situation in DC is going to become dire. CRE is the foundation of the services we have come to expect.

What services are there really in DC, besides just funding the vagrant-industrial complex? You go to the suburbs and they have tons more actual communities amenities like rec centers, cultural events, workshops, etc.

Uh, are you under the impression that DC does not have "rec centers, cultural events, workshops, etc.?"

DC offers a free and incredibly high quality Pre-K program, tons of cultural events and festivals, dozens of excellent libraries, rec centers in pretty much every neighborhood in the city, playgrounds and athletic fields, after school programming, summer camps, and tons of low-cost-to-resident programs in everything from tennis and swimming to art and job skills.

Do you... live in DC?