OT for low frustration tolerance

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:OK PP. You have the one kid who met all the DSM-V criteria for autism yet doesn’t have autism. Meanwhile for the rest of us, you should be prepared for an autism diagnosis if your child:

has social issues (doesn’t socialize the same way other kids do

has sensory issues

has rigidity, likely evident via meltdowns in response to unexpected events, transitions,

and the above symptoms result in significant impairment

Excellent example of someone who has a hammer and thinks everything is a nail.

One of my kids meets your criteria. Turned out to be anxiety. He was in an OT playgroup with other kids working on the same issues he was having. One kid had anxiety like DS. One kid had apraxia of speech. Two kids had ADHD and one kid had ASD. Ten years later, none of the had ASD added to their diagnosis and no suspicion of it.

Interestingly, my kid with ASD domestic your criteria. 🤔

those are literally the criteria from the DSM, which literally defines the disorder. if you’re saying you have a kid who meets the DSM criteria but doesn’t have autism; and one who had autism but doesn’t meet the DSM criteria, that’s … interesting.

I cannot find your 'literal' criteria in the DSM.

We, too, participate in research studies - at NIH, KKI and GWU, including longitudinal studies for anxiety and ADHD. In fact, one of the exclusion factors for the ADHD study is ASD.

I don't know why you believe you know better than the experts whose life's work would be invalidated by inclusion of kids, year after year, outside the researches parameters. I suspect you have your own social deficiencies and rigidity.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:OT has been helpful for us, though our DD's issues are a little different. She has ASD1 that presents as her playing alone a lot, being socially inhibited and anxious at school and inflexibility and rigidity at home. The OT has worked with her on the Zones of Regulation and on helping her work through complex tasks. She also does a social skills class that uses an evidence-based curriculum. The psychologist that diagnosed her, who is really big on evidence-based treatment, verified that the OT is a good support for her and not just for motor skills (though they do work on that too). We have seen massive improvements at school in terms of her being able to complete tasks independently since she started OT. The social skills class (which started 6 months later) has also been really helpful in terms of her playing with other kids more.

Personally it does sound like OT could help your kid a lot, but I am no expert.

there’s actually very little evidence for zones of regulation or any social skills class. my guess is that OT is helping because it’s getting her used to structure, following directions, and building the gross & fine motor skills necessary for school. social skills groups are just giving the opportunity to be more exposed to other kids in a low-stress setting.

that’s not to dispute that what you are doing is working. just to say that there really is very little evidence for autism treatments.

so my top advice to parents is use your common sense: think about what your child needs to learn and how they can learn it. exposure and practice of skills you already know your child needs to learn is 9/10ths of the reason for success!

without this perspective it is FAR to easy for SN parents to waste time and money on useless therapies.

But there actually is evidence supporting social skills classes that use evidence based curricula. PEERS is a good example though that is typically for older children. Social Thinking has been questioned in terms of the evidence but it uses research backed strategies.

A lack of evidence does not mean that OT doesn't work. It means there haven't been good studies on it. It is really difficult to do this especially for something like autism which presents in so many different ways, and therefore requires addressing different challenges in each kid.

Based on our experience I would encourage OP to follow the advice of trusted, licensed professionals and not random people on DCUM. We have been lucky to find really great providers that have proven to us that they know what they are doing is it has lead to huge improvements. Dismissing recommended treatment at age 5 is a terrible idea - at this age kids are learning so much and have such potential.

Sure, there are 1000s of providers willing to bankrupt OP claiming that their therapy works and is essential early intervention.

We paid about $150 per week for OT before we got new insurance that pays for it. Is it cheap? No. Is it going to bankrupt the typical DCUM family? Not even close.

Your posts reveal your ignorance. You don't know what you are talking about and you are misinforming OP when you make these absurd generalizations. If you aren't a troll, I encourage you to share your specific experience with a provider that was "willing to bankrupt" you, what the signs were and how OP can avoid them. The notion that all OTs fall into this category is blatantly false and completely unhelpful.

Of course I know what I’m talking about. I have paid thousands and thousands and dollars and spent countless hours on therapies for a kid whose primary challenge is emotional regulation. The only thing OT was useful for was fine and gross motor (which should not be shocking given that motor skills are actually the scopt of OT practice). Unfortunately there are many many ways to waste your time and money with a SN kid. The things that were actually useful:

- an ed consultant to get the first IEP and BIP (but after that a waste of $$)
- actually trained behavioral psychology therapist
- 1:1 sports coaching
- my own actually trained therapist
- Xbox and switch so my kid could participate in mainstream boy social life
-

Ok, PP-got to be honest with you. I know what I'm talking about, also, and the bolded would be useless for my sn child. They don't play sports and actively dislike xbox. But OT was very beneficial for them. The bolded items weren't a waste of money for 'your' kid but would be for mine.

sports coaching and game stuff that the pp mentioned were huge for my dc.
regardless of dx, if your child is motivated by sports and motivated by socializing then getting them good at the things that facilitate that is a huge win. Many of our SN kids whether ADHD, audhd, asd, anxiety, ocd (etc) have social deficits because social deficits are a byproduct of almost any neurodiversity or mental health challenge (why the term 'social deficits' as a diagnostic tool for asd is unhelpful). Anything that gives them added confidence is a win.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:OT has been helpful for us, though our DD's issues are a little different. She has ASD1 that presents as her playing alone a lot, being socially inhibited and anxious at school and inflexibility and rigidity at home. The OT has worked with her on the Zones of Regulation and on helping her work through complex tasks. She also does a social skills class that uses an evidence-based curriculum. The psychologist that diagnosed her, who is really big on evidence-based treatment, verified that the OT is a good support for her and not just for motor skills (though they do work on that too). We have seen massive improvements at school in terms of her being able to complete tasks independently since she started OT. The social skills class (which started 6 months later) has also been really helpful in terms of her playing with other kids more.

Personally it does sound like OT could help your kid a lot, but I am no expert.

there’s actually very little evidence for zones of regulation or any social skills class. my guess is that OT is helping because it’s getting her used to structure, following directions, and building the gross & fine motor skills necessary for school. social skills groups are just giving the opportunity to be more exposed to other kids in a low-stress setting.

that’s not to dispute that what you are doing is working. just to say that there really is very little evidence for autism treatments.

so my top advice to parents is use your common sense: think about what your child needs to learn and how they can learn it. exposure and practice of skills you already know your child needs to learn is 9/10ths of the reason for success!

without this perspective it is FAR to easy for SN parents to waste time and money on useless therapies.

But there actually is evidence supporting social skills classes that use evidence based curricula. PEERS is a good example though that is typically for older children. Social Thinking has been questioned in terms of the evidence but it uses research backed strategies.

A lack of evidence does not mean that OT doesn't work. It means there haven't been good studies on it. It is really difficult to do this especially for something like autism which presents in so many different ways, and therefore requires addressing different challenges in each kid.

Based on our experience I would encourage OP to follow the advice of trusted, licensed professionals and not random people on DCUM. We have been lucky to find really great providers that have proven to us that they know what they are doing is it has lead to huge improvements. Dismissing recommended treatment at age 5 is a terrible idea - at this age kids are learning so much and have such potential.

Sure, there are 1000s of providers willing to bankrupt OP claiming that their therapy works and is essential early intervention.

We paid about $150 per week for OT before we got new insurance that pays for it. Is it cheap? No. Is it going to bankrupt the typical DCUM family? Not even close.

Your posts reveal your ignorance. You don't know what you are talking about and you are misinforming OP when you make these absurd generalizations. If you aren't a troll, I encourage you to share your specific experience with a provider that was "willing to bankrupt" you, what the signs were and how OP can avoid them. The notion that all OTs fall into this category is blatantly false and completely unhelpful.

Of course I know what I’m talking about. I have paid thousands and thousands and dollars and spent countless hours on therapies for a kid whose primary challenge is emotional regulation. The only thing OT was useful for was fine and gross motor (which should not be shocking given that motor skills are actually the scopt of OT practice). Unfortunately there are many many ways to waste your time and money with a SN kid. The things that were actually useful:

- an ed consultant to get the first IEP and BIP (but after that a waste of $$)
- actually trained behavioral psychology therapist
- 1:1 sports coaching
- my own actually trained therapist
- Xbox and switch so my kid could participate in mainstream boy social life
-

Ok, PP-got to be honest with you. I know what I'm talking about, also, and the bolded would be useless for my sn child. They don't play sports and actively dislike xbox. But OT was very beneficial for them. The bolded items weren't a waste of money for 'your' kid but would be for mine.

sports coaching and game stuff that the pp mentioned were huge for my dc.
regardless of dx, if your child is motivated by sports and motivated by socializing then getting them good at the things that facilitate that is a huge win. Many of our SN kids whether ADHD, audhd, asd, anxiety, ocd (etc) have social deficits because social deficits are a byproduct of almost any neurodiversity or mental health challenge (why the term 'social deficits' as a diagnostic tool for asd is unhelpful). Anything that gives them added confidence is a win.

OT is one of those things.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:OT has been helpful for us, though our DD's issues are a little different. She has ASD1 that presents as her playing alone a lot, being socially inhibited and anxious at school and inflexibility and rigidity at home. The OT has worked with her on the Zones of Regulation and on helping her work through complex tasks. She also does a social skills class that uses an evidence-based curriculum. The psychologist that diagnosed her, who is really big on evidence-based treatment, verified that the OT is a good support for her and not just for motor skills (though they do work on that too). We have seen massive improvements at school in terms of her being able to complete tasks independently since she started OT. The social skills class (which started 6 months later) has also been really helpful in terms of her playing with other kids more.

Personally it does sound like OT could help your kid a lot, but I am no expert.

there’s actually very little evidence for zones of regulation or any social skills class. my guess is that OT is helping because it’s getting her used to structure, following directions, and building the gross & fine motor skills necessary for school. social skills groups are just giving the opportunity to be more exposed to other kids in a low-stress setting.

that’s not to dispute that what you are doing is working. just to say that there really is very little evidence for autism treatments.

so my top advice to parents is use your common sense: think about what your child needs to learn and how they can learn it. exposure and practice of skills you already know your child needs to learn is 9/10ths of the reason for success!

without this perspective it is FAR to easy for SN parents to waste time and money on useless therapies.

But there actually is evidence supporting social skills classes that use evidence based curricula. PEERS is a good example though that is typically for older children. Social Thinking has been questioned in terms of the evidence but it uses research backed strategies.

A lack of evidence does not mean that OT doesn't work. It means there haven't been good studies on it. It is really difficult to do this especially for something like autism which presents in so many different ways, and therefore requires addressing different challenges in each kid.

Based on our experience I would encourage OP to follow the advice of trusted, licensed professionals and not random people on DCUM. We have been lucky to find really great providers that have proven to us that they know what they are doing is it has lead to huge improvements. Dismissing recommended treatment at age 5 is a terrible idea - at this age kids are learning so much and have such potential.

Sure, there are 1000s of providers willing to bankrupt OP claiming that their therapy works and is essential early intervention.

We paid about $150 per week for OT before we got new insurance that pays for it. Is it cheap? No. Is it going to bankrupt the typical DCUM family? Not even close.

Your posts reveal your ignorance. You don't know what you are talking about and you are misinforming OP when you make these absurd generalizations. If you aren't a troll, I encourage you to share your specific experience with a provider that was "willing to bankrupt" you, what the signs were and how OP can avoid them. The notion that all OTs fall into this category is blatantly false and completely unhelpful.

Of course I know what I’m talking about. I have paid thousands and thousands and dollars and spent countless hours on therapies for a kid whose primary challenge is emotional regulation. The only thing OT was useful for was fine and gross motor (which should not be shocking given that motor skills are actually the scopt of OT practice). Unfortunately there are many many ways to waste your time and money with a SN kid. The things that were actually useful:

- an ed consultant to get the first IEP and BIP (but after that a waste of $$)
- actually trained behavioral psychology therapist
- 1:1 sports coaching
- my own actually trained therapist
- Xbox and switch so my kid could participate in mainstream boy social life
-

Ok, PP-got to be honest with you. I know what I'm talking about, also, and the bolded would be useless for my sn child. They don't play sports and actively dislike xbox. But OT was very beneficial for them. The bolded items weren't a waste of money for 'your' kid but would be for mine.

sports coaching and game stuff that the pp mentioned were huge for my dc.
regardless of dx, if your child is motivated by sports and motivated by socializing then getting them good at the things that facilitate that is a huge win. Many of our SN kids whether ADHD, audhd, asd, anxiety, ocd (etc) have social deficits because social deficits are a byproduct of almost any neurodiversity or mental health challenge (why the term 'social deficits' as a diagnostic tool for asd is unhelpful). Anything that gives them added confidence is a win.

OT is one of those things.

I found ot beyond useless and think it’s sort of bs but maybe I had bad therapists