Duke vs. Brown

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Students at Duke and Brown today are far more alike than they are dissimilar. Duke is not nearly as fratty and douchy as it may have once been. And Brown's reputation as some kind of pinko-commie-lefty haven for the purple-haired is far overblown. Both schools tend to draw from the same type of students - academically-motivated, fairly ambitious, social, a lot of private school kids, joiners rather than isolators.

Visit both. The campuses will have different vibes. Personally, I think Brown is a little run down and I don't love Providence. But it is an ivy in New England and that has its own mood - fairly close to Boston and NY, which many will like. Duke has a nicer campus. It's in the South but it doesn't really feel southern. It's probably a little more pre-professional than Brown. In either school, typical students will find their people. Duke, because of basketball and increasingly football, does have more of the traditional rah rah college atmosphere than Brown.

One thing to be mindful of is that for pre-med you'll want to go someplace where you can maintain a high GPA. Very important for med school. And students at Brown have the highest average GPA of any school in America. There's pass-fail. There's redoing tests and assignments. It's hard not to have an A average at Brown, which is good for the med school app.

Mostly agree about visiting both and the stereotypes not holding, but this is a naive impression of academics at Brown. Yes, to P/F option, but that has to be declared early, not as a bailout; also, not so much to redoing assignments and tests. Not sure what this "list" is, but students are all over-acheivers to begin with and work very hard for a high GPA, and it definitely isn't all As. Similar GPAs to Stanford and Harvard. I don't think this poster has any direct experience with Brown.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:This is OP. Resurrecting this thread because decision is still out there. DC has visited both. But here's something I didn't ask because I wanted broader insight to start:

Does being an athlete (recruited) change the calculus in this decision? There are also 2-3 other schools in play (some with offers and some not), but these are the top choices (and offers are there).

DC has the stats to get in without athletics, although it would then be more of a lottery. But GPA and test scores are solidly in the middle of the current student profile. Honestly liked both very much, which is interesting because they do have different vibes, but both vibes are, in their opinion, great. If we had visited in January, I suspect this decision would be being made based on weather.

Mine plays a sport at Brown but was a walk on and I don’t think it would have been an option at her other choice (Northwestern). She is in music theatre which may be a similar factor in this case. NU had better theatre offerings but limited music unless she did dual degree. She liked people/campus feel/academic flexibility (also stem major) better at Brown and has probably had more opportunities there in student and department theatre productions than would have had at NU. But, it was a trade off. You just can't have everything.
Talking to students at both schools was very helpful.
Both Duke and Brown will likely lead to fantastic college experiences. But, you'll have to choose one and look forward, so inventory your gut and your info thus far, and ask questions about what you aren't sure of to current students. Good luck.

[Anonymous]

I guess it depends on the sport, but they’re really aren’t that many where the teams are similar quality at both schools

If you really want to play your sport, I’d pick the one where you like the coach and think you will get playing time

[Anonymous]

Playing a D1 sport and being premed seems super ambitious but maybe that’s just my middle aged self talking

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:This is OP. Resurrecting this thread because decision is still out there. DC has visited both. But here's something I didn't ask because I wanted broader insight to start:

Does being an athlete (recruited) change the calculus in this decision? There are also 2-3 other schools in play (some with offers and some not), but these are the top choices (and offers are there).

DC has the stats to get in without athletics, although it would then be more of a lottery. But GPA and test scores are solidly in the middle of the current student profile. Honestly liked both very much, which is interesting because they do have different vibes, but both vibes are, in their opinion, great. If we had visited in January, I suspect this decision would be being made based on weather.

I guess it depends on the sport, but in terms of truly “getting in” is there a substantial difference between the two? I was under the impression that with Duke, the coaches generally can apply more pressure and more say in who gets in, as opposed to schools in the Ivy League, where a recruit may have to go through more stringent levels of review (especially in light of the whole Varsity Blues scandal). The full Duke treatment afforded to the basketball certainly doesn’t extend to non-revenue sports like field hockey or fencing, but I was always under the impression that given the sports culture at Duke coaches generally have more avenues with admissions.

[Anonymous]

I think that is a fair assessment as a parent of one at an IVY and one at top ACC. IVY definitely more focused on grades while my ACC was a pretty good student and did not have to sweat it too much dying the admissions process.

[Anonymous]

OP here. Thanks to all who have contributed more from an athletic perspective. I did wonder about Duke's "pull" for athletes and suspect there may be some truth to that, but early indications seem to be that they would be okay at either. Note that it's definitely not Basketball! It's absolutely a non-revenue sport, and the teams are probably equal to each other (middle of the road within their conference, perhaps Duke being a little higher ranked than Brown, but that's not really important to my DC - they just want to continue competing and improving through college).

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Well they are extremely different. Huge public vs small private for starters. Brown has an open curriculum that means things are both much more flexible but also the student is much more responsible for designing their own academic experience, which can be challenging for some who are used or do better with a more prescribed process.

Wut

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:OP here. Thanks to all who have contributed more from an athletic perspective. I did wonder about Duke's "pull" for athletes and suspect there may be some truth to that, but early indications seem to be that they would be okay at either. Note that it's definitely not Basketball! It's absolutely a non-revenue sport, and the teams are probably equal to each other (middle of the road within their conference, perhaps Duke being a little higher ranked than Brown, but that's not really important to my DC - they just want to continue competing and improving through college).

Is this fencing?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:OP here. Thanks to all who have contributed more from an athletic perspective. I did wonder about Duke's "pull" for athletes and suspect there may be some truth to that, but early indications seem to be that they would be okay at either. Note that it's definitely not Basketball! It's absolutely a non-revenue sport, and the teams are probably equal to each other (middle of the road within their conference, perhaps Duke being a little higher ranked than Brown, but that's not really important to my DC - they just want to continue competing and improving through college).

Is this fencing?

Didn't Brown almost cut its fencing team a few years ago during the pandemic for financial reasons? In the end they just ended up cutting the men's team. But if it is fencing, I would be somewhat weary about institutional support at Brown compared to Duke.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:OP here. Thanks to all who have contributed more from an athletic perspective. I did wonder about Duke's "pull" for athletes and suspect there may be some truth to that, but early indications seem to be that they would be okay at either. Note that it's definitely not Basketball! It's absolutely a non-revenue sport, and the teams are probably equal to each other (middle of the road within their conference, perhaps Duke being a little higher ranked than Brown, but that's not really important to my DC - they just want to continue competing and improving through college).

Is this fencing?

Didn't Brown almost cut its fencing team a few years ago during the pandemic for financial reasons? In the end they just ended up cutting the men's team. But if it is fencing, I would be somewhat weary about institutional support at Brown compared to Duke.

Duke is good at fencing she mentioned middle of the pack maybe women’s field hockey

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:OP here. Thanks to all who have contributed more from an athletic perspective. I did wonder about Duke's "pull" for athletes and suspect there may be some truth to that, but early indications seem to be that they would be okay at either. Note that it's definitely not Basketball! It's absolutely a non-revenue sport, and the teams are probably equal to each other (middle of the road within their conference, perhaps Duke being a little higher ranked than Brown, but that's not really important to my DC - they just want to continue competing and improving through college).

As a Duke alum, I’m completely biased, of course. But my take is that it’s hard to beat the rah-rah school spirit of Duke, if that’s your thing. As a student, it surprised me how much I loved that part. (And I wasn’t especially a “school spirit” type of kid in high school.)

In part for that reason, it’s hard for me to imagine a better place for a student-athlete, even in a non-revenue sport, as you said. The “Go Duke” thing is everywhere - not just for basketball. And the current athletic department is top-notch. It’s a well-run, sophisticated, top-of-class operation. (Google the Athletic Director, Nina King, to learn more!)

I recently visited Duke again with my DC, and they picked up on that “Go Duke” vibe, too. It’s hard not to. Duke still lacks the hard, cynical, urban-sophisticate or too-cool-for-school thing. Kids seem like kids - campus-focused and into being at Duke.

To be clear, I know this isn’t appealing to everyone. I can see how some top students might find this vibe way too much of a college cliche - not sophisticated or “worldly” enough in tone. For sure. This is not to say that Duke students aren’t top-notch or aware of the world. But so much of that wider-lens experience happens in the classrooms. The rest of the experience just isn’t as “outwardly focused” as it is at some other schools. (For example, I can’t imagine protests at Duke like the one we’re currently seeing at Columbia.)

So for more activist kids or for kids who want a “bigger” experience in addition to a thriving campus life, Duke may feel small after a year or two. It’s obviously not a place where you can hop on a train and be in NYC in a few hours (or Boston even quicker.) If your kid imagines himself doing that, Brown may be the better fit. Roadtrips to Charlotte really aren’t the same.

[Anonymous]

Baseball is a non-revenue sport; the Duke baseball coach has--or at the least had--substantial pull with admissions.

[Anonymous]

Brown - no second thought

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Brown - no second thought

Exactly this